RE: Wild 2019/2020 Season (Full Version)

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TJSweens -> RE: Wild 2019/2020 Season (2/18/2020 6:58:46 AM)

Your wife doesn't want you watching hockey. Go away.




stfrank -> RE: Wild 2019/2020 Season (2/18/2020 7:00:26 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

Your wife doesn't want you watching hockey. Go away.

[&:]




SoMnFan -> RE: Wild 2019/2020 Season (2/18/2020 7:57:38 AM)

Anyone else get a "I'm pouting" vibe from several Wild guys during the game Saturday?
Nah, me neither.




TJSweens -> RE: Wild 2019/2020 Season (2/18/2020 8:11:03 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: SoMnFan

Anyone else get a "I'm pouting" vibe from several Wild guys during the game Saturday?
Nah, me neither.

Kind of their MO. Look, BB was doing a lot of things I didn't like. That said, the fortunes of this team will not change drastically, until the pouty bitch vibe, that has permeated that locker room for many years, is exorcised once and for all. Unfortunately, the only way to do that is to move unmovable players. The best we can hope for is that the next coach won't tolerate it or at least not enable it the way BB and Yeo did.




Mr. Ed -> RE: Wild 2019/2020 Season (2/18/2020 8:16:17 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: SoMnFan

Anyone else get a "I'm pouting" vibe from several Wild guys during the game Saturday?
Nah, me neither.

Kind of their MO. Look, BB was doing a lot of things I didn't like. That said, the fortunes of this team will not change drastically, until the pouty bitch vibe, that has permeated that locker room for many years, is exorcised once and for all. Unfortunately, the only way to do that is to move unmovable players. The best we can hope for is that the next coach won't tolerate it or at least not enable it the way BB and Yeo did.

That’s pretty weak

Trades happen
Coaches get fired even when it seems all is well

Apparently some players need to take off the blinders

Been too cushy without consequences from what you guys have posted

Sounds like the 2010s Twins while Gardy was around




twinsfan -> RE: Wild 2019/2020 Season (2/18/2020 8:34:41 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mr. Ed

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: SoMnFan

Anyone else get a "I'm pouting" vibe from several Wild guys during the game Saturday?
Nah, me neither.

Kind of their MO. Look, BB was doing a lot of things I didn't like. That said, the fortunes of this team will not change drastically, until the pouty bitch vibe, that has permeated that locker room for many years, is exorcised once and for all. Unfortunately, the only way to do that is to move unmovable players. The best we can hope for is that the next coach won't tolerate it or at least not enable it the way BB and Yeo did.

That’s pretty weak

Trades happen
Coaches get fired even when it seems all is well

Apparently some players need to take off the blinders

Been too cushy without consequences from what you guys have posted

Sounds like the 2010s Twins while Gardy was around

That's a much better comparison, Ed.




SoMnFan -> RE: Wild 2019/2020 Season (2/18/2020 8:38:29 AM)

Exclusive: Former Wild coach Bruce Boudreau opens up about his firing
Michael Russo Feb 17, 2020 467
DELLWOOD, Minn. — Bruce Boudreau went out in public for the first time Sunday afternoon.
Two days after losing his job with the Wild, after sequestering himself inside his Woodbury house for 51 hours, Boudreau walked into the private Tamarack Room at Dellwood Country Club with his wife of nearly 25 years, Crystal, to sit down with The Athletic for his first interview since the blindsiding news was delivered to him Friday morning.
The Boudreaus sat down at a corner table next to a crackling fireplace and in front of a window that faced the gorgeous, snow-covered first tee box and a glassy outdoor ice rink that reminded Boudreau of the one he skated on as a kid.
“I think small ice like that is how children can best develop puck skills,” the former junior star said.
In the adjacent dining room, there was a large family enjoying Sunday brunch, and they immediately spotted the former Wild coach and turned their heads with astonished gazes.
“For two days I haven’t shown my face because I don’t want a pity party,” Boudreau said during the sitdown over lunch. “Everybody knows me, so it’d be like, ‘Poor you.’”
But with his eyes subtly becoming wet, Boudreau, still trying to accept and digest the decision made by Wild general manager Bill Guerin, said, “It’s tough.”
It was a normal Friday morning.
Boudreau set his alarm for just after 6 a.m. and arrived first at the Wild’s practice facility in St. Paul like he did every day at 7 o’clock.
The Wild had surrendered a two-goal, third-period lead to the New York Rangers before losing in a shootout the night before. Boudreau held his normal coaches meeting at 8:45 with assistants Dean Evason, Bob Woods and Darby Hendrickson, goalie coach Bob Mason and video coach Jonas Plumb.
They broke down video, came up with a practice plan, pre-scouted the San Jose Sharks and decided on a lineup for Saturday’s game before Boudreau left the coach’s room to return to his office. It was 9:30 a.m.
“It was funny because Bill came in and he shut the door, and as soon as he shut the door, I knew,” Boudreau said. “You just know, right? And he says, ‘I’m going to make a change,’ and I instantly said, ‘Are you firing me?!’ — just like that.
“And he goes, ‘Yes.’ I said, ‘Are you ****ing kidding me?’”
Guerin said it was something he was thinking about for awhile and began to praise Boudreau for the type of coach and person he was, but Boudreau was in no mood to hear any of that. Boudreau uttered a few choice words and walked out of the room. He found a private area to calm himself down, then went into the coaches’ room.
“I said, ‘Boys, it’s been fun working with you. I just got fired,’” Boudreau said. “Dean wasn’t in there because Bill pulled him into his office to let him know he would be the interim. Then, I went and told Jonas I was fired, told Whitey (director of team operations Andrew Heydt), gave him a hug with tears in my eyes and I left.”
Boudreau has coached 10 hockey teams since 1990-91, three in the NHL, so he’s been fired plenty of times.
“But it doesn’t get easier — ever,” Boudreau said.
Over the two hours Boudreau spent with The Athletic Sunday, as broken up as he still is over losing his job, he talked about how much he enjoyed coaching the Wild and their players and how great it was to work for people like Guerin, former GM Chuck Fletcher and owner Craig Leipold.
He and his wife spoke often about how they fell in love with the people of Minnesota and how much they adored establishing roots in the state.
And Boudreau, who was 158-110-35 in three-plus seasons with the Wild and ranks 22nd in NHL history with 567 regular-season wins and third with a .635 points percentage, made it clear how much he hopes to coach again.
“If I could coach yesterday, I’d do it,” Boudreau said. “I get mad, and instead of feeling sorry for myself, I want to get right back into it. In the past, I’ve gotten lucky that I got back into it right away. When I came here four years ago, I hoped this was my last job. I hoped to be here 10 years. It didn’t work out that way, but I know I can still coach.”
________________________________________
When a coach or GM is fired, he usually disappears out of the public eye for some time. Fans and the media don’t usually get to see the heavy toll it takes on the person. For instance, when Mike Yeo was fired by the Wild, he escaped off the beaten path to northern Minnesota and Canada to go ice fishing.
“But we don’t have a second home,” Crystal said.
“We don’t have a cottage to get away to,” Bruce said.
So, since he’s hanging around, Boudreau was gracious enough Sunday afternoon to draw back that curtain on the human side of being fired.
After leaving the Wild’s practice facility Friday, Boudreau called his wife to inform her of the bad news. Crystal immediately called Boudreau’s three children from his first marriage, Andy, Ben and Kasey, and their 21-year-old son, Brady.
The next call from Crystal was to Bruce’s 86-year-old mother, Theresa.
“Yeah, I couldn’t talk to my mum,” Boudreau said. “I would have broke down.”
It’s a crazy profession hockey coaches lead.
Sure, they’re handsomely paid, but you are hired knowing full well that someday, probably relatively soon, you’ll be fired unceremoniously.
That first day, in front of a crisp, colorful backdrop, is always filled with excitement and joy as you’re presented with a brand-new baseball cap and team jersey from the general manager. In Boudreau’s case in Minnesota, that was three GMs ago — Fletcher.
You talk about how you expect to turn your new club into a perennial contender and you smile widely as you express your dream of someday winning a Stanley Cup. You say all of this to a large audience of reporters and team employees and other onlookers knowing all along that in two, three, 3 ½ years you’re probably going to be storming out of some office incensed, devastated and cursing at the sky.
Heck, look simply at this bloody year in the NHL where eight coaches have been fired or resigned, including 2018, 2017 and 2016 Stanley Cup runner-up coaches Gerard Gallant, Peter Laviolette and Pete DeBoer.
There’s no easy way to fire a coach.
Guerin agonized over the decision for a few weeks, discussed it for some time with Leipold and finally called Leipold into his office around 9 a.m. Friday to explain his reasoning and get the final go-ahead before driving a couple blocks from Wild headquarters to TRIA Rink.
“In Anaheim, two days after the season, Bob (Murray) called me to meet him in his office at 9 a.m. So you know,” Boudreau said. “At 8:59, I was waiting. At 9 o’clock I went in. At 9:01, I was out.
“With George (McPhee) in Washington, I was on my way to work, he phoned and said, ‘Can you come by the house?’ What he didn’t realize is I was five minutes away. So when I got there, he answered the door in his pajamas. He said, ‘Can you wait in my office? I’ll be right down.’ He put a suit on, and then he told me. And with George, it was different. He fired me, but then he hugged me and he said, ‘I’m going to miss you.’ There was a genuine connection there, which is why I still really like him.”
It’s reminiscent of how Fletcher fired Yeo in Minnesota. After delivering Yeo the bruising news after a loss to Boston, Fletcher and Yeo cried over a beer in Yeo’s office.
Boudreau, incidentally, never gave Guerin — who by all accounts really does like Boudreau — a chance to hug him or cry with him.
Boudreau was out the door in a huff and mostly disappointed that he didn’t get a chance to finish what he strived to do when he arrived in the Twin Cities in April 2016.
________________________________________
“We’re addicts. We love this sport. We love this profession. Coaching, teaching, winning,” Boudreau said on this chilly, sunny Sunday, talking passionately about how he craves another crack behind an NHL bench. “The thrill of winning is a real drug and wanting to compete. I’ve been doing it my whole life.”
“She knows,” Boudreau said, looking at Crystal. “That’s why we don’t play any games anymore … because I cheat at them all.”
“Yeah, he cheats a lot,” Crystal agreed.
“I just want to win. It’s the drug of winning that has driven me forever,” Boudreau said.
In the two days since being let go, Boudreau’s emotions have run the natural gamut.
His mood varies from anger to down-in-the-dumps to embarrassed to “bored already” to fretting about whether his coaching career has come to an end.
He’s 65, and even though Calgary, Dallas, San Jose, New Jersey, Seattle and undoubtedly more teams will be looking for coaches this offseason, he hopes owners and GMs don’t feel he’s too old.
“I don’t feel old. I feel young,” Boudreau said. “It’s not like you’re old and you don’t have energy. I’m the first one at work every day, I go in every day on off-days, I’m doing this all the time, thinking hockey all the time, so I feel very young. And anytime you go to a new job, you’re rejuvenated and you work harder.”
Boudreau entered this season as a lame-duck coach.
In the final year of a four-year contract with the Wild unwilling to entertain an extension last offseason, Boudreau and his wife were convinced he’d be fired at some point, whether that was during the season or right after, because “all GMs want their own coach. And I understood that,” Boudreau said.
Throughout the season, Boudreau’s three oldest children, including Ben, who coaches the ECHL Fort Wayne Komets, would call and occasionally ask if he was doing OK amidst the pressure of winning and losing without the security of time left on his contract.
“And I would always say, ‘I’m OK if it happens,’ but when it (happened), I just was reminded, you’re never OK,” Boudreau said. “As much as this is the nature of this business, nobody wants to hear the words. I’d be throwing on the brave front whenever my daughter or other kids would call me and ask if I was nervous. I’d say, ‘Hey, don’t worry about me. If this goes down, I’ll be OK. I understand the game, I understand the business.’
“But when it does go down, it’s funny … but you’re not OK. So that’s why I probably reacted like that with Billy.”
But Boudreau was also genuinely caught off guard.
“I’ll tell you what, I’m pretty sharp when it comes to these things,” Boudreau said, laughing. “I may not be sharp in a lot of things, but with firings, I usually know. This one I didn’t see coming. In Washington, they asked us to redo the lease on our house and even though I had two years left on my contract, I told Crystal to only do one year because, ‘I’m not going to make it through this year. They’re ready to get rid of me.’
“The same thing with our home in Anaheim. We were renting, and the guy was great. He said, ‘We’ll just go month-to-month.’”
But this one?
The Wild were 7-3-1 in their past 11, getting closer to a playoff spot and Boudreau’s guard was particularly down because he had survived so many other arduous times earlier in the season — like a 3-7 start, a couple real tough losses last month and that 6-1 loss coming out of the bye to Boston.
“We knew (he’d be fired) at the end of the year, but at this point, we thought it would definitely be the end of the year,” Crystal said.
“Yeah,” Bruce said. “I didn’t know if it would at the beginning of the year, Christmastime, the middle of the year or the end of the year. But, I thought we were playing really good and when you’re into the second week of February, I just figured I was safe ‘til the end.”
________________________________________
Plus, the timing stunk. It was Valentine’s Day. It was two days before the Wild’s Wild About Children gala, which Boudreau loved because he was in his element where he could powwow with hockey fans. It was four days before the Wild’s father-son trip, and Boudreau was excited to bring Brady to Vancouver and to see Andy, who works in Banff, in Edmonton.
And it was 16 games before Boudreau would tie his mentor, Roger Neilson, by becoming the 29th coach in NHL history to work 1,000 regular-season games.
“All year long, whenever my kids wanted to visit me, they’d want to book flights, but never knowing what was going to happen, I told them, ‘You better not,’” Boudreau said. “But my daughter, Kasey, wanted to book a flight for my 1,000th game (which would’ve been March 17 vs. Chicago). I said, ‘OK,’ because I figured March was safe. I mean, we’re in February now and there’s no chance I’ll get fired when we’re fighting for a playoff spot after coming back from however many points back.
“So, she books the flight, and I get fired.”
Said Crystal, “We’ll take her and the kids to Disney instead.”
In hindsight, Boudreau said there were recent signs he was on unsteady ground.
For instance, Sunday night was the Wild About Children event, and just like the Boudreaus did in Washington and Anaheim, they auction off two or three eight-person dinners for hockey fans to attend at their home in the offseason.
Crystal cooks. Bruce does what he does best — gabs.
In the past, both in Minnesota and previous stops, the dinners have been purchased for tens of thousands of dollars.
“This year, we were asked not to do it, which pretty well tells you they don’t expect you to be here in the summer,” Boudreau said, chuckling.
And, from a hockey perspective, it just felt to him that Guerin had been distant with him lately and not including him in hockey decisions. Guerin was also starting to voice his displeasure after losses with some of Boudreau’s deployment of players and lineup decisions and Boudreau said “it’s quite possible” the decreased ice time amidst the development of players like Kevin Fiala, Joel Eriksson Ek, Luke Kunin and Jordan Greenway were rubbing veterans the wrong way.
“But I dismissed all that as nothing out of the ordinary,” Boudreau said. “Maybe that was my naivety.”
Boudreau was asked if it was a hard existence every day waking up knowing that he was probably closer to the finish line in Minnesota.
“If I wanted to be dramatic, I’d say, ‘Yes,’” Boudreau said. “But I got up every day and went to work and didn’t think it was hanging over my head until maybe at night time when you’d go home and think. But I set my alarm every morning at the same time, got to work at the same time and never acted like it was my last year.”
Plain and simple, the Wild are a flawed team.
They don’t have a true star. They are weak at the center position. They’ve gotten sub-par goaltending.
Yet after surviving the slow start to this season and a crazy schedule that saw them play 20 of their first 30 games on the road, after starting to repair their dismal special teams lately, Boudreau felt things were trending in the right direction. It sure seemed like a testament to his coaching that they were even flirting with a playoff spot at the time of his dismissal.
Yet, despite these obvious weaknesses, Boudreau, at least outwardly, seemed optimistic about the team’s chances.
“My job is always to just make it work,” Boudreau said. “It’s funny, I remember that first press conference when I got hired by Chuck, you asked me, ‘After having Alex Ovechkin and Nicklas Backstrom and Ryan Getzlaf and Corey Perry, do you think you can win without a star player?’ I said, ‘Yes, we can win.’
“My thinking always all summer long last summer, if (Matt) Dumba comes in and returns to form, if Mikko (Koivu’s) healthy, if Ek, Kunin, Greener improve, if Zach (Parise) can stay in that 25- to 30-goal form, if Jason (Zucker) can get back to 30, if (Eric) Staal and (Devan Dubnyk) can bounce back after off years, if (Fiala) keeps growing, if (Ryan) Suter can get back to being the Ryan Suter after that terrible injury two years ago, we can surprise people.
“When I did that SiriusXM interview and I was telling Boomer (Gordon), ‘You’re wrong. We’re going to be there,’ I wasn’t just blowing smoke. I really believed it. I was just thinking real positive thoughts. My main worry was the schedule hampering us, not the players. I don’t want to act like I’m a friggin’ superstar coach, but I’ve never had a problem getting players to win.
“So I came into this season confident and tried not to worry about if we had this and that compared to other teams.”
________________________________________
The hockey world is a tight one, and when word got out Friday morning that Boudreau was fired, he was inundated with calls and texts.
On Friday, Boudreau said he didn’t get off the phone for 15 hours. On Saturday, it was probably 12 hours. On Sunday, it was the well-wishers who wanted to give him a couple days of peace.
“It’s amazing the conversations,” Boudreau said. “The hockey world is so good.”
He has heard from everybody, even Yeo, the now-Philadelphia Flyers assistant, who he doesn’t know well, and even folks like Brian Burke.
“Brian Burke has phoned me three times to check up on me,” Boudreau said. “And I don’t even know Brian Burke.”
The first call Boudreau received?
Fletcher, the person who hired him in Minnesota.
“I didn’t make it through that phone call (without crying),” Boudreau said, his eyes welling up. “He is class from top to bottom.”
One of the afternoon calls he received was from McPhee, the now-president of the Vegas Golden Knights: “I was happy to speak to him because he’s always one to cheer me up and make me feel better.”
“As we were driving here, we just realized it’s been two days,” Crystal interrupted. “It’s like a funeral because you have to reload every time someone calls you, you have to go through the emotions all over again. You have to grieve. You have to be upset. You are angry. It’s just like a funeral, and then it takes time to move on.”
Boudreau loved it in Minnesota. He and his wife purchased a junior expansion team, the Minnesota Blue Ox, and placed them in Coon Rapids.
If Boudreau lands another job next season, they’ll have to sell the majority ownership of the team unless Brady, one of their assistant coaches who also helps Crystal run the team, wants to take over.
“But this is our home,” Boudreau said. “I think more than any other team — I thought I dove in pretty good everywhere I went, but I think I delved in more here. Anything anybody asked I did because I just loved this franchise and these fans. It was always pro-Wild, whether it was doing the State Fair appearances or charitable endeavors or doing radio and TV. The one thing about us, everywhere we’ve gone — Mississippi, San Francisco, Lowell, Manchester, Hershey — we move lock, stock and barrel.
“I mean, we just go, and that’s it. That’s our home. We want to be part of the community.”
Saturday night, when the Wild hosted the Sharks with Evason making his NHL head-coaching debut, Boudreau couldn’t stomach watching.
But he stayed close to his phone because he wanted updates. But none were coming in until a late NHL notification that said the Sharks scored a third-period goal to make it 1-0. Boudreau was stunned the notification appeared, but then it dawned on him, the reason he didn’t know Wild notifications appear on his phone is because he’s usually coaching their games at the time. As he contemplated this fact, another notification popped up that said the Wild lost, 2-0.
“I was like, ‘Woah.’ I was surprised,” Boudreau said.
Asked if he’ll remove Wild game notifications off his phone, Boudreau laughed.
“Not yet,” he said. “But I’ll get Crystal to do it at some point. That’s the thing. I loved this place. But, as pissed as I was at Billy at that moment, I’ll get over it and I wish him and the Wild all the best.
“I mean, I’ve been really lucky. I was fired in Washington, I got a job the same day. In Anaheim, I was fired two days after the season and I had a job within a week. When it happened in Manchester, I had a job a week later in Hershey.
“So from 2004 basically ‘til now, I’ve never gone a week without working. Now, this timing, there’s no way that anything can happen ‘til maybe the end of the season. So for the first time I’m sitting down not knowing my future.”
And that is scary for Boudreau.
“I don’t like sitting on my ass,” Boudreau said. “I need to work, so hopefully I can do some TV the rest of the season and in the playoffs. Everybody that talks to me knows they have to talk hockey with me because I don’t know anything else.”
Now, Boudreau on NBC or NHL Network or TSN or Sportsnet would be a hoot.
In the meantime, on Saturday, Boudreau solemnly drove to TRIA to clean out his office and “hand in all of our stuff,” from their ID tags to his laptop.
He left a note on the whiteboard for his old players that read in part, “Thanks for everything, boys.”
And then, Boudreau left.
On Tuesday night, when the Wild hit the road for that father-son trip that he’ll so miss, Boudreau will drive down to Xcel Energy Center to clean out that office.
“Yeah,” Boudreau said, his voice shaking, as he got up from the table and stared out the window at that beautiful hockey rink, “getting fired sucks.”
No matter how many times it has happened, no matter how much you know it’ll eventually happen, you’re never, ever fully prepared.




Mr. Ed -> RE: Wild 2019/2020 Season (2/18/2020 8:46:27 AM)

Good guy that did his best
Don’t envy that life

Hired to be fired

Did make chicken salad from the scraps

And probably cost himself by being too loyal to some veterans




SoMnFan -> RE: Wild 2019/2020 Season (2/18/2020 8:57:18 AM)

You wouldn't believe how much of that article I get. Personally.
Well said,. Ed.




Pete M. -> RE: Wild 2019/2020 Season (2/18/2020 9:56:23 AM)

I'm no hockey savant, but you'll never convince me Bruce isn't a really good coach. (I don't know that I'd say "great"; the playoff results don't justify it.) The historical numbers speak for themselves, and what he did with a pretty underwhelming group of players here was notable. I'm not opposed to the firing -- even great coaches sometimes aren't the right fit, particularly in hockey -- but I wish him nothing but the best and recognize that the next coach probably won't be as good a coach as he.




MDK -> RE: Wild 2019/2020 Season (2/18/2020 10:03:01 AM)

Nice story......but feeling the same way about an NHL coach is a lot different than feeling about the crap coaches take at the High School Level and down from parents despite all their hard work and effort and minimal compensation. At those levels, it isn't their primary job.

BB was too loyal to the Vets......Vets that have lost their passion and fire. Injuries are a part of the game. But if you lose your passion as some Wild players have, retire.

My feeling after reading the article is how I feel for coaching in general.

I don't shed too many tears when guys with salaries of more than a million per year are let go at the professional level.

I really don't shed too many tears when college coaches at levels even below the big time schools are let go.

They are doing something they absolutely love for a living. The rest of the world isn't that lucky. And the coaches at our University do pretty well financially.

They are people throughout the country who give and give and give and are not compensated for their efforts. Served at the Vermillion banquet table last night......can't believe the effort of people who volunteer their time week in and week out to help the poor through the food pantry and the banquet and get little if any recognition.




TJSweens -> RE: Wild 2019/2020 Season (2/18/2020 10:27:20 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pete M.

I'm no hockey savant, but you'll never convince me Bruce isn't a really good coach. (I don't know that I'd say "great"; the playoff results don't justify it.) The historical numbers speak for themselves, and what he did with a pretty underwhelming group of players here was notable. I'm not opposed to the firing -- even great coaches sometimes aren't the right fit, particularly in hockey -- but I wish him nothing but the best and recognize that the next coach probably won't be as good a coach as he.


As Jeff pointed out earlier, BB stepped into two of the greatest coaching scenarios of all time when he took over Washington with OV8 and Anaheim with a great, deep roster. Those teams uniformly had great regular seasons followed by playoff disappointment.

With the Wild, it has been diminishing returns. Second in the Central/ first round exit, Third in the Central/ first round exit, Seventh in the Central/ missed the playoffs, currently out of the playoffs.

My feeling is that Boudreau isn't a bad coach, but there are probably coaches out there who were just as good, that never stepped into the roster scenarios that he did. It would not surprise me if Guerin brings in somebody who does better. It wouldn't surprise me if he lands another Richards or Yeo.




Phil Riewer -> RE: Wild 2019/2020 Season (2/18/2020 11:26:37 AM)

Expectations since the Owner bought the Wild has been to win it all. Fletcher, Fenton, and Guerin seem good to very good. Richards, Yeo, BB, Torch, etc. have been good to very good coaches...just a tough roster to figure out and it just shows the difference between being good/very good and winning it all.




Phil Riewer -> RE: Wild 2019/2020 Season (2/18/2020 11:32:16 AM)

Even though there have been rough patches...I really like this team currently and what Fenton did and Guerin is doing.

Zucker, Nino, Coyle, Granlund gone.

Mikko, Dubes next.

Dumba or Brodin also
next.

Giving time to Ek, Greenway, Kunin, Fiala, etc. Get the Russian kid in.




SoMnFan -> RE: Wild 2019/2020 Season (2/18/2020 12:35:49 PM)

Gotta say I'm with ya Phil
I do like the changes, I do like some of the existers, I do think this team could win.
There are two huge holes imo.
As was said …. goaltending and consistent center play.
The 7-3-1 recent run wasn't BS, it wasn't even our best hockey. There's talent here, that can play.
I know the prevailing winds always say, blame the owner, the GM, the coach, but I really think they've been pretty good, too.
I just can't pile this on one guy or department.
Leiopold spends money. He sees needs and attempts to fill them. I can't fault him.




SoMnFan -> RE: Wild 2019/2020 Season (2/18/2020 12:37:41 PM)

The Blues WERE LOWER than we were, when they turned it around. In a couple months.
of course it won't happen here, for us, because that would be awesome.
And we are not allowed awesome things.




SoMnFan -> RE: Wild 2019/2020 Season (2/18/2020 1:01:09 PM)

Since we have another mid-season break here … interesting story today



Picture hockey in the United States like its own universe.
There are some large, gaseous planets with many moons, such as Boston and the Twin Cities. There are smaller planets, with the buoyancy of new life, such as Chicago or Washington. There are dimming, dying stars, and there are new ones that glow with the intensity of ... well, the Las Vegas Strip.
It's been a long-standing theory that Toronto -- for better or worse -- is the center (centre) of the Canadian hockey universe. What's the American equivalent?
"In the whole United States? Wow," pondered Seth Jones of the Columbus Blue Jackets, the 25-year-old Texas native who has played on the U.S. men's national team three times. "Minnesota's always a big hockey location. Detroit. Probably one of those two."
The U.S. hockey universe is constantly expanding. In 1990, there were 195,125 players who were part of USA Hockey. After a record-setting 2018-19 season, that number reached 567,908 -- an increase of more than 190%. The growth includes men but is especially thanks to women: In 2018-19, the number of women and girls players cracked 80,000 nationally for the first time, according to USA Hockey.
Jones has marveled at that growth.

"It's come a long way from when I was 10 years old. I grew up playing hockey in Colorado, so it was a little bit more developed than when I moved to Dallas," he said. "They were probably 10 years ahead of Dallas. But now I go and there are so many rinks in Dallas. The organizations are doing such a great job developing kids and giving them a chance to be on the ice constantly. There are tournaments every other weekend for them."
There are factors that have helped that growth. Representation, for example. Players such as Jones, Auston Matthews (Arizona) and Jack Hughes (Florida) have shown there are paths from non-traditional hockey markets to reaching the NHL.
"When kids can say, 'Hey, that guy made it from this area,' it really encourages kids to say, 'I can make it from here if they did,'" Vegas forward Max Pacioretty said.
Then there's the trickle-down effect from the NHL to the local levels. "Every American market that wins the Stanley Cup gets a bump. St. Louis is up 30% in 8-and-under players after the Blues won the Cup," said Pat Kelleher, executive director of USA Hockey.
Of course, the opposite can happen for those who don't win ...
There are hockey hotbeds, markets that are slightly cooler and regions that generate the most gravity in the U.S. hockey universe. This is a tiered look at some of them.
Note: The numbers provided here were collected from USA Hockey and the NHL, unless otherwise specified. Keep in mind that for older youth players, those who compete in high school hockey are not counted toward the local totals.

Hotbeds heating up

5. Seattle
What, already? The Seattle (maybe Kraken?) don't arrive in the NHL until the 2021-22 season, but the market is already showing growth. There's the long-standing major junior Seattle Thunderbirds in the market. In 2018-19, its 2,802 youth players ranked the market ahead of at least four current NHL markets. But it's the landscape that has many anticipating a hockey boom. There are 16 sheets of ice in the area now, but more on are on the way as Seattle builds up the hockey groundwork following the NHL's arrival. That includes a 180,000-square foot, $70 million practice facility that will include three sheets of ice.
"Seattle's just going to blow up," Kelleher said. "There's already a lot of infrastructure there as far as rinks. But the new Seattle team is building even more. I think there are at least seven sheets of ice under construction in the Seattle market right now."
4. Nashville
The story starts with the Predators, who are averaging 17,416 fans per game and have seen that attendance increase over a three-season span. Their success on the ice and at the gate has led to an increase of 36.6% in total participation from 2014 to '19. There are some points of concern: While players ages 15-18 increased for six straight years, the 8-and-under player pool declined in 2018-19. But with the highly anticipated (and highly over budget) Ford Ice Center having finally opened in October 2019, expect all of these numbers to take a jump.
"Nashville is growing because it's adding more facilities," Kelleher said. "That's it. It's about access."
3. Washington
This is more along the lines of "remaining hot" rather than heating up, because the D.C. area has seen a boom in hockey participation for the past decade. The Capitals are arguably the region's most popular professional franchise, averaging more than 18,500 fans per game. Ever since the team opened MedStar Capitals Iceplex in 2006, giving the region some much-needed local ice, there has been a surge in community participation. From 2014 to '19, the Capitals saw an 18.5% increase in local participation, to 22,144. Boys and girls youth hockey has grown steadily over that span, and adult participation increased by 8.7% in 2018-19.
A true success story for how excitement on the NHL level, and investment in the local levels, can transform a hockey market.
2. Anaheim
The Anaheim Ducks' $108 million, 280,000-square foot practice facility that opened in Irvine, California, in January 2019 is going to strap a rocket to the back of a market that has already shown solid growth. From 2014 to '19, total participation grew by 27.4%. From 2016 to '19 alone, youth hockey participation was up 18%. It's a hockey-soaked area, with the Los Angeles Kings and their AHL affiliate the Ontario Reign within a reasonable distance.
This market would have ranked higher were it not for the downward attendance trend for the Ducks (down 5% over three seasons) and the lack of any Division I programs nearby. But on a local level, it's a market on the rise.
1. Las Vegas
Vegas Golden Knights winger Pacioretty sees it whenever he takes his children to play hockey. The boom for Vegas isn't just in the stands at home games -- where the Knights are averaging 18,290 fans per game, playing to a 105.3% capacity -- but at the local participatory level too. "It's just picked up huge," Pacioretty said. "I see a lot of good kids that are coming up when I go to the rink with my kids."
In the past five years, total participation is up 86.4% in Vegas. From 2016 to '19, youth hockey participation increased by 60%, and the 8-and-under participation grew by 125% from 2017 to '19. While the overall numbers remain small in comparison to other NHL markets -- there were 2,255 total players, coaches and officials in 2018-19 -- there's no denying the growth in one of the league's most non-traditional markets. The Golden Knights gave the city a state-of-the-art practice facility in Summerlin back in 2017; two more sheets are on the way at Lifeguard Arena in Henderson, Nevada, a Golden Knights-funded facility that will open this summer for its new AHL team.
"Vegas is one of these hotbeds that's going to happen," Pacioretty said. One can argue it already is happening.

Hotbeds cooling down

5. Boston
Few NHL teams can rival the local popularity of the Bruins, whose attendance has risen over the past three seasons. With the Red Sox trading away franchise players and Tom Brady staring at the sunset of this career, that might only increase. That said, local participation levels are decreasing. Total participation was down 2.8% from 2014 to '19, and boys' youth hockey alone was down 1.5% in 2018-19. (Girls hockey, however, was up 4.6%.)
As we'll cover in a bit, the margins in the Boston area can easily withstand this kind of "decline," but the numbers are what they are.
4. Philadelphia
Despite the presence of Gritty and a room where fans can smash a television with a hockey stick, the Flyers' average attendance has declined 7.3% over three seasons. The city's local participation numbers are down as well over a three-year span (minus-183 participants), making Philadelphia one of only five NHL markets to see a decline. A good portion of that decline is in the region's youth hockey, as the 8-and-under players declined by 5.0% and the 9-14 players declined by 2.4%.
None of the state's Division I college programs are nearby, and the closest minor league team is the Flyers' AHL affiliate in Allentown, Pennsylvania, about 60 miles away.

3. Chicago
The Chicago market's turnaround is one of the biggest hockey stories of the past 20 years. In 2006-07, the Blackhawks were filling their arena to a 62% capacity. Today, they're still averaging more than 21,000 fans per game even though they've missed the playoffs for two straight seasons and haven't been out of the first round since 2015.
But we're starting to see some erosion on the local levels. Total participation was down 2.6% from 2016 to '19, including a whopping 11.6% decline in adult male players from 2017 to '19. (Women players were up 3.8%.) Meanwhile, 8-and-under participation in 2018-19 was down 19.8%.
2. Detroit
Much of it is due to the economics of the region, and the fact that hockey remains an expensive sport to play. A lot of it can be attributed to the worst seven-year span for the Detroit Red Wings since the early 1980s -- they'll miss the playoffs for the fourth season in a row, and potentially do so with the fewest points in the standings in the salary-cap era. Red Wings attendance is down 3.5% since 2017.
The market has suffered a 4.2% decline in total community participation from 2014 to '19, and that has escalated to a 4.5% decline from 2016 to '19. The 9-14 age group shrank by 4.3% in 2018-19.
1. Buffalo
Detroit had a steeper decline, but it also had a higher starting point locally than Buffalo. From 2014 to '19, Buffalo saw its total participation numbers drop to 15,064, a decline of 3.3%. Boys' youth hockey totals declined four out of five years in that span, although girls' youth hockey was up 4.5% in 2018-19. The 9-14 age range saw a decline of 6.7% in 2018-19. Adult players saw a decline in four of five years, dropping 2.9% in 2018-19 alone.
Buffalo isn't lacking for facilities, with about 29 available sheets of ice. It also has Canisius and Niagara's Division I teams. But it's on the NHL level where the market is hurting, with nearly a 5% decline in attendance from 2017-18 to 2019-20, and increasing fan apathy over what is likely to be a ninth straight season outside the playoffs.

Centers of the U.S. hockey universe

5. Chicago
In the great Chicago vs. Detroit hockey debate, the Windy City has some advantages over its Michigan neighbor.
Local participation numbers are at 29,580 for 2018-19, representing a 1.2% increase over a five-year span. But the declines in youth hockey (4.9%) and adult hockey (10.2%, all of it among men's league players) in 2018-19, leading to a 5.4% decline in total participation, is dispiriting. That said, there are 85 sheets of ice in the USA Hockey-defined Chicago market. High school hockey is thriving, with the United Center hosting the state finals on an annual basis.
The Blackhawks continue to average 21,415 per home game, despite a lack of success on the ice. The market also has the AHL Chicago Wolves and the USHL Chicago Steel.
While the area lacks Division I programs, there are 118 men's and women's players from Illinois playing Division I hockey this season. That's a lot of kids who grew up during Generation Kane and Toews.
"Chicago's done a really good job, especially on the youth hockey front," Kelleher said.
4. New York City
Admittedly, this choice is a complicated one. There are three NHL teams that claim their own territories in the New York area, with the Rangers in Manhattan, the Islanders on Long Island and the Devils just a tunnel's drive away in Newark, New Jersey. USA Hockey declares a "market" to have a 50-mile radius from where the team plays, which means the Rangers gobble up participatory numbers from both of their rivals' areas and dip into Connecticut too. Taken as that whole, a total participation number of 40,317 doesn't seem like much when viewed as a percentage of the metropolitan area's total population. And when a good chunk of those numbers come from Northern New Jersey -- which, while Rangers territory, doesn't love being treated as a New York City suburb -- the market is a tough one to define.
That said ... 40,317 people participating in youth and adult hockey is nothing to sneeze at, especially when you get into the trends. From 2014 to '19, total participation has grown by 13.8%, with youth hockey for boys and girls growing at a 15% clip during that time. It was up 5.1% alone in 2018-19, thanks to an 8.5% increase for girls' hockey players and a 12.1% increase for 8-and-under players overall.
In a 50-mile radius from Madison Square Garden, there are no less than 95 sheets of available ice. That includes 42 sheets in northern and central New Jersey, where 17,642 of the New York City total resides.
While it lacks Division I college programs -- West Point is the lone men's program, Long Island University the lone women's one -- there are scores of public and private high school programs in this region. Plus, it has something no other area can boast: four professional teams in the Rangers, Islanders, Devils and the Metropolitan Riveters of the National Women's Hockey League.

3. Detroit
Even as the NHL team struggles in the market, there's no denying the deep-seated passion for the sport in his hockey hotbed. Total participation numbers for the sport are 23,237, placing it sixth among NHL markets. But keep in mind the youth hockey numbers might not account for the thriving high school hockey scene in the metro area, which includes powerhouses such as Detroit Country Day and Detroit Catholic Central.
It's impossible to divorce the passion in the Detroit market from the hockey culture in the entirety of Michigan, especially when the University of Michigan and Michigan State put on an annual display at the "Duel in the D." There are seven men's Division I programs in the state. Michigan also has the third-most men's and women's current Division I NCAA players combined (190). Plus, USA Hockey Arena in Plymouth is less than 30 miles away, and there are 63 sheets of ice in the market.
It's going to take the Red Wings a few playoff years to restore the luster to "Hockeytown, USA." But in many ways, Detroit can still put a claim on the moniker.
"Detroit has always been really, really strong. Their numbers are good. But they've had some statewide economic numbers that have been an influence," Kelleher said.
2. Boston
We're talking Boston specifically here, but we all know we're essentially talking about the majority of Massachusetts. The Boston region defined by USA Hockey has 178 sheets of ice and had 55,981 total community participants as of 2018-19. A region that has eight Division I men's programs -- Bentley, Boston College, Boston University, Harvard, Holy Cross, Merrimack, Northeastern, UMass-Lowell -- within that market, with six of them having Division I women's teams. A state that has produced 205 current Division I men's and women's players. A city where the high school and college hockey championship games have more hype locally than what many NHL teams receive in their own markets.
While there has been some erosion at the youth level, the 2018-19 season saw an increase of 2.9% among 8-and-under players, and a whopping 7.6% increase for adult players, including a 4.0% increase for women's players after two years of decline.
The hockey community in Boston was always thriving, but the trickle down from the big club in town certainly helps. It's still incredible to think about where the Bruins were 15 years ago, struggling to sell out home games, and where they are today, which is one of the NHL's most popular teams by any metric.
Boston is a hockey hotbed. But it's not the center of the hockey universe in the U.S.
1. Minneapolis-St. Paul

A.J. Mleczko Griswold was born in Nantucket, played at Harvard and proudly flaunts her Massachusetts hockey creds as a U.S. national team gold medalist and NBC broadcaster. But she had a concession to make.
"This is a tough question, because I'm from Massachusetts, but I might have to give it to the State of Hockey," she told ESPN. "On our '98 team, we had five players from Massachusetts and only three from Minnesota. Look at the roster from 2018."
The gold-medal winners from the Pyeongchang Games had seven Minnesotan players and three from Massachusetts. Five of them were from the Minneapolis-St. Paul area.
Is this the center of the U.S. hockey universe?
"That's a loaded question for me, because I'm a native Bostonian, so this is going to get me in trouble. But it's hard not to say Minnesota," said Kelleher, echoing Mleczko Griswold. "You have the Wild. You have all the college programs, men's and women's. You have girls high school hockey that's just huge there. It's tremendous."

From 2014 to '19, Minneapolis saw a 4.5% increase in community participation, to 53,989 total participants. That included a 9.6% increase in girls' hockey players during that span, up to 9,227 in 2018-19. There were 36,620 youth hockey players (ages 4-18) accounted for by USA Hockey in 2018-19, but that didn't include the massive number of boys and girls playing public and private high school hockey in the market -- statewide, an estimated 6,500 players play on prep teams. (And, as we've seen, many of them have resplendent hair.) According to USA Hockey's count, there are 163 sheets of ice in the Minneapolis area.
"The community-based model for youth hockey just does so much. When I grew up in the Boston area, it was more community based. We still have some great community-based programs that do it, but it's a little different," Kelleher said. "In Minnesota, it's community based. It builds towards high school hockey. They all go to the same school together. Their parents all shop for groceries at the same place. They all play from ages 5 to 7 up through high school, and that's the most unique place in the country for that. They have a rink in every community. It's different than that in different parts of the country."
The Wild have infamously taken a step back in popularity in the past several years, including the end of a yearslong sellout streak. From last season to this season, the Wild have seen an 8.0% decrease at the gate. They aren't the only show in town, of course: The Minnesota Whitecaps of the NHWL are the other pro team in the market, and the University of Minnesota's men's and women's programs are among the most popular in the nation.
While there are other contenders for the throne, it's hard to argue against the Twin Cities as the center of the hockey universe.
"Minnesota is the heartbeat," Kelleher said.
But can we get even more specific?
Is there a center of the center of the hockey universe?

Consider this: USA Hockey says that the Twin Cities market pulled 10,922 of its total participants in 2018-19 from a region that includes Bloomington (estimated population 85,934), Eden Prairie (64,952) and a little, rather wealthy place ($99,295 median household income, per the U.S. Census Bureau) called Edina (54,791).

No one has captured more Minnesota Tier 1 boys' state hockey championships than Edina, with 13. They also lost three times in the title game, and finished third three times. Edina also has won the Class AA girls' hockey title for three straight seasons. Among the notable Edina High School alumni: Anders Lee and Kieffer Bellows of the New York Islanders; former Montreal Canadiens player Bill Nyrop; former NHL player Paul Ranheim; and former NHL executive Brian Burke.
"In the Twin Cities, it might be Edina," said Tom Chorske, a Minneapolis-born former NHL player who's now an analyst for Fox Sports North. "They win a lot at youth level and produce a lot of college players. A lot of Wild players live in Edina and their little kids are playing there."
So there you have it: Edina, Minnesota. The center of the center of the hockey universe in the United States.




MDK -> RE: Wild 2019/2020 Season (2/18/2020 1:09:00 PM)

And my grandson is playing hockey.......love MN......really do.




SoMnFan -> RE: Wild 2019/2020 Season (2/18/2020 1:16:51 PM)

Agree Miles, love that the state embraces it.




Jeff Jesser -> RE: Wild 2019/2020 Season (2/18/2020 9:55:48 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: stfrank

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

Your wife doesn't want you watching hockey. Go away.

[&:]



Nah, lets play the game. We've got nothing else to talk about unless "how we can….lol…..make the playoffs". How is that apples to oranges? The premise is simple. We have not addressed "scoring goals" so badly, as a franchise, that a guy (1 dude) has more than our top 4, franchise leading, goal scorers combined in 3 less years than we've been around.

Do you want to go on individual numbers to make it more apples to apples? If you do please do the research. I've puked enough.




Jeff Jesser -> RE: Wild 2019/2020 Season (2/18/2020 10:00:23 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: SoMnFan

Agree Miles, love that the state embraces it.



Don't know my man. I'm getting pretty sick and tired of the mediocrity of my teams. Maybe the "State of Youth Hockey and non-Gopher colleges". Then, I agree. Outside of that we are the "State of shitty hockey".




Phil Riewer -> RE: Wild 2019/2020 Season (2/19/2020 8:20:31 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: SoMnFan
The Blues WERE LOWER than we were, when they turned it around. In a couple months.
of course it won't happen here, for us, because that would be awesome.
And we are not allowed awesome things.


Hot Goaltender. We haven't had one since we first acquired Dubes. Amazing how well they have done when you look at that.




Jeff Jesser -> RE: Wild 2019/2020 Season (2/19/2020 11:16:44 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: SoMnFan
The Blues WERE LOWER than we were, when they turned it around. In a couple months.
of course it won't happen here, for us, because that would be awesome.
And we are not allowed awesome things.


Hot Goaltender. We haven't had one since we first acquired Dubes. Amazing how well they have done when you look at that.




I wouldn't even classify it specifically to hot goaltending. They had a 244 goals for and a 220 goals against. Us, 210 and 230 respectively. It again points out to what I've been saying. Yes, we suck because Dubnyk has gone to hell but we can't score. Never have been able to. League average last year was 244. We were 34 below the damn average. Not the league leader....the average and we were 34 back of that.




TJSweens -> RE: Wild 2019/2020 Season (2/19/2020 11:39:34 AM)

No doubt. This franchise, since its inception, is the place where offensive hockey goes to die.




SoMnFan -> RE: Wild 2019/2020 Season (2/19/2020 1:33:40 PM)

Hey! We get to play again this week!

Think its the Father/Son trip?
I like those, they usually mean the boys will play hard.




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