RE:Mike Vick case (Full Version)

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John Childress -> RE:Mike Vick case (8/24/2007 9:42:09 PM)

[quote="Duane Sampson"]The plea agree agreement is between the prosecutor and the defense lawyer. The judge can sentence him any way he wants to.[/quote]But if he doesn't admit to gambling then that will give Goodell some wiggle room. As for the NAACP, I really wish the media would stop quoting them like they are the official representatives of Black thought. It is 2007 and the time has past for any one organization or person to be held up as a spokesperson for an entire race of people.



Jeff Jesser -> RE:Mike Vick case (8/24/2007 10:03:11 PM)

I don't know the guy because I didn't see the speech but I'll assume he's black (head of the NAACP). I don't care if the dude's green, that's really a weak retort to MV killed dogs.



Lynn G. -> RE:Mike Vick case (8/24/2007 10:07:50 PM)

quote:

"It's real clear that Mr. Vick himself would acknowledge that he has made a mistake,"
I might be inclined to disagree with this inane statement. The guy has been saying all along "I didn't do anything wrong. I'll be cleared of these charges."



Todd M -> RE:Mike Vick case (8/25/2007 12:36:41 AM)

VICK ADMITS EVERYTHING We've reviewed in detail the plea agreement signed by Michael Vick on Thursday, along with the statement of facts. Notwithstanding the anonymous source who told the anonymous reporter at ESPN that Vick would not admit to killing dogs or to gambling, Vick admits to everything. In paragraph 1, Vick pleads guilty to conspiracy to establish, maintain, etc. an interstate gambling enterprise and conspiracy to engage in interstate dog fighting. In paragraph 2, Vick admits that the Surry County property to which he initially said he never goes was the main staging area for housing and training pit bulls for fighting. In paragraph 3, Vick admits to being involved in dog fights at the Surry County property, and to participating in dog fights in other states. In paragraph 4, Vick admits that the enterprise involved gambling activities in violation of Virginia law. Vick denies that he placed side bets on any fights, or that he received process from the purses. (However, he admits that he was the primary source of funds for the operation. If the winnings went only to his co-defendants, then that's less money Vick had to give them to get them to continue to tend to the operation while he was "at work" for the Atlanta Falcons.) In paragraph 9, Vick admits that he began acquiring dogs for the operation in "2001-2002," and that the "Bad Newz Kennels" were established in 2002. In paragraph 12, Vick admits that he knew the other defendants "killed a number of dogs" that did not perform well in testing sessions in 2002. Vick denies killing any dogs at that time. In paragraph 32, Vick admits that in April 2007 -- the same month in which he say face-to-face with NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell and denied that dog fighting was occurring on his land -- he agreed with Purnell Peace and Quanis Phillips to kill six-to-eight dogs that did not perform well in testing sessions. Here's the key passage: "[A]ll of those dogs were killed by various methods, including hanging and drowning. VICK agrees and stipulates that these dogs all died as a result of the collective efforts of PEACE, PHILLIPS, and VICK." Case closed. He admits to gambling, and he admits to killing dogs. Someone at ESPN has some serious explaining to do. That's good enough for me. Vick will serve whatever time dictated by the judge. I hope it's fair. I should have bet Jesser some beer on this at the beginning. If Vick helps stop a number of dog fighting rings by ratting out some people that is worth more to me than any arbitrary jail sentence. My only wish now would be if there was some way to weed through all the pit bulls seized in this and any pending cases to see if any can be rehabilitated. There has to be a handful that can live out there days in the proper environment.



El Duderino -> RE:Mike Vick case (8/25/2007 1:42:05 AM)

NFL Suspends Vick Indefinitely



Kurtis -> RE:Mike Vick case (8/25/2007 3:38:23 AM)

Wow. I support the NFL's decision, but I'm really disappointed in Vick. Awesome player. Lousy representation of human being.



Jeff Jesser -> RE:Mike Vick case (8/25/2007 3:59:31 AM)

If Vick helps stop a number of dog fighting rings by ratting out some people that is worth more to me than any arbitrary jail sentence. I hate to even type this but I believe it's too late. They had to be claimed by today before they were put down, I think.



Guest -> RE:Mike Vick case (8/25/2007 4:20:36 AM)

[quote="John Childress"][quote="Duane Sampson"]The plea agree agreement is between the prosecutor and the defense lawyer. The judge can sentence him any way he wants to.[/quote]But if he doesn't admit to gambling then that will give Goodell some wiggle room. As for the NAACP, I really wish the media would stop quoting them like they are the official representatives of Black thought. It is 2007 and the time has past for any one organization or person to be held up as a spokesperson for an entire race of people.[/quote] Amen John!! :nodding:



Guest -> RE:Mike Vick case (8/25/2007 4:29:15 AM)

[quote="Lynn Garthwaite"]
quote:

"It's real clear that Mr. Vick himself would acknowledge that he has made a mistake,"
I might be inclined to disagree with this inane statement. The guy has been saying all along "I didn't do anything wrong. I'll be cleared of these charges." Totally agree Lynn! Making a mistake is something truly accidental or without much thought. What Vick did was intentional an only for his sick and disgusting personal gratification of dog misery. I hope he is out of the NFL for at least FIVE YEARS-sick, lying dog killer!



Guest -> RE:Mike Vick case (8/25/2007 5:33:47 AM)

One more thing... Listening to now EX team-mates of Vick is actually quite sickening. The general attitude is, "Well, the guy is feeling pretty bad right now and he needs our support, let's forgive and move on". Basically this seems to sum up the feelings toward Vick. Blah, blah, blah. Sorry, this doesn't fly with me. Do the crime, do the time and THEN WE CAN MOVE ON.



Guest -> RE:Mike Vick case (8/25/2007 6:10:57 AM)

[quote="Purpleporter"]One more thing... Listening to now EX team-mates of Vick is actually quite sickening. The general attitude is, "Well, the guy is feeling pretty bad right now and he needs our support, let's forgive and move on". Basically this seems to sum up the feelings toward Vick. Blah, blah, blah. Sorry, this doesn't fly with me. Do the crime, do the time and THEN WE CAN MOVE ON.[/quote] ********************************************************** I don't think that is very accurate. Vick has had more than 100 former team mates, and I have only heard three of them attempting to come to his defense. I think it's pretty clear what the general attitude about him is.



Easy E -> RE:Mike Vick case (8/25/2007 7:49:09 PM)

So I've posted a lot about this case, and I still do believe that animal cruelty, because it's a hot topic right now, is getting more attention than many other cruel things in our society, from date rape, domestic abuse, pedaphelia, drunk driving, etc, it doesn't mean I think it's right. As I said, I have donated money to organizations, get all my pets from either people who don't want them or the humane society, and grew up on a farm raising and loving pretty much every animal you can think of. People here have strong feelings about it, so most are probably already doing something about it, but here's a great link on animal cruelty that will allow you to follow cases, and they can use help. So if Vick bothers you, start helping out someway. Donations are important, just don't forget those other causes. http://www.pet-abuse.com/pages/home.php BTW - Scott, I haven't written the NFL commisioner about punishing Leonard Little, but I have written my state representatives. I believe that when we look to professional sports entities to lead the way on societal issues, we're in big trouble. If society itself isn't able to punish someone enough, then that needs to be changed. I'm fine with the NFL banning players, btw, I just care more that the legal system can treat them as they should be.



Easy E -> RE:Mike Vick case (8/25/2007 7:58:18 PM)

[quote="Purpleporter"]One more thing... Listening to now EX team-mates of Vick is actually quite sickening. The general attitude is, "Well, the guy is feeling pretty bad right now and he needs our support, let's forgive and move on". Basically this seems to sum up the feelings toward Vick. Blah, blah, blah. Sorry, this doesn't fly with me. Do the crime, do the time and THEN WE CAN MOVE ON.[/quote] I don't think that it's the "general feeling" towards him, I think the general feeling is that he should go to jail and his life should be over. However, the simple truth is that even those that kill people have families and close friends. If you've ever know someone who did something you never thought they would, you know the confliction that can happen. It's not unusual for close friends and family to want to forgive quicker, mostly because they have seen many good things from that person, and the bad things doesn't even seem possible.



Guest -> RE:Mike Vick case (8/25/2007 8:25:47 PM)

[quote="Pete C"][quote="Purpleporter"]One more thing... Listening to now EX team-mates of Vick is actually quite sickening. The general attitude is, "Well, the guy is feeling pretty bad right now and he needs our support, let's forgive and move on". Basically this seems to sum up the feelings toward Vick. Blah, blah, blah. Sorry, this doesn't fly with me. Do the crime, do the time and THEN WE CAN MOVE ON.[/quote] ********************************************************** I don't think that is very accurate. Vick has had more than 100 former team mates, and I have only heard three of them attempting to come to his defense. I think it's pretty clear what the general attitude about him is.[/quote] Three for three is more than "general". Just because the rest may be silent or you have yet to hear from them does not take away from my statement. The man first LIES about the case and NOW wants us to move on. Sorry Vick! Pay your dues and MAYBE you can come back to a game that pays you more than you are worth. How sick is this world when the NCAAP calls for the firing of Imus for some racial slurs and then wants Vick to someday return after the murder and brutality of several countless defenseless animals. What a sick and twisted world we do live in.



Jeff Jesser -> RE:Mike Vick case (8/26/2007 4:04:38 AM)

Too much social preasure for the ones who think he should "fry" to come out and say it Judi. It's too bad, but IMO they remain silent because, theoritically, they pretty much have too. Vick was a team leader, and I'm sure he was loved by his boys. To come out against him would alienate that person.



John Childress -> RE:Mike Vick case (8/26/2007 3:43:48 PM)

[quote="Purpleporter"][quote="Pete C"][quote="Purpleporter"]One more thing... Listening to now EX team-mates of Vick is actually quite sickening. The general attitude is, "Well, the guy is feeling pretty bad right now and he needs our support, let's forgive and move on". Basically this seems to sum up the feelings toward Vick. Blah, blah, blah. Sorry, this doesn't fly with me. Do the crime, do the time and THEN WE CAN MOVE ON.[/quote] ********************************************************** I don't think that is very accurate. Vick has had more than 100 former team mates, and I have only heard three of them attempting to come to his defense. I think it's pretty clear what the general attitude about him is.[/quote] Three for three is more than "general". Just because the rest may be silent or you have yet to hear from them does not take away from my statement. The man first LIES about the case and NOW wants us to move on. Sorry Vick! Pay your dues and MAYBE you can come back to a game that pays you more than you are worth. How sick is this world when the NCAAP calls for the firing of Imus for some racial slurs and then wants Vick to someday return after the murder and brutality of several countless defenseless animals. What a sick and twisted world we do live in.[/quote]While I am always "against" comments like that from Imus, I wish the NAACP and the so-called civil rights leaders would spend a lot more time worrying about violence and bad schools in Black communities than when some drunk racist makes derogatory comments. 1. You are letting a powerless nitwit control your actions because you are just reactionary 2. It is not even close to the biggest issues hurting young Blacks - that is where their focus should rest 3. In a small way his comments actually help you because it reminds everyone that racism and ignorance are not dead and we, all Americans and all people, have a ways to go in learning tolerance and respect for other culture



Guest -> RE:Mike Vick case (8/26/2007 5:13:46 PM)

[quote="John Childress"]While I am always "against" comments like that from Imus, I wish the NAACP and the so-called civil rights leaders would spend a lot more time worrying about violence and bad schools in Black communities than when some drunk racist makes derogatory comments. 1. You are letting a powerless nitwit control your actions because you are just reactionary 2. It is not even close to the biggest issues hurting young Blacks - that is where their focus should rest 3. In a small way his comments actually help you because it reminds everyone that racism and ignorance are not dead and we, all Americans and all people, have a ways to go in learning tolerance and respect for other culture[/quote] Excellent John! I do agree with all your points, especially the bolded section.



Todd M -> RE:Mike Vick case (8/27/2007 2:22:25 PM)

There's no limit to people's ignorance it seems. A quick catch up on the Fanhouse: - "I gotta be strong for him," Brenda Vick sobbed, standing outside the handsome brick mansion her son bought for her in Suffolk, Va. "It is tough on everybody. They are trying to put my baby in jail, and for what?" "Everybody makes mistakes," she continued, only hours after her son filed his guilty plea Friday. "Everybody deserves a second chance. He has given his life over to God. He is not a criminal . . . He's a good person. He has a big heart, and it just hurts." - Now the writer Lawrence O'Donnell has come right out and asked it: What's wrong with what Michael Vick did?... I have no comprehension of what all the fuss is about. Most people who are upset about killing dogs or letting them attack each other have at some point in their lives caught a fish... Between bites at McDonald's today there will be a lot of outrage expressed about Michael Vick getting off easy. I won't understand a word of it. - "I love Vick," he said. "Everybody makes mistakes. The president of the United States made a mistake. To everybody that gets to see this: All y'all have made mistakes. Maybe not as big as this one. But we all make mistakes. "We all have grown to love Vick the football player. I still love Vick the football player. I love Vick the person. He made a mistake. I'm going to support him regardless. "And he will be back, man. You know he'll be back playing. He's one of the greatest athletes to ever play the game - ever. He'll be back, and he'll still be able to do the same things he's done on the field." ~ Chad Johnson of the Bengals Morons. All of them. Like Judi said. Where are the (what should be countless) remarks on how sick it is what Vick did from professional atheletes?



Guest -> RE:Mike Vick case (8/27/2007 4:54:50 PM)

[quote="Todd Mallett"]There's no limit to people's ignorance it seems. A quick catch up on the Fanhouse: - "I gotta be strong for him," Brenda Vick sobbed, standing outside the handsome brick mansion her son bought for her in Suffolk, Va. "It is tough on everybody. They are trying to put my baby in jail, and for what?" "Everybody makes mistakes," she continued, only hours after her son filed his guilty plea Friday. "Everybody deserves a second chance. He has given his life over to God. He is not a criminal . . . He's a good person. He has a big heart, and it just hurts." - Now the writer Lawrence O'Donnell has come right out and asked it: What's wrong with what Michael Vick did?... I have no comprehension of what all the fuss is about. Most people who are upset about killing dogs or letting them attack each other have at some point in their lives caught a fish... Between bites at McDonald's today there will be a lot of outrage expressed about Michael Vick getting off easy. I won't understand a word of it. - "I love Vick," he said. "Everybody makes mistakes. The president of the United States made a mistake. To everybody that gets to see this: All y'all have made mistakes. Maybe not as big as this one. But we all make mistakes. "We all have grown to love Vick the football player. I still love Vick the football player. I love Vick the person. He made a mistake. I'm going to support him regardless. "And he will be back, man. You know he'll be back playing. He's one of the greatest athletes to ever play the game - ever. He'll be back, and he'll still be able to do the same things he's done on the field." ~ Chad Johnson of the Bengals Morons. All of them. Like Judi said. Where are the (what should be countless) remarks on how sick it is what Vick did from professional atheletes?[/quote] Wow Todd, this is actually no surprise. Like Jeff said earlier-They remain silent, because they have to. Silence doesn't mean they think what Vick did is wrong, it may mean that if they tell us how they REALLY FEEL, we would view them as idiotic and uncaring towards animals. Warren Moon had the best statements toward M. Vick- He feels bad for him, BUT he must do the time. Be a man.



Guest -> RE:Mike Vick case (8/27/2007 5:02:03 PM)

Also to that MORON who stated what Vick did was as others who go fishing... :roll: :shrug: :lol: :ohno: Yeah, sending pets to their death and making sure you torture relentlessly is akin to catching fish. :lol:



Duane Sampson -> RE:Mike Vick case (8/27/2007 7:16:52 PM)

-- Judge Accepts Vick's Guilty Plea -- Mon Aug 27, 2007 AP reports Atlanta Falcons QB Michael Vick apologized to the NFL and his teammates Monday for "using bad judgment and making bad decisions" and vowed to redeem himself of charges in a dogfighting case. Shortly before making his first public statements, the star quarterback pleaded guilty to a federal dogfighting charge and awaited a Dec. 10 sentencing date that likely will send him to prison. "First I want to apologize for all the things that I've done and that I have allowed to happen," Vick said at a news conference following his appearance in U.S. District Court. "I made a mistake in using bad judgment and making bad decisions," he said. "Dogfighting is a terrible thing." He concluded by saying, "I offer my deepest apologies to everyone. And I will redeem myself. I have to."



Duane Sampson -> RE:Mike Vick case (8/27/2007 7:18:15 PM)

Dog fighting is a terrible thing. Sounds like that chick TO had for a press agent wrote this. :lol:



Lynn G. -> RE:Mike Vick case (8/27/2007 7:32:12 PM)

Yeah - he should have added "I have 130 million reasons to make amends for this."



Easy E -> RE:Mike Vick case (8/27/2007 11:32:16 PM)

Gotta love the ESPN. They were doing their round table this morning, talking about how Vick needs to apologize and own up to it, that we're a forgiving society, if he just takes responsibility, etc. Then the host reads an email from someone. It asked "Would Michael Vick have been better off killing a person, or just saying he was drunk when he did it? Jayson Williams shot and killed someone, and Leonard Little drove drunk and killed someone, and they're both free men walking around?" So the host says, what does this say about our society, and would Vick have been better off killing someone drunk? The panelists stare dumbly at one another, then one of them says "Well, it is hard to ignore those things...." The others nod and harrumph, and then they go right back to ignoring it. Total time spent thinking about the subject was maybe 10 seconds. Sad.



Guest -> RE:Mike Vick case (8/28/2007 1:07:38 AM)

is it over yet, have we all vented all our bile and brilliant observations on another "celebrity" FUBAR?. :bang: :shrug: :yawn:



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