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RE: General Vikes Talk

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RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/20/2021 8:45:54 AM   
Richard Neussendorfer

 

Posts: 19051
Joined: 12/7/2007
From: Alamogordo, NM
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

27 and 34 points allowed so far from the defense. This isn’t getting enough discussion.


Who would’ve guessed that after 2 games, our defense is our clear weakest link?

Not altogether surprising though. If you can't figure out how to run a modern NFL offense, it's pretty hard to scheme to stop one.

A lot of truth to that statement.

Agreed. In this modern NFL he's in WAY over his head.
Post #: 5126
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/20/2021 8:58:40 AM   
Daniel Lee Young


Posts: 12756
Joined: 9/21/2013
Status: offline 		There was a lot of improvement on offense , but our head coaches, specialty, defense, was a sieve..

Running game was on point, and pass pro was not horrible at first, but pass pro weakened, on a downward slope all, game, long.

Maybe conditioning and playing the OL a lot more in P S might have helped.

Penalties were way down, which is a good thing.

Nick Vigil and Erik Kendricks, played well, safeties were “ adequate”, CB’s in coverage, and the DL, side to side and up the gut, in contain and run support, were, quite frankly, pathetic.

The DL brought pressure on most pass plays, but Murry’s mobility and ability to throw on the run, killed our secondary.

Westbrook is not a punt returner.. FFS don’t field punts inside the 15 and run backwards, signal fair catch and let what happens, happen..

Westbrook helped Arizona flip the field with just plain stupid play.

I’d cut him.

We came out on FIRE, looked like world beaters, then reverted to Zimmerball.

Played conservative, let Arizona get back in with big plays, ended up losing, wide right…

Where have we lived that Sunday before?

Forever.

Fire Zimmer, ditch Spielman.

Do it now.

< Message edited by Daniel Lee Young -- 9/20/2021 9:00:53 AM >

_____________________________

"Thou shall not bear false witness”
I am WRATH, incarnate.
@RlyeeNicole’sDad
Post #: 5127
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/20/2021 8:58:42 AM   
TJSweens


Posts: 44242
Joined: 7/16/2007
Status: online
quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

27 and 34 points allowed so far from the defense. This isn’t getting enough discussion.


Who would’ve guessed that after 2 games, our defense is our clear weakest link?

Not altogether surprising though. If you can't figure out how to run a modern NFL offense, it's pretty hard to scheme to stop one.

A lot of truth to that statement.

Agreed. In this modern NFL he's in WAY over his head.

The modern RPO QB has Zimmer befuddled.

_____________________________

"The eternal fate of the noble and enlightened: to be brutally crushed by the armed and dumb."
Post #: 5128
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/20/2021 8:58:46 AM   
Bill Johanesen


Posts: 27463
Status: offline 		The regime cut rookie kicker Carlson early in 2018 saying they couldn't have him messing up our season of really big things cause we are going places!

We went 8-7-1.
Post #: 5129
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/20/2021 8:59:47 AM   
TJSweens


Posts: 44242
Joined: 7/16/2007
Status: online
quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

The regime cut rookie kicker Carlson early in 2018 saying they couldn't have him messing up our season of really big things cause we are going places!

We went 8-7-1.

And Carlson has become an elite kicker.

_____________________________

"The eternal fate of the noble and enlightened: to be brutally crushed by the armed and dumb."
Post #: 5130
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/20/2021 9:02:01 AM   
Brad H


Posts: 22611
Joined: 8/16/2007
From: Parts Unknown
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Daniel Lee Young

There was a lot of improvement on offense , but our head coaches, specialty, defense, was a sieve..

Running game was on point, and pass pro was not horrible at first, but pass pro weakened, on a downward slope all, game, long.

Maybe conditioning and playing the OL a lot more in P S might have helped.

Penalties were way down, which is a good thing.

Nick Vigil and Erik Kendricks, played well, safeties were “ adequate”, CB’s in coverage, and the DL, side to side and up the gut, in contain and run support, were, quite frankly, pathetic.

The DL brought pressure on most pass plays, but Murry’s mobility and ability to throw on the run, killed our secondary.

Westbrook is not a punt returner.. FFS don’t field punts inside the 15 and run backwards, signal fair catch and let what happens, happen..

Westbrook helped Arizona flip the field with just plain stupid play.

I’d cut him.

We came out on FIRE, looked like world beaters, then reverted to Zimmerball.

Played conservative, let Arizona get back in with big plays, ended up losing, wide right…

Where have we lived that Sunday before?

Forever.

Fire Zimmer, ditch Spielman.

Do it now.

Tackling was terrible

_____________________________

Defense starts at the corners!
Post #: 5131
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/20/2021 9:02:47 AM   
Bill Johanesen


Posts: 27463
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

Cousins weighs in: “ I think you still want to get as many [yards] as you can, be greedy and get all you can, so that you’re not asking too much of somebody."


Then audible you spineless dork!

But kudos for at least saying it. Maybe this will be the beginning of some sort of tipping point.
Post #: 5132
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/20/2021 9:03:53 AM   
Daniel Lee Young


Posts: 12756
Joined: 9/21/2013
Status: offline 		For a mid market team, Minnesota gets a lot of useless coaches, in almost all professional sports.

Any of us could pick better coaches, than practically any of the teams GM’S.

_____________________________

"Thou shall not bear false witness”
I am WRATH, incarnate.
@RlyeeNicole’sDad
Post #: 5133
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/20/2021 9:12:31 AM   
Bill Johanesen


Posts: 27463
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Daniel Lee Young

For a mid market team, Minnesota gets a lot of useless coaches, in almost all professional sports.

Any of us could pick better coaches, than practically any of the teams GM’S.


Speaking of mid-market team, the Wilfs are probably still getting high fives from other owners about how they pulled off the new stadium deal and keep that fan base engaged.
Post #: 5134
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/20/2021 9:20:12 AM   
Bill Johanesen


Posts: 27463
Status: offline 		Zimmer had it cozy in Cincy. Periodically blab about his 'double a gap' defense and let Marvin Lewis take the heat for everything post-season related.

Perfect! But no.....

He couldn't be like Jim Johnson who stayed as Philly's D coordinator, maybe because he liked it, maybe because his ego was in check, maybe because he knew he'd be in over his head as a HC. No, not Zimmer, who somehow convinced himself he was HC material years prior!

And after years at his dream job his legacy will be "He got peter-principled."
Post #: 5135
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/20/2021 9:26:14 AM   
Bill Johanesen


Posts: 27463
Status: offline 		Zimmer should me made to watch Murray and Moore run around making fools of his defense while not being able to blink because his eyes are clamped open like Alex in A Clockwork Orange.

All the while, in the background he hears a soothing phrase on an endless loop, "Modern NFL".
Post #: 5136
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/20/2021 9:29:44 AM   
TJSweens


Posts: 44242
Joined: 7/16/2007
Status: online 		The game turned on Zimmer's decision making and clock management in the last two minutes of the first half. That was as bad as it gets.

_____________________________

"The eternal fate of the noble and enlightened: to be brutally crushed by the armed and dumb."
Post #: 5137
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/20/2021 9:31:59 AM   
TJSweens


Posts: 44242
Joined: 7/16/2007
Status: online 		And I know Cousins is just supposed to execute the play that's called, but at this point he should know that whenever a receiver screen is called, he should automatically audible out of it.

_____________________________

"The eternal fate of the noble and enlightened: to be brutally crushed by the armed and dumb."
Post #: 5138
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/20/2021 9:35:39 AM   
bohumm

 

Posts: 5705
Joined: 10/28/2007
From: Altadena, CA
Status: offline 		I don't know how much flexibility Vikings QBs under Zimmer have had to audible. He is a control freak extraordinaire, and other than Case, his QBs have all exhibited risk aversion and almost robotic progression through the options. That can't be a coincidence, IMO, but I obviously don't know for sure.
Post #: 5139
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/20/2021 9:40:28 AM   
Brad H


Posts: 22611
Joined: 8/16/2007
From: Parts Unknown
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

And I know Cousins is just supposed to execute the play that's called, but at this point he should know that whenever a receiver screen is called, he should automatically audible out of it.

Precisely. A good quarterback shakes off the call and marches down the field.

_____________________________

Defense starts at the corners!
Post #: 5140
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/20/2021 9:49:29 AM   
TJSweens


Posts: 44242
Joined: 7/16/2007
Status: online
quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

And I know Cousins is just supposed to execute the play that's called, but at this point he should know that whenever a receiver screen is called, he should automatically audible out of it.

Precisely. A good quarterback shakes off the call and marches down the field.

More to the point, our carousel of offensive coordinators should have figured out that our receiver screens, that haven't been updated in 10 years, are just garbage plays and should be removed from the playbook all together.

_____________________________

"The eternal fate of the noble and enlightened: to be brutally crushed by the armed and dumb."
Post #: 5141
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/20/2021 9:50:52 AM   
TJSweens


Posts: 44242
Joined: 7/16/2007
Status: online
quote:

ORIGINAL: bohumm
I don't know how much flexibility Vikings QBs under Zimmer have had to audible. He is a control freak extraordinaire, and other than Case, his QBs have all exhibited risk aversion and almost robotic progression through the options. That can't be a coincidence, IMO, but I obviously don't know for sure.

What's Zim going to do? Bench Cousins and start Manion?

_____________________________

"The eternal fate of the noble and enlightened: to be brutally crushed by the armed and dumb."
Post #: 5142
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/20/2021 9:53:43 AM   
David F.


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Joined: 12/31/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

The game turned on Zimmer's decision making and clock management in the last two minutes of the first half. That was as bad as it gets.


The two runs near the end of the half were stupid on a level of inconceivable stupidness. In the second half, AZ came out and focused completely on Dalvin Cook (as they should!). Instead of pivoting on this and mixing in play-action the Vikes doubled down, tripled down, and quadrupled down on Cook feeding him the ball over and over and over again with good but diminishing returns and an added bonus of him being injured.

It sucks to watch a talented roster like we have get used to poorly. It feels like negligence.

_____________________________

I wouldn't give ANY qb $30-50+ mil unless that QB had won me a Super Bowl. Did you win a Super Bowl on your rookie deal? Yes? Great! Here's your hugenormous contract. F it let's just run victory laps and love life. No? Good luck. Next!
Post #: 5143
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/20/2021 9:58:03 AM   
bohumm

 

Posts: 5705
Joined: 10/28/2007
From: Altadena, CA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

The game turned on Zimmer's decision making and clock management in the last two minutes of the first half. That was as bad as it gets.


The two runs near the end of the half were stupid on a level of inconceivable stupidness. In the second half, AZ came out and focused completely on Dalvin Cook (as they should!). Instead of pivoting on this and mixing in play-action the Vikes doubled down, tripled down, and quadrupled down on Cook feeding him the ball over and over and over again with good but diminishing returns and an added bonus of him being injured.

It sucks to watch a talented roster like we have get used to poorly. It feels like negligence.

The OL also seemed to wear down a bit in the second half, though their overall performance was actually encouraging.
Post #: 5144
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/20/2021 10:21:15 AM   
Mark Anderson

 

Posts: 11994
Joined: 9/1/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: bohumm

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

The game turned on Zimmer's decision making and clock management in the last two minutes of the first half. That was as bad as it gets.


The two runs near the end of the half were stupid on a level of inconceivable stupidness. In the second half, AZ came out and focused completely on Dalvin Cook (as they should!). Instead of pivoting on this and mixing in play-action the Vikes doubled down, tripled down, and quadrupled down on Cook feeding him the ball over and over and over again with good but diminishing returns and an added bonus of him being injured.

It sucks to watch a talented roster like we have get used to poorly. It feels like negligence.

The OL also seemed to wear down a bit in the second half, though their overall performance was actually encouraging.

Yep.
Post #: 5145
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/20/2021 10:24:59 AM   
Brad H


Posts: 22611
Joined: 8/16/2007
From: Parts Unknown
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: bohumm
I don't know how much flexibility Vikings QBs under Zimmer have had to audible. He is a control freak extraordinaire, and other than Case, his QBs have all exhibited risk aversion and almost robotic progression through the options. That can't be a coincidence, IMO, but I obviously don't know for sure.

What's Zim going to do? Bench Cousins and start Manion?

If you start 0-4, you start the rookie. It's time to turn the page.

_____________________________

Defense starts at the corners!
Post #: 5146
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/20/2021 10:29:55 AM   
Mark Anderson

 

Posts: 11994
Joined: 9/1/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: bohumm
I don't know how much flexibility Vikings QBs under Zimmer have had to audible. He is a control freak extraordinaire, and other than Case, his QBs have all exhibited risk aversion and almost robotic progression through the options. That can't be a coincidence, IMO, but I obviously don't know for sure.

What's Zim going to do? Bench Cousins and start Manion?

If you start 0-4, you start the rookie. It's time to turn the page.

If Cousins keeps playing the way he is playing and you do that, you lose the whole team.

Maybe if it was Fields. But not Mond.
Post #: 5147
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/20/2021 10:32:54 AM   
Brad H


Posts: 22611
Joined: 8/16/2007
From: Parts Unknown
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: bohumm
I don't know how much flexibility Vikings QBs under Zimmer have had to audible. He is a control freak extraordinaire, and other than Case, his QBs have all exhibited risk aversion and almost robotic progression through the options. That can't be a coincidence, IMO, but I obviously don't know for sure.

What's Zim going to do? Bench Cousins and start Manion?

If you start 0-4, you start the rookie. It's time to turn the page.

If Cousins keeps playing the way he is playing and you do that, you lose the whole team.

Maybe if it was Fields. But not Mond.

Fields looked mediocre, at-best, yesterday. He threw one terrible pick and looked very indecisive most of the game. He looked scared to death.

At 0-4, you've already lost the team.

< Message edited by Brad H -- 9/20/2021 10:35:05 AM >

_____________________________

Defense starts at the corners!
Post #: 5148
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/20/2021 10:34:59 AM   
paulgly

 

Posts: 167
Joined: 4/13/2020
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: bohumm
I don't know how much flexibility Vikings QBs under Zimmer have had to audible. He is a control freak extraordinaire, and other than Case, his QBs have all exhibited risk aversion and almost robotic progression through the options. That can't be a coincidence, IMO, but I obviously don't know for sure.

What's Zim going to do? Bench Cousins and start Manion?

If you start 0-4, you start the rookie. It's time to turn the page.

If Cousins keeps playing the way he is playing and you do that, you lose the whole team.

Maybe if it was Fields. But not Mond.

I generally agree, but if you're 0-4 the season is over for all intents and purposes. Certainly 0-5 or even 1-5. If they are 1-5 going in to bye week (beat Det at home, lose to Carolina on the road), I'm guessing we might see a coaching change.
Post #: 5149
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/20/2021 10:35:44 AM   
DavidAOlson

 

Posts: 17322
Joined: 8/2/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H
...
Fields looked mediocre, at-best, yesterday.
...


OTOH, Fields is playing for Chicago. So he'd almost certainly be doing better elsewhere.

Kinda like pretty much anybody who plays for Detroit.

_____________________________

I give myself very good advice, but I very seldom follow it. --- Alice
Post #: 5150
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