quote:

ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson

quote:

ORIGINAL: thebigo

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson

I was not very gracious to the Patriot fans I know for their teams Super Bowl victory. They were shocked and said that I'm a better person than that. Perhaps I am, or perhaps I'm not. I feel a lot of resentment that I have not been able to experience the euphoria of a championship. It was pointed out that I experienced the Twins World Series victory, but you know in 1991 I was out of the country and was unable to catch a single game. (I did watch the '87 Series, though, but you know that was 32 years ago.) That was before I moved back to Minnesota in 1992. Maybe I brought bad luck to the Minnesota teams. That makes me very bad.

Can we get a better definition of "not very gracious"?

Among other things, I compared a Patriot celebrating in front me to a rapist celebrating before his victim- because his joy is at the expense at the one who is suffering. Pretty extreme, right?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

I was happy the Pats won. I hope Brady gets one more and is 7-3 in SB's. Feel lucky to be a fan watching someone own it like never before. Maybe ever again.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lynn G.

Well put Pager. We all know the bleakness of having hopes dashed year after year after year.

And I don't think we owe Patriots fans a single dang thing. They are experiencing a high that is rarely felt in the sports world - why do they need anything from us? Why do they expect congratulations from us? THEY should be the gracious ones with their bounty of amazing luck. The fans haven't done a single thing to earn the joy they are feeling, so why is it OUR job to pump them up further?

Bruce - I say don't feel a bit bad for not giving the Patriots fans what they were apparently expecting. It's like being in the presence of a millionaire who just won an additional million dollars on a gameshow and not congratulating him for that extra pile of money in his bank account. He already had more money than he can spend - why would we be excited for him for getting more?

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson

quote:

ORIGINAL: thebigo

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson

I was not very gracious to the Patriot fans I know for their teams Super Bowl victory. They were shocked and said that I'm a better person than that. Perhaps I am, or perhaps I'm not. I feel a lot of resentment that I have not been able to experience the euphoria of a championship. It was pointed out that I experienced the Twins World Series victory, but you know in 1991 I was out of the country and was unable to catch a single game. (I did watch the '87 Series, though, but you know that was 32 years ago.) That was before I moved back to Minnesota in 1992. Maybe I brought bad luck to the Minnesota teams. That makes me very bad.

Can we get a better definition of "not very gracious"?

Among other things, I compared a Patriot celebrating in front me to a rapist celebrating before his victim- because his joy is at the expense at the one who is suffering. Pretty extreme, right?

Now that might be a little extreme.

quote:

ORIGINAL: The Happy Norseman

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pager

quote:

ORIGINAL: The Happy Norseman

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

FA olineman are not only scarce but extremely expensive.

We should have been drafting oline early and often for the last 5 years.

Amen! That's why this is the year to attack the problem in the draft. We are set up on defense. Go get one FA guard, sign Easton to a vet minimum then draft:

1st - Greg Little - T
2nd- Chris Lindstrom - G
3rd - TJ Hockenson - TE

Then address DT and LB.

Then win the f'n Superbowl!

Sign me up. I posted FA Guard list right after our embarrassing lost to the Bears (the second one). If Saffold resigns with the Rams, he wants to and the team has indicated they want him back - caveat with their salary cap situation they might not be able to, then FA G options aren't very good (pending any veteran cuts).

Best options to me, sign an upgrade at center. That FA seemed much younger, better, and cheaper (the last item is debatable https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/positional/ there appears to me very little difference between guard and center. There are two guards worth trading for. The RFA of the NE Pats, who has been excellent filling in for injury (name starts with a K). And Sitton, where the Dolphins appear to be in tanking mode to get the best QB of 2020 or 2021. I would kick the tires on either to see if they would accept a 2020 pick (hopefully in the 5th-2nd range - I'd be willing to give a higher pick if MIA would pick up some/half/most of Sitton's salary).

In a vacuum. I'd sign a center, trade for a guard - one of the two options listed above, draft a guard in one of the first two rounds. If it's within range of value at 18 or 50 - so bet it, if it can happen with a trade back even better. I'd jettison Compton/Jones/Remmers. I'd see what Easton is willing to accept, I wouldn't pay him more than a 2M prove it contract. If a developmental tackle is available in the draft round 3 or so, I might take him. I personally think A Collins, should be groomed as a swing tackle with the goal of him taking over the RT spot. Let OTAs and Training camp decide our interior lineup.

I don't know how feasible any component of this is. If they sign/or let go either of Barr/Richardson and don't think they have the inhouse horses, then that alters plans a lot of this. If players I expect to restructure like Griffen, aren't willing to, it has a huge impact.

But that's the framework I'd be looking at. But leaving no-stone unturned.

The more I think about it, the more it makes sense to make the move for Paradis as some posters have suggested, and kick Elf out to Guard where he was successful in college. Better to pay for an excellent center than an average Guard. Then sign Easton to a vet minimum, assuming he's healthy. It's a move I could realistically see Spielman pull off. Dump Remmers and salary wise it would be close to a push, maybe cost the team a few million bucks more per year. After the draft, we could very realistically go into next year with a line that looks something like:

Reiff - Little(r)
Lindstrom(r) - Easton
Paradis - Elflein
Elflein - Remmers
O'Neill - Hill - Collins

With Dennison and Kubiak taking over, I'd actually feel cautiously optimistic that our line would be above average to good.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: The Happy Norseman

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pager

quote:

ORIGINAL: The Happy Norseman

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

FA olineman are not only scarce but extremely expensive.

We should have been drafting oline early and often for the last 5 years.

Amen! That's why this is the year to attack the problem in the draft. We are set up on defense. Go get one FA guard, sign Easton to a vet minimum then draft:

1st - Greg Little - T
2nd- Chris Lindstrom - G
3rd - TJ Hockenson - TE

Then address DT and LB.

Then win the f'n Superbowl!

Sign me up. I posted FA Guard list right after our embarrassing lost to the Bears (the second one). If Saffold resigns with the Rams, he wants to and the team has indicated they want him back - caveat with their salary cap situation they might not be able to, then FA G options aren't very good (pending any veteran cuts).

Best options to me, sign an upgrade at center. That FA seemed much younger, better, and cheaper (the last item is debatable https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/positional/ there appears to me very little difference between guard and center. There are two guards worth trading for. The RFA of the NE Pats, who has been excellent filling in for injury (name starts with a K). And Sitton, where the Dolphins appear to be in tanking mode to get the best QB of 2020 or 2021. I would kick the tires on either to see if they would accept a 2020 pick (hopefully in the 5th-2nd range - I'd be willing to give a higher pick if MIA would pick up some/half/most of Sitton's salary).

In a vacuum. I'd sign a center, trade for a guard - one of the two options listed above, draft a guard in one of the first two rounds. If it's within range of value at 18 or 50 - so bet it, if it can happen with a trade back even better. I'd jettison Compton/Jones/Remmers. I'd see what Easton is willing to accept, I wouldn't pay him more than a 2M prove it contract. If a developmental tackle is available in the draft round 3 or so, I might take him. I personally think A Collins, should be groomed as a swing tackle with the goal of him taking over the RT spot. Let OTAs and Training camp decide our interior lineup.

I don't know how feasible any component of this is. If they sign/or let go either of Barr/Richardson and don't think they have the inhouse horses, then that alters plans a lot of this. If players I expect to restructure like Griffen, aren't willing to, it has a huge impact.

But that's the framework I'd be looking at. But leaving no-stone unturned.

The more I think about it, the more it makes sense to make the move for Paradis as some posters have suggested, and kick Elf out to Guard where he was successful in college. Better to pay for an excellent center than an average Guard. Then sign Easton to a vet minimum, assuming he's healthy. It's a move I could realistically see Spielman pull off. Dump Remmers and salary wise it would be close to a push, maybe cost the team a few million bucks more per year. After the draft, we could very realistically go into next year with a line that looks something like:

Reiff - Little(r)
Lindstrom(r) - Easton
Paradis - Elflein
Elflein - Remmers
O'Neill - Hill - Collins

With Dennison and Kubiak taking over, I'd actually feel cautiously optimistic that our line would be above average to good.

I don't know if they can do it....sign a FA like Paradis and keep Reiff and Remmers? They are going to have to trade Reiff or cut Remmers...same thing will apply for Treadwell as applies to Remmers or Reiff....you can't have a 6-7 million dollar player sitting on the bench as a backup.

quote:

ORIGINAL: ratoppenheimer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: The Happy Norseman

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pager

quote:

ORIGINAL: The Happy Norseman

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

FA olineman are not only scarce but extremely expensive.

We should have been drafting oline early and often for the last 5 years.

Amen! That's why this is the year to attack the problem in the draft. We are set up on defense. Go get one FA guard, sign Easton to a vet minimum then draft:

1st - Greg Little - T
2nd- Chris Lindstrom - G
3rd - TJ Hockenson - TE

Then address DT and LB.

Then win the f'n Superbowl!

Sign me up. I posted FA Guard list right after our embarrassing lost to the Bears (the second one). If Saffold resigns with the Rams, he wants to and the team has indicated they want him back - caveat with their salary cap situation they might not be able to, then FA G options aren't very good (pending any veteran cuts).

Best options to me, sign an upgrade at center. That FA seemed much younger, better, and cheaper (the last item is debatable https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/positional/ there appears to me very little difference between guard and center. There are two guards worth trading for. The RFA of the NE Pats, who has been excellent filling in for injury (name starts with a K). And Sitton, where the Dolphins appear to be in tanking mode to get the best QB of 2020 or 2021. I would kick the tires on either to see if they would accept a 2020 pick (hopefully in the 5th-2nd range - I'd be willing to give a higher pick if MIA would pick up some/half/most of Sitton's salary).

In a vacuum. I'd sign a center, trade for a guard - one of the two options listed above, draft a guard in one of the first two rounds. If it's within range of value at 18 or 50 - so bet it, if it can happen with a trade back even better. I'd jettison Compton/Jones/Remmers. I'd see what Easton is willing to accept, I wouldn't pay him more than a 2M prove it contract. If a developmental tackle is available in the draft round 3 or so, I might take him. I personally think A Collins, should be groomed as a swing tackle with the goal of him taking over the RT spot. Let OTAs and Training camp decide our interior lineup.

I don't know how feasible any component of this is. If they sign/or let go either of Barr/Richardson and don't think they have the inhouse horses, then that alters plans a lot of this. If players I expect to restructure like Griffen, aren't willing to, it has a huge impact.

But that's the framework I'd be looking at. But leaving no-stone unturned.

The more I think about it, the more it makes sense to make the move for Paradis as some posters have suggested, and kick Elf out to Guard where he was successful in college. Better to pay for an excellent center than an average Guard. Then sign Easton to a vet minimum, assuming he's healthy. It's a move I could realistically see Spielman pull off. Dump Remmers and salary wise it would be close to a push, maybe cost the team a few million bucks more per year. After the draft, we could very realistically go into next year with a line that looks something like:

Reiff - Little(r)
Lindstrom(r) - Easton
Paradis - Elflein
Elflein - Remmers
O'Neill - Hill - Collins

With Dennison and Kubiak taking over, I'd actually feel cautiously optimistic that our line would be above average to good.

I don't know if they can do it....sign a FA like Paradis and keep Reiff and Remmers? They are going to have to trade Reiff or cut Remmers...same thing will apply for Treadwell as applies to Remmers or Reiff....you can't have a 6-7 million dollar player sitting on the bench as a backup.

i think we can afford all of the above for one season...thing is, o'neill is so athletic that i see him as the future at left tackle...whether it's o'neill or little - when do we pull the trigger on reiff?....

i think we let remmers go, as reiff can play both left and right tackle....


could we go: 10 o-linemen

O'neill - Reiff - Little(r) - (Collins/Hill)
Lindstrom(r) - Easton
Paradis - Elflein
Elflein - Easton - Isadora
Reiff - Little(r) - Hill - Collins


i hope we go after kj wright in free agency - he'll be 30 this summer, but i think he'd give us quality play for two seasons and we can probably sign him to a $12m/3yr deal....

ramon foster could give us a couple of years at about $3-4m/yr - he'd be a better option than remmers....

quote:

ORIGINAL: The Happy Norseman

quote:

ORIGINAL: ratoppenheimer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: The Happy Norseman

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pager

quote:

ORIGINAL: The Happy Norseman

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

FA olineman are not only scarce but extremely expensive.

We should have been drafting oline early and often for the last 5 years.

Amen! That's why this is the year to attack the problem in the draft. We are set up on defense. Go get one FA guard, sign Easton to a vet minimum then draft:

1st - Greg Little - T
2nd- Chris Lindstrom - G
3rd - TJ Hockenson - TE

Then address DT and LB.

Then win the f'n Superbowl!

Sign me up. I posted FA Guard list right after our embarrassing lost to the Bears (the second one). If Saffold resigns with the Rams, he wants to and the team has indicated they want him back - caveat with their salary cap situation they might not be able to, then FA G options aren't very good (pending any veteran cuts).

Best options to me, sign an upgrade at center. That FA seemed much younger, better, and cheaper (the last item is debatable https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/positional/ there appears to me very little difference between guard and center. There are two guards worth trading for. The RFA of the NE Pats, who has been excellent filling in for injury (name starts with a K). And Sitton, where the Dolphins appear to be in tanking mode to get the best QB of 2020 or 2021. I would kick the tires on either to see if they would accept a 2020 pick (hopefully in the 5th-2nd range - I'd be willing to give a higher pick if MIA would pick up some/half/most of Sitton's salary).

In a vacuum. I'd sign a center, trade for a guard - one of the two options listed above, draft a guard in one of the first two rounds. If it's within range of value at 18 or 50 - so bet it, if it can happen with a trade back even better. I'd jettison Compton/Jones/Remmers. I'd see what Easton is willing to accept, I wouldn't pay him more than a 2M prove it contract. If a developmental tackle is available in the draft round 3 or so, I might take him. I personally think A Collins, should be groomed as a swing tackle with the goal of him taking over the RT spot. Let OTAs and Training camp decide our interior lineup.

I don't know how feasible any component of this is. If they sign/or let go either of Barr/Richardson and don't think they have the inhouse horses, then that alters plans a lot of this. If players I expect to restructure like Griffen, aren't willing to, it has a huge impact.

But that's the framework I'd be looking at. But leaving no-stone unturned.

The more I think about it, the more it makes sense to make the move for Paradis as some posters have suggested, and kick Elf out to Guard where he was successful in college. Better to pay for an excellent center than an average Guard. Then sign Easton to a vet minimum, assuming he's healthy. It's a move I could realistically see Spielman pull off. Dump Remmers and salary wise it would be close to a push, maybe cost the team a few million bucks more per year. After the draft, we could very realistically go into next year with a line that looks something like:

Reiff - Little(r)
Lindstrom(r) - Easton
Paradis - Elflein
Elflein - Remmers
O'Neill - Hill - Collins

With Dennison and Kubiak taking over, I'd actually feel cautiously optimistic that our line would be above average to good.

I don't know if they can do it....sign a FA like Paradis and keep Reiff and Remmers? They are going to have to trade Reiff or cut Remmers...same thing will apply for Treadwell as applies to Remmers or Reiff....you can't have a 6-7 million dollar player sitting on the bench as a backup.

i think we can afford all of the above for one season...thing is, o'neill is so athletic that i see him as the future at left tackle...whether it's o'neill or little - when do we pull the trigger on reiff?....

i think we let remmers go, as reiff can play both left and right tackle....


could we go: 10 o-linemen

O'neill - Reiff - Little(r) - (Collins/Hill)
Lindstrom(r) - Easton
Paradis - Elflein
Elflein - Easton - Isadora
Reiff - Little(r) - Hill - Collins


i hope we go after kj wright in free agency - he'll be 30 this summer, but i think he'd give us quality play for two seasons and we can probably sign him to a $12m/3yr deal....

ramon foster could give us a couple of years at about $3-4m/yr - he'd be a better option than remmers....

I'd be all for that lineup and I'd be up for paying a bit more for Foster over Remmers. We haven't had a lot of luck with olinemen coming off of injury. It would be nice to find an upgrade to Isadora as well. He has shown nothing in his time with the team.

quote:

ORIGINAL: ratoppenheimer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: The Happy Norseman

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pager

quote:

ORIGINAL: The Happy Norseman

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

FA olineman are not only scarce but extremely expensive.

We should have been drafting oline early and often for the last 5 years.

Amen! That's why this is the year to attack the problem in the draft. We are set up on defense. Go get one FA guard, sign Easton to a vet minimum then draft:

1st - Greg Little - T
2nd- Chris Lindstrom - G
3rd - TJ Hockenson - TE

Then address DT and LB.

Then win the f'n Superbowl!

Sign me up. I posted FA Guard list right after our embarrassing lost to the Bears (the second one). If Saffold resigns with the Rams, he wants to and the team has indicated they want him back - caveat with their salary cap situation they might not be able to, then FA G options aren't very good (pending any veteran cuts).

Best options to me, sign an upgrade at center. That FA seemed much younger, better, and cheaper (the last item is debatable https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/positional/ there appears to me very little difference between guard and center. There are two guards worth trading for. The RFA of the NE Pats, who has been excellent filling in for injury (name starts with a K). And Sitton, where the Dolphins appear to be in tanking mode to get the best QB of 2020 or 2021. I would kick the tires on either to see if they would accept a 2020 pick (hopefully in the 5th-2nd range - I'd be willing to give a higher pick if MIA would pick up some/half/most of Sitton's salary).

In a vacuum. I'd sign a center, trade for a guard - one of the two options listed above, draft a guard in one of the first two rounds. If it's within range of value at 18 or 50 - so bet it, if it can happen with a trade back even better. I'd jettison Compton/Jones/Remmers. I'd see what Easton is willing to accept, I wouldn't pay him more than a 2M prove it contract. If a developmental tackle is available in the draft round 3 or so, I might take him. I personally think A Collins, should be groomed as a swing tackle with the goal of him taking over the RT spot. Let OTAs and Training camp decide our interior lineup.

I don't know how feasible any component of this is. If they sign/or let go either of Barr/Richardson and don't think they have the inhouse horses, then that alters plans a lot of this. If players I expect to restructure like Griffen, aren't willing to, it has a huge impact.

But that's the framework I'd be looking at. But leaving no-stone unturned.

The more I think about it, the more it makes sense to make the move for Paradis as some posters have suggested, and kick Elf out to Guard where he was successful in college. Better to pay for an excellent center than an average Guard. Then sign Easton to a vet minimum, assuming he's healthy. It's a move I could realistically see Spielman pull off. Dump Remmers and salary wise it would be close to a push, maybe cost the team a few million bucks more per year. After the draft, we could very realistically go into next year with a line that looks something like:

Reiff - Little(r)
Lindstrom(r) - Easton
Paradis - Elflein
Elflein - Remmers
O'Neill - Hill - Collins

With Dennison and Kubiak taking over, I'd actually feel cautiously optimistic that our line would be above average to good.

I don't know if they can do it....sign a FA like Paradis and keep Reiff and Remmers? They are going to have to trade Reiff or cut Remmers...same thing will apply for Treadwell as applies to Remmers or Reiff....you can't have a 6-7 million dollar player sitting on the bench as a backup.

i think we can afford all of the above for one season...thing is, o'neill is so athletic that i see him as the future at left tackle...whether it's o'neill or little - when do we pull the trigger on reiff?....

i think we let remmers go, as reiff can play both left and right tackle....


could we go: 10 o-linemen

O'neill - Reiff - Little(r) - (Collins/Hill)
Lindstrom(r) - Easton
Paradis - Elflein
Elflein - Easton - Isadora
Reiff - Little(r) - Hill - Collins


i hope we go after kj wright in free agency - he'll be 30 this summer, but i think he'd give us quality play for two seasons and we can probably sign him to a $12m/3yr deal....

ramon foster could give us a couple of years at about $3-4m/yr - he'd be a better option than remmers....

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

Its very possible that the team feels a little different about Remmers than we fans do.

Remmers was brought onto the roster briefly, then went CAR and became a starter, then paid him handsomely to come back; he moved from T to G which is no small personal sacrifice for a starting T making starter T money – so there's the team player thing; Remmers may also get some slack on his bad performance because he was playing a new position.

As fans, if somebody doesn't play well, its 'off with their head'.

Its no certainty that he is no longer in their plans.

quote:

ORIGINAL: thebigo

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

Its very possible that the team feels a little different about Remmers than we fans do.

Remmers was brought onto the roster briefly, then went CAR and became a starter, then paid him handsomely to come back; he moved from T to G which is no small personal sacrifice for a starting T making starter T money – so there's the team player thing; Remmers may also get some slack on his bad performance because he was playing a new position.

As fans, if somebody doesn't play well, its 'off with their head'.

Its no certainty that he is no longer in their plans.

I can see it, between him and Easton coming back we should be good at OG.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

quote:

ORIGINAL: thebigo

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

Its very possible that the team feels a little different about Remmers than we fans do.

Remmers was brought onto the roster briefly, then went CAR and became a starter, then paid him handsomely to come back; he moved from T to G which is no small personal sacrifice for a starting T making starter T money – so there's the team player thing; Remmers may also get some slack on his bad performance because he was playing a new position.

As fans, if somebody doesn't play well, its 'off with their head'.

Its no certainty that he is no longer in their plans.

I can see it, between him and Easton coming back we should be good at OG.

Thats funny. I had Easton in my post but deleted it ... I decided to just poke the needle under skin intstead of a full on thrusting it into the eyeball.

Reiff Easton Elf Remmers O’Neil. Its coming.

quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

quote:

ORIGINAL: thebigo

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

Its very possible that the team feels a little different about Remmers than we fans do.

Remmers was brought onto the roster briefly, then went CAR and became a starter, then paid him handsomely to come back; he moved from T to G which is no small personal sacrifice for a starting T making starter T money – so there's the team player thing; Remmers may also get some slack on his bad performance because he was playing a new position.

As fans, if somebody doesn't play well, its 'off with their head'.

Its no certainty that he is no longer in their plans.

I can see it, between him and Easton coming back we should be good at OG.

Thats funny. I had Easton in my post but deleted it ... I decided to just poke the needle under skin intstead of a full on thrusting it into the eyeball.

Reiff Easton Elf Remmers O’Neil. Its coming.

There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

quote:

ORIGINAL: JT2

quote:

ORIGINAL: thebigo

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pager

quote:

ORIGINAL: Viking Rich

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

Moving Reiff inside might be even stupider than moving Remmers inside.

I hope they are not seriously thinking about this

Guards all over the league will soon be looking at and reading the tombstones of Remmers and Reiff:

THE MINNESOTA VIKINGS:

"Where Tackles Go To Die As Guards"

Well played.

Kind of a play on the old adage "Where Chicago WRs go to continue to suck, but at higher pay"

At least we stopped picking them up.

Well done JT2. You’ve just guaranteed we are signing Kevin White - a bigger bust - this off season to replace Treadwell.

quote:

ORIGINAL: JT2

As much as I appreciate Thielen and Diggs; would you rather have Thielen, Diggs and Treadwell or Woods, Cooks and Kupp?

3 is more than 2.

quote:

ORIGINAL: JT2

As much as I appreciate Thielen and Diggs; would you rather have Thielen, Diggs and Treadwell or Woods, Cooks and Kupp?

3 is more than 2.