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RE: Twins 2022 Season and Game Day Thread

 
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RE: Twins 2022 Season and Game Day Thread - 9/15/2022 10:51:28 PM   
Phil Riewer


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quote:

ORIGINAL: MDK

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Trekgeekscott

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

Anatomy of another disappointment.


Off Season: Falvine started off looking like they were making the right moves. Before the lockout, they nailed Buxton down to multi-year deal that protected them from Buck's extensive injury history. They traded a shiny coin for Sonny Gray. Heading into spring training they shocked everybody and signed Correa. They made a series of moves in trading Fred Garvin for Kiner Filefa and 24 hour later packaging KF and Donaldson for Urshala and Sanchez.

The problem is that they needed another front line starter to go with Gray. Instead, they decided to sign Homer Bai...I mean JA Happ and Matt Shoe...I mean Al Bundy and Chris Archer. This assured that they would have to rely on unproven Joe Ryan and injury prone Bailey Ober to fill the 2-3 slots. Then they made a deal to add hard throwing high era Chris Paddack, despite knowing his elbow was hanging on by a thread. The also brought in Pagan to further weaken an already bad bullpen. But, what the hell, they still had Smeltzer and Uber waiting in the wings.

We were all heartened when the Twins started the season with Jake Cave off the 40 man roster. Youth was being served. Kirilloff and Larnach were playing and contributing. Correa was flashing great play and even greater leadership. Buck was healthy. Jeffers and Sanchez looked like a viable catching rotation. Ryan and Ober started out well. Paddack wasn't half bad and even Ted Bundy was contributing. The Twins were winning and then...

Injuries, injuries and more injuries. First was Sano and we all thought...great, this opens up more time for young players. Then the last strand of Paddack's UCL snapped. Winder came up, looked good, shut down for second straight year with a shoulder impingement. Ober missed months with a groin pull. Larnach, abdominal surgery. Kirilloff, season ending wrist surgery. Jeffers injury exposed the complete lack of depth at catcher. The Twins acquired Sonny Leon to catch. A man so bad he lost his job to Matt Hedges. Oh yeah, that bs about resting Buxton regularly to keep him healthy. Turns out he was hurt right away and they were resting him regularly to save on a gimpy knee. Worked so much better than just shutting him down when it happened. A season of favoring the knee aggravated the ligaments in his hip. So, Buck is on the IL while the games matter most.

As inevitable as death and taxes, Smeltzer and Cave returned to the roster and the lineup.

The bullpen imploded. Pagan made everyone pine for Colome. Duffey completely lost his stuff. The Twins tried to remedy this by cycling 97 pitchers between the majors and AAA. This was bound to confuse the other teams hitters right? Rocco made a horrible situation worse by refusing to let starters pitch more than 2 times through the rotation. A terrible bullpen became a terrible & overworked bullpen.

Speaking of Rocco, his game management has been pathetic. It's not just pitching mismanagement. Other coaches have been bad as well. Mayor Watkins has surpassed every previous Twins 3B coach in sending runners to an untimely demise at home plate.

I'm sure I have overlooked plenty. The Twins will no doubt chalk it up to bad luck. The Wonder Twins will probably stand pat with the pitching staff. No doubt they will bank on Maeda coming back like he was in 2020. They will assume Paddack will be just fine after a second TJ. They will stick with Rocco and his bad managing. They will stand behind Sean Johnson and his terrible drafts. The Pohlads will stand behind Falvine and their culture of mediocrity.

Stick a fork in 2022 and rinse and repeat for 2023.


Though true this post was posted about a month early.

Too soon sir

Too soon


Big Brother was on last night so I watched that instead. Guardians of the Galaxy were on also; Twins aren't fun to watch and haven't been for a while.


Guardians of the Galaxy is a great movie.
But Big Brother?????
On a level with Housewives of whoknowswhere.
Or the Kardashians


So disappointed in what has been wasted of this season. Dr. Pimple Popper would have sufficed. Using Duffey and letting Pagan fail when you had Moran. Just such a waste.

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RE: Twins 2022 Season and Game Day Thread - 9/16/2022 8:46:03 AM   
Mister Ed


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Sweep the Royals

Gain 1 game

Showdown

4 games down. This is it. And it's Ober off a rehab stint with it all on the line.

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RE: Twins 2022 Season and Game Day Thread - 9/16/2022 12:33:22 PM   
twinsfan


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Karl Juhnke

quote:

ORIGINAL: twinsfan

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: twinsfan

quote:

ORIGINAL: Trekgeekscott

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mister Ed

Varland pitched 8 days ago in Yankee stadium

And has not pitched in any game anywhere since

SMH

That's some dumbass shit right there.

Pitched well, against the Yankees, in Yankee stadium and we can't give him the ball for more than a week afterwards?

What stupid as hell analytic are you shit for brains using to justify this bullshit?

The Twins couldn't keep him up because he was the extra guy on a double-header day. Then when they sent him back down, he wasn't eligible to be called back up for 10 days. So they aren't risking injury in the minors. He'll be back with the Twins to help us the rest of the way.


So you advocate sending down your 3rd best pitcher when he obviously was needed? The day he was sent down is the day I quit watching live games.

It was made worse when Archer and Bundy pitched the next two days...

He HAD to be sent down. Damn, you don't even know the rules.


SOMEONE had to be sent down. Didn’t have to be him.

And risk injury?? Young pitchers need to pitch, no matter the level. If that’s truly the reason he’s been on the shelf for 10 days, that’s awful.

It DID have to be him because he wasn't really on the official roster! He was the extra man for the double-header day!!

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RE: Twins 2022 Season and Game Day Thread - 9/16/2022 3:38:58 PM   
Phil Riewer


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quote:

ORIGINAL: twinsfan

quote:

ORIGINAL: Karl Juhnke

quote:

ORIGINAL: twinsfan

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: twinsfan

quote:

ORIGINAL: Trekgeekscott

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mister Ed

Varland pitched 8 days ago in Yankee stadium

And has not pitched in any game anywhere since

SMH

That's some dumbass shit right there.

Pitched well, against the Yankees, in Yankee stadium and we can't give him the ball for more than a week afterwards?

What stupid as hell analytic are you shit for brains using to justify this bullshit?

The Twins couldn't keep him up because he was the extra guy on a double-header day. Then when they sent him back down, he wasn't eligible to be called back up for 10 days. So they aren't risking injury in the minors. He'll be back with the Twins to help us the rest of the way.


So you advocate sending down your 3rd best pitcher when he obviously was needed? The day he was sent down is the day I quit watching live games.

It was made worse when Archer and Bundy pitched the next two days...

He HAD to be sent down. Damn, you don't even know the rules.


SOMEONE had to be sent down. Didn’t have to be him.

And risk injury?? Young pitchers need to pitch, no matter the level. If that’s truly the reason he’s been on the shelf for 10 days, that’s awful.

It DID have to be him because he wasn't really on the official roster! He was the extra man for the double-header day!!

Because they expected him to fail instead of succeed. Please expect more for once Matt. It has been so long since they have used all their resources to put forth their best lineup, bullpen, and rotation. Varland, Moran, and Wallner are further proof.

< Message edited by Phil Riewer -- 9/16/2022 3:46:17 PM >


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RE: Twins 2022 Season and Game Day Thread - 9/16/2022 3:39:49 PM   
Phil Riewer


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Call up Wallner. Call up Larnach. Call up Varland.

Using Palacios over Wallner seem likes u r not trying

< Message edited by Phil Riewer -- 9/16/2022 3:48:07 PM >


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RE: Twins 2022 Season and Game Day Thread - 9/17/2022 12:28:06 PM   
TJSweens


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Varland forced to come over the plate because asshat ump refused to call strikes against Ramirez. 3-0 count when it should have been 1-2.

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RE: Twins 2022 Season and Game Day Thread - 9/17/2022 1:57:11 PM   
Mister Ed


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

Call up Wallner. Call up Larnach. Call up Varland.

Using Palacios over Wallner seem likes u r not trying


Wallner finally called up
weeks late

the fat lady about to take center stage

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RE: Twins 2022 Season and Game Day Thread - 9/17/2022 8:25:44 PM   
Mister Ed


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Good night 2022

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RE: Twins 2022 Season and Game Day Thread - 9/18/2022 8:52:40 AM   
stfrank

 

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Twins are what I thought they were......can't win baseball games without pitching..........which costs money.......which means more of the same for the Twins.
Good night indeed.
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RE: Twins 2022 Season and Game Day Thread - 9/18/2022 5:03:41 PM   
Mister Ed


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It took an almost completely exhausted bullpen for Rockhead to allow Ryan to get 2 outs into the 8th inning.

Ryan has been a flyball pitcher. Got 3 double plays.

Let him work out of "trouble". Amazing.

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RE: Twins 2022 Season and Game Day Thread - 9/18/2022 5:17:27 PM  1 votes
twinsfan


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The Twins just keep reeling me back in!

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RE: Twins 2022 Season and Game Day Thread - 9/18/2022 5:21:10 PM   
Mister Ed


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Strotman got DFA'd after they Added DRod to the 40man
He'll probably pass through waivers like Dobnak did. Dobnak actually threw better after passing through waivers.

Henriquez, who they got in the Garver deal is now on the ML roster. Chance for them to add to their massive total of guys who have pitched in the bigs.

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RE: Twins 2022 Season and Game Day Thread - 9/18/2022 7:08:58 PM   
TJSweens


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mister Ed

It took an almost completely exhausted bullpen for Rockhead to allow Ryan to get 2 outs into the 8th inning.

Ryan has been a flyball pitcher. Got 3 double plays.

Let him work out of "trouble". Amazing.

Ryan is one of the few reasons to watch the Twins right now.

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RE: Twins 2022 Season and Game Day Thread - 9/19/2022 7:20:49 AM   
Phil Riewer


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quote:

ORIGINAL: stfrank

Twins are what I thought they were......can't win baseball games without pitching..........which costs money.......which means more of the same for the Twins.
Good night indeed.


Pitching hasn't been the problem; position players can't stay healthy. We are starting 2nd stringers except for Arreaz, Correa, Urshela, and Miranda. Kepler is supposed to be a first stringer but has played like a 2nd.

< Message edited by Phil Riewer -- 9/19/2022 11:18:39 AM >


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RE: Twins 2022 Season and Game Day Thread - 9/19/2022 1:09:13 PM   
Mister Ed


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All the feel good about Sunday gone in 2 bad innings for Gray

Henriquez makes it 37 pitchers in 2022

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RE: Twins 2022 Season and Game Day Thread - 9/19/2022 1:42:46 PM   
David Levine


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: stfrank

Twins are what I thought they were......can't win baseball games without pitching..........which costs money.......which means more of the same for the Twins.
Good night indeed.


Pitching hasn't been the problem; position players can't stay healthy. We are starting 2nd stringers except for Arreaz, Correa, Urshela, and Miranda. Kepler is supposed to be a first stringer but has played like a 2nd.


Kepler hasn't looked like a first stringer in 4 years. Inexcusable that he's still gifted his role.
Post #: 2141
RE: Twins 2022 Season and Game Day Thread - 9/19/2022 1:45:17 PM   
Phil Riewer


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quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: stfrank

Twins are what I thought they were......can't win baseball games without pitching..........which costs money.......which means more of the same for the Twins.
Good night indeed.


Pitching hasn't been the problem; position players can't stay healthy. We are starting 2nd stringers except for Arreaz, Correa, Urshela, and Miranda. Kepler is supposed to be a first stringer but has played like a 2nd.


Kepler hasn't looked like a first stringer in 4 years. Inexcusable that he's still gifted his role.


TB wanted Kepler a few years back; we should have bit on it.

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RE: Twins 2022 Season and Game Day Thread - 9/19/2022 1:58:42 PM   
David Levine


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: stfrank

Twins are what I thought they were......can't win baseball games without pitching..........which costs money.......which means more of the same for the Twins.
Good night indeed.


Pitching hasn't been the problem; position players can't stay healthy. We are starting 2nd stringers except for Arreaz, Correa, Urshela, and Miranda. Kepler is supposed to be a first stringer but has played like a 2nd.


Kepler hasn't looked like a first stringer in 4 years. Inexcusable that he's still gifted his role.


TB wanted Kepler a few years back; we should have bit on it.


Even if you didn't trade him, there is no rule that he gets to start every game. Or that you don't make an effort to find a better player.

At the very least, he should've become a part-time platoon guys 2-3 years ago.

This team is rotten from ownership down to management and nothing is going to change until it's sold.

I'll say it again, this team died when Eloise Pohlad did. We have 1 Playoff win since her death - and it's no surprise to me that it was the first Playoff game we played after she passed.

She was the heart and soul of the franchise and the only Pohlad to give a shit about the game of baseball.
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RE: Twins 2022 Season and Game Day Thread - 9/19/2022 3:16:25 PM   
Phil Riewer


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quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: stfrank

Twins are what I thought they were......can't win baseball games without pitching..........which costs money.......which means more of the same for the Twins.
Good night indeed.


Pitching hasn't been the problem; position players can't stay healthy. We are starting 2nd stringers except for Arreaz, Correa, Urshela, and Miranda. Kepler is supposed to be a first stringer but has played like a 2nd.


Kepler hasn't looked like a first stringer in 4 years. Inexcusable that he's still gifted his role.


TB wanted Kepler a few years back; we should have bit on it.


Even if you didn't trade him, there is no rule that he gets to start every game. Or that you don't make an effort to find a better player.

At the very least, he should've become a part-time platoon guys 2-3 years ago.

This team is rotten from ownership down to management and nothing is going to change until it's sold.

I'll say it again, this team died when Eloise Pohlad did. We have 1 Playoff win since her death - and it's no surprise to me that it was the first Playoff game we played after she passed.

She was the heart and soul of the franchise and the only Pohlad to give a shit about the game of baseball.


They have had very good regular season teams in the last 10 years.

This year they actually acquired talent in Gray, Correa, Mahle, Lopez, and Fullmer that could help the team in the playoffs. Just couldn't overcome the injuries to full Major League roster on the IR.

< Message edited by Phil Riewer -- 9/19/2022 3:17:44 PM >


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RE: Twins 2022 Season and Game Day Thread - 9/19/2022 3:24:12 PM   
David Levine


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

They have had very good regular season teams in the last 10 years.



Have they? Or have they just played in a terrible division?

We've finished below .500 in 7 of the past 10 years.
Post #: 2145
RE: Twins 2022 Season and Game Day Thread - 9/19/2022 4:16:14 PM   
Phil Riewer


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quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

They have had very good regular season teams in the last 10 years.



Have they? Or have they just played in a terrible division?

We've finished below .500 in 7 of the past 10 years.


So you don't think they tried this year and had an abonormal amount of injuries? That is your opinion?

I don't think they have made the moves they have needed to make midseason from between when they acquired Shannon Stewart to this year. They haven't gone for it for a long time; this season was the closest in a long time.

< Message edited by Phil Riewer -- 9/19/2022 4:18:24 PM >


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RE: Twins 2022 Season and Game Day Thread - 9/19/2022 4:32:34 PM   
David Levine


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

They have had very good regular season teams in the last 10 years.



Have they? Or have they just played in a terrible division?

We've finished below .500 in 7 of the past 10 years.


So you don't think they tried this year and had an abonormal amount of injuries? That is your opinion?

I don't think they have made the moves they have needed to make midseason from between when they acquired Shannon Stewart to this year. They haven't gone for it for a long time; this season was the closest in a long time.


Sure they tried. But they didn't build anything resembling a contender. Or with any real eye towards long-term success.

Trying hard and failing is still failing.
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RE: Twins 2022 Season and Game Day Thread - 9/19/2022 10:29:27 PM   
MDK


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Two pitchers for the rotation
On paper, Paddock and Mahler look good.
Both were damaged.
Did Falvine do their due diligence?
Pagan???
How long did it take this org to realize Gordon can play.
Broken org
Will not be better next season

Buxtons career is probably over.

Catcher????

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RE: Twins 2022 Season and Game Day Thread - 9/20/2022 7:27:26 AM   
TJSweens


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When Is Falvey's Pitching Pipeline Going To Reach Minnesota?

When Derek Falvey and Thad Levine took over the Minnesota Twins, you could explain why in one word: pitching. By the time he landed the top job, Falvey had built a pitching pipeline that the Cleveland Guardians are still maintaining and enjoying today. If he could do it there, why not here?


And not only did Falvey’s Cleveland pitchers perform well, but they had velocity! Strikeouts! It was a vastly different philosophy from two decades of Terry Ryan employing “pitch-to-contact” types. Forget a World Series; Twins fans were desperate to see a pitch thrown above 94 mph.

2022 was supposed to be the year we saw that pipeline come to fruition. Joe Ryan (acquired via trade by Falvey’s Twins in 2021) had already made it to the majors and was penciled into a starting role. Jhoan Duran (acquired via 2018 trade) started the year in the bullpen. Bailey Ober (2017 Draft) and Josh Winder (2018 Draft) were going to figure into the mix.


Beyond them, prospects like Jordan Balazovic (pre-Falvey acquisition, 2016 Draft), Matt Canterino (2019 Draft), Ronny Henriquez (2022 trade), and Simeon Woods Richardson (2021 trade) were all on the horizon.

And hey, Ryan and Duran delivered. But the rest of the arms? There were a lot of ice baths involved. Ober and Winder missed huge chunks of the season. 26-year-old Chris Paddack, who the Twins traded for on Opening Day Eve, went under the Tommy John knife. So did Caterino, who will likely miss the 2023 season. Balazovic has a 7.47 ERA at AAA.


That’s all bad news when your biggest weakness is pitching. So six years into the regime, it’s fair to ask: What’s happening? Is the pitching pipeline broken, or is it just in the awkward middle-Pokémon stage before these prospects evolve into a Major League staff?

Being six games out of a playoff spot on Sep. 19 is depressing enough, so let’s look at the case for the latter. The case that the pitching pipeline is delayed and not broken starts with the majors. Ryan emerged as a terrific mid-rotation starter this season, posting a 3.61 ERA through 137 innings.

Dating back to 2000, that’s the seventh-lowest ERA by a 26-and-under Twins starter with 130-plus innings. For comparison’s sake, that’s also lower than all but José Berríos‘ final season in Minnesota. He might not have major velocity, but his fastball movement gets to the 9.00 K/9 threshold. The list of Twins starters to do that is Ryan, Johan Santana, Kenta Maeda, Francisco Liriano, Jake Odorizzi, and Berríos. That’s it.

And if you want fireballers, Duran can throw a marshmallow through a bank vault. So many words have already been said about Duran, but he’s truly a phenom and a one-of-a-kind pitcher. Nobody throws 101 mph with movement, except for Duran. Only 2019 Luke Jackson has had more strikeouts per nine than Duran (11.8) and a ground ball rate of over 60% this century. Duran is an ace reliever as long as his arm holds up.


But two pitchers aren’t exactly a pipeline. We’ll have to go a bit deeper than that and look for signs of hope elsewhere.

Let’s stick with players at the MLB level. Ober and Winder just made their returns, with Ober impressing in five innings of one-hit, no-run ball in Cleveland with the season on the line. The Twins lost the game, but you can’t fault Ober there.

It’s a small sample, but Ober is at a 3.49 ERA on the season and is at 3.98 in 131 career innings. His strikeout rate dipped this year, but if he can get back to 2021 levels, he can still be a strong back-end option.

Winder has had a tougher season (4.17 ERA), but he’s also back to pitching. Paddack should return sometime next season as well. If neither of them can crack future rotations, both of them might be able to flourish as relievers. Winder has a strong fastball/slider combo, while Paddack rocks a great change-up. Both could potentially help the bullpen, especially if they can get more velocity in relief.

There is actual, unqualified reason for optimism at Triple-A. Louie Varland (2019 Draft) grabbed some spot-starts in September, which were well-deserved. Varland dominated Double- and Triple-A batters all season, posting a K/9 rate of 10.2 and 11.4 at both stops, respectively. Woods Richardson is also dominating, with over a strikeout per inning and an ERA under 3.00 at Double-A. Henriquez shows promise if he can control the long ball.


Even Balazovic is making strides lately. In his last five starts, he’s got a 2.14 ERA with 28 strikeouts and nine walks over 21 innings. You want to see that walk rate improve, but baby steps. It isn’t driven by a great BABIP, as his batted balls have fallen for a .300 or higher average in every game. He’s just getting outs at the plate.

Then you have two true wild cards in Canterino and 2022 second-rounder Connor Prielipp. Both figure to be on the fast track one recovered from Tommy John. Canterino won’t be on the mound until 2024, but he destroyed Double-A pitchers to the tune of 50Ks in 34.1 innings as a starter.

Prielipp hasn’t pitched as a pro, but his stats at Alabama were incredible, if only for a short time. Pitching in the SEC for 21 innings, Prielipp struck out 35 batters and allowed zero runs. Not earned runs. Runs. He has to recover well, but that gamble could easily pay off for Falvey and Levine.

It’s been a rough year for the pipeline, but things should start flowing again next year. Do they have a Shane Bieber or Triston McKenzie in the bunch? It’s hard to say whether Falvey can duplicate that magic in Minneapolis. But this year had too many injuries to see what it had, leaving us to wait until next year to see if this pipeline can deliver on the hype.

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RE: Twins 2022 Season and Game Day Thread - 9/20/2022 7:51:32 AM   
Phil Riewer


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From: MN
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MDK

Two pitchers for the rotation
On paper, Paddock and Mahler look good.
Both were damaged.
Did Falvine do their due diligence?
Pagan???
How long did it take this org to realize Gordon can play.
Broken org
Will not be better next season

Buxtons career is probably over.

Catcher????


Gordon is a tough one...he finally was healthy and able to put on 30 lbs after Covid and a stomach issue but w/o him we would really be hurting.

< Message edited by Phil Riewer -- 9/20/2022 12:09:22 PM >


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