quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

Ryan and Lopez are under team control for several more years. Ober, Varland, Woods-Richardson, etc. will be under team control for a lot longer than that. If Falvine has finally worked out the kinks in their pitching development program, the Twins will be set up for starting pitching for a few years.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

Here is the one thing you guys are missing from the big picture. You are all encouraged about the young pitching and their futures. What you forget is that we aren't a big market team and once those guy hit their stride (if they ever do) they will be gone.

If the Twins are going to win a title, they are going to have to catch lightning in a bottle (which is what they did in both '87 and '91). Both times they won it all they didn't have great pitching staffs. They had a handful of guys that kept them in games and had 4-5 guys with career years at the plate.

The Minnesota Twins are never going to have a rotation that looks like the Braves from the 90's or most recently the Dodgers. It's a nice thought, but it's not reality.

Joe Ryan, Pablo Lopez and the old Vet Gray....eerily similar to 1991 (Tapani, Erickson, Morris). In addition this is the most pitching depth they have had in a very long time in the bullpen and rotation. Exactly the reason why you jump on the Lopez trade and sign him.....Ryan and Lopez alone is the best 1 and 2 we have had in a long time before you even consider what Gray has done this year.

They also have more depth on Defense and Offense w/o Arreaz....which brings me back to the same question. How much Twins baseball have you watched this year and the 2 years prior....Injuries, Pagan, BUNDY, and ARCHER were the demise in 2022. If you think pitching wasn't a problem......Arreaz hitting didn't get us far in 2022...he is one minor piece to the puzzle.

I'll be at the upcoming Dodgers and Angels series'. How about you?

Eerily similar? Where did you come up with that? Jack Morris had been in the league for 15 years and won nearly 200 games by the time he played for the Twins. Are you comparing Sonny Gray to Jack Morris? Gray has never won more than 14 games. Morris did that 13 times.

But I forgot, you guys don't think wins is a pertinent statistic.

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

Nobody has Maddux, Glavine and Smoltz. Those rotations don't exist anymore.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

Here is the one thing you guys are missing from the big picture. You are all encouraged about the young pitching and their futures. What you forget is that we aren't a big market team and once those guy hit their stride (if they ever do) they will be gone.

If the Twins are going to win a title, they are going to have to catch lightning in a bottle (which is what they did in both '87 and '91). Both times they won it all they didn't have great pitching staffs. They had a handful of guys that kept them in games and had 4-5 guys with career years at the plate.

The Minnesota Twins are never going to have a rotation that looks like the Braves from the 90's or most recently the Dodgers. It's a nice thought, but it's not reality.

Joe Ryan, Pablo Lopez and the old Vet Gray....eerily similar to 1991 (Tapani, Erickson, Morris). In addition this is the most pitching depth they have had in a very long time in the bullpen and rotation. Exactly the reason why you jump on the Lopez trade and sign him.....Ryan and Lopez alone is the best 1 and 2 we have had in a long time before you even consider what Gray has done this year.

They also have more depth on Defense and Offense w/o Arreaz....which brings me back to the same question. How much Twins baseball have you watched this year and the 2 years prior....Injuries, Pagan, BUNDY, and ARCHER were the demise in 2022. If you think pitching wasn't a problem......Arreaz hitting didn't get us far in 2022...he is one minor piece to the puzzle.

I'll be at the upcoming Dodgers and Angels series'. How about you?

Eerily similar? Where did you come up with that? Jack Morris had been in the league for 15 years and won nearly 200 games by the time he played for the Twins. Are you comparing Sonny Gray to Jack Morris? Gray has never won more than 14 games. Morris did that 13 times.

But I forgot, you guys don't think wins is a pertinent statistic.

Exactly my point....look at Gray's playoff experience and he is 3 years younger (than Morris was in 91)...Gray pitched for Oakland and Cincy for a lot of years but has major playoff experience with NYY and Oak. Wins are not what you look at when Pitchers pitch for Oak, Cincy, and (Miami Marlins).

I will be at a game this week and I also know you are very wrong on Arreaz. I thought we shouldn't traded Arreaz the prior 2 years--my mind changed after 2022 because frankly I was wrong; especially getting the assets back we did.

The other tradeable assets in my mind were Polanco and Kepler (to acquire Lopez)....Kepler had no value and Polanco was more expensive for a team like Miami.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

Here is the one thing you guys are missing from the big picture. You are all encouraged about the young pitching and their futures. What you forget is that we aren't a big market team and once those guy hit their stride (if they ever do) they will be gone.

If the Twins are going to win a title, they are going to have to catch lightning in a bottle (which is what they did in both '87 and '91). Both times they won it all they didn't have great pitching staffs. They had a handful of guys that kept them in games and had 4-5 guys with career years at the plate.

The Minnesota Twins are never going to have a rotation that looks like the Braves from the 90's or most recently the Dodgers. It's a nice thought, but it's not reality.

Joe Ryan, Pablo Lopez and the old Vet Gray....eerily similar to 1991 (Tapani, Erickson, Morris). In addition this is the most pitching depth they have had in a very long time in the bullpen and rotation. Exactly the reason why you jump on the Lopez trade and sign him.....Ryan and Lopez alone is the best 1 and 2 we have had in a long time before you even consider what Gray has done this year.

They also have more depth on Defense and Offense w/o Arreaz....which brings me back to the same question. How much Twins baseball have you watched this year and the 2 years prior....Injuries, Pagan, BUNDY, and ARCHER were the demise in 2022. If you think pitching wasn't a problem......Arreaz hitting didn't get us far in 2022...he is one minor piece to the puzzle.

I'll be at the upcoming Dodgers and Angels series'. How about you?

Eerily similar? Where did you come up with that? Jack Morris had been in the league for 15 years and won nearly 200 games by the time he played for the Twins. Are you comparing Sonny Gray to Jack Morris? Gray has never won more than 14 games. Morris did that 13 times.

But I forgot, you guys don't think wins is a pertinent statistic.

Exactly my point....look at Gray's playoff experience and he is 3 years younger (than Morris was in 91)...Gray pitched for Oakland and Cincy for a lot of years but has major playoff experience with NYY and Oak. Wins are not what you look at when Pitchers pitch for Oak, Cincy, and (Miami Marlins).

I will be at a game this week and I also know you are very wrong on Arreaz. I thought we shouldn't traded Arreaz the prior 2 years--my mind changed after 2022 because frankly I was wrong; especially getting the assets back we did.

The other tradeable assets in my mind were Polanco and Kepler (to acquire Lopez)....Kepler had no value and Polanco was more expensive for a team like Miami.

Sonny Gray has almost nothing in common with Jack Morris other than being a pitcher. Nice try.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

Here is the one thing you guys are missing from the big picture. You are all encouraged about the young pitching and their futures. What you forget is that we aren't a big market team and once those guy hit their stride (if they ever do) they will be gone.

If the Twins are going to win a title, they are going to have to catch lightning in a bottle (which is what they did in both '87 and '91). Both times they won it all they didn't have great pitching staffs. They had a handful of guys that kept them in games and had 4-5 guys with career years at the plate.

The Minnesota Twins are never going to have a rotation that looks like the Braves from the 90's or most recently the Dodgers. It's a nice thought, but it's not reality.

Joe Ryan, Pablo Lopez and the old Vet Gray....eerily similar to 1991 (Tapani, Erickson, Morris). In addition this is the most pitching depth they have had in a very long time in the bullpen and rotation. Exactly the reason why you jump on the Lopez trade and sign him.....Ryan and Lopez alone is the best 1 and 2 we have had in a long time before you even consider what Gray has done this year.

They also have more depth on Defense and Offense w/o Arreaz....which brings me back to the same question. How much Twins baseball have you watched this year and the 2 years prior....Injuries, Pagan, BUNDY, and ARCHER were the demise in 2022. If you think pitching wasn't a problem......Arreaz hitting didn't get us far in 2022...he is one minor piece to the puzzle.

I'll be at the upcoming Dodgers and Angels series'. How about you?

Eerily similar? Where did you come up with that? Jack Morris had been in the league for 15 years and won nearly 200 games by the time he played for the Twins. Are you comparing Sonny Gray to Jack Morris? Gray has never won more than 14 games. Morris did that 13 times.

But I forgot, you guys don't think wins is a pertinent statistic.

Exactly my point....look at Gray's playoff experience and he is 3 years younger (than Morris was in 91)...Gray pitched for Oakland and Cincy for a lot of years but has major playoff experience with NYY and Oak. Wins are not what you look at when Pitchers pitch for Oak, Cincy, and (Miami Marlins).

I will be at a game this week and I also know you are very wrong on Arreaz. I thought we shouldn't traded Arreaz the prior 2 years--my mind changed after 2022 because frankly I was wrong; especially getting the assets back we did.

The other tradeable assets in my mind were Polanco and Kepler (to acquire Lopez)....Kepler had no value and Polanco was more expensive for a team like Miami.

Sonny Gray has almost nothing in common with Jack Morris other than being a pitcher. Nice try.

You may want to look again...closer than you think.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

Here is the one thing you guys are missing from the big picture. You are all encouraged about the young pitching and their futures. What you forget is that we aren't a big market team and once those guy hit their stride (if they ever do) they will be gone.

If the Twins are going to win a title, they are going to have to catch lightning in a bottle (which is what they did in both '87 and '91). Both times they won it all they didn't have great pitching staffs. They had a handful of guys that kept them in games and had 4-5 guys with career years at the plate.

The Minnesota Twins are never going to have a rotation that looks like the Braves from the 90's or most recently the Dodgers. It's a nice thought, but it's not reality.

Joe Ryan, Pablo Lopez and the old Vet Gray....eerily similar to 1991 (Tapani, Erickson, Morris). In addition this is the most pitching depth they have had in a very long time in the bullpen and rotation. Exactly the reason why you jump on the Lopez trade and sign him.....Ryan and Lopez alone is the best 1 and 2 we have had in a long time before you even consider what Gray has done this year.

They also have more depth on Defense and Offense w/o Arreaz....which brings me back to the same question. How much Twins baseball have you watched this year and the 2 years prior....Injuries, Pagan, BUNDY, and ARCHER were the demise in 2022. If you think pitching wasn't a problem......Arreaz hitting didn't get us far in 2022...he is one minor piece to the puzzle.

I'll be at the upcoming Dodgers and Angels series'. How about you?

Eerily similar? Where did you come up with that? Jack Morris had been in the league for 15 years and won nearly 200 games by the time he played for the Twins. Are you comparing Sonny Gray to Jack Morris? Gray has never won more than 14 games. Morris did that 13 times.

But I forgot, you guys don't think wins is a pertinent statistic.

Exactly my point....look at Gray's playoff experience and he is 3 years younger (than Morris was in 91)...Gray pitched for Oakland and Cincy for a lot of years but has major playoff experience with NYY and Oak. Wins are not what you look at when Pitchers pitch for Oak, Cincy, and (Miami Marlins).

I will be at a game this week and I also know you are very wrong on Arreaz. I thought we shouldn't traded Arreaz the prior 2 years--my mind changed after 2022 because frankly I was wrong; especially getting the assets back we did.

The other tradeable assets in my mind were Polanco and Kepler (to acquire Lopez)....Kepler had no value and Polanco was more expensive for a team like Miami.

Sonny Gray has almost nothing in common with Jack Morris other than being a pitcher. Nice try.

You may want to look again...closer than you think.

Oh please, lets not be silly.

Jack Morris won more games in the 80's than any pitcher in baseball. He pitched 175 complete games and had 515 consecutive starts.

Anybody else see how silly this argument is?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

Here is the one thing you guys are missing from the big picture. You are all encouraged about the young pitching and their futures. What you forget is that we aren't a big market team and once those guy hit their stride (if they ever do) they will be gone.

If the Twins are going to win a title, they are going to have to catch lightning in a bottle (which is what they did in both '87 and '91). Both times they won it all they didn't have great pitching staffs. They had a handful of guys that kept them in games and had 4-5 guys with career years at the plate.

The Minnesota Twins are never going to have a rotation that looks like the Braves from the 90's or most recently the Dodgers. It's a nice thought, but it's not reality.

Joe Ryan, Pablo Lopez and the old Vet Gray....eerily similar to 1991 (Tapani, Erickson, Morris). In addition this is the most pitching depth they have had in a very long time in the bullpen and rotation. Exactly the reason why you jump on the Lopez trade and sign him.....Ryan and Lopez alone is the best 1 and 2 we have had in a long time before you even consider what Gray has done this year.

They also have more depth on Defense and Offense w/o Arreaz....which brings me back to the same question. How much Twins baseball have you watched this year and the 2 years prior....Injuries, Pagan, BUNDY, and ARCHER were the demise in 2022. If you think pitching wasn't a problem......Arreaz hitting didn't get us far in 2022...he is one minor piece to the puzzle.

I'll be at the upcoming Dodgers and Angels series'. How about you?

Eerily similar? Where did you come up with that? Jack Morris had been in the league for 15 years and won nearly 200 games by the time he played for the Twins. Are you comparing Sonny Gray to Jack Morris? Gray has never won more than 14 games. Morris did that 13 times.

But I forgot, you guys don't think wins is a pertinent statistic.

Exactly my point....look at Gray's playoff experience and he is 3 years younger (than Morris was in 91)...Gray pitched for Oakland and Cincy for a lot of years but has major playoff experience with NYY and Oak. Wins are not what you look at when Pitchers pitch for Oak, Cincy, and (Miami Marlins).

I will be at a game this week and I also know you are very wrong on Arreaz. I thought we shouldn't traded Arreaz the prior 2 years--my mind changed after 2022 because frankly I was wrong; especially getting the assets back we did.

The other tradeable assets in my mind were Polanco and Kepler (to acquire Lopez)....Kepler had no value and Polanco was more expensive for a team like Miami.

Sonny Gray has almost nothing in common with Jack Morris other than being a pitcher. Nice try.

You may want to look again...closer than you think.

Oh please, lets not be silly.

Jack Morris won more games in the 80's than any pitcher in baseball. He pitched 175 complete games and had 515 consecutive starts.

Anybody else see how silly this argument is?

Twins didn't get the 80s version; they signed the 36 year old/90s version after Detroit didn't want him.....look at Sonny's start to this year so far.

Jack was the 3rd best pitcher on the staff that year after Erickson and Tapani. Maybe you don't remember?

He remade himself and only pitched one year effectively after it.....he was probably the 3rd best Toronto pitcher in 92 also.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

Here is the one thing you guys are missing from the big picture. You are all encouraged about the young pitching and their futures. What you forget is that we aren't a big market team and once those guy hit their stride (if they ever do) they will be gone.

If the Twins are going to win a title, they are going to have to catch lightning in a bottle (which is what they did in both '87 and '91). Both times they won it all they didn't have great pitching staffs. They had a handful of guys that kept them in games and had 4-5 guys with career years at the plate.

The Minnesota Twins are never going to have a rotation that looks like the Braves from the 90's or most recently the Dodgers. It's a nice thought, but it's not reality.

Joe Ryan, Pablo Lopez and the old Vet Gray....eerily similar to 1991 (Tapani, Erickson, Morris). In addition this is the most pitching depth they have had in a very long time in the bullpen and rotation. Exactly the reason why you jump on the Lopez trade and sign him.....Ryan and Lopez alone is the best 1 and 2 we have had in a long time before you even consider what Gray has done this year.

They also have more depth on Defense and Offense w/o Arreaz....which brings me back to the same question. How much Twins baseball have you watched this year and the 2 years prior....Injuries, Pagan, BUNDY, and ARCHER were the demise in 2022. If you think pitching wasn't a problem......Arreaz hitting didn't get us far in 2022...he is one minor piece to the puzzle.

I'll be at the upcoming Dodgers and Angels series'. How about you?

Eerily similar? Where did you come up with that? Jack Morris had been in the league for 15 years and won nearly 200 games by the time he played for the Twins. Are you comparing Sonny Gray to Jack Morris? Gray has never won more than 14 games. Morris did that 13 times.

But I forgot, you guys don't think wins is a pertinent statistic.

Exactly my point....look at Gray's playoff experience and he is 3 years younger (than Morris was in 91)...Gray pitched for Oakland and Cincy for a lot of years but has major playoff experience with NYY and Oak. Wins are not what you look at when Pitchers pitch for Oak, Cincy, and (Miami Marlins).

I will be at a game this week and I also know you are very wrong on Arreaz. I thought we shouldn't traded Arreaz the prior 2 years--my mind changed after 2022 because frankly I was wrong; especially getting the assets back we did.

The other tradeable assets in my mind were Polanco and Kepler (to acquire Lopez)....Kepler had no value and Polanco was more expensive for a team like Miami.

Sonny Gray has almost nothing in common with Jack Morris other than being a pitcher. Nice try.

You may want to look again...closer than you think.

Oh please, lets not be silly.

Jack Morris won more games in the 80's than any pitcher in baseball. He pitched 175 complete games and had 515 consecutive starts.

Anybody else see how silly this argument is?

Twins didn't get the 80s version; they signed the 36 year old/90s version after Detroit didn't want him.....look at Sonny's start to this year so far.

Jack was the 3rd best pitcher on the staff that year after Erickson and Tapani. Maybe you don't remember?

He remade himself and only pitched one year effectively after it.....he was probably the 3rd best Toronto pitcher in 92 also.

At 36-years old, Jack Morris threw 10 innings in game seven of the World Series to outduel John Schmoltz. He won 18 games that year, which is four more than Gray has ever won in a season.

There's a partial chance if he took the mound tomorrow he'd still have more gas in the tank than Sonny Gray.

There is no reason to continue this discussion.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

Here is the one thing you guys are missing from the big picture. You are all encouraged about the young pitching and their futures. What you forget is that we aren't a big market team and once those guy hit their stride (if they ever do) they will be gone.

If the Twins are going to win a title, they are going to have to catch lightning in a bottle (which is what they did in both '87 and '91). Both times they won it all they didn't have great pitching staffs. They had a handful of guys that kept them in games and had 4-5 guys with career years at the plate.

The Minnesota Twins are never going to have a rotation that looks like the Braves from the 90's or most recently the Dodgers. It's a nice thought, but it's not reality.

Joe Ryan, Pablo Lopez and the old Vet Gray....eerily similar to 1991 (Tapani, Erickson, Morris). In addition this is the most pitching depth they have had in a very long time in the bullpen and rotation. Exactly the reason why you jump on the Lopez trade and sign him.....Ryan and Lopez alone is the best 1 and 2 we have had in a long time before you even consider what Gray has done this year.

They also have more depth on Defense and Offense w/o Arreaz....which brings me back to the same question. How much Twins baseball have you watched this year and the 2 years prior....Injuries, Pagan, BUNDY, and ARCHER were the demise in 2022. If you think pitching wasn't a problem......Arreaz hitting didn't get us far in 2022...he is one minor piece to the puzzle.

I'll be at the upcoming Dodgers and Angels series'. How about you?

Eerily similar? Where did you come up with that? Jack Morris had been in the league for 15 years and won nearly 200 games by the time he played for the Twins. Are you comparing Sonny Gray to Jack Morris? Gray has never won more than 14 games. Morris did that 13 times.

But I forgot, you guys don't think wins is a pertinent statistic.

Exactly my point....look at Gray's playoff experience and he is 3 years younger (than Morris was in 91)...Gray pitched for Oakland and Cincy for a lot of years but has major playoff experience with NYY and Oak. Wins are not what you look at when Pitchers pitch for Oak, Cincy, and (Miami Marlins).

I will be at a game this week and I also know you are very wrong on Arreaz. I thought we shouldn't traded Arreaz the prior 2 years--my mind changed after 2022 because frankly I was wrong; especially getting the assets back we did.

The other tradeable assets in my mind were Polanco and Kepler (to acquire Lopez)....Kepler had no value and Polanco was more expensive for a team like Miami.

Sonny Gray has almost nothing in common with Jack Morris other than being a pitcher. Nice try.

You may want to look again...closer than you think.

Oh please, lets not be silly.

Jack Morris won more games in the 80's than any pitcher in baseball. He pitched 175 complete games and had 515 consecutive starts.

Anybody else see how silly this argument is?

Twins didn't get the 80s version; they signed the 36 year old/90s version after Detroit didn't want him.....look at Sonny's start to this year so far.

Jack was the 3rd best pitcher on the staff that year after Erickson and Tapani. Maybe you don't remember?

He remade himself and only pitched one year effectively after it.....he was probably the 3rd best Toronto pitcher in 92 also.

At 36-years old, Jack Morris threw 10 innings in game seven of the World Series to outduel John Schmoltz. He won 18 games that year, which is four more than Gray has ever won in a season.

There's a partial chance if he took the mound tomorrow he'd still have more gas in the tank than Sonny Gray.

There is no reason to continue this discussion.

Oh he was good that year; Tapani and Erickson were better and received CY Young votes......another example of you not seeing things clearly though.

The three pitchers were the reason not just Morris; similar to your view on Arreaz and what was better for the team. Enjoy the upcoming games!!!

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

Here is the one thing you guys are missing from the big picture. You are all encouraged about the young pitching and their futures. What you forget is that we aren't a big market team and once those guy hit their stride (if they ever do) they will be gone.

If the Twins are going to win a title, they are going to have to catch lightning in a bottle (which is what they did in both '87 and '91). Both times they won it all they didn't have great pitching staffs. They had a handful of guys that kept them in games and had 4-5 guys with career years at the plate.

The Minnesota Twins are never going to have a rotation that looks like the Braves from the 90's or most recently the Dodgers. It's a nice thought, but it's not reality.

Joe Ryan, Pablo Lopez and the old Vet Gray....eerily similar to 1991 (Tapani, Erickson, Morris). In addition this is the most pitching depth they have had in a very long time in the bullpen and rotation. Exactly the reason why you jump on the Lopez trade and sign him.....Ryan and Lopez alone is the best 1 and 2 we have had in a long time before you even consider what Gray has done this year.

They also have more depth on Defense and Offense w/o Arreaz....which brings me back to the same question. How much Twins baseball have you watched this year and the 2 years prior....Injuries, Pagan, BUNDY, and ARCHER were the demise in 2022. If you think pitching wasn't a problem......Arreaz hitting didn't get us far in 2022...he is one minor piece to the puzzle.

I'll be at the upcoming Dodgers and Angels series'. How about you?

Eerily similar? Where did you come up with that? Jack Morris had been in the league for 15 years and won nearly 200 games by the time he played for the Twins. Are you comparing Sonny Gray to Jack Morris? Gray has never won more than 14 games. Morris did that 13 times.

But I forgot, you guys don't think wins is a pertinent statistic.

Exactly my point....look at Gray's playoff experience and he is 3 years younger (than Morris was in 91)...Gray pitched for Oakland and Cincy for a lot of years but has major playoff experience with NYY and Oak. Wins are not what you look at when Pitchers pitch for Oak, Cincy, and (Miami Marlins).

I will be at a game this week and I also know you are very wrong on Arreaz. I thought we shouldn't traded Arreaz the prior 2 years--my mind changed after 2022 because frankly I was wrong; especially getting the assets back we did.

The other tradeable assets in my mind were Polanco and Kepler (to acquire Lopez)....Kepler had no value and Polanco was more expensive for a team like Miami.

Sonny Gray has almost nothing in common with Jack Morris other than being a pitcher. Nice try.

You may want to look again...closer than you think.

Oh please, lets not be silly.

Jack Morris won more games in the 80's than any pitcher in baseball. He pitched 175 complete games and had 515 consecutive starts.

Anybody else see how silly this argument is?

Twins didn't get the 80s version; they signed the 36 year old/90s version after Detroit didn't want him.....look at Sonny's start to this year so far.

Jack was the 3rd best pitcher on the staff that year after Erickson and Tapani. Maybe you don't remember?

He remade himself and only pitched one year effectively after it.....he was probably the 3rd best Toronto pitcher in 92 also.

At 36-years old, Jack Morris threw 10 innings in game seven of the World Series to outduel John Schmoltz. He won 18 games that year, which is four more than Gray has ever won in a season.

There's a partial chance if he took the mound tomorrow he'd still have more gas in the tank than Sonny Gray.

There is no reason to continue this discussion.

Oh he was good that year; Tapani and Erickson were better and received CY Young votes......another example of you not seeing things clearly though.

The three pitchers were the reason not just Morris; similar to your view on Arreaz and what was better for the team. Enjoy the upcoming games!!!

The Twins batted .280 as a team in 1991 (next closest team in the league was .271). That's how they won the World Series. Which is what I said to start the day.

Lets not get sidetracked. The Twins are batting .234 this season.

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

I think we can all agree Kenta Maeda is a liability at this point. 10 runs in 3 innings today. The Twins have put 5 on the board and aren't even in the game.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

I think we can all agree Kenta Maeda is a liability at this point. 10 runs in 3 innings today. The Twins have put 5 on the board and aren't even in the game.

Could Hartman on one leg pitch better? [;)]

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mister Ed

I would prefer Headrick, a lefty over Ober, but I don't think they go wrong with either.

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mister Ed

I would prefer Headrick, a lefty over Ober, but I don't think they go wrong with either.

That's fine with me too. I just get the sense that Ober is their next in line. I think Headrick is slated for long relief for now.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mister Ed

I would prefer Headrick, a lefty over Ober, but I don't think they go wrong with either.

That's fine with me too. I just get the sense that Ober is their next in line. I think Headrick is slated for long relief for now.

Varland has to be in the mix too....every time he pitches he does pretty good.

Any status on Winder; probably another bullpen arm eventually.

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens



BTW, the 91 WS win was at least as much about pitching as hitting.

quote:

ORIGINAL: bstinger

Brad is running the risk of making Phil win an argument. [:-]

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens



BTW, the 91 WS win was at least as much about pitching as hitting.

That's just silly. Perhaps you could make a case for the actual World Series, but it completely discounts the other 180+ games that were played to get them there.

The Twins were one of the best hitting teams in the league for a period of 5-6 years when they won their two World Series. To make a case that it was about the pitching staff is just silly.

The pitching staff was #9 in ERA that season. Good, but not among the elite in the league. In the meantime they led the league in batting average and on-base percentage while being second in slugging percentage and OPS. They were an elite hitting team.