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Daniel Lee Young -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/11/2023 10:22:15 AM)

I used to go to any lengths to watch Vikings football..

I rejoiced in the wins..

I raged at the losses..

McCoombs sold the team, **** us as fans with the moss trade..

It’s been all such a false hope ride since then..

Almost 20 years of crushed hopes and dreams..

Watching weak teams built into sham contenders around singular “ marketing value” players..

Watching our better coaches be “sniped” by other teams, with more commitment to winning management, have equal or better success.

Watching players like Birk, McKinnie, Mitch Berger, even TJack and Harvin, with the Seahawks.. get SUPERBOWL wins and Championship Rings..

It apparent that the Wilfs and GM’s of the past 20 years, can’t pick a quality coach on offense, our NOT make the mistake of paying big money to “middle of the road , “steady but not electric “ star/stud players.

Tice, Childress, Fraiser, Zimmer, and now, KOC..

A true pentagon of mediocrity, as reflected by the offensive mediocrity that they employ on game days.

This co- dependent relationship and obsessive/ compulsive attachment to this team is quite literally bad for my mental health and my personality.

I have been kicked into a cycle of negativity and despair, by false hope and dreams.

When I feel compelled to find other things to do on game days.. I feel like it’s over.

FML…



Richard Neussendorfer -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/11/2023 10:26:47 AM)

I get the feeling we'll be watching Flores succeed elsewhere and it'll be another kick in the shorts. I really don't see him staying unless he's made head coach. We know that'll never happen so I'm prepared to be disappointed.



Tom Sykes -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/11/2023 10:33:20 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

I get the feeling we'll be watching Flores succeed elsewhere and it'll be another kick in the shorts. I really don't see him staying unless he's made head coach. We know that'll never happen so I'm prepared to be disappointed.

For sure. Somebody is going to give him, if not a HC deal, then a DC-ASST HC with a wink wink deal to take over HC when available.

We are going to collaborate ourselves into oblivion with our best buddy regime finding some way to extend Cousins for another year, push his dead money into the 50m strata in 2025 ... and continue on next year with last year's defense.

Imagine this year with last year's defense (ie, with someone other than Flores)

owie.



Jeff Jesser -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/11/2023 10:46:33 AM)

My only hope for Flores is (and this is a really bad "hope") is that his case against the NFL keeps teams at bay until it's resolved. Otherwise, I agree. He should be the hottest name in the league for a HC spot.


I'm just floored at how the mystique (for me, not speaking for others) has just been torn down on KOC. Dude was going to be some offensive wonder mind. Another in the new wave of offensive geniuses. Our offense hasn't adapted with 4 different QB's. We had a brief glimpse but that was just Dobbs running for his life and making something out of fear. As he learned the offense he has gotten much worse and KOC hasn't done anything to help him out. I mentioned it on the game day thread.

Every person on the planet knew that the ball was going to forced to JJ when he entered the game on play 2. You don't think that corner was squatting on that route? A double move would have been 6 or, at least, made them think. Nope, KOC goes the conservative route and it's almost a pick 6.

They were pinning their ears back and Dobbs barely had time to react. Maybe a hard count or 2??? I know it's revolutionary but isn't that what he was billed as? Every time he does do something off script, on offense, it's ill-timed
or just plain weird.

I guess you could point to the fake punts but is that on him or the ST coach?



Richard Neussendorfer -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/11/2023 10:47:50 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

I get the feeling we'll be watching Flores succeed elsewhere and it'll be another kick in the shorts. I really don't see him staying unless he's made head coach. We know that'll never happen so I'm prepared to be disappointed.

For sure. Somebody is going to give him, if not a HC deal, then a DC-ASST HC with a wink wink deal to take over HC when available.

We are going to collaborate ourselves into oblivion with our best buddy regime finding some way to extend Cousins for another year, push his dead money into the 50m strata in 2025 ... and continue on next year with last year's defense.

Imagine this year with last year's defense (ie, with someone other than Flores)

owie.

Exactly. It'll take years for the organization to figure out KOC isn't that good even though yesterday's game should pretty much seal the deal. A timeout then a delay of game was worse than high school.



Jeff Jesser -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/11/2023 10:48:08 AM)

KOC is forcing his guys in to the system rather than molding it around them. O'Coneshell. [:@]



Jeff Jesser -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/11/2023 10:48:58 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

I get the feeling we'll be watching Flores succeed elsewhere and it'll be another kick in the shorts. I really don't see him staying unless he's made head coach. We know that'll never happen so I'm prepared to be disappointed.

For sure. Somebody is going to give him, if not a HC deal, then a DC-ASST HC with a wink wink deal to take over HC when available.

We are going to collaborate ourselves into oblivion with our best buddy regime finding some way to extend Cousins for another year, push his dead money into the 50m strata in 2025 ... and continue on next year with last year's defense.

Imagine this year with last year's defense (ie, with someone other than Flores)

owie.

Exactly. It'll take years for the organization to figure out KOC isn't that good even though yesterday's game should pretty much seal the deal. A timeout then a delay of game was worse than high school.



Exactly. In a vacuum you can let it go. It wans't the first time that's happened.



Jeff Jesser -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/11/2023 10:54:50 AM)

For the record, before i get put on blast, I like KOC. I was really excited at some of the things I saw last year. His game management and play calling were iffy at times but his situational awareness was miles better than Zimmer. I just thought he needed experience in the other areas. He's not shown any growth in the weak areas and I think he's gotten worse.

At a bare minimum I think he needs to hire a real OC and let that person call plays. Some up and comer from the same tree but an outside voice.



Jeff Allen -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/11/2023 10:56:36 AM)

KOC is 17-0 when winning or at least pushing in turnover battle...yeah, he's the problem.



Richard Neussendorfer -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/11/2023 11:06:43 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeff Allen

KOC is 17-0 when winning or at least pushing in turnover battle...yeah, he's the problem.

He kept a turnover machine in about 6 quarters too long so I'd say he has culpability.



Ricky J -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/11/2023 11:06:49 AM)

I want to also go on record as saying, "Give the man a chance!"

He's been here less than two full seasons for pete's sake!



Richard Neussendorfer -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/11/2023 11:09:03 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

I want to also go on record as saying, "Give the F man a chance!"

He's been here less than two full seasons for pete's sake!

He's getting worse. I've seen enough. If you want to flounder around for another 3 years that's ok. I think I know how this ends.



Jeff Jesser -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/11/2023 11:14:13 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeff Allen

KOC is 17-0 when winning or at least pushing in turnover battle...yeah, he's the problem.



Talk Vikes board total vindication! [;)]



Tom Sykes -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/11/2023 11:22:14 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeff Jesser

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeff Allen

KOC is 17-0 when winning or at least pushing in turnover battle...yeah, he's the problem.



Talk Vikes board total vindication! [;)]

LOL.

Allen with his usual decadent swirl of purple icing on the cake.



Ricky J -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/11/2023 11:23:48 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

I want to also go on record as saying, "Give the F man a chance!"

He's been here less than two full seasons for pete's sake!

He's getting worse. I've seen enough. If you want to flounder around for another 3 years that's ok. I think I know how this ends.

You think, but you really don't know!

Peace!



Ricky J -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/11/2023 11:25:04 AM)

It's Monday. Vikes win. Life is good!

3-0 I wish I was there (but only bc we had the 3)



Richard Neussendorfer -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/11/2023 11:25:28 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

I want to also go on record as saying, "Give the F man a chance!"

He's been here less than two full seasons for pete's sake!

He's getting worse. I've seen enough. If you want to flounder around for another 3 years that's ok. I think I know how this ends.

You think, but you really don't know!

Peace!

By that logic let's hire Brandon Stayley. I mean we don't know!



Ricky J -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/11/2023 11:28:58 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

I want to also go on record as saying, "Give the F man a chance!"

He's been here less than two full seasons for pete's sake!

He's getting worse. I've seen enough. If you want to flounder around for another 3 years that's ok. I think I know how this ends.

You think, but you really don't know!

Peace!

By that logic let's hire Brandon Stayley. I mean we don't know!

Hey! Do what youve gotta do to enjoy your life. Ill do likewise.

Ifs and butts ... Kirk would of made this a great team with this defense. But that's out the window. Im giving O'Connell a chance to see what happens.

Oh, and Flo is going to turn around our offense, huh? good one!



Richard Neussendorfer -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/11/2023 11:31:21 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

I want to also go on record as saying, "Give the F man a chance!"

He's been here less than two full seasons for pete's sake!

He's getting worse. I've seen enough. If you want to flounder around for another 3 years that's ok. I think I know how this ends.

You think, but you really don't know!

Peace!

By that logic let's hire Brandon Stayley. I mean we don't know!

Hey! Do what youve gotta do to enjoy your life. Ill do likewise.

Ifs and butts ... Kirk would of made this a great team with this defense. But that's out the window. Im giving O'Connell a chance to see what happens.

Oh, and Flo is going to turn around our offense, huh? good one!

I think he could find a person to coordinate the offense. Doesn't seem like an impossible task.



Richard Neussendorfer -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/11/2023 11:35:16 AM)

Let's be honest. It's not getting fixed with KOC either.



Ricky J -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/11/2023 11:39:23 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

Let's be honest. It's not getting fixed with KOC either.

What's honest about that? He hasn't even had 2 seasons. He just lost his QB. It's starting from scratch during the stretch run.

whatever -- getting into it with you guys on this board is not a battle that can be won



beo -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/11/2023 11:41:09 AM)

Flores is an INCREDIBLE defensive coordinator.

But people have serious short term memory on his head coaching stint.
He was not a great head coach.
He was not good for Tua.

Best case scenario is Flores beef with the NFL and some of his bad press by Tua/former players keeps him with Vikes for another year and KOC improves.



Richard Neussendorfer -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/11/2023 11:45:21 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

Let's be honest. It's not getting fixed with KOC either.

What's honest about that? He hasn't even had 2 seasons. He just lost his QB. It's starting from scratch during the stretch run.

whatever -- getting into it with you guys on this board is not a battle that can be won

It's just differing opinions. It's fine. I'm just seeing a guy do silly things like getting delays of game after timeouts and poor clock management. Seems very slow to recognize problems and address them too. Dobbs should have been pulled in the Bears game and at the very worst at halftime of the Raiders game. To me these are red flags but I have no problem with your views on it.



Tom Sykes -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/11/2023 11:59:08 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

I want to also go on record as saying, "Give the man a chance!"

He's been here less than two full seasons for pete's sake!

How about just calling it what it is, while it is.

He needs to get a lot better.

Regardless of his 1.697 seasons of experience.

I totally get the dumbing down stuff for new/back-up QBs ... I get the rash of injuries having a huge impact ... I get the karmic bad bounces compared to last year ... I also see a lot of stale playcalling that ensures games are going to be close regardless of the opponent. Since he got here.

I was hoping for a fresh young offensive mind ... whether it was effective from the get go or needed fine tuning along the way.

Now I'm just hoping he matures into something better than the last OC or HC.



Ricky J -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/11/2023 12:03:18 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

Let's be honest. It's not getting fixed with KOC either.

What's honest about that? He hasn't even had 2 seasons. He just lost his QB. It's starting from scratch during the stretch run.

whatever -- getting into it with you guys on this board is not a battle that can be won

It's just differing opinions. It's fine. I'm just seeing a guy do silly things like getting delays of game after timeouts and poor clock management. Seems very slow to recognize problems and address them too. Dobbs should have been pulled in the Bears game and at the very worst at halftime of the Raiders game. To me these are red flags but I have no problem with your views on it.

I hear ya.

All we can really do is stay tuned and see where this goes.

I would be ok with beo being right



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