RE: Wolves 2018 Game Day (Full Version)

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TJSweens -> RE: Wolves 2018 Game Day (2/14/2019 12:47:25 PM)

Agree. Then move Heaven and earth to get rid of him after the season. I still laugh at the notion of teams trying to steal Wig at the deadline.




JT2 -> RE: Wolves 2018 Game Day (2/14/2019 1:02:46 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: SoMnFan

I'm no longer an NBA junkie, but if I was, I'd be crowing about Okogie's stuff on that Harden step-back.
That NEVER gets smothered like that.
Damn that was athletic.
I just do not like Hardens game. At all. Someone said it well.
You need 50 from him, he'll get er done. Win or lose. Matters not to him.


Okogie really did a fantastic job on Harden.

For the season, Harden averages a ridiculous 1.5 points per shot, Josh held him to a much more pedestrian 1.2. That may not sound like a huge number, but if a team takes 90 shots in a game, its an almost 30 point difference. Its huge.

But as importantly, he did it without fouling. Harden took 4 FTs on the night - and he averages 12.


Keeping him off the line is key. He actually looked uncomfortable out there at times. That's a rare site.

Okogie looks like he is playing with so much more confidence. You can see it in his stance and body language.

This offseason will be huge for him. I'm hoping he puts in a ton of work on his shot.




JT2 -> RE: Wolves 2018 Game Day (2/14/2019 1:10:04 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: bohumm

Still a couple of years before you can really know for sure, but Clippers taking Robinson over Okogie not looking good at all so far.......


And we thank your team for doing it.

Huerter would've been a much better choice too if scoring/shooting was the idea.



He has improved tremendously since the start of the season. He looked to be very timid, even nervous, at the start of the season. He has really nice stroke and high release. Getting some starts has really helped him. Similar to Ogokie in that respect. These young guys need to play.




David Levine -> RE: Wolves 2018 Game Day (2/14/2019 1:55:27 PM)

Dane Moore@DaneMooreNBA
Andrew Wiggins has attempted 130 shots from 15-to-19 feet this season.

The Houston Rockets have attempted 103 shots from 15-to-19 feet this season.

10:30 AM - Feb 14, 2019




TJSweens -> RE: Wolves 2018 Game Day (2/14/2019 2:03:20 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

Dane Moore@DaneMooreNBA
Andrew Wiggins has attempted 130 shots from 15-to-19 feet this season.

The Houston Rockets have attempted 103 shots from 15-to-19 feet this season.

10:30 AM - Feb 14, 2019


He shoots the most ineffective shot in the NBA and shoots it very ineffectively.




twinsfan -> RE: Wolves 2018 Game Day (2/14/2019 2:46:17 PM)

How is it we're a better team when Standrew Wiggins isn't on the floor?




David Levine -> RE: Wolves 2018 Game Day (2/14/2019 2:48:50 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: twinsfan

How is it we're a better team when Standrew Wiggins isn't on the floor?


When you don't play bad players, you tend to be better.




David Levine -> RE: Wolves 2018 Game Day (2/14/2019 3:28:26 PM)

No Wiggins

The Wolves were without Andrew Wiggins for the second straight game because of an illness, and the two straight wins have given his legion of critics ample fodder.

The Wolves had 31 assists on 49 made baskets, slinging the ball around the horn for open shooters. Deng had 13 points, eight rebounds and four assists in 36 minutes, not a box score that leaps off the page, but one that showed just how a game can be controlled without scoring 35 points.

And perhaps most of all, Deng and Dario Saric were cutting off the ball, opening up the offense for easy buckets that led to a 70-36 advantage in the paint. The instincts to move without the ball are not Wiggins’ strong suit, and the difference was noticeable.

“Usually you’re going to need a thrust to the basket offensively, but when you have intelligent cutters that play in the slotted area like Lu, like Dario, you can use those guys as your thrust to the basket,” Saunders said. “That pulls the defense in from the weak side and opens things up for Karl. We like that.”

https://theathletic.com/816637/2019/02/14/timberwolves-beat-rockets-josh-okogie-block-jeff-teague-karl-anthony-towns/




bohumm -> RE: Wolves 2018 Game Day (2/14/2019 4:03:07 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: JT2

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: bohumm

Still a couple of years before you can really know for sure, but Clippers taking Robinson over Okogie not looking good at all so far.......


And we thank your team for doing it.

Huerter would've been a much better choice too if scoring/shooting was the idea.



He has improved tremendously since the start of the season. He looked to be very timid, even nervous, at the start of the season. He has really nice stroke and high release. Getting some starts has really helped him. Similar to Ogokie in that respect. These young guys need to play.

Tough thing for Robinson, who I definitely have hope for, is that he hasn't gotten much of a chance to play and then looks uncomfortable when he does. Now it's even worse because he's justifiably losing minutes to Shamet that he may have gotten once Bradley got traded. He has a lot of work to do and may be in that unfortunate zone where the things he needs most to improve he can't do as readily in the G-League, but he can't really get NBA minutes either. This summer will be huge for him.




Karl Juhnke -> RE: Wolves 2018 Game Day (2/14/2019 6:52:12 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

No Wiggins

The Wolves were without Andrew Wiggins for the second straight game because of an illness, and the two straight wins have given his legion of critics ample fodder.

The Wolves had 31 assists on 49 made baskets, slinging the ball around the horn for open shooters. Deng had 13 points, eight rebounds and four assists in 36 minutes, not a box score that leaps off the page, but one that showed just how a game can be controlled without scoring 35 points.

And perhaps most of all, Deng and Dario Saric were cutting off the ball, opening up the offense for easy buckets that led to a 70-36 advantage in the paint. The instincts to move without the ball are not Wiggins’ strong suit, and the difference was noticeable.

“Usually you’re going to need a thrust to the basket offensively, but when you have intelligent cutters that play in the slotted area like Lu, like Dario, you can use those guys as your thrust to the basket,” Saunders said. “That pulls the defense in from the weak side and opens things up for Karl. We like that.”

https://theathletic.com/816637/2019/02/14/timberwolves-beat-rockets-josh-okogie-block-jeff-teague-karl-anthony-towns/


That's kind of a damning assessment of Wiggins by extrapolation.




David Levine -> RE: Wolves 2018 Game Day (2/14/2019 7:04:45 PM)

Saric, for his career:

Starter, 125 games: 15 PPG (44/37/84), 7 RPG, 2.6 APG.
Reserve, 90 games: 10 PPG (42/33/81), 5.5 RPG, 1.6 APG.

Some guys just play a lot better if they're starting.




Bill Jandro -> RE: Wolves 2018 Game Day (2/15/2019 6:53:17 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

Agree. Then move Heaven and earth to get rid of him after the season. I still laugh at the notion of teams trying to steal Wig at the deadline.

I don't recall hearing what the offers were. Do you know?




TJSweens -> RE: Wolves 2018 Game Day (2/15/2019 8:34:42 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

Agree. Then move Heaven and earth to get rid of him after the season. I still laugh at the notion of teams trying to steal Wig at the deadline.

I don't recall hearing what the offers were. Do you know?


I didn't hear any specifics. I think it was David that posted some NBA writer saying that teams were trying to "steal" Wiggins at the deadline. Like I said, I don't know of anyone in the NBA under performing a huge contract as bad as Wiggens. I don't know how anyone could put together a package that would be considered a steal.




David Levine -> RE: Wolves 2018 Game Day (2/15/2019 10:26:45 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

Agree. Then move Heaven and earth to get rid of him after the season. I still laugh at the notion of teams trying to steal Wig at the deadline.

I don't recall hearing what the offers were. Do you know?


We only heard about offers for Tolliver. CJ Miles + a 2nd round pick, Patrick Patterson + a 2nd round pick...




David Jerde -> RE: Wolves 2018 Game Day (2/15/2019 11:37:51 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

If I was Ryan, I'd continue to start Okogie/Deng when Wigs is ready to come back and make him earn his minutes.

Its literally the only thing a coach hasn't tried yet.



I don't think Deng is a good longer-term option. Still, the concept holds (replace Deng with RoCo when healthy). I'm not sure Wiggins would earn the starting position and might be best suited coming off the bench - competing with Rose to be the only Wolf to touch the ball in each possession.




TJSweens -> RE: Wolves 2018 Game Day (2/15/2019 11:46:55 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Jerde

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

If I was Ryan, I'd continue to start Okogie/Deng when Wigs is ready to come back and make him earn his minutes.

Its literally the only thing a coach hasn't tried yet.



I don't think Deng is a good longer-term option. Still, the concept holds (replace Deng with RoCo when healthy). I'm not sure Wiggins would earn the starting position and might be best suited coming off the bench - competing with Rose to be the only Wolf to touch the ball in each possession.


Wigg is at the point where he needs to be forced to earn it. Force him to stay focused on defense and to keep his damn feet moving on offense. I was stunned when I learned there was an analytic that measures how often a player is stationary vs. moving and that Wigg was at the bottom of the league. He doesn't get the basic concept that someone with his athletic gifts is at a big advantage when he is on the move and forcing the other guy to chase.




twinsfan -> RE: Wolves 2018 Game Day (2/15/2019 11:55:09 AM)

Standrew Wiggins. That's funny.




TJSweens -> RE: Wolves 2018 Game Day (2/15/2019 11:56:02 AM)

So needy.




David Levine -> RE: Wolves 2018 Game Day (2/15/2019 12:03:11 PM)

Even the freaking Pelicans are more proactive than we are...

Adrian Wojnarowski✔@wojespn
Ownership was livid with an injured Anthony Davis leaving arena during Thursday night’s game, sources say. Gayle Benson is telling associates she wants an overhaul of Pelicans and a search for a GM to take command of Davis trade talks and the reshaping of team’s future.
8:59 AM - Feb 15, 2019




David Levine -> RE: Wolves 2018 Game Day (2/15/2019 1:17:32 PM)

Saunders has demarcated different areas on the practice court with different point values — including negative points for the midrange — and it has become a requirement to have the ball cross half court in two seconds, so as to condition some additional pace. But again, little has changed for Wiggins.

Since the coaching change, Wiggins shot volume from the midrange (10-to-19 feet) has increased while his 3-point volume has decreased by 23 percent. And the Wolves’ pace has drooped from 12th in the league under Thibodeau to 20th under Saunders, per Second Spectrum’s tracking data.

“I don’t think about it too much, to be honest,” Wiggins said when asked specifically about the shot selections Saunders is pushing. “I just play my game. Really, if the 3 is open, I’m going to shoot it. The long 2s, I’ll shoot it. The layups, I’ll shoot it.”

https://zonecoverage.com/2019/featured/assessing-ryan-saunders-is-about-more-than-andrew-wiggins/

Also, a lot of good stuff in there about Dario, and that bleeds into KAT.




Bill Jandro -> RE: Wolves 2018 Game Day (2/15/2019 6:53:11 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

Saunders has demarcated different areas on the practice court with different point values — including negative points for the midrange — and it has become a requirement to have the ball cross half court in two seconds, so as to condition some additional pace. But again, little has changed for Wiggins.

Since the coaching change, Wiggins shot volume from the midrange (10-to-19 feet) has increased while his 3-point volume has decreased by 23 percent. And the Wolves’ pace has drooped from 12th in the league under Thibodeau to 20th under Saunders, per Second Spectrum’s tracking data.

“I don’t think about it too much, to be honest,” Wiggins said when asked specifically about the shot selections Saunders is pushing. “I just play my game. Really, if the 3 is open, I’m going to shoot it. The long 2s, I’ll shoot it. The layups, I’ll shoot it.”

https://zonecoverage.com/2019/featured/assessing-ryan-saunders-is-about-more-than-andrew-wiggins/

Also, a lot of good stuff in there about Dario, and that bleeds into KAT.


Start to get the feeling this clown just isn't even coachable

I agree with the notion of putting him on the pine when he returns and make him earn his minutes. Saunders needs to yank these guys and park them at the end of the bench if their not doing their job.




ruffenach -> RE: Wolves 2018 Game Day (2/18/2019 10:41:40 AM)

It is going to take time for Wiggins to learn to not be a jump shooter and going for deep two's. If we could get Wiggins involved in the defense, rebounding and passing the ball, this would be a significant achievement for him and Saunders.




TJSweens -> RE: Wolves 2018 Game Day (2/18/2019 10:44:25 AM)

Along with pigs flying and people farting cotton candy.




David Levine -> RE: Wolves 2018 Game Day (2/18/2019 10:49:30 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: ruffenach

It is going to take time for Wiggins to learn to not be a jump shooter and going for deep two's. If we could get Wiggins involved in the defense, rebounding and passing the ball, this would be a significant achievement for him and Saunders.


More than 4.5 years, 14,000 minutes and 383 games?

He is what he is.

To put those minutes into perspective:

Butler: 16,584
Giannis: 14,619
Kawhi: 13,859
Wiggins: 13,613
Covington: 9,747




ruffenach -> RE: Wolves 2018 Game Day (2/18/2019 2:01:46 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: ruffenach

It is going to take time for Wiggins to learn to not be a jump shooter and going for deep two's. If we could get Wiggins involved in the defense, rebounding and passing the ball, this would be a significant achievement for him and Saunders.


More than 4.5 years, 14,000 minutes and 383 games?

He is what he is.

To put those minutes into perspective:

Butler: 16,584
Giannis: 14,619
Kawhi: 13,859
Wiggins: 13,613
Covington: 9,747

I don't believe that a player cannot change if he is motivated to do so. I am not sure that Wiggins is motivated to change. We either keep him as is or we trade him. Right now Taylor has little interest in trading him, now or in the immediate future. So we are stuck. I also don't see Taylor selling the team either.




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