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Trekgeekscott -> RE: General Vikes Talk (9/11/2023 12:03:23 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: beo quote: ORIGINAL: ronhextall If you want to trade JJ for a shot at moving to the top spot for Caleb Williams I think you will need Mahomes, Burrow, Herbert, or Lawerence to blow their knee out very soon and have an awful year. Outside of those 4 guys I think anybody else would keep the pick and draft Williams I think yesterday was a must win (as silly as it sounds). Detroit beats KC and Vikings lose to Tampa is a 2 game flip from what I assumed would happen. Williams won't be the only QB in the draft next year that could turn out to be very good. Early returns are that it is a very talented college group of QBs this year. Which means we shouldn't have to trade JJ to get one of them.

Trekgeekscott -> RE: General Vikes Talk (9/11/2023 12:04:30 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Jeff Jesser It's not "one loss". Is the same exact issues we've been yelling about for years. You keep beating your head against that wall. At some point you may be right, the wall might move out of your way. Not one team in the NFL is throwing their season in the toilet after losing week one. Not one. We shouldn't either.

Richard Neussendorfer -> RE: General Vikes Talk (9/11/2023 12:05:55 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Trekgeekscott quote: ORIGINAL: Jeff Jesser It's not "one loss". Is the same exact issues we've been yelling about for years. You keep beating your head against that wall. At some point you may be right, the wall might move out of your way. Not one team in the NFL is throwing their season in the toilet after losing week one. Not one. We shouldn't either. I'll say this. If they get pummeled on Thursday things will probably unravel quickly. Feels like we gotta be at least competitive in this one.

Bill Johanesen -> RE: General Vikes Talk (9/11/2023 12:06:25 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Trekgeekscott quote: ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen quote: ORIGINAL: Trekgeekscott JJ is here at least the next few years. This year. Next year on 5th year option and then we can franchise him two more years after that. Why on Earth would anybody actively shop him unless he is totally disgruntled, which he isn't? Yes, the idea would be to try to get a king's ransom. quote: Except no one would give us what he is truly worth. No good player would ever want to sign here again either if that's how you treat your best player. If we were to try to trade him now, everyone would assume primmadonna and not give us what he is truly worth. and then all you super, exceptional, highly critical GM wannabes would criticize KAM for what he got. quote: No, you build around a QB. You build around TALENT. JJ would make any young QB look better. without him, a rookie would probably look like a wasted pick. quote: Franchise him for two more years after no extension? History shows players become disgruntled very quick at the first sign of the franchise tag option. I only point this out because we are in no rush to get him signed. we have options...we can build around him and if a good well Established QB comes available, JJ would make this a VERY enticing place to move to. quote: And the Ponder pick has nothing to do with the 2024 draft regardless of how many times it is repeated. The point you are ignoring is that if we are trading JJ to get a QB we may end up with a terrible reach like Ponder. And the way some of you guys are talking about KAM, He wont be able to make the right pick. It never fails....Teams get a really good player and someone always pipes in saying "WE SHOULD TRADE HIM FOR PICKS" At some point you need to keep your great players and stop trading them away or letting them go. IT'S ONE LOSS PEOPLE....LET'S NOT PULL THE PLUG ON OUR SEASON JUST YET Hey, you brought up the king's ransom. Outside of a couple of anomalies, you need a QB to build a successful team. A QB, not a WR. There you go with Ponder again. You do know that GM that drafted him is not even here right? And you can repeat that we might swing and miss but that doesn't make it so because we could hit on the pick. I'm not advocating JJ be traded, but your reasoning is flawed.

Jeff Jesser -> RE: General Vikes Talk (9/11/2023 12:08:33 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: beo quote: ORIGINAL: ronhextall If you want to trade JJ for a shot at moving to the top spot for Caleb Williams I think you will need Mahomes, Burrow, Herbert, or Lawerence to blow their knee out very soon and have an awful year. Outside of those 4 guys I think anybody else would keep the pick and draft Williams I think yesterday was a must win (as silly as it sounds). Detroit beats KC and Vikings lose to Tampa is a 2 game flip from what I assumed would happen. Williams won't be the only QB in the draft next year that could turn out to be very good. Early returns are that it is a very talented college group of QBs this year. Agree. I watched a lot of CFB the past 2 weekends and have been really impressed. There are the familar names but even DJU/Oregon State impressed the heck out of me

Bill Johanesen -> RE: General Vikes Talk (9/11/2023 12:10:58 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: beo quote: ORIGINAL: ronhextall If you want to trade JJ for a shot at moving to the top spot for Caleb Williams I think you will need Mahomes, Burrow, Herbert, or Lawerence to blow their knee out very soon and have an awful year. Outside of those 4 guys I think anybody else would keep the pick and draft Williams I think yesterday was a must win (as silly as it sounds). Detroit beats KC and Vikings lose to Tampa is a 2 game flip from what I assumed would happen. Williams won't be the only QB in the draft next year that could turn out to be very good. Early returns are that it is a very talented college group of QBs this year. I posted a month ago the regime needs to triple their scouting effort and focus on QB. I'm 100% sure our first pick will be a QB, and he will be throwing to JJ & Co.

thebigo -> RE: General Vikes Talk (9/11/2023 12:28:57 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer quote: ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen quote: ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer quote: ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer quote: ORIGINAL: Jeff Jesser quote: ORIGINAL: Trekgeekscott quote: ORIGINAL: Mark C. Johnson Hi Talkvikes crew. Thought I'd chime in some this year. Hope that's okay! Yes, you could end up with a Mahomes or a Mayfield. Does that mean you don't draft a QB high in the first round? Of course not. The question seems to be should the team trade JJ to acquire picks and take a shot at one of the top QB's next draft? JJ is the most gifted receiver in the NFL, no question. He'll cost a fortune to sign to his next contract. We've had Moss, Carter, Diggs and now Jefferson to name a few of the standout receivers the team has had. Zero Super Bowl appearances with any of them. Their fault? No, of course not. I'd trade JJ at the end of the season IF I determined that the overall talent on the roster is not capable of making it to the Super Bowl. Having the best receiver in the NFL doesn't matter if the team overall isn't good enough to make it to the Super Bowl. Bottom line...would you rather have the best receiver in football or a true star at QB? Giving up JJ would be a very hard decision. Obviously, you could screw up the draft and get another Ponder, but you could also get the next great QB. Wow We lost ONE game and now the calls to trade JJ are surfacing. He is one of the top 5 players in the NFL. You don't trade talent like that unless you get a king's ransom. You don't actively shop them either. You build around them. He is ESTABLISHED talent. He has ESTABLISHED himself as one of the best in the game. You don't trade them for the crapshoot that a draftpick can be. JJ is here at least the next few years. This year. Next year on 5th year option and then we can franchise him two more years after that. Why on Earth would anybody actively shop him unless he is totally disgruntled, which he isn't? In fairness the question of trading JJ for multiple #1's has been around for a while. The idea is give Hou/AZ (or whomever) multiple 1's to get the #1 overall and taking William's. I'm not advocating it but I see the logic. If they keep playing the way they did this week they may not have to trade much. 9/150....wth are you talking about? JJ made plays all over the field against a top secondary. Do you even know what you are saying? Then they moved coverage to JJ and Addison and KJ made plays....that is the way it works. You certainly don't have your facts straight. Addison and KJ did NOT make plays during the second half in which JJ was invisible. Addison had one catch, no scores. KJ had one catch, no scores. True we didn't have the ball but 3 times after half time (I forgot about that)....so the adjustments were earlier. The passes went to Addison, TJ, KJ, Mattison, and even Oliver as adjustments starting in the 2nd quarter. I suspect that our adjustments were more Tampa Bay's defense adjustments in the second half

Tom Sykes -> RE: General Vikes Talk (9/11/2023 1:25:39 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen quote: ORIGINAL: beo quote: ORIGINAL: ronhextall If you want to trade JJ for a shot at moving to the top spot for Caleb Williams I think you will need Mahomes, Burrow, Herbert, or Lawerence to blow their knee out very soon and have an awful year. Outside of those 4 guys I think anybody else would keep the pick and draft Williams I think yesterday was a must win (as silly as it sounds). Detroit beats KC and Vikings lose to Tampa is a 2 game flip from what I assumed would happen. Williams won't be the only QB in the draft next year that could turn out to be very good. Early returns are that it is a very talented college group of QBs this year. I posted a month ago the regime needs to triple their scouting effort and focus on QB. I'm 100% sure our first pick will be a QB, and he will be throwing to JJ & Co. I can't wait to throw it in your face when we draft TE! I'm bookmarking your post.

Ricky J -> RE: General Vikes Talk (9/11/2023 1:27:52 PM)
Vikings had the ball for just under 10 min in the 2nd half. Ouch! 3 drives. The 20 play 76 yarder for a TD was nice but the next two were almost identically sad : minus yds pass play, dink/dunk, incomplete short ... kiind of hard for JJ or anyone else to go off in that environment No doubt the interception by the goal line makes it a whole different game before the half, but you'll have that every game (see #19)

Bill Johanesen -> RE: General Vikes Talk (9/11/2023 2:30:59 PM)
Was expecting more out of the running game. Philly's DL is likely to annihilate our IOL.

Phil Riewer -> RE: General Vikes Talk (9/11/2023 2:42:51 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen quote: ORIGINAL: beo quote: ORIGINAL: ronhextall If you want to trade JJ for a shot at moving to the top spot for Caleb Williams I think you will need Mahomes, Burrow, Herbert, or Lawerence to blow their knee out very soon and have an awful year. Outside of those 4 guys I think anybody else would keep the pick and draft Williams I think yesterday was a must win (as silly as it sounds). Detroit beats KC and Vikings lose to Tampa is a 2 game flip from what I assumed would happen. Williams won't be the only QB in the draft next year that could turn out to be very good. Early returns are that it is a very talented college group of QBs this year. I posted a month ago the regime needs to triple their scouting effort and focus on QB. I'm 100% sure our first pick will be a QB, and he will be throwing to JJ & Co. They say there are 6 QBs worth picking next year...

Tom Sykes -> RE: General Vikes Talk (9/11/2023 2:53:43 PM)
https://twitter.com/DaneMizutani/status/1701311048832229848 Not only did Ingram cause the fumble, not only did Ingram not block the NT, not only did Ingram follow Schlottmann out of the play ... and get knocked back into the backfield ... I could keep going but I'll leave it there.

Tom Sykes -> RE: General Vikes Talk (9/11/2023 3:04:04 PM)
Oh and ... not only did Ingram also kick the football after knocking out of KCs hands ... Exhausted. now I'm done.

Bill Johanesen -> RE: General Vikes Talk (9/11/2023 3:15:31 PM)
In other news, Stroud's first NFL pass was a completion to himself.

stfrank -> RE: General Vikes Talk (9/11/2023 3:15:43 PM)
All of this worry about getting a QB other than Cousins..... In my opinion we can draft or trade for a middle of the road QB and it won't really matter much since anybody we have will still get their asses kicked until something is done at the center and guard positions. I am getting tired of watching our team get pushed all over the field every Sunday. When are the Wilf's going to get tired of that too? First it was Spielman continually waiting until the 4th of 5th round thinking he was going to find another Matt Birk and now we have a commodities trader that has no clue. Do we even have a scouting department or is it really Mark Wilf watching clips on YouTube?

Mark C. Johnson -> RE: General Vikes Talk (9/11/2023 3:53:23 PM)
Me to. Does anyone on this site actually strongly believe that this Vikings team can win the Super Bowl? I don't so I can't get too upset when they fail. My biggest concern is Kwesi because he will be in charge of selecting the next QB and I for one have zero idea what his plan is in that regard.

Mark C. Johnson -> RE: General Vikes Talk (9/11/2023 3:56:01 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Trekgeekscott quote: ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer quote: ORIGINAL: Trekgeekscott quote: ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer quote: ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer quote: ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer quote: ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H quote: ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer Jordan Love looks more composed than Cousins ever has Very true I don't know about that....Kirk had a RG knock the ball out of his hands and a WR hand a CB the football at the goal line. He shredded TB for over 400 yards passing and they have a very good defense. The worst thing he did is not move protection over on Winfield sack/fumble. For shredding a defense he sure did have a lot of 3 and outs. You're still fooled by the few plays a game I see. How do you rate the TB defense Richard? He threw for over 400 yards. I saw about 5 remarkable throws....the throw to KJ was a good one two that was a little late and KJ should have held on. Look at the tape on the throw to Addison for the TD and 3 of the throws to JJ that were in coverage. Who cares about yards. I'll agree the Osborn play wasn't all on him. There's always an excuse though. Obviously our top 5 wr room needs to work too. This team will struggle to ever have a comfortable win until we get a real qb in here that doesn't crap his pants under pressure. Just my opinion. No I'm not letting the interior line off the hook either. There is no such thing as a QB that doesn't crap his pants under pressure. Tom Brady did it. And he's the GOAT False. Brady processed and got rid of the ball quickly usually. He could also maneuver and climb the pocket. Cousins has zero feel for those things but nice try. 19-0 going into the superbowl and he got totally flustered by the relentless pass rush the Giants sent against him that day. NOT FALSE. Brady won 7 Super Bowls. So, what you seem to be saying is that he wasn't perfect all the time just most of the time.

Phil Riewer -> RE: General Vikes Talk (9/11/2023 4:05:24 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Mark C. Johnson Me to. Does anyone on this site actually strongly believe that this Vikings team can win the Super Bowl? I don't so I can't get too upset when they fail. My biggest concern is Kwesi because he will be in charge of selecting the next QB and I for one have zero idea what his plan is in that regard. I don't think many believe that yet but they can always improve enough to make the playoffs then you never know. The worst thing you can do though is trade young talent and almost equally overpay to keep old talent. QB? You keep drafting at least one every year---doesn't matter the round. SF drafted one in the 7th and he was better than the 3rd pick in the draft.

Murph -> RE: General Vikes Talk (9/11/2023 4:56:05 PM)
I haven't been too excited about an upcoming season since KC's first year. Initially, I liked the signing. The extensions were beyond dumb though and we'll be paying for it, thanks to void years for seasons to come. I won't get too excited about again until: 1. We get a REAL GM, not a commodity trader. He is over his head with his unique draft charts to his talent misevaluations. I heard Flores was pounding the table at the draft for Blackmon, so that pick has a chance. 2. Kirk Cousins and over sized cap space hit are gone, on another team. We will never win a Super Bowl with KC and his cap hit. 3. O'Connell becomes a head coach or we find another. He needs to find someone else to call plays and focus on the 50,000 foot view along with the defense and special teams.

Phil Riewer -> RE: General Vikes Talk (9/11/2023 5:05:59 PM)
vikesinsider @vikesinsider · 4h Week 1 pass blocking grades: Ezra Cleveland: 84.8 Brian O'Neill: 81.5 Christian Darrisaw: 73.9 Austin Schlottmann: 66.9 Ed Ingram: 40.3 Risner wants to come here....Week 1 gone.....lets sign him.

Phil Riewer -> RE: General Vikes Talk (9/11/2023 5:13:34 PM)
Adam Schefter @AdamSchefter · 40m Current scene at MetLife, where a shelter-in-place warning is now in effect. No players or personnel are being allowed on the field.

Phil Riewer -> RE: General Vikes Talk (9/11/2023 5:14:22 PM)
Adam Schefter @AdamSchefter · 1h Chris Jones still has one year left on his deal with the Chiefs, no new years were added to his contract, but he received multiple incentives to earn considerably more money this season, per sources. KC fixed one of their issues; our turn to get Risner in.

David Levine -> RE: General Vikes Talk (9/11/2023 5:47:18 PM)
Dalton Risner is ready to join the Vikings if he gets the call. The 28-year-old guard, who remains a free agent, made that very clear on Sunday. He replied to a bunch of tweets from Vikings fans who were frustrated with their interior offensive line's performance in the season-opening loss to the Buccaneers. https://www.si.com/nfl/vikings/news/dalton-risner-ready-join-vikings-if-they-give-him-a-call

Kurt B -> RE: General Vikes Talk (9/11/2023 6:53:21 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: David Levine Dalton Risner is ready to join the Vikings if he gets the call. The 28-year-old guard, who remains a free agent, made that very clear on Sunday. He replied to a bunch of tweets from Vikings fans who were frustrated with their interior offensive line's performance in the season-opening loss to the Buccaneers. https://www.si.com/nfl/vikings/news/dalton-risner-ready-join-vikings-if-they-give-him-a-call Evidently Kwesi is good with 20 straight games of incompetence at RG.

TJSweens -> RE: General Vikes Talk (9/11/2023 7:20:30 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kurt B quote: ORIGINAL: David Levine Dalton Risner is ready to join the Vikings if he gets the call. The 28-year-old guard, who remains a free agent, made that very clear on Sunday. He replied to a bunch of tweets from Vikings fans who were frustrated with their interior offensive line's performance in the season-opening loss to the Buccaneers. https://www.si.com/nfl/vikings/news/dalton-risner-ready-join-vikings-if-they-give-him-a-call Evidently Kwesi is good with 20 straight games of incompetence at RG. Ingram is coming up with new ways to suck. I've been watching the Vikings since 1968. In 55 years of following the NFL, yesterday was the first time I've ever seen a guard punch the ball out on the center / qb exchange. Please sign Risner.

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