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kgdabom -> RE: General Vikes Talk (5/12/2019 4:06:34 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro Absconded from another site Out of 81 eligible TE’s, Rudolph ranks 59th and 60th in run and pass blocking grades according to PFF And for the primary receiving TEs that's probably average. And it's from PFF so why did I even bother.

Tom Sykes -> RE: General Vikes Talk (5/12/2019 4:16:05 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson He doesn't block. It's time for him to go. Sure he does. He's no Morgan, that's for sure. Like a lot of TEs, he occupies defenders more than he drives them off the ball. Yes I've seen him get run over, but I've also seen him getting it done. I think he's gone. I'm ready to roll with Smith even though he is no sure thing ... I'm interested in seeing what Hikutini brings, if anything. Just hoping someone can fill the gap in production that Rudolph will leave.

Bruce Johnson -> RE: General Vikes Talk (5/12/2019 4:37:13 PM)
He occupies defenders on running plays too?

Tom Sykes -> RE: General Vikes Talk (5/12/2019 4:41:17 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: David F. If a slow TE with zero open field skill can produce in this offense then why the heck aren’t we asking what a faster, more agile TE could do? Alex smith produced just fine in KC too. That's the thing. Rudolph is what he is ... but the problem is not Rudolph, it has been the team's inability to find a better downfield threat. Instead of the slow dude (who is somewhat effective on short yardage and in the redzone) complementing a better TE ... we have pure blockers or even less effective pass catchers complementing him. I understand the exasperation with Rudolph ... it would be nice to see Rudy (playing for less) complementing Smith – if Smith is what we hope he is.

Tom Sykes -> RE: General Vikes Talk (5/12/2019 4:51:30 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson He occupies defenders on running plays too? Don't make it sound like Rudolph runs the other direction when he's supposed to block. He's a good effort player who is a subpar blocker. There's plenty to criticize without embellishing.

Bruce Johnson -> RE: General Vikes Talk (5/12/2019 6:21:04 PM)
I know he makes effort to run with the ball after catching it, too. [;)]

Bruce Johnson -> RE: General Vikes Talk (5/12/2019 6:25:18 PM)
Trae Waynes, Jeff Badet to participate in new NFL fastest man competition https://www.dailynorseman.com/2019/5/12/18616886/trae-waynes-jeff-badet-nfl-fastest-man-competition-40-yards-of-gold-minnesota-vikings

Tom Sykes -> RE: General Vikes Talk (5/12/2019 6:43:58 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson I know he makes effort to run with the ball after catching it, too. [;)] Point taken.

Bruce Johnson -> RE: General Vikes Talk (5/12/2019 7:30:48 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes quote: ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson I know he makes effort to run with the ball after catching it, too. [;)] Point taken. I feel like I am a bad guy because I have been defending Rudolph until now. It's just that we didn't protect our quarterback and we didn't run the ball very well last year. I came to the conclusion that it's not all on the O-linemen. Rudolph has strengths. He catches almost everything and he converts first downs and scores touchdowns. But it still is a team game.

kgdabom -> RE: General Vikes Talk (5/12/2019 8:02:34 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson quote: ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes quote: ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson I know he makes effort to run with the ball after catching it, too. [;)] Point taken. I feel like I am a bad guy because I have been defending Rudolph until now. It's just that we didn't protect our quarterback and we didn't run the ball very well last year. I came to the conclusion that it's not all on the O-linemen. Rudolph has strengths. He catches almost everything and he converts first downs and scores touchdowns. But it still is a team game. IMO if we had average OL play last year we had a shot at the title.

Bruce Johnson -> RE: General Vikes Talk (5/13/2019 6:21:06 AM)
With our outside zone running scheme, even as a tight end will Rudolph be a good fit moving His feet laterally or finding a defender to block on the second level? I'm not sure Morgan is either.

Bruce Johnson -> RE: General Vikes Talk (5/13/2019 6:24:31 AM)
I checked out Morgan's draft profile to see if he might be athletic enough. Still not sure. Maybe. https://syndication.bleacherreport.com/amp/2632153-david-morgan-ii-nfl-draft-2016-scouting-report-grade-for-vikings-rookie.amp.html

Phil Riewer -> RE: General Vikes Talk (5/13/2019 7:41:19 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson quote: ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes quote: ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson I know he makes effort to run with the ball after catching it, too. [;)] Point taken. I feel like I am a bad guy because I have been defending Rudolph until now. It's just that we didn't protect our quarterback and we didn't run the ball very well last year. I came to the conclusion that it's not all on the O-linemen. Rudolph has strengths. He catches almost everything and he converts first downs and scores touchdowns. But it still is a team game. That doesn't make you a bad guy in this. There are some that say Rudolph isn't good. I think Rudolph is good---I just think he is the one you trade or cut over Waynes or Griffen (at this point). I saw how little Cousins went to Rudolph except for one game. Diggs and Thielen are so dominant that Rudolph is the fourth or fifth option which makes him expendable at 7.5 million.

kgdabom -> RE: General Vikes Talk (5/13/2019 8:09:00 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson I checked out Morgan's draft profile to see if he might be athletic enough. Still not sure. Maybe. https://syndication.bleacherreport.com/amp/2632153-david-morgan-ii-nfl-draft-2016-scouting-report-grade-for-vikings-rookie.amp.html Morgan is basically an O Lineman who has good hands for catching the ball. He is ridiculously slow for a TE at over 5 second 40. He was a great pick for us in the late 6th round IIRC, for his blocking ability and reliable hands. I'd never heard of him before we drafted him, but as soon as we did and I heard the reports I was confident that he would not only make the team, but be used regularly.

kgdabom -> RE: General Vikes Talk (5/13/2019 8:13:11 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer quote: ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson quote: ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes quote: ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson I know he makes effort to run with the ball after catching it, too. [;)] Point taken. I feel like I am a bad guy because I have been defending Rudolph until now. It's just that we didn't protect our quarterback and we didn't run the ball very well last year. I came to the conclusion that it's not all on the O-linemen. Rudolph has strengths. He catches almost everything and he converts first downs and scores touchdowns. But it still is a team game. That doesn't make you a bad guy in this. There are some that say Rudolph isn't good. I think Rudolph is good---I just think he is the one you trade or cut over Waynes or Griffen (at this point). I saw how little Cousins went to Rudolph except for one game. Diggs and Thielen are so dominant that Rudolph is the fourth or fifth option which makes him expendable at 7.5 million. Rudolph was the third option in the passing game catching about 4 passes per game. In the next to last game last season against Detroit he busted out for 9 receptions on 9 targets, 122 yards and 2 TDs. I think assuming he remains on the team he will continue to be the #3 option, but eventually be supplanted by Smith for that role.

kgdabom -> RE: General Vikes Talk (5/13/2019 8:33:34 AM)
Hillarious article from the Daily Norseman. Vikings OL: Love it or List it. https://www.dailynorseman.com/2019/5/9/18538100/the-vikings-offensive-line-are-you-going-to-love-it-or-list-it

Phil Riewer -> RE: General Vikes Talk (5/13/2019 9:01:46 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: kgdabom quote: ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer quote: ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson quote: ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes quote: ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson I know he makes effort to run with the ball after catching it, too. [;)] Point taken. I feel like I am a bad guy because I have been defending Rudolph until now. It's just that we didn't protect our quarterback and we didn't run the ball very well last year. I came to the conclusion that it's not all on the O-linemen. Rudolph has strengths. He catches almost everything and he converts first downs and scores touchdowns. But it still is a team game. That doesn't make you a bad guy in this. There are some that say Rudolph isn't good. I think Rudolph is good---I just think he is the one you trade or cut over Waynes or Griffen (at this point). I saw how little Cousins went to Rudolph except for one game. Diggs and Thielen are so dominant that Rudolph is the fourth or fifth option which makes him expendable at 7.5 million. Rudolph was the third option in the passing game catching about 4 passes per game. In the next to last game last season against Detroit he busted out for 9 receptions on 9 targets, 122 yards and 2 TDs. I think assuming he remains on the team he will continue to be the #3 option, but eventually be supplanted by Smith for that role. Again....targets last year Thielen 153 Diggs 149 Rudolph 82 Treadwell 53 RBs 75 (cook 49 Murray 26) He is a third option but when you have Thielen and Diggs with so many targets (like I mentioned in the last post)...you can get by w/o Rudolph if they find someone better than Treadwell (beebe, Mitchell, etc.)

kgdabom -> RE: General Vikes Talk (5/13/2019 9:12:58 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer quote: ORIGINAL: kgdabom quote: ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer quote: ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson quote: ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes quote: ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson I know he makes effort to run with the ball after catching it, too. [;)] Point taken. I feel like I am a bad guy because I have been defending Rudolph until now. It's just that we didn't protect our quarterback and we didn't run the ball very well last year. I came to the conclusion that it's not all on the O-linemen. Rudolph has strengths. He catches almost everything and he converts first downs and scores touchdowns. But it still is a team game. That doesn't make you a bad guy in this. There are some that say Rudolph isn't good. I think Rudolph is good---I just think he is the one you trade or cut over Waynes or Griffen (at this point). I saw how little Cousins went to Rudolph except for one game. Diggs and Thielen are so dominant that Rudolph is the fourth or fifth option which makes him expendable at 7.5 million. Rudolph was the third option in the passing game catching about 4 passes per game. In the next to last game last season against Detroit he busted out for 9 receptions on 9 targets, 122 yards and 2 TDs. I think assuming he remains on the team he will continue to be the #3 option, but eventually be supplanted by Smith for that role. Again....targets last year Thielen 153 Diggs 149 Rudolph 82 Treadwell 53 RBs 75 (cook 49 Murray 26) He is a third option but when you have Thielen and Diggs with so many targets (like I mentioned in the last post)...you can get by w/o Rudolph if they find someone better than Treadwell (beebe, Mitchell, etc.) We will most likely be using two TE base sets this year. In the Kubiak offense the #3WR averages 21 receptions per season. Expect Rudolph and Smith to combine for over 100 receptions.

thebigo -> RE: General Vikes Talk (5/13/2019 9:17:58 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson Trae Waynes, Jeff Badet to participate in new NFL fastest man competition https://www.dailynorseman.com/2019/5/12/18616886/trae-waynes-jeff-badet-nfl-fastest-man-competition-40-yards-of-gold-minnesota-vikings Badet wins, Waynes blows his hammy out.

kgdabom -> RE: General Vikes Talk (5/13/2019 9:20:12 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: thebigo quote: ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson Trae Waynes, Jeff Badet to participate in new NFL fastest man competition https://www.dailynorseman.com/2019/5/12/18616886/trae-waynes-jeff-badet-nfl-fastest-man-competition-40-yards-of-gold-minnesota-vikings Badet wins, Waynes blows his hammy out. Waynes is very fast, but Badet is ridiculously fast. I think Badet has a chance to win the competition. I don't think it is all that risky. They have all the players at the combine running 40s and I almost never hear of injuries from that.

thebigo -> RE: General Vikes Talk (5/13/2019 9:21:32 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: kgdabom quote: ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson I checked out Morgan's draft profile to see if he might be athletic enough. Still not sure. Maybe. https://syndication.bleacherreport.com/amp/2632153-david-morgan-ii-nfl-draft-2016-scouting-report-grade-for-vikings-rookie.amp.html Morgan is basically an O Lineman who has good hands for catching the ball. He is ridiculously slow for a TE at over 5 second 40. He was a great pick for us in the late 6th round IIRC, for his blocking ability and reliable hands. I'd never heard of him before we drafted him, but as soon as we did and I heard the reports I was confident that he would not only make the team, but be used regularly. While slow, I think Morgan has bit of a knack for picking his way downfield after the catch.

Phil Riewer -> RE: General Vikes Talk (5/13/2019 9:24:10 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: kgdabom quote: ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer quote: ORIGINAL: kgdabom quote: ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer quote: ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson quote: ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes quote: ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson I know he makes effort to run with the ball after catching it, too. [;)] Point taken. I feel like I am a bad guy because I have been defending Rudolph until now. It's just that we didn't protect our quarterback and we didn't run the ball very well last year. I came to the conclusion that it's not all on the O-linemen. Rudolph has strengths. He catches almost everything and he converts first downs and scores touchdowns. But it still is a team game. That doesn't make you a bad guy in this. There are some that say Rudolph isn't good. I think Rudolph is good---I just think he is the one you trade or cut over Waynes or Griffen (at this point). I saw how little Cousins went to Rudolph except for one game. Diggs and Thielen are so dominant that Rudolph is the fourth or fifth option which makes him expendable at 7.5 million. Rudolph was the third option in the passing game catching about 4 passes per game. In the next to last game last season against Detroit he busted out for 9 receptions on 9 targets, 122 yards and 2 TDs. I think assuming he remains on the team he will continue to be the #3 option, but eventually be supplanted by Smith for that role. Again....targets last year Thielen 153 Diggs 149 Rudolph 82 Treadwell 53 RBs 75 (cook 49 Murray 26) He is a third option but when you have Thielen and Diggs with so many targets (like I mentioned in the last post)...you can get by w/o Rudolph if they find someone better than Treadwell (beebe, Mitchell, etc.) We will most likely be using two TE base sets this year. In the Kubiak offense the #3WR averages 21 receptions per season. Expect Rudolph and Smith to combine for over 100 receptions. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/den/2015.htm Did Vernon Davis and Owen Daniels have 100 receptions in 2015 when Denver had two stud WRs? (nope)

thebigo -> RE: General Vikes Talk (5/13/2019 9:27:33 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: kgdabom quote: ORIGINAL: thebigo quote: ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson Trae Waynes, Jeff Badet to participate in new NFL fastest man competition https://www.dailynorseman.com/2019/5/12/18616886/trae-waynes-jeff-badet-nfl-fastest-man-competition-40-yards-of-gold-minnesota-vikings Badet wins, Waynes blows his hammy out. Waynes is very fast, but Badet is ridiculously fast. I think Badet has a chance to win the competition. I don't think it is all that risky. They have all the players at the combine running 40s and I almost never hear of injuries from that. The combine is a bunch of guys who have been training just for the combine, this thing you don't where the guys are at conditioning wise. I'm a little surprised teams are on board with this. I don't know how the competition is organized, probably single elimination, in that case the eventual winner would be running 4 times.

kgdabom -> RE: General Vikes Talk (5/13/2019 9:27:46 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer quote: ORIGINAL: kgdabom quote: ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer quote: ORIGINAL: kgdabom quote: ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer quote: ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson quote: ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes quote: ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson I know he makes effort to run with the ball after catching it, too. [;)] Point taken. I feel like I am a bad guy because I have been defending Rudolph until now. It's just that we didn't protect our quarterback and we didn't run the ball very well last year. I came to the conclusion that it's not all on the O-linemen. Rudolph has strengths. He catches almost everything and he converts first downs and scores touchdowns. But it still is a team game. That doesn't make you a bad guy in this. There are some that say Rudolph isn't good. I think Rudolph is good---I just think he is the one you trade or cut over Waynes or Griffen (at this point). I saw how little Cousins went to Rudolph except for one game. Diggs and Thielen are so dominant that Rudolph is the fourth or fifth option which makes him expendable at 7.5 million. Rudolph was the third option in the passing game catching about 4 passes per game. In the next to last game last season against Detroit he busted out for 9 receptions on 9 targets, 122 yards and 2 TDs. I think assuming he remains on the team he will continue to be the #3 option, but eventually be supplanted by Smith for that role. Again....targets last year Thielen 153 Diggs 149 Rudolph 82 Treadwell 53 RBs 75 (cook 49 Murray 26) He is a third option but when you have Thielen and Diggs with so many targets (like I mentioned in the last post)...you can get by w/o Rudolph if they find someone better than Treadwell (beebe, Mitchell, etc.) We will most likely be using two TE base sets this year. In the Kubiak offense the #3WR averages 21 receptions per season. Expect Rudolph and Smith to combine for over 100 receptions. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/den/2015.htm Did Vernon Davis and Owen Daniels have 100 receptions in 2015 when Denver had two stud WRs? (nope) Good point. If Rudolph can maintain his 64 all Smith needs to do is catch 36 that's barely over 2 a game. If they can both catch 3 a game that's 96. I think it's doable, but certainly not a lock. How many did VD and Reed combine for in their best year together? Did they manage 100?

kgdabom -> RE: General Vikes Talk (5/13/2019 9:29:57 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: thebigo quote: ORIGINAL: kgdabom quote: ORIGINAL: thebigo quote: ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson Trae Waynes, Jeff Badet to participate in new NFL fastest man competition https://www.dailynorseman.com/2019/5/12/18616886/trae-waynes-jeff-badet-nfl-fastest-man-competition-40-yards-of-gold-minnesota-vikings Badet wins, Waynes blows his hammy out. Waynes is very fast, but Badet is ridiculously fast. I think Badet has a chance to win the competition. I don't think it is all that risky. They have all the players at the combine running 40s and I almost never hear of injuries from that. The combine is a bunch of guys who have been training just for the combine, this thing you don't where the guys are at conditioning wise. I'm a little surprised teams are on board with this. I don't know how the competition is organized, probably single elimination, in that case the eventual winner would be running 4 times. I'm sure the guys in this competition are training for it. It "should" be safe.

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