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RE: Wolves 2020

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RE: Wolves 2020 - 1/12/2021 10:47:04 AM   
McMurfy


Posts: 13743
Joined: 7/31/2007
From: Portland, Oregon
Status: offline 		I’ve started to hear rumblings that Ball not going #1 was a mistake.

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Post #: 301
RE: Wolves 2020 - 1/12/2021 10:50:58 AM   
David Levine


Posts: 71472
Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Las Vegas
Status: online
quote:

ORIGINAL: McMurfy

I’ve started to hear rumblings that Ball not going #1 was a mistake.


Huge mistake.
Post #: 302
RE: Wolves 2020 - 1/12/2021 11:34:51 AM   
McMurfy


Posts: 13743
Joined: 7/31/2007
From: Portland, Oregon
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: McMurfy

I’ve started to hear rumblings that Ball not going #1 was a mistake.


Huge mistake.



Not I wanted you to say.
Was hoping you’d talk me off of the ledge.

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Post #: 303
RE: Wolves 2020 - 1/12/2021 11:39:40 AM   
David Levine


Posts: 71472
Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Las Vegas
Status: online
quote:

ORIGINAL: McMurfy

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: McMurfy

I’ve started to hear rumblings that Ball not going #1 was a mistake.


Huge mistake.



Not I wanted you to say.
Was hoping you’d talk me off of the ledge.


I still think there is a lot to like about Edwards, but Ball is on another level already.

Don't listen to Dane Moore and Will DeBerg break down the three top rookies through 10 games...

https://www.canishoopus.com/2021/1/12/22227305/dane-moore-nba-podcast-anthony-edwards-lamelo-ball-james-wiseman-nba-film-review-rookies

< Message edited by David Levine -- 1/12/2021 2:40:05 PM >
Post #: 304
RE: Wolves 2020 - 1/13/2021 6:30:53 PM   
Karl Juhnke


Posts: 10059
Joined: 7/28/2007
Status: offline 		As expected (and hoped) Towns is reported to be back in the starting lineup tonight vs Griz. So last game appears to be indeed have been a planned rest on a back to back night.

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Post #: 305
RE: Wolves 2020 - 1/13/2021 6:33:23 PM   
Karl Juhnke


Posts: 10059
Joined: 7/28/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: McMurfy

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: McMurfy

I’ve started to hear rumblings that Ball not going #1 was a mistake.


Huge mistake.



Not I wanted you to say.
Was hoping you’d talk me off of the ledge.


I still think there is a lot to like about Edwards, but Ball is on another level already.

Don't listen to Dane Moore and Will DeBerg break down the three top rookies through 10 games...

https://www.canishoopus.com/2021/1/12/22227305/dane-moore-nba-podcast-anthony-edwards-lamelo-ball-james-wiseman-nba-film-review-rookies


Edwards has shown flashes but will likely take some time. Ball seems to much further along at least out of the starting gate. No surprise here. I didn't think picking Edwards was a total flop at the time, but I was hoping for Ball.

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Post #: 306
RE: Wolves 2020 - 1/13/2021 9:18:41 PM   
Karl Juhnke


Posts: 10059
Joined: 7/28/2007
Status: offline 		A pretty solid 3 quarters followed by probably their worst quarter of the season and all the good feeling out the window.

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Post #: 307
RE: Wolves 2020 - 1/13/2021 9:29:36 PM   
David Levine


Posts: 71472
Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Las Vegas
Status: online 		Jenkins coached rings around Saunders in the 4th.

They have a fantastic coach and a smartly built roster.

Missing Morant and JJJ and they don’t get blown out and they don’t make excuses.

They just play everyone tough – including 2 very good games against the Lakers.
Post #: 308
RE: Wolves 2020 - 1/13/2021 10:13:16 PM   
Mr. Ed


Posts: 88413
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From: Minne-so-ta
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

Jenkins coached rings around Saunders in the 4th.

They have a fantastic coach and a smartly built roster.

Missing Morant and JJJ and they don’t get blown out and they don’t make excuses.

They just play everyone tough – including 2 very good games against the Lakers.



Any chance good fortune like that happens in minnesota this decade? Sheesh

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Post #: 309
RE: Wolves 2020 - 1/13/2021 10:40:37 PM   
David Levine


Posts: 71472
Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Las Vegas
Status: online
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mr. Ed

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

Jenkins coached rings around Saunders in the 4th.

They have a fantastic coach and a smartly built roster.

Missing Morant and JJJ and they don’t get blown out and they don’t make excuses.

They just play everyone tough – including 2 very good games against the Lakers.



Any chance good fortune like that happens in minnesota this decade? Sheesh


Not as long as Taylor owns the team.
Post #: 310
RE: Wolves 2020 - 1/14/2021 1:23:31 PM   
David Levine


Posts: 71472
Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Las Vegas
Status: online 		Every NBA Team's Biggest Disappointment After 3 Weeks

Minnesota Timberwolves: Everything

You can't pick just one disappointment for the Minnesota Timberwolves, not in a season that has gone south so quickly that the team's best hope may be to lose enough games to keep the top-three protected pick they owe the Warriors in the 2021 draft.

Karl-Anthony Towns dislocated his left wrist on Dec. 26 and missed six games. Jarret Culver still can't shoot. Anthony Edwards is doing nothing to dispel concerns he'd be an empty-numbers scorer. And D'Angelo Russell (a pantheon member of that same club) is getting his stats while doing little to drive winning.

The Wolves have been obliterated in Russell's minutes, which is a problem because he's played more of them than anyone on the team other than Malik Beasley.

Minnesota, toting the worst net rating in the league by a mile, is in rough shape.

This team was never going to be objectively good this year, but starts this rotten (3-7) risk spoiling the development of young players. And let's face it, this year seems like a wash three weeks in, so the Wolves are already playing for the future.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2926035-every-nba-teams-biggest-disappointment-after-3-weeks
Post #: 311
RE: Wolves 2020 - 1/14/2021 1:26:10 PM   
David Levine


Posts: 71472
Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Las Vegas
Status: online 		They are tied for the 2nd worst box outs per game in the league (8.9). The league leaders are above 15 (Bucks and Heat). They’re 5th worst in charges drawn, 5th worst on contested 3 pointers, bottom 10 in contested shots, bottom half in defensive distance run, 7th worst on average defensive speed…they don’t run hard in defensive situations, basically.

There isn’t a single wolf in the top 10 deflections per game, total deflections, loose balls recovered/game or per 36, screen assists (game/36/total), charges drawn, contested threes, contested total shots, or box outs. The only wolves on the hustle board leader lists are Naz as the 10th best contested 2s per 36 and Vanderbilt, with the #1 number for deflections per 36 minutes.

They certainly don’t look like the fittest team, they don’t seem to run very hard on defense, and they have 2 or 3 guys who hustle. Between this and the strategic decision to play fast with bad d and no shooting…Suits really seems to be bad at coaching a pro team.

Posted by Chairman Bud on Jan 14, 2021 | 11:18 AM
Post #: 312
RE: Wolves 2020 - 1/14/2021 2:28:44 PM   
Bill Johanesen


Posts: 20572
Status: offline 		So the Wolves have finished, on average, almost at the bottom of the Western Conference for KAT's entire time there. I read pro/con posts about him here recently, but it sure looks to an outsider like he is the common denominator for this terrible era. For the team to be that bad his entire time no matter the GM, HC, or surrounding players? He sure isn't a leader and probably lacks certain qualities winners have. Has he not had chemistry with anyone?
Post #: 313
RE: Wolves 2020 - 1/14/2021 2:32:14 PM   
Bill Johanesen


Posts: 20572
Status: offline 		Conversely, while I thought Butler was a jackwagon in his last days in Minny, he is very competitive. Maybe you got rid of the wrong guy. KAT would have fetched good assets in a trade, especially because every coach thinks they can plug and play anyone. Those assets plus Butler could have been fairly formidable. Certainly enough to come up for air out of the cellar.

< Message edited by Bill Johanesen -- 1/14/2021 2:35:25 PM >
Post #: 314
RE: Wolves 2020 - 1/14/2021 2:38:00 PM   
David Levine


Posts: 71472
Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Las Vegas
Status: online
quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

So the Wolves have finished, on average, almost at the bottom of the Western Conference for KAT's entire time there. I read pro/con posts about him here recently, but it sure looks to an outsider like he is the common denominator for this terrible era. For the team to be that bad his entire time no matter the GM, HC, or surrounding players? He sure isn't a leader and probably lacks certain qualities winners have. Has he not had chemistry with anyone?


He's had no talent around him. And horrible coaching.

Other than Butler, I'm not sure we've had a single player that would start on a Playoff team around him.

Its like how we wasted most of Garnett's career, but doing an even worse job of it.
Post #: 315
RE: Wolves 2020 - 1/14/2021 2:38:24 PM   
ronhextall


Posts: 5344
Joined: 7/19/2007
Status: online
quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

So the Wolves have finished, on average, almost at the bottom of the Western Conference for KAT's entire time there. I read pro/con posts about him here recently, but it sure looks to an outsider like he is the common denominator for this terrible era. For the team to be that bad his entire time no matter the GM, HC, or surrounding players? He sure isn't a leader and probably lacks certain qualities winners have. Has he not had chemistry with anyone?


If he commanded anything close to the Harden deal they should jump on it.

KAT is not a leader, he needs somebody like Lebron to show him how to win.
Post #: 316
RE: Wolves 2020 - 1/14/2021 2:39:50 PM   
David Levine


Posts: 71472
Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Las Vegas
Status: online
quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

Conversely, while I thought Butler was a jackwagon in his last days in Minny, he is very competitive. Maybe you got rid of the wrong guy. KAT would have fetched good assets in a trade, especially because every coach thinks they can plug and play anyone. Those assets plus Butler could have been fairly formidable. Certainly enough to come up for air out of the cellar.


Butler still would've left after the year. No way our coaching and front office would've been able to do enough to make him stay.

He was a bounce away from the ECF and he couldn't get out of Philly fast enough.
Post #: 317
RE: Wolves 2020 - 1/14/2021 3:19:15 PM   
David Levine


Posts: 71472
Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Las Vegas
Status: online 		For reference, let's look at this team by BPM.

Granted, BPM is noisy, and like every "all in one" stat has its issues, but let's get to it (With BBR definitions):

"BPM uses a player’s box score information, position, and the team’s overall performance to estimate the player’s contribution in points above league average per 100 possessions played."

To give a sense of the scale:

+10.0 is an all-time season (think peak Jordan or LeBron)
+8.0 is an MVP season (think peak Dirk or peak Shaq)
+6.0 is an all-NBA season
+4.0 is in all-star consideration
+2.0 is a good starter
+0.0 is a decent starter or solid 6th man
-2.0 is a bench player (this is also defined as "replacement level")
Below -2.0 are many end-of-bench players

Karl-Anthony Towns 6.4
Jarred Vanderbilt 1.1
Jaden McDaniels 1.0
Malik Beasley -0.5
DAngelo Russell -1.6
Naz Reid -1.6
Jordan McLaughlin -3.6
Ricky Rubio -4.2
Josh Okogie -4.3
Juan Hernangomez -4.4
Jake Layman -4.6
Ed Davis -5.6
Jarrett Culver -7.3
Anthony Edwards -7.7
Jaylen Nowell -9.8
Post #: 318
RE: Wolves 2020 - 1/14/2021 3:32:57 PM   
Karl Juhnke


Posts: 10059
Joined: 7/28/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

They are tied for the 2nd worst box outs per game in the league (8.9). The league leaders are above 15 (Bucks and Heat). They’re 5th worst in charges drawn, 5th worst on contested 3 pointers, bottom 10 in contested shots, bottom half in defensive distance run, 7th worst on average defensive speed…they don’t run hard in defensive situations, basically.

There isn’t a single wolf in the top 10 deflections per game, total deflections, loose balls recovered/game or per 36, screen assists (game/36/total), charges drawn, contested threes, contested total shots, or box outs. The only wolves on the hustle board leader lists are Naz as the 10th best contested 2s per 36 and Vanderbilt, with the #1 number for deflections per 36 minutes.

They certainly don’t look like the fittest team, they don’t seem to run very hard on defense, and they have 2 or 3 guys who hustle. Between this and the strategic decision to play fast with bad d and no shooting…Suits really seems to be bad at coaching a pro team.

Posted by Chairman Bud on Jan 14, 2021 | 11:18 AM


Memphis had 80 points in the paint. 80. I admittedly don’t follow that number a lot, but that seems like an extraordinary number to me. What’s the average, like 40?

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Post #: 319
RE: Wolves 2020 - 1/14/2021 3:58:32 PM   
David Levine


Posts: 71472
Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Las Vegas
Status: online
quote:

ORIGINAL: Karl Juhnke

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

They are tied for the 2nd worst box outs per game in the league (8.9). The league leaders are above 15 (Bucks and Heat). They’re 5th worst in charges drawn, 5th worst on contested 3 pointers, bottom 10 in contested shots, bottom half in defensive distance run, 7th worst on average defensive speed…they don’t run hard in defensive situations, basically.

There isn’t a single wolf in the top 10 deflections per game, total deflections, loose balls recovered/game or per 36, screen assists (game/36/total), charges drawn, contested threes, contested total shots, or box outs. The only wolves on the hustle board leader lists are Naz as the 10th best contested 2s per 36 and Vanderbilt, with the #1 number for deflections per 36 minutes.

They certainly don’t look like the fittest team, they don’t seem to run very hard on defense, and they have 2 or 3 guys who hustle. Between this and the strategic decision to play fast with bad d and no shooting…Suits really seems to be bad at coaching a pro team.

Posted by Chairman Bud on Jan 14, 2021 | 11:18 AM


Memphis had 80 points in the paint. 80. I admittedly don’t follow that number a lot, but that seems like an extraordinary number to me. What’s the average, like 40?


It was rough. Especially since Ryan refuses to play 2 bigs together (and Rosas refuses to add any defensive bigs).

The ONE positive so far this year has been KAT's commitment to defense. He's been really good. But Memphis was easily able to exploit the rest of the roster.

The issue was that if someone got penetration, KAT had to step up. That leaves the restricted area protected by who.... DLo? Beasley?

Honestly it seems like most of those paint points were on rolls or missed shots that function as assists since they drew KAT out and no one was there to rebound.
Post #: 320
RE: Wolves 2020 - 1/14/2021 6:01:47 PM   
David Levine


Posts: 71472
Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Las Vegas
Status: online 		Minnesota @Timberwolves
Status Report in advance of Jan. 15 vs. Memphis:

PROBABLE
Okogie – Left Hamstring Strain
Towns – Left Perilunate Subluxation

OUT
Hernangómez – Health & Safety Protocols
Layman – Personal Reasons
Rubio – Health & Safety Protocols

Juancho Hernangomez has entered isolation and will be out at least 10 days, sources told
@TheAthleticMIN
Post #: 321
RE: Wolves 2020 - 1/14/2021 6:04:02 PM   
jimbo

 

Posts: 872
Joined: 5/2/2010
Status: offline 		Minnesota need a strong power forward......is their anyone available to fill this position. Give me some names, because this needs to be addressed.
Post #: 322
RE: Wolves 2020 - 1/14/2021 6:08:35 PM   
David Levine


Posts: 71472
Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Las Vegas
Status: online
quote:

ORIGINAL: jimbo

Minnesota need a strong power forward......is their anyone available to fill this position. Give me some names, because this needs to be addressed.


Rosas doesn't like strong PFs.
Post #: 323
RE: Wolves 2020 - 1/14/2021 8:06:01 PM   
Bruce Johnson

 

Posts: 16348
Joined: 8/27/2007
Status: offline 		D'Angelo Russell's plus/minus through 11 games:

On court: -138 points in 346 minutes
Off court: +27 points in 187 minutes

Not only is -138 points the worst plus/minus for any player in the NBA this season, no one else is worse than -82. And no other Wolves are worse than -72.

Aaron Gleeman on Twitter

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Post #: 324
RE: Wolves 2020 - 1/14/2021 11:17:12 PM   
Matt Lang


Posts: 5358
Joined: 7/30/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson

D'Angelo Russell's plus/minus through 11 games:

On court: -138 points in 346 minutes
Off court: +27 points in 187 minutes

Not only is -138 points the worst plus/minus for any player in the NBA this season, no one else is worse than -82. And no other Wolves are worse than -72.

Aaron Gleeman on Twitter


https://www.nbcsports.com/bayarea/warriors/warriors-fleecing-t-wolves-andrew-wiggins-trade-becomes-clearer-every-day
Post #: 325
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