RE: General Vikes Talk

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kgdabom -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/10/2021 6:48:14 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: David F. quote: ORIGINAL: kgdabom quote: ORIGINAL: David F. quote: ORIGINAL: kgdabom quote: ORIGINAL: David F. quote: ORIGINAL: kgdabom quote: ORIGINAL: David F. quote: ORIGINAL: kgdabom quote: ORIGINAL: David F. quote: ORIGINAL: kgdabom quote: ORIGINAL: TJSweens quote: ORIGINAL: David F. quote: ORIGINAL: Todd M Take the gamble...pay 99 and lock him up for the next 5 years. Yep. He's a cornerstone of the defense and an incredible talent. He's watched the team tear up the contracts of other players and give them raises. The teams have the best doctors money can buy. They know if he can play or not. This whole mess should have been cleaned up by draft day. If they couldn't agree to a contract they would have had trade options for the draft. If Hunter had underperformed his contract, he would have been forced to either renegotiate to a more team favorable contract or would have been released. Hunter is exercising the only leverage he has. I have no problem with that. He already pocketed the signing bonus and got paid last year for not playing at all. Because he signed long term deal and got the security that came with it. If he thinks creating bad will between himself and the team is leverage whatever. Do you want him on the field this year or not? Yes and him reporting to camp is the best way to assure we see him on the field this year. Hunter violating his contract will lead to ill will and perhaps an impasse where he doesn't take the field for us this year. And you don't see a new contract as a way to remedy that? Sure give a player who we don't have a clue whether he's any good or not a new contract with a huge raise. Sure it would remedy that, but by no means worth the cost. The Vikings have already given Hunter a signing bonus and paid him for a year of not playing football. It's Hunter's turn to show some good will by honoring his contract and showing he is the all pro caliber defensive end he was in 2019. If he is then the Vikings will step up like they always do and rework his contract to be commensurate with Hunter's abilities. If he isn't Hunter still gets paid for 3 more years because he took the security route of signing a long term deal. We have some clue. He's been sending videos of his workouts and Zimmer said they were impressive. He's not suddenly become a gimp. And to say Hunter needs to show some good will is so naive. Teams will dump a player in a heartbeat if they don't live up to expectations. After this year, Hunter only has $9 million guaranteed left on his deal. He is arguably the best defensive player in football. He is the most talented player on our team. If we were in a rebuilding mode I'd be less urgent with the need to keep him but if we don't put Hunter on the field this season then everything the team has done for the last three years has been for nothing. It would be the very definition of failure. All the good will has come from the Vikings. The signing bonus and paying him for not playing last year. If Hunter can never play again the Vikings will still be paying him what? Another $40 million? To show good faith Hunter should honor his contract by showing up to any mandatory activities. Show the Vikings he is fully healed and the Vikings will compensate him like they always do their own. I agree with you that Hunter assuming health is critical, but why would he have a problem doing what I suggest unless something is wrong with him? He's already protected in case of a practice injury. Another $40 million? Try $15.3. And should he honor his ridiculously undervalued contract this year, continue to deliver elite excellence, and then suffer a career ending injury in the last game he is owed $7 million. There are players that can’t even sniff his jock with way better deals than him. He only gets a limited chance to make his money. Honor his current deal? That’s laughable. The team won’t honor one more penny than what’s guaranteed at their whim. I just looked up the Spotrac details. 5 years 72Million 15 million of that signing bonus prorated over the 5 years but paid up front. Remaining compensation for the next 3 years is. 2021 12,150,000 + 500,000 Roster Bonus 2022 11,400,000 + 500,000 Roster Bonus 2023 11,400,000 remaining compensation to be paid 36,950,000 Factor in the prorated signing bonus and it's 45,950,000 DF you are so full of crap. After double checking what looks like intentional blatant lies I don't know if I can believe anything you say here. And how much of that remaining compensation is guaranteed? $15.3 if he’s done this year. $7 million next year. And that’s cumulative. It’s not $22.3 total it’s $15.3 total. You’re awfully sure of yourself or you’re the greatest satire of all time. My statement was if he was injured and unable to play again. In that case the Vikings would have to pay all of it. The Vikings would not be allowed to cut him to weasel out of paying him. They would have to HONOR the contract. DF you were either making an honest mistake or flat out lying. Which is it? It's OK to admit when you're wrong.

David F. -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/10/2021 6:51:03 PM)
What part of not guaranteed do you not understand?

kgdabom -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/10/2021 6:53:11 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: David F. What part of not guaranteed do you not understand? It's guaranteed in case of injury.

ratoppenheimer -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/10/2021 7:07:37 PM)
. . Both parties have the right to follow the language of the contract, which Hunter and his agent read, agreed to, and signed...Hunter has the right to get a private insurance policy if he wants more money guaranteed against injury.... Hunter also suffered a cervical spine disc herniation in his neck, which required surgery last year, and resulted in missing the entire season on IR. That type of neck injury is what sidelined Mike Hughes, and after surgery began to flare up again, causing him to miss more time. When the Vikings released Hughes, there were reports that Hughes simply wasn’t the same player after suffering the neck injuries. That injury is also what sidelined Peyton Manning years ago, ultimately requiring four surgeries, including an eventual cervical fusion of the vertebrate. Manning played a few more years in Denver, but missed time his last year. Kam Chancellor also suffered a similar injury, and retired a year later at age 30, as later tests showed no healing, and he risked paralysis if he continued to play. I haven’t seen any reports suggesting Hunter’s neck hasn’t healed after surgery, and his continuing to work-out and prepare for the coming season suggests the surgery went well and his neck has healed. But there is also no telling if the injury could flare up again, as it did with Mike Hughes...daily norseman

David F. -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/10/2021 8:00:22 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: kgdabom quote: ORIGINAL: David F. What part of not guaranteed do you not understand? It's guaranteed in case of injury. Only the $15.3. $7 after this season where he’s supposed to ‘prove he’s any good.’

kgdabom -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/10/2021 8:03:42 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: David F. quote: ORIGINAL: kgdabom quote: ORIGINAL: David F. What part of not guaranteed do you not understand? It's guaranteed in case of injury. Only the $15.3. $7 after this season where he’s supposed to ‘prove he’s any good.’ Prove it. I'm of the understanding that with any career ending injury the full balance of the contract is guaranteed. A quick internet search revealed this and several other similar reports. Are NFL contracts guaranteed for injury? This guarantee comes into effect when a player suffers a football-related injury that renders him unable to play the length of his contract, as diagnosed by the team's physician. This usually occurs in situations where a player suffers a career-ending injury and the team has no choice but to release said player.Mar 10, 2021 and this What happens to NFL contract when player is injured? Normally, NFL player contracts stipulate that teams cannot just cut a player who is injured while playing or practicing with the team. They are required to continue honoring the player's contract until the player is deemed medically cleared by their doctor.

kgdabom -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/10/2021 8:22:54 PM)
This is the best/most complete report regarding contracts and injuries I've found so far. John Blick, Played and Coached Answered October 9, 2020 Normally, NFL player contracts stipulate that teams cannot just cut a player who is injured while playing or practicing with the team. They are required to continue honoring the player’s contract until the player is deemed medically cleared by their doctor. At that point, the player can resume playing or the club can cut them and would only owe money that was marked as guaranteed. The idea of a career-ending injury is actually a bit misunderstood, as almost all players are medically cleared eventually. Being cleared doesn’t mean they are still capable of playing at a high level, in which case they would be cut and their career would end. In rare cases, where a young player sustains a truly debilitating injury, such as paralysis, a team may try and negotiate a settlement with the player. This would be tricky for them as the player isn’t obligated to settle and a team would face a PR nightmare with the public if they mistreated a player who received this type of injury while playing for them in good faith. There are some undrafted rookies, just trying to make the team who have signed an injury waiver to be allowed to participate in pre-season practices. If a player signs an injury waiver, the club is not responsible for honoring the contract and can cut them immediately. Only players who are relatively unknown would be asked to sign an injury waiver, so chances are you haven’t heard of anyone this has happened to. If a player injures themselves outside of practice or a game, say they fall off a skateboard at home and severely break their ankle, the team is free to cut them and possible not even owe them guaranteed money. They could go so far as to sue the player and try to recover money from a signing bonus if the player was injured doing something where there was a high probability of being injured, like skydiving. Most contracts have language that protects the organization from incidents such as this, but everything is negotiable, and a player may be able to negotiate some further protections into their contract. 2.4K viewsView 3 upvotes

David F. -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/10/2021 8:35:04 PM)
Yes they will pay a player who is injured during the season for as long as he’s injured - that season. Then they can cut them at the end of the season. They don’t get the rest of the remaining years compensation.

kgdabom -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/10/2021 8:52:46 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: David F. Yes they will pay a player who is injured during the season for as long as he’s injured - that season. Then they can cut them at the end of the season. They don’t get the rest of the remaining years compensation. Nope did you read any of what I posted. Here is my statement that you disputed and tried to act like I was an idiot. If Hunter can never play again the Vikings will still be paying him what? Another $40 million? Once again note I stated can NEVER PLAY AGAIN. If Hunter can no longer play the Vikings are on the hook for every penny of the remainder of his contract. They can't cut him and weasel out. Just admit you were wrong. It's not that big a deal.

Pager -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/10/2021 9:14:04 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Pager quote: ORIGINAL: kgdabom quote: ORIGINAL: Pager quote: ORIGINAL: David F. quote: ORIGINAL: Todd M Take the gamble...pay 99 and lock him up for the next 5 years. Yep. He's a cornerstone of the defense and an incredible talent. He's watched the team tear up the contracts of other players and give them raises. The teams have the best doctors money can buy. They know if he can play or not. I don't remember us ever tearing up a contract. I've seen us give extensions but could be wrong. I would be ok adding 3 years 90 M to his contract with low guaranteed money with that guarantee money coming in the form of signing bonus. Protects the team a little, ups Hunter's annual salary, gives him some money up front. 30 M a year for a non qb? That is some tall cotton. Not in 3-4 years. Look what highest paid DE get right now. We 'd be projecting what it will take and adding a little. That was a ballpark number/best guess (I'd have to look up what the highest paid gets right now). If we structure it right, it provides downside protection in case the neck injury re-occurs or impacts his performance. Finally had time to look it up. Bosa @ 27M and Garrett @25M https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nfl/news/nfl-highest-paid-defensive-players-salary/6zz96k59t0l21vowl9ef4wixr What do you say now KGB?

David F. -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/10/2021 9:34:29 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: kgdabom quote: ORIGINAL: David F. Yes they will pay a player who is injured during the season for as long as he’s injured - that season. Then they can cut them at the end of the season. They don’t get the rest of the remaining years compensation. Nope did you read any of what I posted. Here is my statement that you disputed and tried to act like I was an idiot. If Hunter can never play again the Vikings will still be paying him what? Another $40 million? Once again note I stated can NEVER PLAY AGAIN. If Hunter can no longer play the Vikings are on the hook for every penny of the remainder of his contract. They can't cut him and weasel out. Just admit you were wrong. It's not that big a deal. OK. If Hunter is paralyzed or blinded then the team owes him his entire contract. In that 0.004% of injury scenarios you are correct. In the world of reality I'm correct.

Pager -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/10/2021 9:40:16 PM)
https://www.yahoo.com/news/love-struggles-teammates-talk-everything-164700144.html

Phil Riewer -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/11/2021 7:05:38 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Pager quote: ORIGINAL: Pager quote: ORIGINAL: kgdabom quote: ORIGINAL: Pager quote: ORIGINAL: David F. quote: ORIGINAL: Todd M Take the gamble...pay 99 and lock him up for the next 5 years. Yep. He's a cornerstone of the defense and an incredible talent. He's watched the team tear up the contracts of other players and give them raises. The teams have the best doctors money can buy. They know if he can play or not. I don't remember us ever tearing up a contract. I've seen us give extensions but could be wrong. I would be ok adding 3 years 90 M to his contract with low guaranteed money with that guarantee money coming in the form of signing bonus. Protects the team a little, ups Hunter's annual salary, gives him some money up front. 30 M a year for a non qb? That is some tall cotton. Not in 3-4 years. Look what highest paid DE get right now. We 'd be projecting what it will take and adding a little. That was a ballpark number/best guess (I'd have to look up what the highest paid gets right now). If we structure it right, it provides downside protection in case the neck injury re-occurs or impacts his performance. Finally had time to look it up. Bosa @ 27M and Garrett @25M https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nfl/news/nfl-highest-paid-defensive-players-salary/6zz96k59t0l21vowl9ef4wixr What do you say now KGB? The problem with Hunter and the Vikings is trust...if I remember correctly the 2nd opinion found that Hunter needed surgery....so I am sure that has Hunter thinking all of a sudden he could be done and my team isn't taking care of me.

bstinger -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/11/2021 7:18:04 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Trekgeekscott quote: ORIGINAL: TJSweens quote: ORIGINAL: Trekgeekscott quote: ORIGINAL: David F. I don't care didily squat if Hunter is a Viking for life. I want him on the field THIS season. To make that happen he needs a new deal. Right now he makes Yannick Ngakoue money. Let that sink in a bit. Rest assured he has. Without him playing this season the team has NO chance of doing anything substantial. Obviously make it contingent on him passing a physical (as every contract already is). He has a deal. And a pretty good one. Yannick Ngakoue is vastly overpaid. Hunter signed the deal. He missed an entire year. He's very good if healthy but he needs to prove he's healthy. If he goes out there an dominates this year I will be all for him renegotiating his contract. but he missed all of last year with a neck injury. He has to show he is completely healthy and return to dominate. If he doesn't play, he loses money and nobody will eventually sign him for more because of the attitude and injury history. He doesn't have as much leverage as people think IMO Boy that simply isn't true. Plenty of teams would be happy to pay him. He is the best pass rusher in football. Good contract? The best DE in football is the 13th highest paid. He hasn't rushed a QB since January 2020. He's coming off an injury that ended Kam Chancellor's career.... One that sapped a HOF QBs arm strength. we don't know how he will respond and how he will perform at all. By the end of this season, if he plays at all we may regret paying him what we are currently paying him. It's all speculation at this point. they shouldn't set a precedent of renegotiation when there are years left on a contract. If he had played last year and didn't have the neck issue. I would agree we should find a way to pay him more...but not under these circumstances. I agree with this take and Dana's from a few posts ago. I also see the other side of the argument. Wondering if a contract extension can be written in such a way that it is conditional on how he plays this year. Meet a certain threshold, get a bonus for this year and a raise for the next X years. Don't meet that standard, contract stays the same, or something like that. I'd be willing to ink that deal. Protects the team and gives Hunter the potential to earn bigger money.

Bill Johanesen -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/11/2021 7:25:55 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ratoppenheimer . . Both parties have the right to follow the language of the contract, which Hunter and his agent read, agreed to, and signed...Hunter has the right to get a private insurance policy if he wants more money guaranteed against injury.... Hunter also suffered a cervical spine disc herniation in his neck, which required surgery last year, and resulted in missing the entire season on IR. That type of neck injury is what sidelined Mike Hughes, and after surgery began to flare up again, causing him to miss more time. When the Vikings released Hughes, there were reports that Hughes simply wasn’t the same player after suffering the neck injuries. That injury is also what sidelined Peyton Manning years ago, ultimately requiring four surgeries, including an eventual cervical fusion of the vertebrate. Manning played a few more years in Denver, but missed time his last year. Kam Chancellor also suffered a similar injury, and retired a year later at age 30, as later tests showed no healing, and he risked paralysis if he continued to play. I haven’t seen any reports suggesting Hunter’s neck hasn’t healed after surgery, and his continuing to work-out and prepare for the coming season suggests the surgery went well and his neck has healed. But there is also no telling if the injury could flare up again, as it did with Mike Hughes...daily norseman To add to the speculation that has run amok, with the track record on that type of injury/surgery Hunter could be trying to get a better contract now in case his performance simply suffers. Or maybe he just doesn't want to come to minicamp but plans to show up for everything after it. Edit: looks like the performance thing was referred to in the above post.

Bill Johanesen -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/11/2021 7:36:09 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: bstinger quote: ORIGINAL: Trekgeekscott quote: ORIGINAL: TJSweens quote: ORIGINAL: Trekgeekscott quote: ORIGINAL: David F. I don't care didily squat if Hunter is a Viking for life. I want him on the field THIS season. To make that happen he needs a new deal. Right now he makes Yannick Ngakoue money. Let that sink in a bit. Rest assured he has. Without him playing this season the team has NO chance of doing anything substantial. Obviously make it contingent on him passing a physical (as every contract already is). He has a deal. And a pretty good one. Yannick Ngakoue is vastly overpaid. Hunter signed the deal. He missed an entire year. He's very good if healthy but he needs to prove he's healthy. If he goes out there an dominates this year I will be all for him renegotiating his contract. but he missed all of last year with a neck injury. He has to show he is completely healthy and return to dominate. If he doesn't play, he loses money and nobody will eventually sign him for more because of the attitude and injury history. He doesn't have as much leverage as people think IMO Boy that simply isn't true. Plenty of teams would be happy to pay him. He is the best pass rusher in football. Good contract? The best DE in football is the 13th highest paid. He hasn't rushed a QB since January 2020. He's coming off an injury that ended Kam Chancellor's career.... One that sapped a HOF QBs arm strength. we don't know how he will respond and how he will perform at all. By the end of this season, if he plays at all we may regret paying him what we are currently paying him. It's all speculation at this point. they shouldn't set a precedent of renegotiation when there are years left on a contract. If he had played last year and didn't have the neck issue. I would agree we should find a way to pay him more...but not under these circumstances. I agree with this take and Dana's from a few posts ago. I also see the other side of the argument. Wondering if a contract extension can be written in such a way that it is conditional on how he plays this year. Meet a certain threshold, get a bonus for this year and a raise for the next X years. Don't meet that standard, contract stays the same, or something like that. I'd be willing to ink that deal. Protects the team and gives Hunter the potential to earn bigger money. Seems a basic incentive-laden contract with # sacks etc. is common but I don't know how that works for multi-year extensions. Potential problem is IF the Vikings doctors originally said his neck was fine, then why should they want Hunter to have to rely on incentives. Guess the Vikes could counter that the surgery has made a questionmark of everything. All that would boil down to whether the surgery was absolutely necessary or could the injury have healed with time, therapy, etc.

TJSweens -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/11/2021 8:00:33 AM)
Did the doctors initially say his neck was fine? I thought they said it was hurt, but they were hoping to treat it with therapy. I have two siblings who had the same issue and the doctors told them, the first step is always therapy. A lot of times herniations will slide back into place with the proper physical therapy. They don't go on to surgery until they have exhausted the therapy option.

Bill Jandro -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/11/2021 8:12:52 AM)
Seems to me Hunter has to bite the bullet and show he's still the same guy. Some kind of gentleman's agreement needs to be reached. After all he is closer to the beginning of his 5 year deal than the end of it.

TJSweens -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/11/2021 8:29:17 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro Seems to me Hunter has to bite the bullet and show he's still the same guy. Some kind of gentleman's agreement needs to be reached. After all he is closer to the beginning of his 5 year deal than the end of it. I don't see that happening. Hunter's agent will, no doubt, keep him from softening his stance. You can stand on the principle of setting a bad precedent. I accept that. The reality is that if the Vikings stand firm on that point, then Danielle Hunter has likely played his last game for the Vikings.

Phil Riewer -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/11/2021 8:33:42 AM)
Andrew Krammer's Mailbag take on Hunter/DLine/CBs: Q: Why aren't the Vikings signing more pass rushers? What does the pass rush and defensive end rotation look like if Hunter can't be counted on? — @thiscrapsucks35 AK: The Vikings' offseason moves in stockpiling veteran cornerbacks Patrick Peterson, Mackensie Alexander, and Bashaud Breeland, gives off the appearance they're banking on Danielle Hunter showing up at some point. Really, Hunter doesn't have much leverage as a 26-year-old star pass rusher in his prime with three years remaining on his current contract while also coming off neck surgery. Hunter is already sending a message by skipping "voluntary" OTAs, for which he was always present prior to this financial riff and now gives up a $100,000 workout bonus for not attending. If he skips next week's mandatory minicamp, it'll be up to the Vikings whether he gets fined the $93,085 for those three days. The real date that matters is the start of training camp in late July, when under the most recent collective bargaining agreement the Vikings are not allowed to waive a daily $50,000 fine for veteran players like Hunter. Follow the transactions: the most significant pass rusher the Vikings added this offseason is defensive end Stephen Weatherly, who has been standing in Hunter's place during spring practices as the left defensive end. That was for a fully guaranteed $500,000. Just six weeks ago, the front office added a third-round end in Patrick Jones II and a fourth-round end in Janarius Robinson. Those moves reflect the need for depth, not a team that's expecting to blink on moving on from its top pass rusher. If/when Hunter reports, he'll lead a pass rush that's expected to feature him, Weatherly, and second-year edge D.J. Wonnum. One of the more intriguing training camp battles will be for roster spots behind them. Jones and Robinson could force out familiar names like Jalyn Holmes and Hercules Mata'afa. Q: Who will be the next free agent the Vikings sign? — @joeldubiel AK: Defensive tackle Geno Atkins has made a lot of sense for a long time. He was an All-Pro selection in 2012 and 2015 for former Bengals coordinators Mike Zimmer and Paul Guenther; both are now on the Vikings staff after Zimmer hired Guenther as a senior assistant this offseason. Atkins is now 33 years old and was cut by the Bengals in March to save nearly $10 million in cap space. He's also coming off shoulder surgery that ended his 2020 season. Medical and financial hurdles would need to be cleared for the Vikings to sign Atkins, but the move would make sense for a defense that lacks interior pass rush and would only need him for a rotational/third-down role behind starters Michael Pierce and Dalvin Tomlinson. Money might be the biggest hurdle, as the Vikings will pay $16 million in cash ($6 million in immediate cap space) this year for signing Tomlinson in March. — Q: Do you think with all the depth at cornerback Zimmer has something up his sleeve with more dime (six defensive backs) packages? — @nicholasbartels AK: I think the depth at cornerback is more about finding the right three corners to play in the often-used nickel, or five defensive back, package, as well as ensuring an injury or two won't cause a massive drop in play. Think about it this way: would the Vikings remove either linebacker Anthony Barr or Eric Kendricks from the field in favor of their fourth corner? Probably not. With how well he covers tight ends and running backs, Kendricks might as well be a third safety on the field. No, the cornerback signings reflect the Vikings not wanting to bank on either of last year's starters in Jeff Gladney and Cameron Dantzler, for very different reasons. Gladney remains away from the team after an April arrest on alleged felony domestic assault, while Dantzler's offseason directive was to bulk up and stay healthy, but he's yet to take an 11-on-11 rep during three OTAs open to reporters while watching from the sideline with his upper right leg wrapped. Dantzler as a No. 4 option, likely behind Breeland, may seem more appealing to the Vikings. Dantzler could still develop into a long-term starter, but the pressure on him in 2021 has decreased.

The Happy Norseman -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/11/2021 8:55:32 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TJSweens quote: ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro Seems to me Hunter has to bite the bullet and show he's still the same guy. Some kind of gentleman's agreement needs to be reached. After all he is closer to the beginning of his 5 year deal than the end of it. I don't see that happening. Hunter's agent will, no doubt, keep him from softening his stance. You can stand on the principle of setting a bad precedent. I accept that. The reality is that if the Vikings stand firm on that point, then Danielle Hunter has likely played his last game for the Vikings. I agree about the "gentleman's agreement" but disagree on your second point. If the Vikings play hardball, what are Hunter's options? Sit out and forfeit 13mil. Then what? He's still under contract. Is he going to do the same thing all over again next year? And no one is trading for a guy who hasn't played in a year and had neck surgery. His current deal for this year is the best he's going to get. The only leverage Hunter has is the fact that he (was) a dominant DE, that Zimmer needs to run his D the way he likes. If I'm Spielman I'd sign Melvin Ingram to a one year deal. You better believe Hunter would show up to camp then.

kgdabom -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/11/2021 9:01:46 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Pager quote: ORIGINAL: Pager quote: ORIGINAL: kgdabom quote: ORIGINAL: Pager quote: ORIGINAL: David F. quote: ORIGINAL: Todd M Take the gamble...pay 99 and lock him up for the next 5 years. Yep. He's a cornerstone of the defense and an incredible talent. He's watched the team tear up the contracts of other players and give them raises. The teams have the best doctors money can buy. They know if he can play or not. I don't remember us ever tearing up a contract. I've seen us give extensions but could be wrong. I would be ok adding 3 years 90 M to his contract with low guaranteed money with that guarantee money coming in the form of signing bonus. Protects the team a little, ups Hunter's annual salary, gives him some money up front. 30 M a year for a non qb? That is some tall cotton. Not in 3-4 years. Look what highest paid DE get right now. We 'd be projecting what it will take and adding a little. That was a ballpark number/best guess (I'd have to look up what the highest paid gets right now). If we structure it right, it provides downside protection in case the neck injury re-occurs or impacts his performance. Finally had time to look it up. Bosa @ 27M and Garrett @25M https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nfl/news/nfl-highest-paid-defensive-players-salary/6zz96k59t0l21vowl9ef4wixr What do you say now KGB? I say it's tall cotton. Hunter may be worthy of tall cotton.

kgdabom -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/11/2021 9:04:10 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: David F. quote: ORIGINAL: kgdabom quote: ORIGINAL: David F. Yes they will pay a player who is injured during the season for as long as he’s injured - that season. Then they can cut them at the end of the season. They don’t get the rest of the remaining years compensation. Nope did you read any of what I posted. Here is my statement that you disputed and tried to act like I was an idiot. If Hunter can never play again the Vikings will still be paying him what? Another $40 million? Once again note I stated can NEVER PLAY AGAIN. If Hunter can no longer play the Vikings are on the hook for every penny of the remainder of his contract. They can't cut him and weasel out. Just admit you were wrong. It's not that big a deal. OK. If Hunter is paralyzed or blinded then the team owes him his entire contract. In that 0.004% of injury scenarios you are correct. In the world of reality I'm correct. I said can never play again. As in no possibility of ever playing again. That would mean he doesn't get cleared by doctors, he doesn't settle and the Vikings would have to pay everything. However, we can drop it now. You can look at it your way and be right in that sense.

bohumm -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/11/2021 9:09:29 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Trekgeekscott quote: ORIGINAL: David F. I don't care didily squat if Hunter is a Viking for life. I want him on the field THIS season. To make that happen he needs a new deal. Right now he makes Yannick Ngakoue money. Let that sink in a bit. Rest assured he has. Without him playing this season the team has NO chance of doing anything substantial. Obviously make it contingent on him passing a physical (as every contract already is). He has a deal. And a pretty good one. Yannick Ngakoue is vastly overpaid. Hunter signed the deal. He missed an entire year. He's very good if healthy but he needs to prove he's healthy. If he goes out there an dominates this year I will be all for him renegotiating his contract. but he missed all of last year with a neck injury. He has to show he is completely healthy and return to dominate. If he doesn't play, he loses money and nobody will eventually sign him for more because of the attitude and injury history. He doesn't have as much leverage as people think IMO This is naïve beyond belief---I don't think you even believe this. If he's available, I guarantee he signs a contract that is more lucrative than his current contract.

bohumm -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/11/2021 9:17:22 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: kgdabom quote: ORIGINAL: David F. quote: ORIGINAL: kgdabom quote: ORIGINAL: David F. quote: ORIGINAL: kgdabom quote: ORIGINAL: David F. quote: ORIGINAL: kgdabom quote: ORIGINAL: TJSweens quote: ORIGINAL: David F. quote: ORIGINAL: Todd M Take the gamble...pay 99 and lock him up for the next 5 years. Yep. He's a cornerstone of the defense and an incredible talent. He's watched the team tear up the contracts of other players and give them raises. The teams have the best doctors money can buy. They know if he can play or not. This whole mess should have been cleaned up by draft day. If they couldn't agree to a contract they would have had trade options for the draft. If Hunter had underperformed his contract, he would have been forced to either renegotiate to a more team favorable contract or would have been released. Hunter is exercising the only leverage he has. I have no problem with that. He already pocketed the signing bonus and got paid last year for not playing at all. Because he signed long term deal and got the security that came with it. If he thinks creating bad will between himself and the team is leverage whatever. Do you want him on the field this year or not? Yes and him reporting to camp is the best way to assure we see him on the field this year. Hunter violating his contract will lead to ill will and perhaps an impasse where he doesn't take the field for us this year. And you don't see a new contract as a way to remedy that? Sure give a player who we don't have a clue whether he's any good or not a new contract with a huge raise. Sure it would remedy that, but by no means worth the cost. The Vikings have already given Hunter a signing bonus and paid him for a year of not playing football. It's Hunter's turn to show some good will by honoring his contract and showing he is the all pro caliber defensive end he was in 2019. If he is then the Vikings will step up like they always do and rework his contract to be commensurate with Hunter's abilities. If he isn't Hunter still gets paid for 3 more years because he took the security route of signing a long term deal. We have some clue. He's been sending videos of his workouts and Zimmer said they were impressive. He's not suddenly become a gimp. And to say Hunter needs to show some good will is so naive. Teams will dump a player in a heartbeat if they don't live up to expectations. After this year, Hunter only has $9 million guaranteed left on his deal. He is arguably the best defensive player in football. He is the most talented player on our team. If we were in a rebuilding mode I'd be less urgent with the need to keep him but if we don't put Hunter on the field this season then everything the team has done for the last three years has been for nothing. It would be the very definition of failure. All the good will has come from the Vikings. The signing bonus and paying him for not playing last year. If Hunter can never play again the Vikings will still be paying him what? Another $40 million? To show good faith Hunter should honor his contract by showing up to any mandatory activities. Show the Vikings he is fully healed and the Vikings will compensate him like they always do their own. I agree with you that Hunter assuming health is critical, but why would he have a problem doing what I suggest unless something is wrong with him? He's already protected in case of a practice injury. So the Vikings should never cut someone who is under contract? That is bad faith, to sign someone to a contract and then cut them and refuse to pay the contracted salary, don't you think?

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