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Pager -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/6/2020 10:28:42 PM)
Before the 2019 season? When he had a total of like 6 starts? And had a year before being an unrestricted free agent? Could you post the source? Sorry if you have posted this before. I don't remember it.

Bill Johanesen -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/7/2020 9:07:15 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Pager Before the 2019 season? When he had a total of like 6 starts? And had a year before being an unrestricted free agent? Could you post the source? Sorry if you have posted this before. I don't remember it. No, you go look it up.

Tom Sykes -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/7/2020 11:21:08 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen quote: ORIGINAL: Pager Before the 2019 season? When he had a total of like 6 starts? And had a year before being an unrestricted free agent? Could you post the source? Sorry if you have posted this before. I don't remember it. No, you go look it up. It would have been a bad business decision for Harris and agent to sign last year - unless he didn’t believe in himself which, if you’ve heard him in an interview, is not the case. He had just 6 starts previously but played well enough to be the presumptive starter for 2019. The team most likely approached him before 2019 because it was hugely to their benefit to do so (even if he turned out to be a merely decent starter, it would have been an UDFA ganga and resume bullet point for Spielman). Unless the cap situation made that negotiation impossible. There is no source for this, just common sense.

Pager -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/7/2020 5:48:56 PM)
I don't remember reading one single article/anything about an extension prior to the 2019 year. I remember tracking the Harris situation because I was advocating for the Vikes to sign him to an extension prior to the 2019 season, ala Thielen (probably best comp) or Hunter/Diggs/Kendricks. Contract talks usually get reported and I def don't remember Harris' agent saying they weren't going to sign an extension. But I could be wrong, missed it, forgot it, etc.

Bill Jandro -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/8/2020 7:37:28 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Pager I don't remember reading one single article/anything about an extension prior to the 2019 year. I remember tracking the Harris situation because I was advocating for the Vikes to sign him to an extension prior to the 2019 season, ala Thielen (probably best comp) or Hunter/Diggs/Kendricks. Contract talks usually get reported and I def don't remember Harris' agent saying they weren't going to sign an extension. But I could be wrong, missed it, forgot it, etc. You are correct. We didn't have the cap space so it simply wasn't on the table. There were a few of us who were advocating to sign Harris long term early. I don't think Harris had mention testing free agency until the end of the 19 season. So Spielman missed the opportunity to get him locked up early/cheaper.

Bill Johanesen -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/8/2020 11:45:16 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes quote: ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen quote: ORIGINAL: Pager Before the 2019 season? When he had a total of like 6 starts? And had a year before being an unrestricted free agent? Could you post the source? Sorry if you have posted this before. I don't remember it. No, you go look it up. It would have been a bad business decision for Harris and agent to sign last year - unless he didn’t believe in himself which, if you’ve heard him in an interview, is not the case. He had just 6 starts previously but played well enough to be the presumptive starter for 2019. The team most likely approached him before 2019 because it was hugely to their benefit to do so (even if he turned out to be a merely decent starter, it would have been an UDFA ganga and resume bullet point for Spielman). Unless the cap situation made that negotiation impossible. There is no source for this, just common sense. I read it and I have provided the link here previously. His agent came off like he was bitter or upset about something.

Tom Sykes -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/8/2020 12:30:31 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen quote: ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes quote: ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen quote: ORIGINAL: Pager Before the 2019 season? When he had a total of like 6 starts? And had a year before being an unrestricted free agent? Could you post the source? Sorry if you have posted this before. I don't remember it. No, you go look it up. It would have been a bad business decision for Harris and agent to sign last year - unless he didn’t believe in himself which, if you’ve heard him in an interview, is not the case. He had just 6 starts previously but played well enough to be the presumptive starter for 2019. The team most likely approached him before 2019 because it was hugely to their benefit to do so (even if he turned out to be a merely decent starter, it would have been an UDFA ganga and resume bullet point for Spielman). Unless the cap situation made that negotiation impossible. There is no source for this, just common sense. I read it and I have provided the link here previously. His agent came off like he was bitter or upset about something. I believe you. I was simply working through the topic to say, with or without re-posting the link, it only makes sense anyway.

Dana Turner -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/8/2020 12:52:38 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Pager I don't remember reading one single article/anything about an extension prior to the 2019 year. I remember tracking the Harris situation because I was advocating for the Vikes to sign him to an extension prior to the 2019 season, ala Thielen (probably best comp) or Hunter/Diggs/Kendricks. Contract talks usually get reported and I def don't remember Harris' agent saying they weren't going to sign an extension. But I could be wrong, missed it, forgot it, etc. I'm not sure it would have mattered if we had signed Harris prior to 2019. He would have just been back at the well a couple years later as one of the top safeties in the league demanding appropriate pay, just like Thielen did. Sure, it would have been nice to avoid this years cap hit, but if he had signed a "friendly" deal, it would have been redone if he follows last year up with another excellent year, and last year was an excellent year for him. I say let him play this year out and if he's just as good, he will demand huge bucks next year and you just have to let him or Smith walk. You simply cannot have $25 million tied up in your two safety spots. Many of us liked Harris when we got him as a UDFA, thought there was solid potential there, but I'm not sure anyone had him picked out to be one of the top safeties in the NFL four years later. Lets hope one of the twenty young guys we have signed up this year is another hidden gem!

Pager -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/8/2020 1:55:00 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Dana Turner quote: ORIGINAL: Pager I don't remember reading one single article/anything about an extension prior to the 2019 year. I remember tracking the Harris situation because I was advocating for the Vikes to sign him to an extension prior to the 2019 season, ala Thielen (probably best comp) or Hunter/Diggs/Kendricks. Contract talks usually get reported and I def don't remember Harris' agent saying they weren't going to sign an extension. But I could be wrong, missed it, forgot it, etc. I'm not sure it would have mattered if we had signed Harris prior to 2019. He would have just been back at the well a couple years later as one of the top safeties in the league demanding appropriate pay, just like Thielen did. Sure, it would have been nice to avoid this years cap hit, but if he had signed a "friendly" deal, it would have been redone if he follows last year up with another excellent year, and last year was an excellent year for him. I say let him play this year out and if he's just as good, he will demand huge bucks next year and you just have to let him or Smith walk. You simply cannot have $25 million tied up in your two safety spots. Many of us liked Harris when we got him as a UDFA, thought there was solid potential there, but I'm not sure anyone had him picked out to be one of the top safeties in the NFL four years later. Lets hope one of the twenty young guys we have signed up this year is another hidden gem! IMO - age makes the Thielen and Harris situations different. Theilen was younger when he signed his contract and so we accommodated him on his raise request. And it was in the form of an extension. The Vikings would likely have been much less likely to give him a raise/extension at age 30 (or pick an age for Harris). I agree - let Harris play out his tag and test the market next year. Draft safety early and maybe often, we might have to replace both pretty soon.

thebigo -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/8/2020 3:16:53 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Pager quote: ORIGINAL: Dana Turner quote: ORIGINAL: Pager I don't remember reading one single article/anything about an extension prior to the 2019 year. I remember tracking the Harris situation because I was advocating for the Vikes to sign him to an extension prior to the 2019 season, ala Thielen (probably best comp) or Hunter/Diggs/Kendricks. Contract talks usually get reported and I def don't remember Harris' agent saying they weren't going to sign an extension. But I could be wrong, missed it, forgot it, etc. I'm not sure it would have mattered if we had signed Harris prior to 2019. He would have just been back at the well a couple years later as one of the top safeties in the league demanding appropriate pay, just like Thielen did. Sure, it would have been nice to avoid this years cap hit, but if he had signed a "friendly" deal, it would have been redone if he follows last year up with another excellent year, and last year was an excellent year for him. I say let him play this year out and if he's just as good, he will demand huge bucks next year and you just have to let him or Smith walk. You simply cannot have $25 million tied up in your two safety spots. Many of us liked Harris when we got him as a UDFA, thought there was solid potential there, but I'm not sure anyone had him picked out to be one of the top safeties in the NFL four years later. Lets hope one of the twenty young guys we have signed up this year is another hidden gem! IMO - age makes the Thielen and Harris situations different. Theilen was younger when he signed his contract and so we accommodated him on his raise request. And it was in the form of an extension. The Vikings would likely have been much less likely to give him a raise/extension at age 30 (or pick an age for Harris). I agree - let Harris play out his tag and test the market next year. Draft safety early and maybe often, we might have to replace both pretty soon. Thielen was 28 years 8 months when he signed his 4 year extension keeping him (at the time) for the next 6 seasons through 2024. Harris is currently 28 years 8 months old. The main reason I would balk on Harris is his body of work is relatively short.

Dana Turner -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/8/2020 3:31:29 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: thebigo quote: ORIGINAL: Pager quote: ORIGINAL: Dana Turner quote: ORIGINAL: Pager I don't remember reading one single article/anything about an extension prior to the 2019 year. I remember tracking the Harris situation because I was advocating for the Vikes to sign him to an extension prior to the 2019 season, ala Thielen (probably best comp) or Hunter/Diggs/Kendricks. Contract talks usually get reported and I def don't remember Harris' agent saying they weren't going to sign an extension. But I could be wrong, missed it, forgot it, etc. I'm not sure it would have mattered if we had signed Harris prior to 2019. He would have just been back at the well a couple years later as one of the top safeties in the league demanding appropriate pay, just like Thielen did. Sure, it would have been nice to avoid this years cap hit, but if he had signed a "friendly" deal, it would have been redone if he follows last year up with another excellent year, and last year was an excellent year for him. I say let him play this year out and if he's just as good, he will demand huge bucks next year and you just have to let him or Smith walk. You simply cannot have $25 million tied up in your two safety spots. Many of us liked Harris when we got him as a UDFA, thought there was solid potential there, but I'm not sure anyone had him picked out to be one of the top safeties in the NFL four years later. Lets hope one of the twenty young guys we have signed up this year is another hidden gem! IMO - age makes the Thielen and Harris situations different. Theilen was younger when he signed his contract and so we accommodated him on his raise request. And it was in the form of an extension. The Vikings would likely have been much less likely to give him a raise/extension at age 30 (or pick an age for Harris). I agree - let Harris play out his tag and test the market next year. Draft safety early and maybe often, we might have to replace both pretty soon. Thielen was 28 years 8 months when he signed his 4 year extension keeping him (at the time) for the next 6 seasons through 2024. Harris is currently 28 years 8 months old. The main reason I would balk on Harris is his body of work is relatively short. Yep, Harris is a solid football player and there's no doubt about that, it's simply what a team can afford to do or not, that simple. One of the two will not be on the Vikings in 2021, Smith or Harris, but it's been great having them together for the past couple years!

Funkytown -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/8/2020 4:37:19 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Pager Welcome to site, please keep posting! I don't either. Contrast to Drew Brees comments and the spat they created between him and Michael Thomas. Ragnarok is a little polarizing especially on Cousins. Not unlike some of your poster at your site; I'm a often visitor/lurker. Nice job you've done over there. Spence is probably my favorite poster - hahah. Oh, wow! Thanks! I really appreciate that. Glad you enjoy the place. I put in a lot of work, and that's always my #1 goal: having a Vikings community all can enjoy. So, that truly means a lot. I'll do my best to continue to post here. As you've probably gathered, I keep myself pretty busy, but I'm sure I can find time a couple times a week to pop over here for a bit. As I said earlier, this seems like a great, old-school community. I wish I had found it several years ago! Oh, Spence. LOL. Wow... I take a LOT of heat over him, lol, but yeah, he's truly one of a kind, huh? I'm an optimist too, but he puts me to shame! Some of the stuff he comes up with... I just have to shake my head. [&:]

Funkytown -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/8/2020 5:02:42 PM)
From Schefter: Pro-Bowl RB Dalvin Cook no longer will participate in any team-related activities until and unless he receives a “reasonable” deal, a source said Monday. “He’s out,” a source told ESPN. “Without a reasonable extension, he will not be showing up for camp or beyond.”

Tom Sykes -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/8/2020 7:37:58 PM)
Darren Wolfson @DWolfsonKSTP 1h Thoughts on Cook & #Vikings: He's not looking for all that close to McCaffrey $$. If they offered what D. Johnson got Sept. 2018 - 3/39 - he'd likely say yes. Sure, that's a lot of $$, but that offense goes as he goes, IMO. Time left to reach a deal. But Vikes will have to budge.

Tom Sykes -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/8/2020 7:39:09 PM)
Ben Goessling @GoesslingStrib ·2h Sources have said Cook has been participating in the Vikings' virtual offseason program to this point. The Vikings ordinarily finish many contract extensions (Griffen, Rhodes, Joseph, Diggs) at the eve of training camp, which remains the date to watch here, by my lights.

Pager -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/8/2020 8:25:17 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: thebigo quote: ORIGINAL: Pager quote: ORIGINAL: Dana Turner quote: ORIGINAL: Pager I don't remember reading one single article/anything about an extension prior to the 2019 year. I remember tracking the Harris situation because I was advocating for the Vikes to sign him to an extension prior to the 2019 season, ala Thielen (probably best comp) or Hunter/Diggs/Kendricks. Contract talks usually get reported and I def don't remember Harris' agent saying they weren't going to sign an extension. But I could be wrong, missed it, forgot it, etc. I'm not sure it would have mattered if we had signed Harris prior to 2019. He would have just been back at the well a couple years later as one of the top safeties in the league demanding appropriate pay, just like Thielen did. Sure, it would have been nice to avoid this years cap hit, but if he had signed a "friendly" deal, it would have been redone if he follows last year up with another excellent year, and last year was an excellent year for him. I say let him play this year out and if he's just as good, he will demand huge bucks next year and you just have to let him or Smith walk. You simply cannot have $25 million tied up in your two safety spots. Many of us liked Harris when we got him as a UDFA, thought there was solid potential there, but I'm not sure anyone had him picked out to be one of the top safeties in the NFL four years later. Lets hope one of the twenty young guys we have signed up this year is another hidden gem! IMO - age makes the Thielen and Harris situations different. Theilen was younger when he signed his contract and so we accommodated him on his raise request. And it was in the form of an extension. The Vikings would likely have been much less likely to give him a raise/extension at age 30 (or pick an age for Harris). I agree - let Harris play out his tag and test the market next year. Draft safety early and maybe often, we might have to replace both pretty soon. Thielen was 28 years 8 months when he signed his 4 year extension keeping him (at the time) for the next 6 seasons through 2024. Harris is currently 28 years 8 months old. The main reason I would balk on Harris is his body of work is relatively short. Thielen signed his first contract extension in 2017 after joining the Vikes in 2013. Started 10 games in 2016. I cant find the date when the contract was signed but let's say Thielen was roughly 26 8 months. Got his raise/extension two years later. Harris would have signed his first contract (in our hypothetical) at the beginning of 2019 after joining the Vikes in 2015. Started 9 games in 2018. Harris would have been roughly 27 years 8 months. Assuming a similar over-performance and request for raise/extension in the same time frame Harris would be 29 years 8 months for the raise/extension. It's only 1 year/season difference but football years are dog years (and more exaggerated/accelerated as a player approaches 30). I don't have access to see Thielen's PFF score in 2016 but had 900+ yards after having 150 yards the year before. I think Harris' was in the 90s (if I remember right) in 2018. It's interesting and a hypothetical. Lot of factors play into contract decisions. Cap space, depth chart, confidence in drafting and developing players at positions.

Pager -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/8/2020 8:27:23 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Funkytown quote: ORIGINAL: Pager Welcome to site, please keep posting! I don't either. Contrast to Drew Brees comments and the spat they created between him and Michael Thomas. Ragnarok is a little polarizing especially on Cousins. Not unlike some of your poster at your site; I'm a often visitor/lurker. Nice job you've done over there. Spence is probably my favorite poster - hahah. Oh, wow! Thanks! I really appreciate that. Glad you enjoy the place. I put in a lot of work, and that's always my #1 goal: having a Vikings community all can enjoy. So, that truly means a lot. I'll do my best to continue to post here. As you've probably gathered, I keep myself pretty busy, but I'm sure I can find time a couple times a week to pop over here for a bit. As I said earlier, this seems like a great, old-school community. I wish I had found it several years ago! Oh, Spence. LOL. Wow... I take a LOT of heat over him, lol, but yeah, he's truly one of a kind, huh? I'm an optimist too, but he puts me to shame! Some of the stuff he comes up with... I just have to shake my head. [&:] Spence is on one far end of the spectrum. You've got way more on the far end of the other spectrum. His posts are pretty amusing - gets all the haters riled up. He's gotta be just poking the hornets' nest right?

Pager -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/8/2020 8:31:07 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes Darren Wolfson @DWolfsonKSTP 1h Thoughts on Cook & #Vikings: He's not looking for all that close to McCaffrey $$. If they offered what D. Johnson got Sept. 2018 - 3/39 - he'd likely say yes. Sure, that's a lot of $$, but that offense goes as he goes, IMO. Time left to reach a deal. But Vikes will have to budge. Interesting - 3/39? If it's a little more incentive based and lower guarantees, I think I'd be ok with it. Only 3 years. Do not want to see a 4 or 5 yr deal. Definately need to cut Reiff. That's what, 23M in cap savings this year and next? Thanks for posting these Twitter feeds. Makes me think of Bruce. Anyone have an update? I think ICU stay/ventilation average for COVID was 10-14 days. I feel like we gotta be close to that.

Pager -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/8/2020 8:47:08 PM)
Doesn't the new CBA heavily penalize players for holding out?

jbusse -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/8/2020 9:09:44 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Pager quote: ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes Darren Wolfson @DWolfsonKSTP 1h Thoughts on Cook & #Vikings: He's not looking for all that close to McCaffrey $$. If they offered what D. Johnson got Sept. 2018 - 3/39 - he'd likely say yes. Sure, that's a lot of $$, but that offense goes as he goes, IMO. Time left to reach a deal. But Vikes will have to budge. Interesting - 3/39? If it's a little more incentive based and lower guarantees, I think I'd be ok with it. Only 3 years. Do not want to see a 4 or 5 yr deal. Definately need to cut Reiff. That's what, 23M in cap savings this year and next? Thanks for posting these Twitter feeds. Makes me think of Bruce. Anyone have an update? I think ICU stay/ventilation average for COVID was 10-14 days. I feel like we gotta be close to that. No recent update on Bruce. This would be day 21 on the ventilator.

David F. -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/8/2020 9:33:38 PM)
If Cook sits out we need Mattison to be our Austin Ekeler. It will probably work out. Then Cook can come back in the middle of the season fresh as a daisy and we can roll with the duo into the playoffs. And we draft another RB in the mid rounds in the next offseason and repeat.

hagar -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/8/2020 10:03:08 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Funkytown quote: ORIGINAL: Pager Welcome to site, please keep posting! I don't either. Contrast to Drew Brees comments and the spat they created between him and Michael Thomas. Ragnarok is a little polarizing especially on Cousins. Not unlike some of your poster at your site; I'm a often visitor/lurker. Nice job you've done over there. Spence is probably my favorite poster - hahah. Oh, wow! Thanks! I really appreciate that. Glad you enjoy the place. I put in a lot of work, and that's always my #1 goal: having a Vikings community all can enjoy. So, that truly means a lot. I'll do my best to continue to post here. As you've probably gathered, I keep myself pretty busy, but I'm sure I can find time a couple times a week to pop over here for a bit. As I said earlier, this seems like a great, old-school community. I wish I had found it several years ago! Oh, Spence. LOL. Wow... I take a LOT of heat over him, lol, but yeah, he's truly one of a kind, huh? I'm an optimist too, but he puts me to shame! Some of the stuff he comes up with... I just have to shake my head. [&:] What site?

Tom Sykes -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/8/2020 10:22:23 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Pager quote: ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes Darren Wolfson @DWolfsonKSTP 1h Thoughts on Cook & #Vikings: He's not looking for all that close to McCaffrey $$. If they offered what D. Johnson got Sept. 2018 - 3/39 - he'd likely say yes. Sure, that's a lot of $$, but that offense goes as he goes, IMO. Time left to reach a deal. But Vikes will have to budge. Interesting - 3/39? If it's a little more incentive based and lower guarantees, I think I'd be ok with it. Only 3 years. Do not want to see a 4 or 5 yr deal. Definately need to cut Reiff. That's what, 23M in cap savings this year and next? Thanks for posting these Twitter feeds. Makes me think of Bruce. Anyone have an update? I think ICU stay/ventilation average for COVID was 10-14 days. I feel like we gotta be close to that. Yeah posting quotes made me think of Bruce also. Hopefully we have him back soon. I agree about the contract parameters. If we do go 4-5 years, I sure hope guarantees are in the first 3 years. Another serious Cook injury this year and it could turn into a cap debacle real fast.

kgdabom -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/8/2020 11:56:31 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes Darren Wolfson @DWolfsonKSTP 1h Thoughts on Cook & #Vikings: He's not looking for all that close to McCaffrey $$. If they offered what D. Johnson got Sept. 2018 - 3/39 - he'd likely say yes. Sure, that's a lot of $$, but that offense goes as he goes, IMO. Time left to reach a deal. But Vikes will have to budge. He's not worth 3-39 unless the first two years are for $20 million and the third year is fully unguaranteed.

kgdabom -> RE: General Vikes Talk (6/8/2020 11:58:00 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Pager Doesn't the new CBA heavily penalize players for holding out? It's my understanding that the fines that would always be forgiven in the past can't be forgiven now.

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