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ORIGINAL: TJSweens

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ORIGINAL: beo

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ORIGINAL: nfrosty

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ORIGINAL: kgdabom
I'm going to go against the herd mentality about Sanders. To me the question is does he have the ability or not. He will most likely become the Browns starting QB before the end of this season and have a good career. If we had drafted him he would have eventually started a game or two that McCarthy misses and we could keep him or trade him for a 2nd or 1st round pick down the road.

I agree with your thinking. Having two high potential young QB's on the roster would not have been a bad move. For all we know Sanders will be a HOF QB and McCarthy will be bust. Reality is most 1st round QB's end up being busts or backups at best. Having two unproven young QB's on your roster greatly increases your odds of ending up with one better than average QB.

My general belief is that any time you can get 1st round qb talent outside of the first round you should do it.

That being said... this was a really tough year to live by that for the Vikes.
You JUST got done with non stop Rodgers debate with the Vikings.
You pick Sheduer... even with the mindset of just developing to flip him and maybe outside chance he takes over for struggling JJ... and the NFL media goes NUTS with "Vikes don't trust JJ!"

I think in this case it would have just been too much of a distraction.

I don't know that I see Shedeur Sanders as a first round talent. I think his rank says more about the premium placed on the position and the weak qb class than it does about Sanders as a prospect. He fell to the 5th round for a reason. The Giants traded into the first round and drafted a qb not named Shedeur Sanders for a reason. From what I have read, teams that interviewed Sanders left their meetings saying yikes.

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ORIGINAL: TJSweens

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ORIGINAL: beo

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ORIGINAL: nfrosty

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ORIGINAL: kgdabom
I'm going to go against the herd mentality about Sanders. To me the question is does he have the ability or not. He will most likely become the Browns starting QB before the end of this season and have a good career. If we had drafted him he would have eventually started a game or two that McCarthy misses and we could keep him or trade him for a 2nd or 1st round pick down the road.

I agree with your thinking. Having two high potential young QB's on the roster would not have been a bad move. For all we know Sanders will be a HOF QB and McCarthy will be bust. Reality is most 1st round QB's end up being busts or backups at best. Having two unproven young QB's on your roster greatly increases your odds of ending up with one better than average QB.

My general belief is that any time you can get 1st round qb talent outside of the first round you should do it.

That being said... this was a really tough year to live by that for the Vikes.
You JUST got done with non stop Rodgers debate with the Vikings.
You pick Sheduer... even with the mindset of just developing to flip him and maybe outside chance he takes over for struggling JJ... and the NFL media goes NUTS with "Vikes don't trust JJ!"

I think in this case it would have just been too much of a distraction.

I don't know that I see Shedeur Sanders as a first round talent. I think his rank says more about the premium placed on the position and the weak qb class than it does about Sanders as a prospect. He fell to the 5th round for a reason. The Giants traded into the first round and drafted a qb not named Shedeur Sanders for a reason. From what I have read, teams that interviewed Sanders left their meetings saying yikes.

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ORIGINAL: kgdabom

I'm going to go against the herd mentality about Sanders. To me the question is does he have the ability or not. He will most likely become the Browns starting QB before the end of this season and have a good career. If we had drafted him he would have eventually started a game or two that McCarthy misses and we could keep him or trade him for a 2nd or 1st round pick down the road.

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ORIGINAL: TJSweens

That was the other thing that came out. The NFL scouts weren't all that impressed with Sanders skills. He is small, not much arm and holds the ball too long. Sanders compounded that part of it by opting out of every workout.

As to the interviews, there are all kinds of links. One coach described his meeting with Sanders as..."the worst formal interview I've ever been in in my life. He's so entitled. He takes unnecessary sacks. He never plays on time. He has horrible body language. He blames teammates. ... But the biggest thing is, he's not that good."

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ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

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ORIGINAL: kgdabom

I'm going to go against the herd mentality about Sanders. To me the question is does he have the ability or not. He will most likely become the Browns starting QB before the end of this season and have a good career. If we had drafted him he would have eventually started a game or two that McCarthy misses and we could keep him or trade him for a 2nd or 1st round pick down the road.

Teams didn’t think he had 1st or 2nd round talent. He really only dropped two rounds. I liked the Ohio State QB size better than Sanders plus he won it all and he was drafted after Sanders as an example.

Max Brosmer who the Vikes picked up as a UDFA had better arm talent than Sanders.

This QB class was very weak compared to last year or next year.

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ORIGINAL: TJSweens

I actually like this draft. They accomplished a fair amount with 4 picks.

1. Jackson: really happy with that pick. He is a good balance between drafting for need and talent. He is a plug and play guard, who moves right into the starting lineup and fixes the biggest problem in our lineup.

2. I like the trade that moved us down 5 spots and moved us up from 187 to 142. I also like the pick. The Tai Felton is another match of need and quality. The Vikings have nothing after Nailor. The receiver core usually has games missed and Addison could still face suspension from his DUI. This was a much bigger need than RB imo.

3. Tyrion Ingram-Dawkins: long athletic DE project to groom behind a couple of aging vets. Already strong against the run with a ton of upside. Flores loves mixing and matching fronts, so he could earn a spot in the rotation early.

4. Kobe King: good value pick. I got to watcha fair amount of Big Ten football. King is downhill tackling machine who hits like a freight train. Like a lot of ILB in the conference, he will need his coverage skills developed. Should play special teams right away.

5. Gavin Bartholomew: supposed to be a good blocking TE and the Vikings were down to TJ and Oliver at that spot. What the hell, it’s a 6th round pick.

The shuffling of late picks also landed Sam Howell. He's only 24, but a fair amount of experience in that time. Howell has a decent skill set and KOC likes him a lot.

Given the amount of picks we had and how they were spaced (yes, that's on KAM) I thought Kwesi and co. did a pretty good job.

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ORIGINAL: DavidAOlson

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ORIGINAL: TJSweens

I actually like this draft. They accomplished a fair amount with 4 picks.

1. Jackson: really happy with that pick. He is a good balance between drafting for need and talent. He is a plug and play guard, who moves right into the starting lineup and fixes the biggest problem in our lineup.

2. I like the trade that moved us down 5 spots and moved us up from 187 to 142. I also like the pick. The Tai Felton is another match of need and quality. The Vikings have nothing after Nailor. The receiver core usually has games missed and Addison could still face suspension from his DUI. This was a much bigger need than RB imo.

3. Tyrion Ingram-Dawkins: long athletic DE project to groom behind a couple of aging vets. Already strong against the run with a ton of upside. Flores loves mixing and matching fronts, so he could earn a spot in the rotation early.

4. Kobe King: good value pick. I got to watcha fair amount of Big Ten football. King is downhill tackling machine who hits like a freight train. Like a lot of ILB in the conference, he will need his coverage skills developed. Should play special teams right away.

5. Gavin Bartholomew: supposed to be a good blocking TE and the Vikings were down to TJ and Oliver at that spot. What the hell, it’s a 6th round pick.

The shuffling of late picks also landed Sam Howell. He's only 24, but a fair amount of experience in that time. Howell has a decent skill set and KOC likes him a lot.

Given the amount of picks we had and how they were spaced (yes, that's on KAM) I thought Kwesi and co. did a pretty good job.

Ditto.

It looks like they had a plan and executed about as well as they could have. They got one of the 3 (maybe 4) guards who can be expected to start right away (had the draft gone differently, they could have traded down — unlucky). They almost certainly got the guy they wanted at 97, but the trading down allowed them to get Tyrion at 139 — and still have a similar pick 142 to trade down for Howell (likely pre-arranged deal with Seattle). And then they traded down from 172 to get two picks to fill up likely reserve slots at LB and TE. I'm sure they could have traded down for more picks if they wanted, but chose not to. So that's a clear indication of mission accomplished: all planned slots filled.

At RB, so many were drafted this year that cut down day will include both some solid vets and developmental prospects. My interpretation: they're fine with what they got, and they'll evaluate who's available later.

I'm a little annoyed at the draft grade commentators who described trading this years picks to get Turner. No, most of those picks were traded to get a shot at a top QB. And after they got the QB, they made a different decision to get Turner. But I guess I'm doomed to hear forever about all the picks the Vikes traded to get Turner, because that was the net outcome. Oh well. Another "Two-pick Toby" running gag for the board to beat to death.

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ORIGINAL: Trekgeekscott

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ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

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ORIGINAL: kgdabom

I'm going to go against the herd mentality about Sanders. To me the question is does he have the ability or not. He will most likely become the Browns starting QB before the end of this season and have a good career. If we had drafted him he would have eventually started a game or two that McCarthy misses and we could keep him or trade him for a 2nd or 1st round pick down the road.

Teams didn’t think he had 1st or 2nd round talent. He really only dropped two rounds. I liked the Ohio State QB size better than Sanders plus he won it all and he was drafted after Sanders as an example.

Max Brosmer who the Vikes picked up as a UDFA had better arm talent than Sanders.

This QB class was very weak compared to last year or next year.

My thoughts were when he kept falling that we should take him, develop him, and then trade him. But Deion going on and on about Shdeur would have been too distracting. JJM is the QB here, we don't need the circus.

As for other QBs we did acquire. I like getting Howell as a backup. He's just what KOC likes. and then to get Brosmer as an UDFA...He'll probably be on the practice squad all year.

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ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

NFL.com's Zierline had UDFA OT Logan Brown as a 3rd to 4th rounder.

Sounds good but why did we pass on him twice in 6th round? Backup OT is just as important as 3rd string TE or backup ILB.

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ORIGINAL: DavidAOlson

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ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

NFL.com's Zierline had UDFA OT Logan Brown as a 3rd to 4th rounder.

Sounds good but why did we pass on him twice in 6th round? Backup OT is just as important as 3rd string TE or backup ILB.

It's to fill up the roster predictably. A team has exclusive negotiating rights for someone they draft.

By the 6th round, teams are mostly filling up backup roster spots. If the Vikes don't draft TE#3, then their TE#3 becomes whichever UDFA they can sign. Although in this case, Yurosek is about as highly rated as Bartholomew. They might want another OT in camp, but they already have that backup spot filled with somebody. So no draft pick.

Spielman used to trade back just so that he got his pick of "almost UDFAs" to put on the practice squad. Basically get guys they thought they could coach up. Bring 'em in and see what happens.

If it were me, I'd try to fill slots before the 5th, then trade back and draft the remaining highly rates players in the late 6th and 7th. Don't let guys like Ivan Pace fall out of the draft, when draftniks think he should've been drafted in the 4th or so.

What if a team traded back in the 7th and just took all these guys...

106 Isaiah Bond Texas WR
119 Xavier Restrepo Miami WR
122 Jared Ivey Mississippi ED
130 Cobee Bryant Kansas CB
143 Logan Brown Kansas OT
147 Zy Alexander LSU CB
150 Sebastian Castro Iowa S
166 Seth McLaughlin Ohio State OC

Position agnostic. BPA.

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ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

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ORIGINAL: DavidAOlson

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ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

NFL.com's Zierline had UDFA OT Logan Brown as a 3rd to 4th rounder.

Sounds good but why did we pass on him twice in 6th round? Backup OT is just as important as 3rd string TE or backup ILB.

It's to fill up the roster predictably. A team has exclusive negotiating rights for someone they draft.

By the 6th round, teams are mostly filling up backup roster spots. If the Vikes don't draft TE#3, then their TE#3 becomes whichever UDFA they can sign. Although in this case, Yurosek is about as highly rated as Bartholomew. They might want another OT in camp, but they already have that backup spot filled with somebody. So no draft pick.

Spielman used to trade back just so that he got his pick of "almost UDFAs" to put on the practice squad. Basically get guys they thought they could coach up. Bring 'em in and see what happens.

If it were me, I'd try to fill slots before the 5th, then trade back and draft the remaining highly rates players in the late 6th and 7th. Don't let guys like Ivan Pace fall out of the draft, when draftniks think he should've been drafted in the 4th or so.

What if a team traded back in the 7th and just took all these guys...

106 Isaiah Bond Texas WR
119 Xavier Restrepo Miami WR
122 Jared Ivey Mississippi ED
130 Cobee Bryant Kansas CB
143 Logan Brown Kansas OT
147 Zy Alexander LSU CB
150 Sebastian Castro Iowa S
166 Seth McLaughlin Ohio State OC

Position agnostic. BPA.

I'm guessing having Skule and Rouse on the roster played into the decision.

Brown sounds like a guy who has all the tools but just hasn't put it all together. Kind of like Dawkins from Georgia that we got in 5th round.

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ORIGINAL: DavidAOlson

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ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

NFL.com's Zierline had UDFA OT Logan Brown as a 3rd to 4th rounder.

Sounds good but why did we pass on him twice in 6th round? Backup OT is just as important as 3rd string TE or backup ILB.

It's to fill up the roster predictably. A team has exclusive negotiating rights for someone they draft.

By the 6th round, teams are mostly filling up backup roster spots. If the Vikes don't draft TE#3, then their TE#3 becomes whichever UDFA they can sign. Although in this case, Yurosek is about as highly rated as Bartholomew. They might want another OT in camp, but they already have that backup spot filled with somebody. So no draft pick.

Spielman used to trade back just so that he got his pick of "almost UDFAs" to put on the practice squad. Basically get guys they thought they could coach up. Bring 'em in and see what happens.

If it were me, I'd try to fill slots before the 5th, then trade back and draft the remaining highly rates players in the late 6th and 7th. Don't let guys like Ivan Pace fall out of the draft, when draftniks think he should've been drafted in the 4th or so.

What if a team traded back in the 7th and just took all these guys...

106 Isaiah Bond Texas WR
119 Xavier Restrepo Miami WR
122 Jared Ivey Mississippi ED
130 Cobee Bryant Kansas CB
143 Logan Brown Kansas OT
147 Zy Alexander LSU CB
150 Sebastian Castro Iowa S
166 Seth McLaughlin Ohio State OC

Position agnostic. BPA.

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ORIGINAL: DavidAOlson

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ORIGINAL: TJSweens

I actually like this draft. They accomplished a fair amount with 4 picks.

1. Jackson: really happy with that pick. He is a good balance between drafting for need and talent. He is a plug and play guard, who moves right into the starting lineup and fixes the biggest problem in our lineup.

2. I like the trade that moved us down 5 spots and moved us up from 187 to 142. I also like the pick. The Tai Felton is another match of need and quality. The Vikings have nothing after Nailor. The receiver core usually has games missed and Addison could still face suspension from his DUI. This was a much bigger need than RB imo.

3. Tyrion Ingram-Dawkins: long athletic DE project to groom behind a couple of aging vets. Already strong against the run with a ton of upside. Flores loves mixing and matching fronts, so he could earn a spot in the rotation early.

4. Kobe King: good value pick. I got to watcha fair amount of Big Ten football. King is downhill tackling machine who hits like a freight train. Like a lot of ILB in the conference, he will need his coverage skills developed. Should play special teams right away.

5. Gavin Bartholomew: supposed to be a good blocking TE and the Vikings were down to TJ and Oliver at that spot. What the hell, it’s a 6th round pick.

The shuffling of late picks also landed Sam Howell. He's only 24, but a fair amount of experience in that time. Howell has a decent skill set and KOC likes him a lot.

Given the amount of picks we had and how they were spaced (yes, that's on KAM) I thought Kwesi and co. did a pretty good job.

Ditto.

It looks like they had a plan and executed about as well as they could have. They got one of the 3 (maybe 4) guards who can be expected to start right away (had the draft gone differently, they could have traded down — unlucky). They almost certainly got the guy they wanted at 97, but the trading down allowed them to get Tyrion at 139 — and still have a similar pick 142 to trade down for Howell (likely pre-arranged deal with Seattle). And then they traded down from 172 to get two picks to fill up likely reserve slots at LB and TE. I'm sure they could have traded down for more picks if they wanted, but chose not to. So that's a clear indication of mission accomplished: all planned slots filled.

At RB, so many were drafted this year that cut down day will include both some solid vets and developmental prospects. My interpretation: they're fine with what they got, and they'll evaluate who's available later.

I'm a little annoyed at the draft grade commentators who described trading this years picks to get Turner. No, most of those picks were traded to get a shot at a top QB. And after they got the QB, they made a different decision to get Turner. But I guess I'm doomed to hear forever about all the picks the Vikes traded to get Turner, because that was the net outcome. Oh well. Another "Two-pick Toby" running gag for the board to beat to death.

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ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

Didn't expect much going into the draft, and the results are about on par with expectations.

After the Wyatt Davis non-experience, we drafted his clone. Didn't think Jackson was a reach. A reach is drafting someone that you assuredly could have drafted much later, so you draft someone else and get the original player in the next round or two.

The WR is fast so there's that.

The DE was not productive at Georgia but we'll see if he is a diamond in the rough. PS?

The LB, PS. The TE might have a chance to stick on the roster.

The most startling thing was how bad the highlights of the collective group were!

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ORIGINAL: DavidAOlson

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ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

Didn't expect much going into the draft, and the results are about on par with expectations.

After the Wyatt Davis non-experience, we drafted his clone. Didn't think Jackson was a reach. A reach is drafting someone that you assuredly could have drafted much later, so you draft someone else and get the original player in the next round or two.

The WR is fast so there's that.

The DE was not productive at Georgia but we'll see if he is a diamond in the rough. PS?

The LB, PS. The TE might have a chance to stick on the roster.

The most startling thing was how bad the highlights of the collective group were!

Don't expect much, and you're rarely disappointed.

Unusual definition of reach. It doesn't make sense to me if Dallas drafting Booker at 12 doesn't qualify as a reach. YMMV.

I'm not thrilled with Felton, either. But he was the tail end of round 3; so that doesn't surprise me. And at WR the Vikes do have a recent history of drafting & developing reasonably well. We'll see.

Tyrion Ingram-Dawkins (needs a nickname) was supposedly productive in the run game, just not as a pass rusher. If he didn't have some major flaw, he wouldn't have lasted past round 4.

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ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

Didn't expect much going into the draft, and the results are about on par with expectations.

After the Wyatt Davis non-experience, we drafted his clone. Didn't think Jackson was a reach. A reach is drafting someone that you assuredly could have drafted much later, so you draft someone else and get the original player in the next round or two.

The WR is fast so there's that.

The DE was not productive at Georgia but we'll see if he is a diamond in the rough. PS?

The LB, PS. The TE might have a chance to stick on the roster.

The most startling thing was how bad the highlights of the collective group were!

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

Didn't expect much going into the draft, and the results are about on par with expectations.

After the Wyatt Davis non-experience, we drafted his clone. Didn't think Jackson was a reach. A reach is drafting someone that you assuredly could have drafted much later, so you draft someone else and get the original player in the next round or two.

The WR is fast so there's that.

The DE was not productive at Georgia but we'll see if he is a diamond in the rough. PS?

The LB, PS. The TE might have a chance to stick on the roster.

The most startling thing was how bad the highlights of the collective group were!

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ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

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ORIGINAL: DavidAOlson

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ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

Didn't expect much going into the draft, and the results are about on par with expectations.

After the Wyatt Davis non-experience, we drafted his clone. Didn't think Jackson was a reach. A reach is drafting someone that you assuredly could have drafted much later, so you draft someone else and get the original player in the next round or two.

The WR is fast so there's that.

The DE was not productive at Georgia but we'll see if he is a diamond in the rough. PS?

The LB, PS. The TE might have a chance to stick on the roster.

The most startling thing was how bad the highlights of the collective group were!

Don't expect much, and you're rarely disappointed.

Unusual definition of reach. It doesn't make sense to me if Dallas drafting Booker at 12 doesn't qualify as a reach. YMMV.

I'm not thrilled with Felton, either. But he was the tail end of round 3; so that doesn't surprise me. And at WR the Vikes do have a recent history of drafting & developing reasonably well. We'll see.

Tyrion Ingram-Dawkins (needs a nickname) was supposedly productive in the run game, just not as a pass rusher. If he didn't have some major flaw, he wouldn't have lasted past round 4.

TID

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