RE: Players and prospects III

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CPAMAN -> RE: Players and prospects III (5/11/2015 12:52:37 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Jim Frenette Hicks POW POW? What does that mean? Player of week in the minor leagues?

djskillz -> RE: Players and prospects III (5/11/2015 12:55:31 PM)
Yes, that "bad attitude with no IQ" Hicks is player of the week: http://www.milb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20150510&content_id=123632260&fext=.jsp&vkey=news_t534&sid=t534

Phil Riewer -> RE: Players and prospects III (5/11/2015 1:27:47 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: djskillz Yes, that "bad attitude with no IQ" Hicks is player of the week: http://www.milb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20150510&content_id=123632260&fext=.jsp&vkey=news_t534&sid=t534 LOL Wouldn't a "superstar" have more than 1 player of the week. Has he ever had a player of the week before? The kid should be up for the award twice a month and he has probably 2 in his career....he still has a long, long ways to go. Who accused him having no IQ/Low IQ? If bad attitude=Low Drive for his craft then Yes I was one of them. He chose not to play winter ball/Fall League or work on his craft the last couple winters. I know he was playing golf instead of working on baseball as much as he should have. It doesn't make him dumb, he just likes playing golf like I do. I am not a +2 HDCP like him but he would have to give me 8 strokes......I think I could shoot an 80 and beat him.

twinsfan -> RE: Players and prospects III (5/11/2015 1:33:22 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer quote: ORIGINAL: djskillz Yes, that "bad attitude with no IQ" Hicks is player of the week: http://www.milb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20150510&content_id=123632260&fext=.jsp&vkey=news_t534&sid=t534 LOL Wouldn't a "superstar" have more than 1 player of the week. Not necessarily. Also, I have not heard anyone call Hicks a superstar.

djskillz -> RE: Players and prospects III (5/11/2015 1:36:23 PM)
The bar is simply; is he better than what we have (Schafer/Robinson-currently .511/.695 OPS's and worse defense than him) and can he help? The answers to both of those questions to me are unequivocally yes. Ditto for Rosario.

Phil Riewer -> RE: Players and prospects III (5/11/2015 1:36:51 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: twinsfan quote: ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer quote: ORIGINAL: djskillz Yes, that "bad attitude with no IQ" Hicks is player of the week: http://www.milb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20150510&content_id=123632260&fext=.jsp&vkey=news_t534&sid=t534 LOL Wouldn't a "superstar" have more than 1 player of the week. Not necessarily. Also, I have not heard anyone call Hicks a superstar. I don't agree. Many on the board are treating Hicks like he should be up on the Major League team already like he his a superstar......this is the first month in the minors he has shown that capability....I hope he keeps it up and gets called up and performs as such in the Majors. I for one wanted it to happen the last 2 years only to be disappointed. I don't link his failures to TR or Gardy. Hicks just has the talent and needs to put in the work. Look back on his last 5 years---always a slow starter until this year because he has never put in as much offseason work as he did this winter, plain and simple. The reason Hicks wasn't called up before Rosario was simple....Rosario put in more offseason work and the Twins rewarded him......

djskillz -> RE: Players and prospects III (5/11/2015 1:40:01 PM)
There's a huge gap between "superstar" and "should be on the big club". Huge. Hicks has a very good minor league track record and obviously has tools; always has. He was a top 10 pick for a reason. Doesn't mean he's going to be a star, or heck, even a regular. But the odds of him becoming a solid major league player are a whole hell of a lot higher than those for 28 year old never-was Jordan Schafer and 30 year old never-was Shane Robinson. That's all the debate should be about. I'd still have both him and Rosario up and get rid of both of those guys or have 1 in AAA in case of injury.

djskillz -> RE: Players and prospects III (5/11/2015 1:41:03 PM)
Your "slow starter" point is also completely untrue. That has nothing to do with "work". That has to do with him being young for his age at basically every stop along the way. Including being rushed to the majors in the first place after the Span/Revere trades. As is your claim about Rosario, a guy that's been suspended in the past for marijuana and has had his own "work ethic" issues. He was called up before Hicks because it's a cup of coffee promotion (for now) with Arcia out. That's all. And Molitor/TR said as much.

Phil Riewer -> RE: Players and prospects III (5/11/2015 1:43:36 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: djskillz There's a huge gap between "superstar" and "should be on the big club". Huge. Hicks has a very good minor league track record and obviously has tools; always has. He was a top 10 pick for a reason. Doesn't mean he's going to be a star, or heck, even a regular. But the odds of him becoming a solid major league player are a whole hell of a lot higher than those for 28 year old never-was Jordan Schafer and 30 year old never-was Shane Robinson. That's all the debate should be about. I'd still have both him and Rosario up and get rid of both of those guys or have 1 in AAA in case of injury. I will say it again....Hicks has all the talent needed to succeed. His problem is his offseason work. He finally put in more time this offseason and he is actually hitting before June 1st. Pretty easy trend to see. If he worked out all offseason like Hunter or spend all winter in Florida working out like Rosario, Bazinga---he is a superstar. He is his own problem and enigma.

djskillz -> RE: Players and prospects III (5/11/2015 1:52:25 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer quote: ORIGINAL: djskillz There's a huge gap between "superstar" and "should be on the big club". Huge. Hicks has a very good minor league track record and obviously has tools; always has. He was a top 10 pick for a reason. Doesn't mean he's going to be a star, or heck, even a regular. But the odds of him becoming a solid major league player are a whole hell of a lot higher than those for 28 year old never-was Jordan Schafer and 30 year old never-was Shane Robinson. That's all the debate should be about. I'd still have both him and Rosario up and get rid of both of those guys or have 1 in AAA in case of injury. I will say it again....Hicks has all the talent needed to succeed. His problem is his offseason work. He finally put in more time this offseason and he is actually hitting before June 1st. Pretty easy trend to see. If he worked out all offseason like Hunter or spend all winter in Florida working out like Rosario, Bazinga---he is a superstar. He is his own problem and enigma. You have no clue what he is or isn't doing in the offseason. Ditto for any of these guys. To claim that is utterly ridiculous. Hell, Torii Hunter himself has said that if anything Hicks takes too much advice, tips, etc. Again, this is about the first time Hicks has been "old" for his level. He's major league ready; was at the end of last year at least. Almost every other stop along the way he was playing above his age level. To insinuate that it's work ethic is completely without merit or proof.

Phil Riewer -> RE: Players and prospects III (5/11/2015 1:52:51 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: djskillz Your "slow starter" point is also completely untrue. That has nothing to do with "work". That has to do with him being young for his age at basically every stop along the way. Including being rushed to the majors in the first place after the Span/Revere trades. As is your claim about Rosario, a guy that's been suspended in the past for marijuana and has had his own "work ethic" issues. He was called up before Hicks because it's a cup of coffee promotion (for now) with Arcia out. That's all. And Molitor/TR said as much. I have posted what has been said about Rosario and Hicks this offseason.....Rosario took it way more serious than Hicks. This is one of the 1st offseasons Hicks put in some extra work and played some winter ball other than 2011 when he played in the fall league. In fact the Twins were pissed the last 2 years about his offseason work and not playing in the fall league...look it up. Rosario plays winter ball (played Winter ball in 2011, 2012, 2013 and Fall ball in 2013 & 2014).....Hicks has not--he got kicked off of a team last year after 16 games and played only 15 games the year before plus he hasn't played fall league since 2011. Who is working harder at their craft? Here it is look it up: http://www.baseball-reference.com/minors/player.cgi?id=rosari001edd http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/h/hicksaa01.shtml

djskillz -> RE: Players and prospects III (5/11/2015 1:55:00 PM)
Winter ball is an indication of hard work? Hardly. There are a whole host of reasons why guys do or don't do winter ball. None of which point to work ethic.

Phil Riewer -> RE: Players and prospects III (5/11/2015 1:58:48 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: djskillz Winter ball is an indication of hard work? Hardly. There are a whole host of reasons why guys do or don't do winter ball. None of which point to work ethic. The Twins asked him to play in the Fall League the last 2 seasons....did he? What does that usually mean when he can't hit a lick for first 2-3 months the following season? I think it means he needed to put in more work in the offseason and he didn't. Hicks hit in August & September last year but couldn't hit a lick up to that point.....I find it funny you keep making excuses for the guy. If he puts in the work and hits he will be called up. He would be up already if he worked as hard the last 2 offseasons, went to the Fall League, etc. Rosario played Fall League and rocked---one of the 1st callups. 2 years before Dozier hit in the Fall League which put him on the fast track.

djskillz -> RE: Players and prospects III (5/11/2015 2:01:06 PM)
I'm not making any excuses. I think you keep looking for (unsubstantiated) reasons to rip the guy, for no apparent reason. I also think you put far too much faith in what the Twins tell the press and/or their "logic". All I've said is that he's ready and he's better than the guys we currently have. That's something no one on here should disagree with. Not to mention that he would at the very least help solve one of our biggest team weaknesses, OF defense. Doesn't mean he's a star, doesn't mean he's going to "get it". But he deserves his shot now that he's ready. He was rushed before and it was also under Gardy. We wouldn't be rushing him at all now. Sink or swim time once and for all. Or we could have him waste away at Rochester until Buxton and Rosario are both fully ready and then waste a potentially valuable asset for peanuts. That always seems to work out well....

djskillz -> RE: Players and prospects III (5/11/2015 2:03:20 PM)
Phil, you're putting way too much stock in the Fall League. I've been to it. It's 1 month. And it's after the season and long before the next season starts. It's not THAT many ab's. Yes, it can be a good experience for some, but it's really not a big deal.

Phil Riewer -> RE: Players and prospects III (5/11/2015 2:09:18 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: djskillz I'm not making any excuses. I think you keep looking for (unsubstantiated) reasons to rip the guy, for no apparent reason. All I've said is that he's ready and he's better than the guys we currently have. That's something no one on here should disagree with. Not to mention that he would at the very least help solve one of our biggest team weaknesses, OF defense. Doesn't mean he's a star, doesn't mean he's going to "get it". But he deserves his shot now that he's ready. He was rushed before and it was also under Gardy. We wouldn't be rushing him at all now. Nothing I have said about Hicks is ripping him. 1) He has a right to not go to the Arizona Fall League, not play in the Winter League, or not put the work in as much as needed in the offseason to hit Major League Pitching in April. 2) He has a right to play golf in the winter. 3) He wasn't rushed by Gardy or TR (He was 23). Hicks has talent and showed some in the 2011 Fall League. He just hasn't put in the work in the offseason to be ready by April to play in the Majors and is a slow starter except for this year because he put in the necessary offseason work. 4) Hicks played and most importantly hit like a Major Leaguer in September the last 2 years. Our OF defense is just fine when Robinson and Rosario are roaming. Hicks has to hit Major League pitching to play a corner OF spot. He has done it 2-3 months earlier this year than the last two. I hope he gets a callup soon and hits major league pitching. Otherwise he won't have a corner OF spot and at best is a 4th OF.

Phil Riewer -> RE: Players and prospects III (5/11/2015 2:12:06 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: djskillz Phil, you're putting way too much stock in the Fall League. I've been to it. It's 1 month. And it's after the season and long before the next season starts. It's not THAT many ab's. Yes, it can be a good experience for some, but it's really not a big deal. Actually it is against High Level/Almost ready Major League pitching.....Rosario hit .330 and it is another month of work. I knew Dozier was making the team after his ARZ fall league performance a few years back. IMO it is very important if you are on the fringe to play for the big club. Hicks declined in 2012 & 2013 to play even though it is only 30 games.

McMurfy -> RE: Players and prospects III (5/11/2015 2:39:12 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer quote: ORIGINAL: twinsfan quote: ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer quote: ORIGINAL: djskillz Yes, that "bad attitude with no IQ" Hicks is player of the week: http://www.milb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20150510&content_id=123632260&fext=.jsp&vkey=news_t534&sid=t534 LOL Wouldn't a "superstar" have more than 1 player of the week. Not necessarily. Also, I have not heard anyone call Hicks a superstar. I don't agree. Many on the board are treating Hicks like he should be up on the Major League team already like he his a superstar......this is the first month in the minors he has shown that capability....I hope he keeps it up and gets called up and performs as such in the Majors. I for one wanted it to happen the last 2 years only to be disappointed. I don't link his failures to TR or Gardy. Hicks just has the talent and needs to put in the work. Look back on his last 5 years---always a slow starter until this year because he has never put in as much offseason work as he did this winter, plain and simple. The reason Hicks wasn't called up before Rosario was simple....Rosario put in more offseason work and the Twins rewarded him...... Bullshit Phil. All anyone ever said was that the potential of Hicks alone was a better option than Schafer/Robinson. He is athletic, he was a First Round pick. Now, I expect your partner from New York to chime in with one of his personalities anytime, he might even post a few links for us as well, likely without full context. But I don't remember anyone calling Hicks a Superstar.

Trekgeekscott -> RE: Players and prospects III (5/11/2015 2:40:48 PM)
Alright it's pretty simple. Hicks has downright sucked at the plate the last two years. Add on mental lapses in the OF and on the basepaths, he's dug himself a great big hole to dig himself out of. And no matter how much one thinks he may have earned it...1 1/2 months in AAA isn't enough to dig himself out yet. Midsummer maybe August if he keeps raking.

Mr. Ed -> RE: Players and prospects III (5/11/2015 2:42:22 PM)
Nick Nelson's tweet summed it up for me. If you're nervous about giving Hicks another chance after last 2 years, I get it. But he's not going to learn to hit MLB pitching in AAA.

McMurfy -> RE: Players and prospects III (5/11/2015 2:46:07 PM)
Not since Joe Mauer has a Twins player polarized this board like Aaron Hicks. Alex Meyer will be next I believe.

TJSweens -> RE: Players and prospects III (5/11/2015 2:55:19 PM)
We need to stop making Schafer / Rpbinson comparisons in the Hicks discussion. If those two are the standard of measure then there are a whole shitload of players being unfairly kept in the minors all over the league. Hicks was not sent to AAA because the organization was enamored with Schafer and Sugar Shane. He was sent down because as Molitor said, he just wasn't good in ST. Molitor doesn't want him up here when he is good enough to surpass the dynamic duo. He wants him up here when he is ready to step in and be a legitimate every day major league outfielder. Two things are certain in Hicks' current situation: 1. a lot of his wounds are self inflicted. 2. The organization has set him to fail a few times. Debating who is more at fault at this point is as pointless and the S&R comparisons. The only relevant point is if Hicks is ready now. I have no problem bringing him up based on this first month +. I also have no problem if Molitor wants him to prove it a little longer. This kid has been set up to fail too many times. He doesn't need to be put in that position again.

Phil Riewer -> RE: Players and prospects III (5/11/2015 3:00:55 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: McMurfy quote: ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer quote: ORIGINAL: twinsfan quote: ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer quote: ORIGINAL: djskillz Yes, that "bad attitude with no IQ" Hicks is player of the week: http://www.milb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20150510&content_id=123632260&fext=.jsp&vkey=news_t534&sid=t534 LOL Wouldn't a "superstar" have more than 1 player of the week. Not necessarily. Also, I have not heard anyone call Hicks a superstar. I don't agree. Many on the board are treating Hicks like he should be up on the Major League team already like he his a superstar......this is the first month in the minors he has shown that capability....I hope he keeps it up and gets called up and performs as such in the Majors. I for one wanted it to happen the last 2 years only to be disappointed. I don't link his failures to TR or Gardy. Hicks just has the talent and needs to put in the work. Look back on his last 5 years---always a slow starter until this year because he has never put in as much offseason work as he did this winter, plain and simple. The reason Hicks wasn't called up before Rosario was simple....Rosario put in more offseason work and the Twins rewarded him...... Bullshit Phil. All anyone ever said was that the potential of Hicks alone was a better option than Schafer/Robinson. He is athletic, he was a First Round pick. Now, I expect your partner from New York to chime in with one of his personalities anytime, he might even post a few links for us as well, likely without full context. But I don't remember anyone calling Hicks a Superstar. Bullshit yourself....go back 3 years---everyone on this board was calling him a future superstar. I had high hopes for him also as we should as he was a high-rated prospect. Hopefully he becomes the former enigma, makes it up soon, and stays in the Majors. Who the hell is my partner from New York?

Phil Riewer -> RE: Players and prospects III (5/11/2015 3:02:20 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Mr. Ed Nick Nelson's tweet summed it up for me. If you're nervous about giving Hicks another chance after last 2 years, I get it. But he's not going to learn to hit MLB pitching in AAA. Nick Nelson is right. We will know soon if he can hit MLB pitching, Mr. Hicks couldn't hit minor league pitching last year until August which is why he was brought up in September.....

McMurfy -> RE: Players and prospects III (5/11/2015 3:04:45 PM)
Sweens, it has to be part of the discussion because they are our in house alternatives. I don't thonk anybody would be clamoring for Hicks now or after Spring Training if Mike Trout or even Denard Span.was in CF for the Twins. My assertion all along was that the first year, he had a nice spring and deserved a shot. The second year he was given a look due to an alternative other than Sam Fuld. This year I thought it was shit or get off the pot time and again, Schafer and Robinson (who has played well) did not seem like worthy alternatives. But you're right, he played his way to where he currently is.

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