quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

Dline 2019

Hunter 13.5ml
Griffin 11.0ml 1.2 dead cap
Joseph 10.7ml 3.6 dead cap

I can't see bringing Richardson back on a big long term contract. We're already paying big money to Smith, Rhode,s Kendricks, and Waynes 5th year option.

I would cut Griffin and roll with the young guys. I'd consider cutting joseph as well.

Need to redirect some money to the oline and modern day TE

quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

Dline 2019

Hunter 13.5ml
Griffin 11.0ml 1.2 dead cap
Joseph 10.7ml 3.6 dead cap

I can't see bringing Richardson back on a big long term contract. We're already paying big money to Smith, Rhode,s Kendricks, and Waynes 5th year option.

I would cut Griffin and roll with the young guys. I'd consider cutting joseph as well.

Need to redirect some money to the oline and modern day TE

Agreed. I think this would be asking too much of Zimmer, given what we've seen from him thus far.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: ronhextall

Luck has a very clean pocket.

It's because he gets rid of the ball quickly. Against an offense that is clicking, high-priced defensive linemen are irrelevant. My case:


"The NFL is a passing league. In particular, a short-passing league. It doesn't matter who the defensive end is. If a good quarterback is running a crisp offense, it's a two-step drop and it's gone. No defensive end on the planet has time to get to the quarterback when an offense is clicking.

Since the turn of the century, Michael Strahan was arguably the best sack man in the game. He led the league with 22.5 in 2003. It's still the NFL record despite the fact that teams are now throwing the ball way more than ever before. If you look at most pass attempts for a season in NFL history, 12 of the top 13 have happened since 2010. Only Drew Bledsoe in 1994 is not.

Aaron Donald led the league this year with 20.5 sacks. Opponents threw the ball 533 times against the Rams. What was he doing the other 512.5 pass plays?

The Patriots have arguably been the most dominant franchise in the league for quite some time. They are the model of how to build a team. Have they ever spent big money on a pass-rushing defensive end? Can you name their defensive ends over the past 8-10 years? Last year their sack leader was Trey Flowers (6.5). 2016 it was Trey Flowers (7.0). Chandler Jones led them in 2015 (12.5). Rob Ninkovich in 2014 (8.0). Chandler Jones again in 2013 (11.5). Ninkovich again in 2012 (8.0). Andre Carter and Mark Anderson in 2011 had 10 each (who?). Mike Wright in 2010 with 5.5 (seriously, never heard of him). In 2009 it was Tully Banta-Cain (10.0). All good football players I'm sure, but not exactly household names.

Trey Flowers has led the Patriots for the last three seasons in sacks. He has a base salary of $1.9-million. Conversely, next season, Everson Griffin will have a base salary of $10.9-million. Linval Joseph will have a base salary of $8.9-million next season. Sheldon Richardson earned $5.8-million this season. In other words, the Vikings are hemorrhaging money on the defensive front. The Texans are even more ridiculous. Clowney made a base salary of $12.3-million this season. Watt made $11-million. Is it any wonder why the Vikings and Texans both have bad offensive lines?"
Brad H (1/6/19)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: ronhextall

Luck has a very clean pocket.

It's because he gets rid of the ball quickly. Against an offense that is clicking, high-priced defensive linemen are irrelevant. My case:


"The NFL is a passing league. In particular, a short-passing league. It doesn't matter who the defensive end is. If a good quarterback is running a crisp offense, it's a two-step drop and it's gone. No defensive end on the planet has time to get to the quarterback when an offense is clicking.

Since the turn of the century, Michael Strahan was arguably the best sack man in the game. He led the league with 22.5 in 2003. It's still the NFL record despite the fact that teams are now throwing the ball way more than ever before. If you look at most pass attempts for a season in NFL history, 12 of the top 13 have happened since 2010. Only Drew Bledsoe in 1994 is not.

Aaron Donald led the league this year with 20.5 sacks. Opponents threw the ball 533 times against the Rams. What was he doing the other 512.5 pass plays?

The Patriots have arguably been the most dominant franchise in the league for quite some time. They are the model of how to build a team. Have they ever spent big money on a pass-rushing defensive end? Can you name their defensive ends over the past 8-10 years? Last year their sack leader was Trey Flowers (6.5). 2016 it was Trey Flowers (7.0). Chandler Jones led them in 2015 (12.5). Rob Ninkovich in 2014 (8.0). Chandler Jones again in 2013 (11.5). Ninkovich again in 2012 (8.0). Andre Carter and Mark Anderson in 2011 had 10 each (who?). Mike Wright in 2010 with 5.5 (seriously, never heard of him). In 2009 it was Tully Banta-Cain (10.0). All good football players I'm sure, but not exactly household names.

Trey Flowers has led the Patriots for the last three seasons in sacks. He has a base salary of $1.9-million. Conversely, next season, Everson Griffin will have a base salary of $10.9-million. Linval Joseph will have a base salary of $8.9-million next season. Sheldon Richardson earned $5.8-million this season. In other words, the Vikings are hemorrhaging money on the defensive front. The Texans are even more ridiculous. Clowney made a base salary of $12.3-million this season. Watt made $11-million. Is it any wonder why the Vikings and Texans both have bad offensive lines?"
Brad H (1/6/19)

Interesting.

Three reasons I can't subscribe to any Patriots model:
1) Their coaching has not been replicated anywhere so it's ludicrous to mirror their player structure but not have the coaches.
2) Their division has been the crappiest in football for at least a decade. They should go 6-0 in it every year. That goes a long way to a first round bye and HFA.
3) Brady.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: ronhextall

Luck has a very clean pocket.

It's because he gets rid of the ball quickly. Against an offense that is clicking, high-priced defensive linemen are irrelevant. My case:


"The NFL is a passing league. In particular, a short-passing league. It doesn't matter who the defensive end is. If a good quarterback is running a crisp offense, it's a two-step drop and it's gone. No defensive end on the planet has time to get to the quarterback when an offense is clicking.

Since the turn of the century, Michael Strahan was arguably the best sack man in the game. He led the league with 22.5 in 2003. It's still the NFL record despite the fact that teams are now throwing the ball way more than ever before. If you look at most pass attempts for a season in NFL history, 12 of the top 13 have happened since 2010. Only Drew Bledsoe in 1994 is not.

Aaron Donald led the league this year with 20.5 sacks. Opponents threw the ball 533 times against the Rams. What was he doing the other 512.5 pass plays?

The Patriots have arguably been the most dominant franchise in the league for quite some time. They are the model of how to build a team. Have they ever spent big money on a pass-rushing defensive end? Can you name their defensive ends over the past 8-10 years? Last year their sack leader was Trey Flowers (6.5). 2016 it was Trey Flowers (7.0). Chandler Jones led them in 2015 (12.5). Rob Ninkovich in 2014 (8.0). Chandler Jones again in 2013 (11.5). Ninkovich again in 2012 (8.0). Andre Carter and Mark Anderson in 2011 had 10 each (who?). Mike Wright in 2010 with 5.5 (seriously, never heard of him). In 2009 it was Tully Banta-Cain (10.0). All good football players I'm sure, but not exactly household names.

Trey Flowers has led the Patriots for the last three seasons in sacks. He has a base salary of $1.9-million. Conversely, next season, Everson Griffin will have a base salary of $10.9-million. Linval Joseph will have a base salary of $8.9-million next season. Sheldon Richardson earned $5.8-million this season. In other words, the Vikings are hemorrhaging money on the defensive front. The Texans are even more ridiculous. Clowney made a base salary of $12.3-million this season. Watt made $11-million. Is it any wonder why the Vikings and Texans both have bad offensive lines?"
Brad H (1/6/19)

Interesting.

Three reasons I can't subscribe to any Patriots model:
1) Their coaching has not been replicated anywhere so it's ludicrous to mirror their player structure but not have the coaches.
2) Their division has been the crappiest in football for at least a decade. They should go 6-0 in it every year. That goes a long way to a first round bye and HFA.
3) Brady.

Either way, the Patriots have not committed much to defensive linemen. That's the point, and it's fairly irrefutable. Why other organizations haven't followed shouldn't be an indictment on the Patriots as much as a direct indictment on the rest of the teams in the league.

Yep, they got Brady. They've also always had a good line in front of him as a result of not overpaying for defensive linemen.

And yes, their division has always been $hit. I'll give you that one.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: ronhextall

Luck has a very clean pocket.

It's because he gets rid of the ball quickly. Against an offense that is clicking, high-priced defensive linemen are irrelevant. My case:


"The NFL is a passing league. In particular, a short-passing league. It doesn't matter who the defensive end is. If a good quarterback is running a crisp offense, it's a two-step drop and it's gone. No defensive end on the planet has time to get to the quarterback when an offense is clicking.

Since the turn of the century, Michael Strahan was arguably the best sack man in the game. He led the league with 22.5 in 2003. It's still the NFL record despite the fact that teams are now throwing the ball way more than ever before. If you look at most pass attempts for a season in NFL history, 12 of the top 13 have happened since 2010. Only Drew Bledsoe in 1994 is not.

Aaron Donald led the league this year with 20.5 sacks. Opponents threw the ball 533 times against the Rams. What was he doing the other 512.5 pass plays?

The Patriots have arguably been the most dominant franchise in the league for quite some time. They are the model of how to build a team. Have they ever spent big money on a pass-rushing defensive end? Can you name their defensive ends over the past 8-10 years? Last year their sack leader was Trey Flowers (6.5). 2016 it was Trey Flowers (7.0). Chandler Jones led them in 2015 (12.5). Rob Ninkovich in 2014 (8.0). Chandler Jones again in 2013 (11.5). Ninkovich again in 2012 (8.0). Andre Carter and Mark Anderson in 2011 had 10 each (who?). Mike Wright in 2010 with 5.5 (seriously, never heard of him). In 2009 it was Tully Banta-Cain (10.0). All good football players I'm sure, but not exactly household names.

Trey Flowers has led the Patriots for the last three seasons in sacks. He has a base salary of $1.9-million. Conversely, next season, Everson Griffin will have a base salary of $10.9-million. Linval Joseph will have a base salary of $8.9-million next season. Sheldon Richardson earned $5.8-million this season. In other words, the Vikings are hemorrhaging money on the defensive front. The Texans are even more ridiculous. Clowney made a base salary of $12.3-million this season. Watt made $11-million. Is it any wonder why the Vikings and Texans both have bad offensive lines?"
Brad H (1/6/19)

Interesting.

Three reasons I can't subscribe to any Patriots model:
1) Their coaching has not been replicated anywhere so it's ludicrous to mirror their player structure but not have the coaches.
2) Their division has been the crappiest in football for at least a decade. They should go 6-0 in it every year. That goes a long way to a first round bye and HFA.
3) Brady.

Either way, the Patriots have not committed much to defensive linemen. That's the point, and it's fairly irrefutable. Why other organizations haven't followed shouldn't be an indictment on the Patriots as much as a direct indictment on the rest of the teams in the league.

Yep, they got Brady. They've also always had a good line in front of him as a result of not overpaying for defensive linemen.

And yes, their division has always been $hit. I'll give you that one.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ragnarök

Report: Kevin Stefanski not returning to Vikings; Mike Mularkey atop wish list for OC

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jason Dorn

https://www.podcastone.com/episode/Assessing-the-Vikings-wreckage-ep-427-

Who is to blame for the Vikings' season coming to an end Sunday with an embarrassing loss to the Chicago Bears at U.S. Bank Stadium? Matthew Coller and Judd Zulgad discuss and also get into whether Mike Zimmer and Rick Spielman are in jeopardy of losing their jobs



https://www.podcastone.com/episode/The-coach-GM-are-returning-so-whats-next-ep-428


Matthew Coller and former NFL quarterback Sage Rosenfels dive deep into the Vikings' disappointing season, who is to blame, whether keeping Zimmer and Spielman is a good idea, how to fix the Vikings' offense, the offseason checklist and where Teddy Bridgewater lands.


Not all see the greatness in Kirk Cousins.


Cliff notes from ep 427 below

(Zulgad)
The FO and coaching staff told us, "don't worry, we're football people and we know what we're doing with our personnel, our offensive line is going to be fine". This is among one of the most disappointing seasons in Vikings history, when considering the expectations in the offseason, and the organization got what they deserved for their arrogance.

I said, don't draft an SEC kicker, Rick! You've been down this road before.

Kirk is paid like a top 3-5 player, and he in no way, shape, or form is. The fact that the team paid a player this much and expected him to carry a team like the other top paid players in the league do, is flawed logic.

I think the buy-in from the locker room when it comes to Cousins is very, very small. Cousins is a corporate QB in that he's constantly telling everyone, "I've got a brain coach, I work with guys on the sidelines". He's constantly telling guys what they should be doing. Kirk Cousins is the type of guy that believes - I'm the QB, I walk in the locker room, I tell you what to do and you say....wow, there's a guy that can really lead. That's not how it works! It works by guys saying - wow, that guys got "it", that guy has the ability to lead. If there's a primary concern to me as this season comes to a close, it's that I think Kirk has lost this team. You can have as many personalized coaches as you want, you can try and coach guys as much as you want, but if you don't have "it", it's not going to work! It's why Washington didn't sign him longterm.

If your first round pick doesn't go toward the best available offensive lineman, you are certifiably crazy! People should be fired! You'd have to be crazy if your first round pick is on the defensive side of the ball. The Wilfs don't get personally involved in personnel decision-making, but I think this is one of the times where they need to walk into the room and say - "Listen you bozos, I don't care what you think you're going to do, but you're going to draft the best available offensive lineman", end of discussion, and then walk out of the room!


(Collier)
Eric Eager from PFF and I dissected Kirk Cousnins' games prior to the season. Eric is one of the smartest football minds out there, he's a guy that NFL teams actually call for advice on players. Eric said prior to the season, "I can legitimately see this team winning only 8 games". We got flooded with tweets and emails from fans telling us, "YOU'RE CRAZY!! Eric stated that "Kirk is a very flawed player with huge holes in his game! If the offensive line doesn't play right, if the playcalls aren't exactly perfect, if the defense isn't dominant for him, you're going to see this team miss the playoffs if all of these factors don't come into play"! The outcome of this season was predicted by his past play. Jay Gruden stated that, "our team's success was reflective of the QB play", when Cousins was at the helm.

Against the Buffalo Bills, your QB no-showed. Against the Seattle Seahawks, your QB no-showed. Against the New England Patriots, your QB no-showed. And when you needed him the most, the guy that was Mr. 4000 yards, did not come through in any way. Other QB's in this league overcome a turnover, overcome a dropped pass, overcome defensive lapses. I watched Deshaun Watson, who's the most sacked QB in the game, bring his team back and take the lead in the 4th quarter against the Eagles. THEN, I watched NICK FREAKING FOLES come back and win the game, and our QB acts like it's impossible, and everybody makes excuses for him CONSTANTLY!(He's screaming at this point) COME ON! YOU CAN'T TAKE THE RESPONSIBILITY OFF OF A PLAYER WHO IS CONSISTENTLY RESPONSIBLE FOR THE TEAM LOSING! AND AT THE END OF THE DAY IN THE BEARS' GAME, HE THROWS FOR 132 YARDS, A MUST-WIN GAME, HE THROWS FOR 132 YARDS. HOW IS THAT POSSIBLE??

I truly believe that despite some of the obstacles the rest of this team faced, this QB can't overcome ANYTHING that goes wrong. They gave him a top defense, and he consistently gave away points to the other team. I'll guarantee you when I look at the statistics at the end of the year, the Vikings will have a top ranked defense by DVOA. And that's what we always heard prior to this season - "Ah, Kirk never had an elite defense before". We gave him an elite defense, we gave him a star runningback, we gave him two of the absolute best wide receivers in the NFL, they gave him a competent TE. And you want to try and say that Cousins would have been fine if you'd just drafted Will Hernandez in the first round? I'm sorry, but you go what you signed up for.....$84 million dollars worth of 8-8.

It's a shame what happened to Teddy Bridgewater, he was everything that Kirk Cousins isn't! He took command of the locker room and made people better around him. He made the offensive line better around him, he made bad receivers better. He scored on a very high percentage of his drives. This year's offense, when I go back and look at the final stats, will be at the bottom of the league. Where, if you go back and look at the offenses Teddy ran, people are surprised to find out that they're always in the top 10 because they didn't throw pick 6's, they didn't constantly fumble the ball, and they consistently converted 3rd downs. What you saw against the Bears was synonymous of Cousins' career. It was 3rd and 17 and he throws a checkdown to Rudolph. Thanks, Sam Bradford! He doesn't seem to have the ability to take anyone to the next level, including when there's a pass rush. I think that the shortcomings of Cousins are easily abused in games against good teams with good coaching. Cousins doesn't have the ability to diagnose pre-snap disguises from good defense.

Thielen has shown frustration with Cousins, even going back to mini camps. We never saw that with Keenum, we certainly never saw that with him and Teddy. I wonder about the buy-in by the locker room.

A couple things from the Bears' game. I want to formerly issue an apology to Mitchell Trubiski. He only threw for 163 yards, not terribly impressive. But he had what I like to call, a Teddy Bridgewater win. He came up big in big situations, he didn't put up huge stats, but he did a wonderful job in this game. On a dagger drive, he completed multiple 3rd and longs, ran for a first down juking out Anthony Barr, he had zero turnovers, and he convinced me that he has enough of the playmaker ability to actually help his team win. Chicago was without their top 2 receivers and yet the team and QB still stepped up.

Jay Gruden and Mike Zimmer know each other very well, I wouldn't be surprised if Jay didn't text Zimmer after the Bears' game and say, "that's Kirk"



Happy New Year! Enjoy running Zimmer out of town. Skol.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ragnarök

​After firing offensive coordinator John DeFilippo and reportedly letting his replacement, Kevin Stefanski, interview for head coaching jobs, the ​Minnesota Vikings are reportedly set on making ​Mike Mularkey their next OC.


In other words, they went from guys who throw the ball too much to someone who, if he had his way, would never throw the ball at all. Talk about over-compensating.

Mularkey was public enemy No. 1 among Twitter tape-grinders and Titans fans alike. After a sparkling sophomore season for quarterback Marcus Mariota under offensive coordinator Terry Robiskie, Mularkey assumed more control of the offense in order to implement his "exotic smashmouth" gameplan. The next year, Mariota threw more picks than touchdowns.

​​Mularkey could easily be a terrific position coach in today's ​NFL, but he is a dinosaur with regards to his offensive philosophy, creativity, and capacity for effective play design. Offensive coordinator might not be the best gig for him right now.





Sounds like just the dinosaur to fit in to Zimms philosophy and get the most out of Kirk Cousins!

Why cant the Vikings ever get out of their own way?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ragnarök

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jason Dorn

https://www.podcastone.com/episode/Assessing-the-Vikings-wreckage-ep-427-

Who is to blame for the Vikings' season coming to an end Sunday with an embarrassing loss to the Chicago Bears at U.S. Bank Stadium? Matthew Coller and Judd Zulgad discuss and also get into whether Mike Zimmer and Rick Spielman are in jeopardy of losing their jobs



https://www.podcastone.com/episode/The-coach-GM-are-returning-so-whats-next-ep-428


Matthew Coller and former NFL quarterback Sage Rosenfels dive deep into the Vikings' disappointing season, who is to blame, whether keeping Zimmer and Spielman is a good idea, how to fix the Vikings' offense, the offseason checklist and where Teddy Bridgewater lands.


Not all see the greatness in Kirk Cousins.


Cliff notes from ep 427 below

(Zulgad)
The FO and coaching staff told us, "don't worry, we're football people and we know what we're doing with our personnel, our offensive line is going to be fine". This is among one of the most disappointing seasons in Vikings history, when considering the expectations in the offseason, and the organization got what they deserved for their arrogance.

I said, don't draft an SEC kicker, Rick! You've been down this road before.

Kirk is paid like a top 3-5 player, and he in no way, shape, or form is. The fact that the team paid a player this much and expected him to carry a team like the other top paid players in the league do, is flawed logic.

I think the buy-in from the locker room when it comes to Cousins is very, very small. Cousins is a corporate QB in that he's constantly telling everyone, "I've got a brain coach, I work with guys on the sidelines". He's constantly telling guys what they should be doing. Kirk Cousins is the type of guy that believes - I'm the QB, I walk in the locker room, I tell you what to do and you say....wow, there's a guy that can really lead. That's not how it works! It works by guys saying - wow, that guys got "it", that guy has the ability to lead. If there's a primary concern to me as this season comes to a close, it's that I think Kirk has lost this team. You can have as many personalized coaches as you want, you can try and coach guys as much as you want, but if you don't have "it", it's not going to work! It's why Washington didn't sign him longterm.

If your first round pick doesn't go toward the best available offensive lineman, you are certifiably crazy! People should be fired! You'd have to be crazy if your first round pick is on the defensive side of the ball. The Wilfs don't get personally involved in personnel decision-making, but I think this is one of the times where they need to walk into the room and say - "Listen you bozos, I don't care what you think you're going to do, but you're going to draft the best available offensive lineman", end of discussion, and then walk out of the room!


(Collier)
Eric Eager from PFF and I dissected Kirk Cousnins' games prior to the season. Eric is one of the smartest football minds out there, he's a guy that NFL teams actually call for advice on players. Eric said prior to the season, "I can legitimately see this team winning only 8 games". We got flooded with tweets and emails from fans telling us, "YOU'RE CRAZY!! Eric stated that "Kirk is a very flawed player with huge holes in his game! If the offensive line doesn't play right, if the playcalls aren't exactly perfect, if the defense isn't dominant for him, you're going to see this team miss the playoffs if all of these factors don't come into play"! The outcome of this season was predicted by his past play. Jay Gruden stated that, "our team's success was reflective of the QB play", when Cousins was at the helm.

Against the Buffalo Bills, your QB no-showed. Against the Seattle Seahawks, your QB no-showed. Against the New England Patriots, your QB no-showed. And when you needed him the most, the guy that was Mr. 4000 yards, did not come through in any way. Other QB's in this league overcome a turnover, overcome a dropped pass, overcome defensive lapses. I watched Deshaun Watson, who's the most sacked QB in the game, bring his team back and take the lead in the 4th quarter against the Eagles. THEN, I watched NICK FREAKING FOLES come back and win the game, and our QB acts like it's impossible, and everybody makes excuses for him CONSTANTLY!(He's screaming at this point) COME ON! YOU CAN'T TAKE THE RESPONSIBILITY OFF OF A PLAYER WHO IS CONSISTENTLY RESPONSIBLE FOR THE TEAM LOSING! AND AT THE END OF THE DAY IN THE BEARS' GAME, HE THROWS FOR 132 YARDS, A MUST-WIN GAME, HE THROWS FOR 132 YARDS. HOW IS THAT POSSIBLE??

I truly believe that despite some of the obstacles the rest of this team faced, this QB can't overcome ANYTHING that goes wrong. They gave him a top defense, and he consistently gave away points to the other team. I'll guarantee you when I look at the statistics at the end of the year, the Vikings will have a top ranked defense by DVOA. And that's what we always heard prior to this season - "Ah, Kirk never had an elite defense before". We gave him an elite defense, we gave him a star runningback, we gave him two of the absolute best wide receivers in the NFL, they gave him a competent TE. And you want to try and say that Cousins would have been fine if you'd just drafted Will Hernandez in the first round? I'm sorry, but you go what you signed up for.....$84 million dollars worth of 8-8.

It's a shame what happened to Teddy Bridgewater, he was everything that Kirk Cousins isn't! He took command of the locker room and made people better around him. He made the offensive line better around him, he made bad receivers better. He scored on a very high percentage of his drives. This year's offense, when I go back and look at the final stats, will be at the bottom of the league. Where, if you go back and look at the offenses Teddy ran, people are surprised to find out that they're always in the top 10 because they didn't throw pick 6's, they didn't constantly fumble the ball, and they consistently converted 3rd downs. What you saw against the Bears was synonymous of Cousins' career. It was 3rd and 17 and he throws a checkdown to Rudolph. Thanks, Sam Bradford! He doesn't seem to have the ability to take anyone to the next level, including when there's a pass rush. I think that the shortcomings of Cousins are easily abused in games against good teams with good coaching. Cousins doesn't have the ability to diagnose pre-snap disguises from good defense.

Thielen has shown frustration with Cousins, even going back to mini camps. We never saw that with Keenum, we certainly never saw that with him and Teddy. I wonder about the buy-in by the locker room.

A couple things from the Bears' game. I want to formerly issue an apology to Mitchell Trubiski. He only threw for 163 yards, not terribly impressive. But he had what I like to call, a Teddy Bridgewater win. He came up big in big situations, he didn't put up huge stats, but he did a wonderful job in this game. On a dagger drive, he completed multiple 3rd and longs, ran for a first down juking out Anthony Barr, he had zero turnovers, and he convinced me that he has enough of the playmaker ability to actually help his team win. Chicago was without their top 2 receivers and yet the team and QB still stepped up.

Jay Gruden and Mike Zimmer know each other very well, I wouldn't be surprised if Jay didn't text Zimmer after the Bears' game and say, "that's Kirk"



Happy New Year! Enjoy running Zimmer out of town. Skol.

So Im not the only "crazy" who voiced some of those exact thoughts...


Kirk Cousins has no clutch about him, his is a ME guy in team sport and does little to inspire his troops when all is falling apart...

He and Zimmer are perfect for one another!

Kirk Cousins is the modern day Herschel Walker mistake for Vikings!

quote:

ORIGINAL: marty

I think it will be a very good failure, and lead to Zimmer leaving town sooner, so I am all for it.

quote:

ORIGINAL: beo

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ragnarök

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jason Dorn

https://www.podcastone.com/episode/Assessing-the-Vikings-wreckage-ep-427-

Who is to blame for the Vikings' season coming to an end Sunday with an embarrassing loss to the Chicago Bears at U.S. Bank Stadium? Matthew Coller and Judd Zulgad discuss and also get into whether Mike Zimmer and Rick Spielman are in jeopardy of losing their jobs



https://www.podcastone.com/episode/The-coach-GM-are-returning-so-whats-next-ep-428


Matthew Coller and former NFL quarterback Sage Rosenfels dive deep into the Vikings' disappointing season, who is to blame, whether keeping Zimmer and Spielman is a good idea, how to fix the Vikings' offense, the offseason checklist and where Teddy Bridgewater lands.


Not all see the greatness in Kirk Cousins.


Cliff notes from ep 427 below

(Zulgad)
The FO and coaching staff told us, "don't worry, we're football people and we know what we're doing with our personnel, our offensive line is going to be fine". This is among one of the most disappointing seasons in Vikings history, when considering the expectations in the offseason, and the organization got what they deserved for their arrogance.

I said, don't draft an SEC kicker, Rick! You've been down this road before.

Kirk is paid like a top 3-5 player, and he in no way, shape, or form is. The fact that the team paid a player this much and expected him to carry a team like the other top paid players in the league do, is flawed logic.

I think the buy-in from the locker room when it comes to Cousins is very, very small. Cousins is a corporate QB in that he's constantly telling everyone, "I've got a brain coach, I work with guys on the sidelines". He's constantly telling guys what they should be doing. Kirk Cousins is the type of guy that believes - I'm the QB, I walk in the locker room, I tell you what to do and you say....wow, there's a guy that can really lead. That's not how it works! It works by guys saying - wow, that guys got "it", that guy has the ability to lead. If there's a primary concern to me as this season comes to a close, it's that I think Kirk has lost this team. You can have as many personalized coaches as you want, you can try and coach guys as much as you want, but if you don't have "it", it's not going to work! It's why Washington didn't sign him longterm.

If your first round pick doesn't go toward the best available offensive lineman, you are certifiably crazy! People should be fired! You'd have to be crazy if your first round pick is on the defensive side of the ball. The Wilfs don't get personally involved in personnel decision-making, but I think this is one of the times where they need to walk into the room and say - "Listen you bozos, I don't care what you think you're going to do, but you're going to draft the best available offensive lineman", end of discussion, and then walk out of the room!


(Collier)
Eric Eager from PFF and I dissected Kirk Cousnins' games prior to the season. Eric is one of the smartest football minds out there, he's a guy that NFL teams actually call for advice on players. Eric said prior to the season, "I can legitimately see this team winning only 8 games". We got flooded with tweets and emails from fans telling us, "YOU'RE CRAZY!! Eric stated that "Kirk is a very flawed player with huge holes in his game! If the offensive line doesn't play right, if the playcalls aren't exactly perfect, if the defense isn't dominant for him, you're going to see this team miss the playoffs if all of these factors don't come into play"! The outcome of this season was predicted by his past play. Jay Gruden stated that, "our team's success was reflective of the QB play", when Cousins was at the helm.

Against the Buffalo Bills, your QB no-showed. Against the Seattle Seahawks, your QB no-showed. Against the New England Patriots, your QB no-showed. And when you needed him the most, the guy that was Mr. 4000 yards, did not come through in any way. Other QB's in this league overcome a turnover, overcome a dropped pass, overcome defensive lapses. I watched Deshaun Watson, who's the most sacked QB in the game, bring his team back and take the lead in the 4th quarter against the Eagles. THEN, I watched NICK FREAKING FOLES come back and win the game, and our QB acts like it's impossible, and everybody makes excuses for him CONSTANTLY!(He's screaming at this point) COME ON! YOU CAN'T TAKE THE RESPONSIBILITY OFF OF A PLAYER WHO IS CONSISTENTLY RESPONSIBLE FOR THE TEAM LOSING! AND AT THE END OF THE DAY IN THE BEARS' GAME, HE THROWS FOR 132 YARDS, A MUST-WIN GAME, HE THROWS FOR 132 YARDS. HOW IS THAT POSSIBLE??

I truly believe that despite some of the obstacles the rest of this team faced, this QB can't overcome ANYTHING that goes wrong. They gave him a top defense, and he consistently gave away points to the other team. I'll guarantee you when I look at the statistics at the end of the year, the Vikings will have a top ranked defense by DVOA. And that's what we always heard prior to this season - "Ah, Kirk never had an elite defense before". We gave him an elite defense, we gave him a star runningback, we gave him two of the absolute best wide receivers in the NFL, they gave him a competent TE. And you want to try and say that Cousins would have been fine if you'd just drafted Will Hernandez in the first round? I'm sorry, but you go what you signed up for.....$84 million dollars worth of 8-8.

It's a shame what happened to Teddy Bridgewater, he was everything that Kirk Cousins isn't! He took command of the locker room and made people better around him. He made the offensive line better around him, he made bad receivers better. He scored on a very high percentage of his drives. This year's offense, when I go back and look at the final stats, will be at the bottom of the league. Where, if you go back and look at the offenses Teddy ran, people are surprised to find out that they're always in the top 10 because they didn't throw pick 6's, they didn't constantly fumble the ball, and they consistently converted 3rd downs. What you saw against the Bears was synonymous of Cousins' career. It was 3rd and 17 and he throws a checkdown to Rudolph. Thanks, Sam Bradford! He doesn't seem to have the ability to take anyone to the next level, including when there's a pass rush. I think that the shortcomings of Cousins are easily abused in games against good teams with good coaching. Cousins doesn't have the ability to diagnose pre-snap disguises from good defense.

Thielen has shown frustration with Cousins, even going back to mini camps. We never saw that with Keenum, we certainly never saw that with him and Teddy. I wonder about the buy-in by the locker room.

A couple things from the Bears' game. I want to formerly issue an apology to Mitchell Trubiski. He only threw for 163 yards, not terribly impressive. But he had what I like to call, a Teddy Bridgewater win. He came up big in big situations, he didn't put up huge stats, but he did a wonderful job in this game. On a dagger drive, he completed multiple 3rd and longs, ran for a first down juking out Anthony Barr, he had zero turnovers, and he convinced me that he has enough of the playmaker ability to actually help his team win. Chicago was without their top 2 receivers and yet the team and QB still stepped up.

Jay Gruden and Mike Zimmer know each other very well, I wouldn't be surprised if Jay didn't text Zimmer after the Bears' game and say, "that's Kirk"



Happy New Year! Enjoy running Zimmer out of town. Skol.

So Im not the only "crazy" who voiced some of those exact thoughts...


Kirk Cousins has no clutch about him, his is a ME guy in team sport and does little to inspire his troops when all is falling apart...

He and Zimmer are perfect for one another!

Kirk Cousins is the modern day Herschel Walker mistake for Vikings!

Everything in your post is valid...
right up until you go with the ridiculous Walker comparison...

Kirk cost us 0 draft picks. Zero.
Kirk didn't live up to expectations this year.
If Kirk flops next year we'll be looking for a new QB.
A likely scenario is we gambled and it's a 2 year failed experiment with a REALLY expensive backup for year 3 or you eat dead money over year 3 and 4.

Hardly handing another franchise a boat load of players, 3 1sts, 3 2nds, a third and change.

The over the top stuff just takes away from your argument.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ragnarök

quote:

ORIGINAL: beo

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ragnarök

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jason Dorn

https://www.podcastone.com/episode/Assessing-the-Vikings-wreckage-ep-427-

Who is to blame for the Vikings' season coming to an end Sunday with an embarrassing loss to the Chicago Bears at U.S. Bank Stadium? Matthew Coller and Judd Zulgad discuss and also get into whether Mike Zimmer and Rick Spielman are in jeopardy of losing their jobs



https://www.podcastone.com/episode/The-coach-GM-are-returning-so-whats-next-ep-428


Matthew Coller and former NFL quarterback Sage Rosenfels dive deep into the Vikings' disappointing season, who is to blame, whether keeping Zimmer and Spielman is a good idea, how to fix the Vikings' offense, the offseason checklist and where Teddy Bridgewater lands.


Not all see the greatness in Kirk Cousins.


Cliff notes from ep 427 below

(Zulgad)
The FO and coaching staff told us, "don't worry, we're football people and we know what we're doing with our personnel, our offensive line is going to be fine". This is among one of the most disappointing seasons in Vikings history, when considering the expectations in the offseason, and the organization got what they deserved for their arrogance.

I said, don't draft an SEC kicker, Rick! You've been down this road before.

Kirk is paid like a top 3-5 player, and he in no way, shape, or form is. The fact that the team paid a player this much and expected him to carry a team like the other top paid players in the league do, is flawed logic.

I think the buy-in from the locker room when it comes to Cousins is very, very small. Cousins is a corporate QB in that he's constantly telling everyone, "I've got a brain coach, I work with guys on the sidelines". He's constantly telling guys what they should be doing. Kirk Cousins is the type of guy that believes - I'm the QB, I walk in the locker room, I tell you what to do and you say....wow, there's a guy that can really lead. That's not how it works! It works by guys saying - wow, that guys got "it", that guy has the ability to lead. If there's a primary concern to me as this season comes to a close, it's that I think Kirk has lost this team. You can have as many personalized coaches as you want, you can try and coach guys as much as you want, but if you don't have "it", it's not going to work! It's why Washington didn't sign him longterm.

If your first round pick doesn't go toward the best available offensive lineman, you are certifiably crazy! People should be fired! You'd have to be crazy if your first round pick is on the defensive side of the ball. The Wilfs don't get personally involved in personnel decision-making, but I think this is one of the times where they need to walk into the room and say - "Listen you bozos, I don't care what you think you're going to do, but you're going to draft the best available offensive lineman", end of discussion, and then walk out of the room!


(Collier)
Eric Eager from PFF and I dissected Kirk Cousnins' games prior to the season. Eric is one of the smartest football minds out there, he's a guy that NFL teams actually call for advice on players. Eric said prior to the season, "I can legitimately see this team winning only 8 games". We got flooded with tweets and emails from fans telling us, "YOU'RE CRAZY!! Eric stated that "Kirk is a very flawed player with huge holes in his game! If the offensive line doesn't play right, if the playcalls aren't exactly perfect, if the defense isn't dominant for him, you're going to see this team miss the playoffs if all of these factors don't come into play"! The outcome of this season was predicted by his past play. Jay Gruden stated that, "our team's success was reflective of the QB play", when Cousins was at the helm.

Against the Buffalo Bills, your QB no-showed. Against the Seattle Seahawks, your QB no-showed. Against the New England Patriots, your QB no-showed. And when you needed him the most, the guy that was Mr. 4000 yards, did not come through in any way. Other QB's in this league overcome a turnover, overcome a dropped pass, overcome defensive lapses. I watched Deshaun Watson, who's the most sacked QB in the game, bring his team back and take the lead in the 4th quarter against the Eagles. THEN, I watched NICK FREAKING FOLES come back and win the game, and our QB acts like it's impossible, and everybody makes excuses for him CONSTANTLY!(He's screaming at this point) COME ON! YOU CAN'T TAKE THE RESPONSIBILITY OFF OF A PLAYER WHO IS CONSISTENTLY RESPONSIBLE FOR THE TEAM LOSING! AND AT THE END OF THE DAY IN THE BEARS' GAME, HE THROWS FOR 132 YARDS, A MUST-WIN GAME, HE THROWS FOR 132 YARDS. HOW IS THAT POSSIBLE??

I truly believe that despite some of the obstacles the rest of this team faced, this QB can't overcome ANYTHING that goes wrong. They gave him a top defense, and he consistently gave away points to the other team. I'll guarantee you when I look at the statistics at the end of the year, the Vikings will have a top ranked defense by DVOA. And that's what we always heard prior to this season - "Ah, Kirk never had an elite defense before". We gave him an elite defense, we gave him a star runningback, we gave him two of the absolute best wide receivers in the NFL, they gave him a competent TE. And you want to try and say that Cousins would have been fine if you'd just drafted Will Hernandez in the first round? I'm sorry, but you go what you signed up for.....$84 million dollars worth of 8-8.

It's a shame what happened to Teddy Bridgewater, he was everything that Kirk Cousins isn't! He took command of the locker room and made people better around him. He made the offensive line better around him, he made bad receivers better. He scored on a very high percentage of his drives. This year's offense, when I go back and look at the final stats, will be at the bottom of the league. Where, if you go back and look at the offenses Teddy ran, people are surprised to find out that they're always in the top 10 because they didn't throw pick 6's, they didn't constantly fumble the ball, and they consistently converted 3rd downs. What you saw against the Bears was synonymous of Cousins' career. It was 3rd and 17 and he throws a checkdown to Rudolph. Thanks, Sam Bradford! He doesn't seem to have the ability to take anyone to the next level, including when there's a pass rush. I think that the shortcomings of Cousins are easily abused in games against good teams with good coaching. Cousins doesn't have the ability to diagnose pre-snap disguises from good defense.

Thielen has shown frustration with Cousins, even going back to mini camps. We never saw that with Keenum, we certainly never saw that with him and Teddy. I wonder about the buy-in by the locker room.

A couple things from the Bears' game. I want to formerly issue an apology to Mitchell Trubiski. He only threw for 163 yards, not terribly impressive. But he had what I like to call, a Teddy Bridgewater win. He came up big in big situations, he didn't put up huge stats, but he did a wonderful job in this game. On a dagger drive, he completed multiple 3rd and longs, ran for a first down juking out Anthony Barr, he had zero turnovers, and he convinced me that he has enough of the playmaker ability to actually help his team win. Chicago was without their top 2 receivers and yet the team and QB still stepped up.

Jay Gruden and Mike Zimmer know each other very well, I wouldn't be surprised if Jay didn't text Zimmer after the Bears' game and say, "that's Kirk"



Happy New Year! Enjoy running Zimmer out of town. Skol.

So Im not the only "crazy" who voiced some of those exact thoughts...


Kirk Cousins has no clutch about him, his is a ME guy in team sport and does little to inspire his troops when all is falling apart...

He and Zimmer are perfect for one another!

Kirk Cousins is the modern day Herschel Walker mistake for Vikings!

Everything in your post is valid...
right up until you go with the ridiculous Walker comparison...

Kirk cost us 0 draft picks. Zero.
Kirk didn't live up to expectations this year.
If Kirk flops next year we'll be looking for a new QB.
A likely scenario is we gambled and it's a 2 year failed experiment with a REALLY expensive backup for year 3 or you eat dead money over year 3 and 4.

Hardly handing another franchise a boat load of players, 3 1sts, 3 2nds, a third and change.

The over the top stuff just takes away from your argument.

Over the top, maybe...

But in todays NFL what we did for Kirk Cousins fully guaranteed contract (first ever) can be viewed somewhat equivalent to the NFL back in the Herschel Walker days of trading a boat load of players... just in reverse...

Kirk is paid like a top 3-5 player, and he in no way, shape, or form is. The fact that the team paid a player this much and expected him to carry a team like the other top paid players in the league do, is flawed logic.

We traded cap space and future ability to sign players at the point we have to move on from Kirk, if as you suggest a year early and eat that contract we have essentially traded away our ability to sign players to the revenue we gave away in the back end of the deal...

As well I was more so speaking of how just as Herschel was a poor move by regime to fit a square peg in a round hole, the player's abilities did not fit with the teams schemes and philosophy of OC and play calling... was failed from start...