RE: General Vikes Talk

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stfrank -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/25/2023 7:34:28 AM)
Having watched all 4 SB's as a teen that loved football, the thing that always hurt me the most was the fact to our team never once showed up for the big game. If just once had they played to their abilities it would be different, but they didn't. After watching those games I always came away wondering what happened to the team we watched all season to get to that point. They were like watching different teams every time.

SAMiller711r -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/25/2023 8:21:26 AM)
I think, Daniel, you have the right of it as to being a Viking fan. I became a fan in 1969. First game I ever watched was the championship game against the Browns. I was in a word hooked. All of those last game gut punches. Each loss more excruciating than the last. The Vikings have been since that day my most intense passion (wife and children & grandchildren notwithstanding) I have also lived and died as a Boston Redsox fan. Not nearly as passionate as I am with the Vikings, but still fairly intense. The 2004 championship preceded by the 4 game comeback against the Yankees (Green Bay equivalent) was about as an explosive cathartic event as can be had. Not a single fan had a bad day the rest of the year. If the boss was on your ass, or the wife mad or the flat tire at a inconvenient time, all you had to do was flash back for a moment or two to that championship moment and dark clouds instantly dissapated. Scores of people flocked into Cemetary's to share, while weeping, the good news with departed family and friends. I write this to say it will be thus with us. Although of course we might be among the lain to rest being so informed by them what are fortunate enough to have experienced it whilst alive. As for the team I think KOC has done a pretty good job. He has to learn as he goes. Hès been dealt. some shaky hands. Having to start 4 Qbs is on no ones menu of success. I thinks hes a little too loyal and maybe stubborn is a better word for that. But I for one am willing to continue with him. And so I go on as a Vikings fan. Not crazy about Cousins anymore. I like him. I see what he brings. Enjoyed the HBO documentary. But the Giants game last year showed me he is not the promised one. time to go. Unfortunately I think KOC will try to keep him. Theres that loyalty thing or was it stubborness ? Still when looking at the QB room its hard to not feel bad for him. Not only is his job on the line and reputation but he dosent want to squander the best remaining years of his best players.

Todd M -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/25/2023 9:09:09 AM)
No offense meant but I hate hearing that Kevin has to learn and grow. This isn’t an internship in an office setting. HC job in the NFL is rarified air. Be spectacular or gtfo. The problems aren’t little nuances needed to be picked up he’s weak and has been routinely out coached this yearsans horseshoe up his ass. I didn’t need to wait to see if Ponder could be a QB or Williamson could learn to catch.

Bill Johanesen -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/25/2023 9:09:56 AM)
I didn't grow up in Minnesota or the midwest, but as a kid watched the Vikings lose a SB and have stuck with them ever since. The Vikes lost to some powerhouse teams whose running games were ahead of their times and a precursor to the Hogs era. Their defenses were superb. Already told my kids that when I'm old and senile just tell me the Vikings won the SB even if it's a lie.

Karl Juhnke -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/25/2023 9:14:18 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: stfrank Having watched all 4 SB's as a teen that loved football, the thing that always hurt me the most was the fact to our team never once showed up for the big game. If just once had they played to their abilities it would be different, but they didn't. After watching those games I always came away wondering what happened to the team we watched all season to get to that point. They were like watching different teams every time. Unpopular opinion alert: Bud never took any heat for his teams’ awful Super Bowl performances, and he should have. Don’t get me wrong, I loved Bud, like everyone else. He was an icon and a tremendous man. But it’s like he got a free pass for the Super Bowl losses that no other coach would have. Somebody else’s fault. I don’t really have an answer here. I certainly didn’t want him fired or anything. But I always wondered why there wasn’t more focus within the organization as a whole, Bud included to make changes instead playing the same Super Bowl re-run over and over.

Todd M -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/25/2023 9:17:21 AM)
My history is different than most. My dad was a Cowbows fan and I did not watch any football until I was well out of high school. Like age 21. Caught a game in 93 with Jim McMahon trying to mount a comeback for us that fell short. One of the few players I would have recognized. Sort of started to identify with them in 94 and in 95 was a fan.

Bill Johanesen -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/25/2023 9:28:08 AM)
A quick look at the play-by-play showed we passed exclusively on 1st down on the first two TD drives. There were also 3 and outs and interceptions starting with 'Ty Chandler left end for 1 yard' and 'Alexander Mattison up the middle for -1 yard' type calls. But there were also more passing plays on 1st down. In a microcosm, that game showed KOC did switch things up. We passed three times more than we ran. Unfortunately, the QB was Mr. 4 Pick Mullens. The running game stats tell part of the story. Both defenses allow 3.7 ypc, basically tied for 4th in the NFL. Results: Det, 36 att, 143 yds, 4.0, 3 TD Minn, 11 att, 17 yds, 1.5 ypc, 1 TD

Bill Johanesen -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/25/2023 9:35:09 AM)
We're currently slotted at pick #15. Record wise, teams in positions 11-15 are all 7-8 but our strength of schedule in the 'strongest'.

SAMiller711r -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/25/2023 9:35:37 AM)
Its true Bud Grant never took any heat for the Super Bowl losses, but you know what, neither did Marv Levy for the 4 Bills SB losses. As far as having no patience for a coach learning on the job, Unless they are a journeyman coach, with experience one would naturally expect some growing pains. Bill Belicheck himself was not a zen master coach his first go around. That said, I think our guy needs to seriously unass his head regarding decision making

Bill Johanesen -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/25/2023 9:56:04 AM)
During the offseason the regime signed Oliver and Mattison in a concentrated effort to improve a running game that averaged 4.1 ypc. As this season winds down, we are at 3.9 ypc (tied for 23rd-25th). All in all, that's an epic fail. We need better blockers and a better RB. Can't fault the defense for much as Flores held it together for much of the season until DCs figured out how to expose it. Continued smoke and mirrors won't hide the need for more talented players, especially at CB and DE/Edge. QB, CB, IOL, DE, RB. Another offseason with a long list of needs.

stfrank -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/25/2023 10:09:45 AM)
I just read Souhan's column in the Strib and like the moniker he used...... Nick "The Pick" Mullens.

Mark Anderson -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/25/2023 11:17:25 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Karl Juhnke quote: ORIGINAL: stfrank Having watched all 4 SB's as a teen that loved football, the thing that always hurt me the most was the fact to our team never once showed up for the big game. If just once had they played to their abilities it would be different, but they didn't. After watching those games I always came away wondering what happened to the team we watched all season to get to that point. They were like watching different teams every time. Unpopular opinion alert: Bud never took any heat for his teams’ awful Super Bowl performances, and he should have. Don’t get me wrong, I loved Bud, like everyone else. He was an icon and a tremendous man. But it’s like he got a free pass for the Super Bowl losses that no other coach would have. Somebody else’s fault. I don’t really have an answer here. I certainly didn’t want him fired or anything. But I always wondered why there wasn’t more focus within the organization as a whole, Bud included to make changes instead playing the same Super Bowl re-run over and over. I only really remember the Raider SB game. But, it seemed to me the Purple People Eaters were built on quickness and speed. It worked in the NFC but we got bullied in the SBs. Steelers Roid OLine killed us. Miami Csonked us. Raider OLine was big and athletic and our DLine was on its last legs.

Mark Anderson -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/25/2023 11:20:46 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen A quick look at the play-by-play showed we passed exclusively on 1st down on the first two TD drives. There were also 3 and outs and interceptions starting with 'Ty Chandler left end for 1 yard' and 'Alexander Mattison up the middle for -1 yard' type calls. But there were also more passing plays on 1st down. In a microcosm, that game showed KOC did switch things up. We passed three times more than we ran. Unfortunately, the QB was Mr. 4 Pick Mullens. The running game stats tell part of the story. Both defenses allow 3.7 ypc, basically tied for 4th in the NFL. Results: Det, 36 att, 143 yds, 4.0, 3 TD Minn, 11 att, 17 yds, 1.5 ypc, 1 TD Detroit is going nowhere with that horrible secondary. Any competent QB would have had 450 and 5 TDs. Also, why pay O'Neill all that money when we can get the same or maybe better performance from Quessenberry?

Mark Anderson -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/25/2023 11:30:09 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen I didn't grow up in Minnesota or the midwest, but as a kid watched the Vikings lose a SB and have stuck with them ever since. The Vikes lost to some powerhouse teams whose running games were ahead of their times and a precursor to the Hogs era. Their defenses were superb. Already told my kids that when I'm old and senile just tell me the Vikings won the SB even if it's a lie. Our best chance was 09, not 98. 98 we would have had too many injuries to overcome to beat Denver. Possibly beat them in a shootout but Denver was solid on both sides of the ball. 09 was solid on both sides. Something we forget was we held a powerhouse Saints offense down. I think five 3 and outs that game.

Bill Johanesen -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/25/2023 11:33:39 AM)
It's amazing how dominant the AFL/AFC was from 1969-81. 11-2 in Super Bowls over those 13 years. The Don Shula led Baltimore and Miami teams ushered in the Steelers/Raiders teams. Then for 1982-1997 the NFC said hold my beer and went 15-1. Wash, SF, Dal. Then the AFC went 8-2.

Bill Johanesen -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/25/2023 11:34:30 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson quote: ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen I didn't grow up in Minnesota or the midwest, but as a kid watched the Vikings lose a SB and have stuck with them ever since. The Vikes lost to some powerhouse teams whose running games were ahead of their times and a precursor to the Hogs era. Their defenses were superb. Already told my kids that when I'm old and senile just tell me the Vikings won the SB even if it's a lie. Our best chance was 09, not 98. 98 we would have had too many injuries to overcome to beat Denver. Possibly beat them in a shootout but Denver was solid on both sides of the ball. 09 was solid on both sides. Something we forget was we held a powerhouse Saints offense down. I think five 3 and outs that game. Who said 98?

Mark Anderson -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/25/2023 11:37:47 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen quote: ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson quote: ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen I didn't grow up in Minnesota or the midwest, but as a kid watched the Vikings lose a SB and have stuck with them ever since. The Vikes lost to some powerhouse teams whose running games were ahead of their times and a precursor to the Hogs era. Their defenses were superb. Already told my kids that when I'm old and senile just tell me the Vikings won the SB even if it's a lie. Our best chance was 09, not 98. 98 we would have had too many injuries to overcome to beat Denver. Possibly beat them in a shootout but Denver was solid on both sides of the ball. 09 was solid on both sides. Something we forget was we held a powerhouse Saints offense down. I think five 3 and outs that game. Who said 98? [/quo No one in particular. IMO, Just a common perception that team would have won SB if not for Gary Anderson, Robert Griffith or Denny.

Mark Anderson -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/25/2023 12:20:57 PM)
Hockenson: Torn ACL [:@]

David F. -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/25/2023 12:45:59 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson quote: ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen A quick look at the play-by-play showed we passed exclusively on 1st down on the first two TD drives. There were also 3 and outs and interceptions starting with 'Ty Chandler left end for 1 yard' and 'Alexander Mattison up the middle for -1 yard' type calls. But there were also more passing plays on 1st down. In a microcosm, that game showed KOC did switch things up. We passed three times more than we ran. Unfortunately, the QB was Mr. 4 Pick Mullens. The running game stats tell part of the story. Both defenses allow 3.7 ypc, basically tied for 4th in the NFL. Results: Det, 36 att, 143 yds, 4.0, 3 TD Minn, 11 att, 17 yds, 1.5 ypc, 1 TD Detroit is going nowhere with that horrible secondary. Any competent QB would have had 450 and 5 TDs. Also, why pay O'Neill all that money when we can get the same or maybe better performance from Quessenberry? The only two qbs to have that kind of success against the lions are Lamar and Herbert. Lamar had 357 and 3 TDs and one more via the run. Herbert had 320+ (can’t remember the exact) and 4 TDs. Outside of that they’ve done ok.

Daniel Lee Young -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/25/2023 1:11:43 PM)
Wow Mahomes doing his best nick mullet impression.. KC getting rolled @home by Duh Raiduhs.. [&:]

beo -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/25/2023 2:16:17 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson Hockenson: Torn ACL [:@] F#$%!!! Don't care about this year... but that is impactful for next year and potentially beyond... damn

odin -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/25/2023 3:06:02 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Daniel Lee Young Wow Mahomes doing his best nick mullet impression.. KC getting rolled @home by Duh Raiduhs.. [&:] Mahomie getting pummeled, constantly hit and hurried. Has thrown very few passes in rhythm and repeatedly forced to move and adjust. Raiders D swarming, smothering, gang tackling, tfls, pds, hurries, absolutely a joy to watch if you love defense. Like a 70s game; Pachinko even had his helmet ripped off. Chiefs absolutely bullied and humiliated at home on Christmas.

jbusse -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/25/2023 3:18:43 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen During the offseason the regime signed Oliver and Mattison in a concentrated effort to improve a running game that averaged 4.1 ypc. As this season winds down, we are at 3.9 ypc (tied for 23rd-25th). All in all, that's an epic fail. We need better blockers and a better RB. Can't fault the defense for much as Flores held it together for much of the season until DCs figured out how to expose it. Continued smoke and mirrors won't hide the need for more talented players, especially at CB and DE/Edge. QB, CB, IOL, DE, RB. Another offseason with a long list of needs. Failings of this sort point directly to the GM. The 49ers have a guy who played in the NFL for 15 years calling the shots, and we have what?

odin -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/25/2023 3:28:27 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Daniel Lee Young As I watched the game.. And you have to remember.. in 1970.. I might have seen about a dozen games. On tv, since the start of the ‘67 season.. mostly in CR, after we moved there in February of 68.. I read Sunday sports sections and articles and poured over box scores like my life depended on it. The games I watched, I learned names, .. tinglehoff, yary, Kapp, talk of how Tark got traded..the Original PPE… Alan Paige was my idol.. people said Joe was a tough guy,a win at any cost player.. But it was my barely 12, wanna be teenager impression that he was intentionally throwing the game with bad throws, sloppy execution of the Almighty Bud (grey up championship) Grant’s game plan.. watching that game, after watching them waltz through the playoffs, was like watching a team that was being paid to lose. They were heavy favorites. I spent the second half of that game pleading, begging, raging at the offense to do something.. At the end of the game, I went to my room and sulked for hours, I caught sooo much flack at school.. because I had been so openly biased that Len Dawson and the Chiefs were going to get crushed nay, even shut out, by the best defense in the league. As I watched the game, I couldn’t believe how inaccurate the throws were… Nothing was working.. Running, which was Bud Grant’s trademark of offense, was stuffed over and over.. I blamed Kapp for every bad play, every overthrow or off target throw.. I thought he was trying to lose because in my mind, he was selling out to “ Vegas”… Rumors about the game being thrown were the only explanation I could find for the teams performance that day.. I have gone back and rewatched that game any number of times.. the quality of the old film to video to digital is shitty at best.. I think it may have had more to do with raging tween anger emotions than actual “ thrown” game, but i never got over it.. And being the Last team to win the NFL championship, before the merger, made it fester all the more over the decades… } Almost { ,,, year after year, decade after decade… and now.. to see people fawning over “ coulda woulda shoulda” and the mediocrity of KFC and the gutless offense of KOC and the inevitable meltdown under the pressure to “ save the win” by the defense …. I’m worn the **** out… I want something like 98.. when we had the best team in the league, but then, when it mattered, Green put his balls in his clutch purse and pranced into overtime with a beat up defense that had just let Atlanta march down the field after “ the miss” .. to tie the game. I knew then, that my fandom was cursed.. and I will, like many we all have known and lost, probably go to our graves with that bitter, bitter taste of “ALMOST”…. Thanks Dan, you've gone through even more than I have as a fan. I remember there were rumblings that Kapp threw the game as part of a contract dispute. Wasn't the field in shitty condition as well ( seems like we've always had the worst equipmentmanagers as well as the worst clock management imaginable)? I was like you regarding the box scores and stats. I used to try to get ahold of the GF Herald's sport section before my dad and developed considerable mental math skills as a result. My dad liked to have me say what the total was going to be to the clerk when we were checking out at the grocery store. I learned to do calendar calculations at the age of 60 for "fun", after seeing it done on YouTube and because it's handy to not have to look up dates.

TJSweens -> RE: General Vikes Talk (12/25/2023 6:36:05 PM)
We lost Super Bowl IV because Hank Stram took Bud Grant to school pure and simple. Grant was unable to make any in game adjustments. The idea that Kapp threw the game is bs. He was a 50% passer that year, so he threw plenty of errant passes. The truth is KC was bigger, more athletic and better coached.

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