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mikegreitzer -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/29/2018 2:27:40 PM)

Keenum would not have thrown away the Buffalo game. Kirk did look rusty to begin Detroit game. Is he a bit of a head case? He gets touchy with reporters at times. Just go play-action on first play and throw it deep. Tighten up those Bear sphincters.



Guest -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/29/2018 4:12:16 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: mikegreitzer

Keenum would not have thrown away the Buffalo game. Kirk did look rusty to begin Detroit game. Is he a bit of a head case? He gets touchy with reporters at times. Just go play-action on first play and throw it deep. Tighten up those Bear sphincters.



Perhaps Case’s pocket presence (Which I’d admit is light years better then Cousins) would have evaded some Bill defenders, but that was a total Viking team shit show.

However there are numerous other instances where Keenum could no way in hell make many of the throws Cousins has made. About 5 in the first Packer game alone.



Bill Jandro -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/29/2018 4:43:48 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: ratoppenheimer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

All of you complaining about Cousins and wanting Case Keenum---we wouldn't have beat the @ Lions, @ Eagles, or tied @ Packers with a missed kick to win w/o Cousins. that would be about 6-9 record right now.

What is Case right now? 6-9 with a good running team and defense.

A lot of pressure on Cousins this weekend.



there is no doubt in my mind that cousins is a better quarterback than keenum...that said, he seems to have a noticeable problem recognizing available receivers in the open field...there were several opportunities during those first four series against detroit that were missed - mostly diggs being wide open....

Keenum's ability to extend plays was a huge factor in his success last year.



Ricky J -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/29/2018 5:20:07 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

quote:

ORIGINAL: ratoppenheimer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

All of you complaining about Cousins and wanting Case Keenum---we wouldn't have beat the @ Lions, @ Eagles, or tied @ Packers with a missed kick to win w/o Cousins. that would be about 6-9 record right now.

What is Case right now? 6-9 with a good running team and defense.

A lot of pressure on Cousins this weekend.



there is no doubt in my mind that cousins is a better quarterback than keenum...that said, he seems to have a noticeable problem recognizing available receivers in the open field...there were several opportunities during those first four series against detroit that were missed - mostly diggs being wide open....

Keenum's ability to extend plays was a huge factor in his success last year.


Note how these young bucks are always rolling out. Buying time. Getting away from those big boys who want beat their brains in.

Is it ok if we do that too? Just asking ...



Pager -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/29/2018 5:21:11 PM)

Keenum missed a ton of open guys too. He has not been good here in Denver.



Ricky J -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/29/2018 5:45:02 PM)

Holy shti!! Mean little bastard

Adam Schefter

@AdamSchefter

·

1h

Costly day for Patriots’ WR Julian Edelman last Sunday vs. Bills, as he was fined for three separate plays -- $10,026 for unnecessary roughness, $26,739 for unnecessary roughness & $26,739 for unnecessary roughness ($63,504 total), per

@MikeReiss

.



Ragnarök -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/29/2018 8:13:46 PM)

Case and Cousins are second tier QB talent, both have major faults in their games and will not elevate a team on JUST their presence... they may have those games occasionally but likely will never be MVPs to carry their team to wins like Brady, Rodgers, Brees, Wilson...

Cousins puts up great numbers for you stat boy kinds, he is a god of numbers, but his past and his present in MN have shown he is NOT ELITE...

We can win a SB with Cousins in right situations, just as we could have with Case last year if stars aligned...

Cousins has warts, some of you can look past them for the numbers he puts up, others see the whole...

No matter, he is ours for two more years... enjoy the ride!



David F. -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/29/2018 8:41:26 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ragnarök

Case and Cousins are second tier QB talent, both have major faults in their games and will not elevate a team on JUST their presence... they may have those games occasionally but likely will never be MVPs to carry their team to wins like Brady, Rodgers, Brees, Wilson...

Cousins puts up great numbers for you stat boy kinds, he is a god of numbers, but his past and his present in MN have shown he is NOT ELITE...

We can win a SB with Cousins in right situations, just as we could have with Case last year if stars aligned...

Cousins has warts, some of you can look past them for the numbers he puts up, others see the whole...

No matter, he is ours for two more years... enjoy the ride!



There are 32 teams but only one each of Brady, Rodgers, Brees, Mahomes, and earlier - Peyton Manning. For the rest of us teams, we have to get the best we can. Cousins was the best available and we got him. Everyone knows he's not elite - including Kirk Cousins himself. But he is in fact - VERY GOOD. And I'll take it. I watched Ponder enough to appreciate a QB that is in fact - very good.



bstinger -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/29/2018 10:05:46 PM)

Kirk has a much better arm than a lot of QB's. He doesn't have as good of escapability as some. He needs a better O line than he has to play his best. He won't be Rodgers or Mahomes, but he could get close to Brady and Brees production wise with a very good O line.



JT2 -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/29/2018 10:51:52 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ragnarök

Case and Cousins are second tier QB talent, both have major faults in their games and will not elevate a team on JUST their presence... they may have those games occasionally but likely will never be MVPs to carry their team to wins like Brady, Rodgers, Brees, Wilson...

Cousins puts up great numbers for you stat boy kinds, he is a god of numbers, but his past and his present in MN have shown he is NOT ELITE...

We can win a SB with Cousins in right situations, just as we could have with Case last year if stars aligned...

Cousins has warts, some of you can look past them for the numbers he puts up, others see the whole...

No matter, he is ours for two more years... enjoy the ride!



There are 32 teams but only one each of Brady, Rodgers, Brees, Mahomes, and earlier - Peyton Manning. For the rest of us teams, we have to get the best we can. Cousins was the best available and we got him. Everyone knows he's not elite - including Kirk Cousins himself. But he is in fact - VERY GOOD. And I'll take it. I watched Ponder enough to appreciate a QB that is in fact - very good.


Very well stated.

This isn't the first time we needed a QB. We got the best one available.

I still think we have a philosophy of football problem, regardless of who is the flavor of the day OC. Zimmer likes QB's as much as he likes Kickers.

Think about it, Keenum had the season of his career, one he will never duplicate. And Zimmer essentially said he was lucky. Really, that's what you say about your QB? Doesn't matter if it was true, why would you say that?

Cousins isn't going away. Makes all kinds of sense to put pieces around him and put him in a position to succeed.

Praise Zimmer all you want, but why did it take so long to realize Treadwell is a liability in a Viking uniform?

Zimmer would almost rather lose 6-3 than win 42-38.

Plasma and artificial lighting bothers him, he prefers chalk and boards. He's still embarrassed to admit that he favors landline telephone over telegraph. Pissed about sliced bread. Owns more boots than shoes. Reluctantly accepted a job that required him to work on the sabbath.



Pager -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/29/2018 10:56:33 PM)

The stars did align for Keenum here and he couldn't win it all.

Keenum is a bridge veteran QB, nothing more. Unfortunately for Denver, they haven't figured out the other side of the bridge.

Give Cousins even an average oline next year and I'm still confident he can elevate this team.



David F. -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/29/2018 11:38:22 PM)

I hope that our defensive gameplan for tomorrow's game put's a minimal amount of respect for downfield passing by the Bears. It's time to use the strategy that so many teams have used successfully against us. Make them beat us with deep passes and simultaneously try to apply enough pressure to make deep passes impossible. Sell out on the pressure, use a spy dedicated to Trubisky, and see if he can beat us. After drafting so many CBs early it's time for them to go earn their money with some one-on-one coverage.



JT2 -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/30/2018 12:03:09 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

I hope that our defensive gameplan for tomorrow's game put's a minimal amount of respect for downfield passing by the Bears. It's time to use the strategy that so many teams have used successfully against us. Make them beat us with deep passes and simultaneously try to apply enough pressure to make deep passes impossible. Sell out on the pressure, use a spy dedicated to Trubisky, and see if he can beat us. After drafting so many CBs early it's time for them to go earn their money with some one-on-one coverage.



This is such a different Bears team than we (even Bears fans) are used to. No studs on offense, but they're really unpredictable and effective. Bears offense with speed, that's a change. No more plodding, predictable ground game. Nagy and Helfrich have done a remarkable job with mediocre offensive talent.



David F. -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/30/2018 12:19:30 AM)

How do we make a successful attack against the Bears awesome defense? Look to someone who did it. In this case it was the Patriots (big surprise). The good news is that they have three long TD drives to look at and there very much IS a pattern in it. The bad news is that they also had to generate three turnovers and score two TDs on special teams to end up winning by 7. We can definitely get those three turnovers but I won't hold my breath for anything positive from our special teams.

Any way, here are the three drives:

(15:00 - 1st) C.Parkey kicks 65 yards from CHI 35 to end zone, Touchback.

1st & 10 at NE 25
(15:00 - 1st) S.Michel right tackle to NE 43 for 18 yards (D.Trevathan).

1st & 10 at NE 43
(14:23 - 1st) T.Brady pass short right to S.Michel to CHI 44 for 13 yards (K.Fuller).

1st & 10 at CHI 44
(13:42 - 1st) (Shotgun) T.Brady pass short left to J.White to CHI 30 for 14 yards (R.Smith).

1st & 10 at CHI 30
(13:05 - 1st) J.White left end to CHI 24 for 6 yards (P.Amukamara).

2nd & 4 at CHI 24
(12:28 - 1st) S.Michel left tackle to CHI 18 for 6 yards (P.Amukamara; B.Nichols).

1st & 10 at CHI 18
(11:49 - 1st) (Shotgun) T.Brady pass short right to J.Edelman to CHI 9 for 9 yards (D.Trevathan).

2nd & 1 at CHI 9
(11:09 - 1st) (Shotgun) T.Brady pass incomplete short middle [B.Nichols].

3rd & 1 at CHI 9
(11:00 - 1st) Julian Edelman Pass From Tom Brady for 9 Yrds S.Gostkowski extra point is GOOD, Center-J.Cardona, Holder-R.Allen.


1st & 10 at NE 36
(9:46 - 2nd) T.Brady pass incomplete deep middle to J.Gordon.

2nd & 10 at NE 36
(9:40 - 2nd) (Shotgun) T.Brady pass short middle to J.White to NE 42 for 6 yards (R.Smith).

3rd & 4 at NE 42
(9:03 - 2nd) (Shotgun) T.Brady pass short middle to J.White to NE 49 for 7 yards (R.Smith; B.Callahan). CHI-B.Callahan was injured during the play.

1st & 10 at NE 49
(8:33 - 2nd) K.Barner right guard to NE 49 for no gain (D.Trevathan). Penalty on NE-J.Gordon, Illegal Shift, declined.

2nd & 10 at NE 49
(8:12 - 2nd) (Shotgun) T.Brady pass short left to C.Hogan to CHI 48 for 3 yards (S.McManis).

3rd & 7 at CHI 48
(7:31 - 2nd) (Shotgun) T.Brady scrambles up the middle to CHI 42 for 6 yards (S.McManis).

4th & 1 at CHI 42
(6:46 - 2nd) (Shotgun) T.Brady pass deep right to J.Gordon to CHI 23 for 19 yards (K.Fuller).

1st & 10 at CHI 23
(6:06 - 2nd) K.Barner right end to CHI 17 for 6 yards (D.Trevathan).

2nd & 4 at CHI 17
(5:24 - 2nd) (Shotgun) T.Brady pass short middle to J.Edelman to CHI 6 for 11 yards (A.Amos).

1st & Goal at CHI 6
(4:49 - 2nd) (Shotgun) T.Brady pass incomplete short left to J.Gordon.

2nd & Goal at CHI 6
(4:45 - 2nd) (Shotgun) Direct snap to J.White. J.White left end to CHI 5 for 1 yard (E.Jackson).

3rd & Goal at CHI 5
(3:58 - 2nd) James White Pass From Tom Brady for 5 Yrds S.Gostkowski extra point is GOOD, Center-J.Cardona, Holder-R.Allen.


1st & 10 at NE 4
(13:04 - 4th) K.Barner right tackle to NE 6 for 2 yards (D.Trevathan).

2nd & 8 at NE 6
(12:32 - 4th) T.Brady pass short right to J.Gordon to NE 12 for 6 yards (K.Fuller).

3rd & 2 at NE 12
(11:56 - 4th) (Shotgun) T.Brady pass short middle to J.White to NE 22 for 10 yards (D.Trevathan).

1st & 10 at NE 22
(11:21 - 4th) K.Barner right tackle to NE 25 for 3 yards (K.Fuller).

(11:21 - 4th) Timeout at 13:05.

2nd & 7 at NE 25
(10:42 - 4th) (Shotgun) T.Brady pass short middle to C.Hogan to NE 44 for 19 yards (D.Trevathan).

1st & 10 at NE 44
(10:15 - 4th) (No Huddle, Shotgun) T.Brady pass incomplete short left to J.White.

2nd & 10 at NE 44
(10:12 - 4th) T.Brady pass deep middle to J.Gordon to CHI 1 for 55 yards (B.Callahan).

1st & Goal at CHI 1
(9:24 - 4th) T.Karras and C.Croston reported in as eligible. K.Barner left tackle to CHI 2 for -1 yards (E.Goldman).

2nd & Goal at CHI 2
(8:40 - 4th) James White Pass From Tom Brady for 2 Yrds S.Gostkowski extra point is GOOD, Center-J.Cardona, Holder-R.Allen.



Todd M -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/30/2018 5:56:07 AM)

It's just a game, right?

In or out there's nothing life defining about it. Yet I am probably going to be way or or way down depending on how this plays out.

It's a sad reality.



David F. -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/30/2018 7:45:57 AM)

Arif Hasan Retweeted

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Vikings’ DT Sheldon Richardson has a $667,000 incentive of finish this season with 6+ sacks; he currently has 4.5 and will need 1.5 sacks Sunday vs. Chicago to achieve it.



Pager -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/30/2018 10:25:17 AM)

David F. Good post.

It's obvious how you attack this D. Miami did it, NE, even the 49ers had the blueprint. Short passes. Don't run the ball up the middle, attack the edges. Misdirection.

We'll see if Zim wants to run up the middle on third and short again.



ratoppenheimer -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/30/2018 10:48:50 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ragnarök

Case and Cousins are second tier QB talent, both have major faults in their games and will not elevate a team on JUST their presence... they may have those games occasionally but likely will never be MVPs to carry their team to wins like Brady, Rodgers, Brees, Wilson...

Cousins puts up great numbers for you stat boy kinds, he is a god of numbers, but his past and his present in MN have shown he is NOT ELITE...

We can win a SB with Cousins in right situations, just as we could have with Case last year if stars aligned...

Cousins has warts, some of you can look past them for the numbers he puts up, others see the whole...

No matter, he is ours for two more years... enjoy the ride!



There are 32 teams but only one each of Brady, Rodgers, Brees, Mahomes, and earlier - Peyton Manning. For the rest of us teams, we have to get the best we can. Cousins was the best available and we got him. Everyone knows he's not elite - including Kirk Cousins himself. But he is in fact - VERY GOOD. And I'll take it. I watched Ponder enough to appreciate a QB that is in fact - very good.


i would not put case and cousins in the same tier...i'd call cousins a 2nd tier quarterback and case a 3rd tier quarterback, who had something close to a 2nd tier season in '17....

there have been plenty of 2nd tier qb's that have won super bowls - even a couple of 3rd tiers....



Bill Johanesen -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/30/2018 11:43:39 AM)

This is the game Cousins needs to protect the ball, both in the pocket and throwing. The Bears create/get so many turnovers, we can't feed into that.

I can see us winning. But I can also see the OL turning this into a shit show. Maybe this will be the game O'Neill goes national for shutting out Mack.

Cohen makes things go, the D has to limit his big plays and runs for 1st downs.



stfrank -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/30/2018 11:50:02 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pager

David F. Good post.

It's obvious how you attack this D. Miami did it, NE, even the 49ers had the blueprint. Short passes. Don't run the ball up the middle, attack the edges. Misdirection.

We'll see if Zim wants to run up the middle on third and short again.

But that's old time football, and that's what Zim wants. It doesn't matter that we don't have the personnel to do it damit, we want old time football! [:D]



Bill Johanesen -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/30/2018 12:03:37 PM)

I don't care if he wants to run as long as we more or less consistently run well. That hasn't been the case of course.

We have a dynamic back in Cook.



Bill Johanesen -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/30/2018 12:13:28 PM)

Timely ESPN article about the run game:

http://www.espn.com/blog/minnesota-vikings/post/_/id/28028/vikings-run-game-faces-major-challenge-with-season-on-line



Pager -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/30/2018 12:42:25 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

I don't care if he wants to run as long as we more or less consistently run well. That hasn't been the case of course.

We have a dynamic back in Cook.



And to run consistently well you have to minimize running at the strength of this defense.



Pager -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/30/2018 1:02:46 PM)

Packer fans turning on A-uh-ron.

Not taking the check down.

Faking a concussion.

It brings me joy.

https://www.acmepackingcompany.com/2018/12/30/18160992/packers-vs-lions-week-17-2018-first-half-game-updates-discussion



marty -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/30/2018 1:21:11 PM)

And the run game gets stalled by a holding call on Compton, because the league prefers games to not be won running the ball, but by passing.



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