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RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/8/2023 1:40:10 PM

Bill Johanesen

Posts: 33137
Status: offline

In a way the D mirrors that of an expansion team. A few high priced vets who haven't done much of late tossed in with a bunch of unknowns and to-be journeymen.

Murphy might be the best exception to that.

Post #: 1901

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/8/2023 1:49:31 PM

Bill Johanesen

Posts: 33137
Status: offline

Per previous post(s), Flores had never been a defensive coordinator and the closest thing to it may have been during his stint as HC in Miami (although he called def. plays for NE one season). How were those early returns?

On September 8, 2019, the Dolphins lost to the Baltimore Ravens, 59–10, in Flores' head coaching debut. Again in Week 2, the Dolphins lost, 43–0, to Flores' former team, the defending Super Bowl champion New England Patriots, leaving the Dolphins outscored by a total of 163 points as of the team's bye week in Week 5, which had included blowout losses to the Dallas Cowboys and Los Angeles Chargers.

At least here he has the opportunity to be more focused, but it's with a D having several new starters and a completely different scheme. Can't recall a season when the D was as big a mystery as last year and this year.

Post #: 1902

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/8/2023 2:25:53 PM

Jeff Jesser

Posts: 20122
Joined: 7/16/2007
From: Southern Cal
Status: offline

How are the Chiefs allowed to lineup their tackles 2 yards off the ball?

Post #: 1903

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/8/2023 2:42:51 PM

David F.

Posts: 10898
Joined: 12/31/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeff Jesser

How are the Chiefs allowed to lineup their tackles 2 yards off the ball?

Collinsworth started saying ‘lineman’s name’ lines up again at slot receiver. Funny stuff

_____________________________

I wouldn't give ANY qb $30-50+ mil unless that QB had won me a Super Bowl. Did you win a Super Bowl on your rookie deal? Yes? Great! Here's your hugenormous contract. F it let's just run victory laps and love life. No? Good luck. Next!

Post #: 1904

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/8/2023 2:54:44 PM

Jeff Jesser

Posts: 20122
Joined: 7/16/2007
From: Southern Cal
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeff Jesser

How are the Chiefs allowed to lineup their tackles 2 yards off the ball?

Collinsworth started saying ‘lineman’s name’ lines up again at slot receiver. Funny stuff

He also false started every play and they didn’t call it.

Post #: 1905

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/8/2023 3:08:06 PM

David Levine

Posts: 80877
Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Las Vegas
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeff Jesser

How are the Chiefs allowed to lineup their tackles 2 yards off the ball?

They pointed out during the broadcast that the Lions coaches needed to say something because it wasn't being called.

Post #: 1906

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/8/2023 3:24:49 PM

Ricky J

Posts: 18444
Joined: 7/19/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeff Jesser

How are the Chiefs allowed to lineup their tackles 2 yards off the ball?

They pointed out during the broadcast that the Lions coaches needed to say something because it wasn't being called.

Tackles allowed to get off before the snap is a huge advantage. I hope they don't start letting stuff like that go - It's not a hard call, you're looking right down the line.

UM may not complete that TD pass if the LT doesn't get a head start.

Post #: 1907

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/8/2023 4:41:24 PM

Richard Neussendorfer

Posts: 20937
Joined: 12/7/2007
From: Alamogordo, NM
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

Kelce didn't play. It might as well have been the Vikings without Jefferson. KC still would have won if not for the drop that turned into the pick 6. Detroit doesn't concern me.

Still not easy winning at Arrow Head. Don't undersell this lions squad.

For sure. In 2019 we went in there and couldn't beat them with Matt Moore in place of Mahomes.

Why would we be concerned? They only went 8-2 down the stretch last year and beat the best qb this year on opening day in his house. Scrubs!

How do you think the Vikings would do without JJ and Hunter. Chefs were playing under those circumstances.

Mahomes is the best qb in the league. Them not having Kelce is a cop out. When Cousins is as good as Mahomes I think we'd do fine offensively without JJ.

Post #: 1908

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/8/2023 4:46:39 PM

Bill Johanesen

Posts: 33137
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

Kelce didn't play. It might as well have been the Vikings without Jefferson. KC still would have won if not for the drop that turned into the pick 6. Detroit doesn't concern me.

Still not easy winning at Arrow Head. Don't undersell this lions squad.

For sure. In 2019 we went in there and couldn't beat them with Matt Moore in place of Mahomes.

Why would we be concerned? They only went 8-2 down the stretch last year and beat the best qb this year on opening day in his house. Scrubs!

How do you think the Vikings would do without JJ and Hunter. Chefs were playing under those circumstances.

Mahomes is the best qb in the league. Them not having Kelce is a cop out. When Cousins is as good as Mahomes I think we'd do fine offensively without JJ.

Maybe not for the first game of the season. No security blanket to make something out of nothing or out of chaos. Plus, I'll give KC a mulligan having come off a SB victory. Barring injuries, I think Det will kick our arse. Lots of talent in the OL.

Post #: 1909

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/8/2023 4:47:47 PM

Richard Neussendorfer

Posts: 20937
Joined: 12/7/2007
From: Alamogordo, NM
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

Kelce didn't play. It might as well have been the Vikings without Jefferson. KC still would have won if not for the drop that turned into the pick 6. Detroit doesn't concern me.

Still not easy winning at Arrow Head. Don't undersell this lions squad.

For sure. In 2019 we went in there and couldn't beat them with Matt Moore in place of Mahomes.

Why would we be concerned? They only went 8-2 down the stretch last year and beat the best qb this year on opening day in his house. Scrubs!

How do you think the Vikings would do without JJ and Hunter. Chefs were playing under those circumstances.

Mahomes is the best qb in the league. Them not having Kelce is a cop out. When Cousins is as good as Mahomes I think we'd do fine offensively without JJ.

Maybe not for the first game of the season. No security blanket to make something out of nothing or out of chaos. Plus, I'll give KC a mulligan having come off a SB victory. Barring injuries, I think Det will kick our arse. Lots of talent in the OL.

No doubt KC didn't play their best game. But to pass off the Lions like they're nothing is just silly. That's all.

Post #: 1910

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/8/2023 4:50:41 PM

Bill Johanesen

Posts: 33137
Status: offline

If any tackle jumps early against us, we have Phillips and Lowry to slash inside like lightning. Oh wait... no. Well, we have Davenport and Hunter to clearly and routinely beat that advantage. Umm, nevermind.

Post #: 1911

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/8/2023 4:52:49 PM

Bill Johanesen

Posts: 33137
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

Kelce didn't play. It might as well have been the Vikings without Jefferson. KC still would have won if not for the drop that turned into the pick 6. Detroit doesn't concern me.

Still not easy winning at Arrow Head. Don't undersell this lions squad.

For sure. In 2019 we went in there and couldn't beat them with Matt Moore in place of Mahomes.

Why would we be concerned? They only went 8-2 down the stretch last year and beat the best qb this year on opening day in his house. Scrubs!

How do you think the Vikings would do without JJ and Hunter. Chefs were playing under those circumstances.

Mahomes is the best qb in the league. Them not having Kelce is a cop out. When Cousins is as good as Mahomes I think we'd do fine offensively without JJ.

Maybe not for the first game of the season. No security blanket to make something out of nothing or out of chaos. Plus, I'll give KC a mulligan having come off a SB victory. Barring injuries, I think Det will kick our arse. Lots of talent in the OL.

No doubt KC didn't play their best game. But to pass off the Lions like they're nothing is just silly. That's all.

Agree about Det. Was just throwing in some variables.

Post #: 1912

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/8/2023 4:54:43 PM

Bill Johanesen

Posts: 33137
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeff Jesser

How are the Chiefs allowed to lineup their tackles 2 yards off the ball?

They pointed out during the broadcast that the Lions coaches needed to say something because it wasn't being called.

Hopefully the mouth-breather Campbell will be their downfall.

Love the early fake punt though. What a statement.

Post #: 1913

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/8/2023 5:26:27 PM

Ricky J

Posts: 18444
Joined: 7/19/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

Kelce didn't play. It might as well have been the Vikings without Jefferson. KC still would have won if not for the drop that turned into the pick 6. Detroit doesn't concern me.

Still not easy winning at Arrow Head. Don't undersell this lions squad.

For sure. In 2019 we went in there and couldn't beat them with Matt Moore in place of Mahomes.

Why would we be concerned? They only went 8-2 down the stretch last year and beat the best qb this year on opening day in his house. Scrubs!

How do you think the Vikings would do without JJ and Hunter. Chefs were playing under those circumstances.

Mahomes is the best qb in the league. Them not having Kelce is a cop out. When Cousins is as good as Mahomes I think we'd do fine offensively without JJ.

Not if KJ gives up an easy 6 and drops two other key first downs in the second half of a close game.

Post #: 1914

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/8/2023 6:16:31 PM

Richard Neussendorfer

Posts: 20937
Joined: 12/7/2007
From: Alamogordo, NM
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

Kelce didn't play. It might as well have been the Vikings without Jefferson. KC still would have won if not for the drop that turned into the pick 6. Detroit doesn't concern me.

Still not easy winning at Arrow Head. Don't undersell this lions squad.

For sure. In 2019 we went in there and couldn't beat them with Matt Moore in place of Mahomes.

Why would we be concerned? They only went 8-2 down the stretch last year and beat the best qb this year on opening day in his house. Scrubs!

How do you think the Vikings would do without JJ and Hunter. Chefs were playing under those circumstances.

Mahomes is the best qb in the league. Them not having Kelce is a cop out. When Cousins is as good as Mahomes I think we'd do fine offensively without JJ.

Not if KJ gives up an easy 6 and drops two other key first downs in the second half of a close game.

I hope you guys are right and Detroit isn't a threat. We shall see.

Post #: 1915

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/8/2023 8:00:02 PM

Daniel Lee Young

Posts: 16455
Status: offline

There IOL controls the LOS, usually..

How many punts followed a third and a <3?

Their defens stepped up on Two separate drives, if they had gotten a first down after tuning KC away with a punt, and their punter hadn’t had his worst punt of the night deeeep into the fourth quarter..

Game over at that point.

Detroit gave up 20 points but they forced field goal when it mattered.

Not an easy out, as I said after the first quarter, and @ ArrowHead?

Impressive..

< Message edited by Daniel Lee Young -- 9/8/2023 8:48:21 PM >

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Post #: 1916

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/8/2023 8:07:01 PM

Tom Sykes

Posts: 6228
Joined: 7/27/2007
Status: offline

The people shrugging off Det are forgetting or denying a lot of what happened last year.

Unless we've significantly improved (from last year) ... doesn't matter if Detroit is the worst team in football ... they'll give us all we can handle.

Which is more about us than Detroit.

Post #: 1917

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/8/2023 8:20:34 PM

Ricky J

Posts: 18444
Joined: 7/19/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

Kelce didn't play. It might as well have been the Vikings without Jefferson. KC still would have won if not for the drop that turned into the pick 6. Detroit doesn't concern me.

Still not easy winning at Arrow Head. Don't undersell this lions squad.

For sure. In 2019 we went in there and couldn't beat them with Matt Moore in place of Mahomes.

Why would we be concerned? They only went 8-2 down the stretch last year and beat the best qb this year on opening day in his house. Scrubs!

How do you think the Vikings would do without JJ and Hunter. Chefs were playing under those circumstances.

Mahomes is the best qb in the league. Them not having Kelce is a cop out. When Cousins is as good as Mahomes I think we'd do fine offensively without JJ.

Not if KJ gives up an easy 6 and drops two other key first downs in the second half of a close game.

I hope you guys are right and Detroit isn't a threat. We shall see.

I'm not saying they're not going to be a threat. I wouldn't say they're going to the Super Bowl off of last nights, win, though, either. It's not often you see one person totally screw your own team over like Toney did last night.

They played well last year, no doubt, and I appreciate the way they took out GB the last game of the year. But theyve been getting a lot of Twitter love - but not quite as much as Justin Fields - and that has a way of influencing peoples presective. We'll see. Should be a fun season.

Post #: 1918

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/8/2023 10:34:14 PM

Ricky J

Posts: 18444
Joined: 7/19/2007
Status: offline

Sam Monson @PPFS
Kadarius Toney's PFF grade last night is the single worst single-game given to WR receiver since 2018

Post #: 1919

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/9/2023 12:05:07 AM

kgdabom

Posts: 33922
Joined: 7/29/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

Kelce didn't play. It might as well have been the Vikings without Jefferson. KC still would have won if not for the drop that turned into the pick 6. Detroit doesn't concern me.

Still not easy winning at Arrow Head. Don't undersell this lions squad.

For sure. In 2019 we went in there and couldn't beat them with Matt Moore in place of Mahomes.

Why would we be concerned? They only went 8-2 down the stretch last year and beat the best qb this year on opening day in his house. Scrubs!

How do you think the Vikings would do without JJ and Hunter. Chefs were playing under those circumstances.

Mahomes is the best qb in the league. Them not having Kelce is a cop out. When Cousins is as good as Mahomes I think we'd do fine offensively without JJ.

Well Mahomes didn't do well without Kelce. Just the way it was. Without Kelce the Chiefs might have the worst receiving corp in the NFL. Compare it to ours without Jefferson. We still have Addison, Osborn and Hockenson. I'd sure take that over Scantling, Toney, Hill and Moore. I'll give Detroit credit for taking care of business when the Chiefs were missing there 2nd and 3rd best players, gifted them a pick 6 and wimped out going for a FG when they needed a TD to ice the game.

< Message edited by kgdabom -- 9/9/2023 12:12:52 AM >

_____________________________

"So let it be written.
So let it be done."

Post #: 1920

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/9/2023 6:23:27 AM

ratoppenheimer

Posts: 9892
Joined: 12/9/2007
From: cascais, portugal...still in exile
Status: offline

.
.
i question our move toward more 12 personnel for our offense....with nailor healthy, our receivers #1-#4 are top 5 in the league...defenses have to double team jefferson every down...with osborn, addison, and nailor we're going to be much quicker than last season....

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the journey...is paradise.

Post #: 1921

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/9/2023 10:00:45 AM

Ricky J

Posts: 18444
Joined: 7/19/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

Kelce didn't play. It might as well have been the Vikings without Jefferson. KC still would have won if not for the drop that turned into the pick 6. Detroit doesn't concern me.

Still not easy winning at Arrow Head. Don't undersell this lions squad.

For sure. In 2019 we went in there and couldn't beat them with Matt Moore in place of Mahomes.

Why would we be concerned? They only went 8-2 down the stretch last year and beat the best qb this year on opening day in his house. Scrubs!

How do you think the Vikings would do without JJ and Hunter. Chefs were playing under those circumstances.

Mahomes is the best qb in the league. Them not having Kelce is a cop out. When Cousins is as good as Mahomes I think we'd do fine offensively without JJ.

Well Mahomes didn't do well without Kelce. Just the way it was. Without Kelce the Chiefs might have the worst receiving corp in the NFL. Compare it to ours without Jefferson. We still have Addison, Osborn and Hockenson. I'd sure take that over Scantling, Toney, Hill and Moore. I'll give Detroit credit for taking care of business when the Chiefs were missing there 2nd and 3rd best players, gifted them a pick 6 and wimped out going for a FG when they needed a TD to ice the game.

If Toney doesn't drop those passes, KC wins and noone is going to say Mahomes didn't do well without Kelce, imo. And on the last drive that last drop was followed up with a 1st down catch inside Det 40 but called back for holding.

But maybe you're right, Kelce would of helped them convert on 2nd/3rd & 20 and 4th & 25, what do I know. Detroit played a lot better than I'm giving them credit for I'm sure

Post #: 1922

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/9/2023 10:21:01 AM

Mark Anderson

Posts: 12688
Joined: 9/1/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

In a way the D mirrors that of an expansion team. A few high priced vets who haven't done much of late tossed in with a bunch of unknowns and to-be journeymen.

Murphy might be the best exception to that.

I like that we have went with more speed at LB. Pace and Asamoah might be green but are top athletes. Metullus will be a LB/S hybrid.

My worry is that we might get bullied at LOS and our poor depth at CB.

Post #: 1923

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/9/2023 10:24:09 AM

Mark Anderson

Posts: 12688
Joined: 9/1/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

Kelce didn't play. It might as well have been the Vikings without Jefferson. KC still would have won if not for the drop that turned into the pick 6. Detroit doesn't concern me.

Still not easy winning at Arrow Head. Don't undersell this lions squad.

For sure. In 2019 we went in there and couldn't beat them with Matt Moore in place of Mahomes.

Why would we be concerned? They only went 8-2 down the stretch last year and beat the best qb this year on opening day in his house. Scrubs!

How do you think the Vikings would do without JJ and Hunter. Chefs were playing under those circumstances.

Mahomes is the best qb in the league. Them not having Kelce is a cop out. When Cousins is as good as Mahomes I think we'd do fine offensively without JJ.

Well Mahomes didn't do well without Kelce. Just the way it was. Without Kelce the Chiefs might have the worst receiving corp in the NFL. Compare it to ours without Jefferson. We still have Addison, Osborn and Hockenson. I'd sure take that over Scantling, Toney, Hill and Moore. I'll give Detroit credit for taking care of business when the Chiefs were missing there 2nd and 3rd best players, gifted them a pick 6 and wimped out going for a FG when they needed a TD to ice the game.

If Toney doesn't drop those passes, KC wins and noone is going to say Mahomes didn't do well without Kelce, imo. And on the last drive that last drop was followed up with a 1st down catch inside Det 40 but called back for holding.
li
But maybe you're right, Kelce would of helped them convert on 2nd/3rd & 20 and 4th & 25, what do I know. Detroit played a lot better than I'm giving them credit for I'm sure

KC's OLine took a big step back from last year. Mahomes was running for his life like the Tampa SB loss.

Toney basically gave all the momentum back to DET when KC was rolling.

DET is tough though. That will be 2 toss up games for us.

Post #: 1924

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/9/2023 11:11:32 AM

Bill Jandro

Posts: 18178
Joined: 8/13/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

In a way the D mirrors that of an expansion team. A few high priced vets who haven't done much of late tossed in with a bunch of unknowns and to-be journeymen.

Murphy might be the best exception to that.

I like that we have went with more speed at LB. Pace and Asamoah might be green but are top athletes. Metullus will be a LB/S hybrid.

My worry is that we might get bullied at LOS and our poor depth at CB.

I wonder if teams will even bother trying to run on us considering our inexperienced CB room. My guess is they will pass early and then will grind on the clock running the ball later. Guess we'll find out but I agree that we will get pushed around quite a bit.

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Post #: 1925