RE: MLB General Information PT 4

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Dave E -> RE: MLB General Information PT 4 (2/14/2014 4:44:34 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: CPAMAN quote: ORIGINAL: Mr. Ed RIP Jim Fregosi One of the old Angels players who actually was half-way decent. He could not have been that old. Maybe early 70's? 71, I think.

Steve Lentz -> RE: MLB General Information PT 4 (2/14/2014 5:45:57 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ewen21 quote: ORIGINAL: Black 47 quote: ORIGINAL: SoMnFan I'd rather have Jeter as my shortstop, captain and leadoff hitter than Almost anyone And certainly most on that "list" He was, is, and always will be a WINNER I'm sure he has a horrible WAR number In fact, I HOPE he does. Could not agree more. Good luck explaining that to the saber-twats. I've always just laughed at idiot Minneaotan's booing guys like Jeter and AJ. So clueless and ignorant. The same idiot fans who a few years ago couldn't stop patting themselves on the back for giving Zumaya a standing ovation when he broke his arm. It's not Jeter's fault 90% of New Yorkers are assholes. I think a lot of the Jeter hate has to do with that. Jeter and AJ have completely different personalities. They are both competitive proven winners, but one is a HOF player that was booed for different reasons than the other.

SoMnFan -> RE: MLB General Information PT 4 (2/15/2014 12:31:31 AM)
Never understood either of those boo targets.

Black 47 -> RE: MLB General Information PT 4 (2/15/2014 11:31:58 AM)
Steve Lentz, You are correct. But my point was neither deserved to be boo'd, and it just shows how ignorant twins fans have become.

CPAMAN -> RE: MLB General Information PT 4 (2/15/2014 12:49:19 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SoMnFan Never understood either of those boo targets. IMO, the reason the MN sheople pick a couple of targeted players to boo is because they refuse to do it with their own players. They have to get it out of their system so they have a few non-Twins players that have a scarlet letter on their uniform.

twinsfan -> RE: MLB General Information PT 4 (2/16/2014 12:13:38 AM)
MLB Network named Jim Palmer the #1 pitcher of the '70s. That doesn't sound right to me. Tom Seaver is the first name that comes to mind. Steve Carlton and Ferguson Jenkins also are more deserving, I think. Although Jenkins "loses" some of his best years to the late 60s. Finally, if Blyleven had played for better teams and bigger markets, I think he is right there with Palmer. I wouldn't make a huge argument for Nolan Ryan, but he's in the discussion as well. Maybe Seaver lost out because 1969 was not in the 70s. I still take Seaver over Palmer.

Black 47 -> RE: MLB General Information PT 4 (2/16/2014 8:58:24 AM)
The 70's, 80's, and pre-strike 90's was a wonderful era of baseball, with the exception of domed stadiums being introduced. Post strike the game has been ruined by Selig, greed, and PED's. Baseball may be more profitable than it ever was, but the game has taken a step back. I can't stand when people defend the state of the game solely because it's popularity and profitability is at an all-time high. The game is a shell of it's former self.

Dave E -> RE: MLB General Information PT 4 (2/16/2014 10:11:43 AM)
That is completely and totally bonkers.

Black 47 -> RE: MLB General Information PT 4 (2/16/2014 10:26:57 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Dave E That is completely and totally bonkers. Money ruined the game. Interleague play ruined the game. Nineteen games a season against division opponents ruined the game. Nineteen! Steroids killed the game. Expansion killed the game. This mass marketing of the game to the casual fan killed the game. People don't go to the ballpark for the game. They go for the show.They go to get drunk and stuff their face. Promotions and blaring music has virtually replaced the organ. Nothing bonkers about this take.

Stacey King -> RE: MLB General Information PT 4 (2/16/2014 10:32:33 AM)
Ryan Dempster posted a disappointing 4.57 ERA in 171 1/3 innings last summer for the Red Sox and did not get a postseason start, but he was still expected to open the 2014 campaign in Boston’s rotation. That is no longer going to happen. According to FOX Sports’ Ken Rosenthal, the veteran right-hander announced Sunday that he will not pitch this season due to “physical reasons and his desire to spend more time with his kids.” “I don’t feel like I am capable of performing to the ability and standard that I am accustomed to,” Dempster told Rosenthal. “I feel it’s in the best interest of both the club but most importantly myself to step away from playing baseball at this time. The time is right. I’m not saying retirement but I definitely won’t be playing this season.” Dempster signed a two-year, $26.5 million free agent contract with the Red Sox last winter. He’ll be placed on the restricted list and won’t get the $13.25 million salary that he stood to earn in 2014.

Dave E -> RE: MLB General Information PT 4 (2/16/2014 10:39:43 AM)
Money ruined the game: I don't understand this argument at all Interleague ruined the game: I'm personally not a huge fan, but these games sell out routinely. We might not like it, but it has been enormously popular. Nineteen games agianst divisional opponents: yeah, this generally sucks. Steriods ruined the game: laughable. PEDs have long been a part of the game; and Sosa/McGwire was one of the most compelling things in baseball. Several people on this board -- including me -- came back to the game after the strike because of those two. Also, steroids were not the only cause of increased offense. People don't go to the ballpark for the game: not what I see at all. Sure, ballparks have more amenities. Nothing wrong with that. The Dome did not enhance the baseball watching experience, nor did the awful cookie cutter stadiums (STL/PITT/PHIL/CINC/BALT), if you were ever at one. Way too much astroturf, bad sight angles, etc. Those detract from the game. Now you can go to a stadium like TF and watch a ballgame with an extraordinary backdrop -- it's like I always imagined baseball was in the "old" days (although it wasn't nearly this comfortable or enjoyable). On top of that... The wildcard games have improved the playoffs. I was initially against it, but it has made the postseason much more exciting. The internet has completely changed the way you can understand the game. You can get any type of baseball analysis you want at your fingertips. Want a boxscore from a game from 50 years ago? No problem. Want to watch replays at the game on your phone? Done. Want to watch a baseball game on your phone wherever you are? You can do it. Got cable at home? You can see every single game of your team. Music v. organ, that's a personal opinion which you are certainly entitled to. Some of the music sucks at TF, sure, but I wouldn't change it for a 75% empty Dome with organ music. No, the game is simply amazing right now. I'm not a giant Selig fan by any stretch, but baseball is much better off than it was 20 years ago, and it isn't close.

Black 47 -> RE: MLB General Information PT 4 (2/16/2014 10:43:50 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Stacey King Ryan Dempster posted a disappointing 4.57 ERA in 171 1/3 innings last summer for the Red Sox and did not get a postseason start, but he was still expected to open the 2014 campaign in Boston’s rotation. That is no longer going to happen. According to FOX Sports’ Ken Rosenthal, the veteran right-hander announced Sunday that he will not pitch this season due to “physical reasons and his desire to spend more time with his kids.” “I don’t feel like I am capable of performing to the ability and standard that I am accustomed to,” Dempster told Rosenthal. “I feel it’s in the best interest of both the club but most importantly myself to step away from playing baseball at this time. The time is right. I’m not saying retirement but I definitely won’t be playing this season.” Dempster signed a two-year, $26.5 million free agent contract with the Red Sox last winter. He’ll be placed on the restricted list and won’t get the $13.25 million salary that he stood to earn in 2014. That's actually very admirable. I wonder what they'd give for Correia!

ewen21 -> RE: MLB General Information PT 4 (2/16/2014 10:50:00 AM)
The music at the ballpark is ridiculous. It's so damn loud and such a distraction. Give me an organ over that piped in nonsense. Screw the Kiss Cams and all the other gimmicky BS. Matter of fact, there are too many damn distractions and distracted people at the ballpark. People noodling around with handheld devices nonstop and what have you. It is thoroughly annoying. What ever happened to..... "I'll be at the ballgame today, catch you later"?? I guess that mentality is more of a societal thing but it certainly effects my time at the ballpark. The games are also far too long. So many meaningless substitutions because the game has become over specialized. Back in the day you could sit through a game watching it on the TV without it eating up almost four hours of your life. Interleague play is a huge pain in the ass as well. There are plenty of things that have diminished the entertainment value of the product.

Black 47 -> RE: MLB General Information PT 4 (2/16/2014 11:01:03 AM)
Interleague play and imbalanced schedule were implemented to make more money. Thats how money ruined the game. Just because it made the game more profitable doesn't mean it made the game better. MLB sold it's soul to the devil. There was a certain level of mystique, for lack of a better word, when the only times the leagues met was in the world series. No way do I agree the game is amazing right now. I can only stomach going to a game if I'm wearing headphones listening to it, and now I can't even listen Carneal and Gordon anymore. The endless promotions to entertain today's casual ADD fan is really very sickening to me. The game takes a backseat to everything else.

Black 47 -> RE: MLB General Information PT 4 (2/16/2014 11:12:31 AM)
Nailed it Ewen. The specialization and endless substitutions is like a slow death. And gardy is one of the worst offenders. Nobody can empty a bullpen like gardy, and I'm not even referring to the last three years when the starting pitching has stunk. He gets aroused if he can bring in a lefty to face one batter in the 6th inning. One rule I'm in favor of would be any reliever who enters the game has to face atleast three batters. Four hour games are killing baseball. In addition to the mass pitching changes, the shrinking strike zone is a disgrace. And now they're adding replay to slow things down even more.

CPAMAN -> RE: MLB General Information PT 4 (2/16/2014 1:17:17 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Black 47 quote: ORIGINAL: Dave E That is completely and totally bonkers. Money ruined the game. Interleague play ruined the game. Nineteen games a season against division opponents ruined the game. Nineteen! Steroids killed the game. Expansion killed the game. This mass marketing of the game to the casual fan killed the game. People don't go to the ballpark for the game. They go for the show.They go to get drunk and stuff their face. Promotions and blaring music has virtually replaced the organ. Nothing bonkers about this take. Agree 100%. [sm=other-checkitout.gif]

CPAMAN -> RE: MLB General Information PT 4 (2/16/2014 1:21:18 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Dave E Money ruined the game: I don't understand this argument at all Interleague ruined the game: I'm personally not a huge fan, but these games sell out routinely. We might not like it, but it has been enormously popular. Nineteen games agianst divisional opponents: yeah, this generally sucks. Steriods ruined the game: laughable. PEDs have long been a part of the game; and Sosa/McGwire was one of the most compelling things in baseball. Several people on this board -- including me -- came back to the game after the strike because of those two. Also, steroids were not the only cause of increased offense. People don't go to the ballpark for the game: not what I see at all. Sure, ballparks have more amenities. Nothing wrong with that. The Dome did not enhance the baseball watching experience, nor did the awful cookie cutter stadiums (STL/PITT/PHIL/CINC/BALT), if you were ever at one. Way too much astroturf, bad sight angles, etc. Those detract from the game. Now you can go to a stadium like TF and watch a ballgame with an extraordinary backdrop -- it's like I always imagined baseball was in the "old" days (although it wasn't nearly this comfortable or enjoyable). On top of that... The wildcard games have improved the playoffs. I was initially against it, but it has made the postseason much more exciting. The internet has completely changed the way you can understand the game. You can get any type of baseball analysis you want at your fingertips. Want a boxscore from a game from 50 years ago? No problem. Want to watch replays at the game on your phone? Done. Want to watch a baseball game on your phone wherever you are? You can do it. Got cable at home? You can see every single game of your team. Music v. organ, that's a personal opinion which you are certainly entitled to. Some of the music sucks at TF, sure, but I wouldn't change it for a 75% empty Dome with organ music. No, the game is simply amazing right now. I'm not a giant Selig fan by any stretch, but baseball is much better off than it was 20 years ago, and it isn't close. Come on Dave. How could you not argue otherwise? MLB is all about money and big contracts. FA has entirely ruined a player being associated with a team for the majority of their career with only a few exceptions (ie, Mauer, Jeter, Konerko, and I am already running out of examples ). [sm=scratch.gif]

CPAMAN -> RE: MLB General Information PT 4 (2/16/2014 1:26:03 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Dave E Money ruined the game: I don't understand this argument at all Interleague ruined the game: I'm personally not a huge fan, but these games sell out routinely. We might not like it, but it has been enormously popular. Nineteen games agianst divisional opponents: yeah, this generally sucks. Steriods ruined the game: laughable. PEDs have long been a part of the game; and Sosa/McGwire was one of the most compelling things in baseball. Several people on this board -- including me -- came back to the game after the strike because of those two. Also, steroids were not the only cause of increased offense. People don't go to the ballpark for the game: not what I see at all. Sure, ballparks have more amenities. Nothing wrong with that. The Dome did not enhance the baseball watching experience, nor did the awful cookie cutter stadiums (STL/PITT/PHIL/CINC/BALT), if you were ever at one. Way too much astroturf, bad sight angles, etc. Those detract from the game. Now you can go to a stadium like TF and watch a ballgame with an extraordinary backdrop -- it's like I always imagined baseball was in the "old" days (although it wasn't nearly this comfortable or enjoyable). On top of that... The wildcard games have improved the playoffs. I was initially against it, but it has made the postseason much more exciting. The internet has completely changed the way you can understand the game. You can get any type of baseball analysis you want at your fingertips. Want a boxscore from a game from 50 years ago? No problem. Want to watch replays at the game on your phone? Done. Want to watch a baseball game on your phone wherever you are? You can do it. Got cable at home? You can see every single game of your team. Music v. organ, that's a personal opinion which you are certainly entitled to. Some of the music sucks at TF, sure, but I wouldn't change it for a 75% empty Dome with organ music. No, the game is simply amazing right now. I'm not a giant Selig fan by any stretch, but baseball is much better off than it was 20 years ago, and it isn't close. This is laughable Dave. We have had this discussion a thousand times. Twins fans DO NOT GO THE GAMES TO WATCH BASEBALL. You know better to even bring this up as a topic of debate. Fans don't pay to watch shitty baseball. They go to TF for the food, ambience and to people watch. That is it.

CPAMAN -> RE: MLB General Information PT 4 (2/16/2014 1:29:36 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ewen21 The music at the ballpark is ridiculous. It's so damn loud and such a distraction. Give me an organ over that piped in nonsense. Screw the Kiss Cams and all the other gimmicky BS. Matter of fact, there are too many damn distractions and distracted people at the ballpark. People noodling around with handheld devices nonstop and what have you. It is thoroughly annoying. What ever happened to..... "I'll be at the ballgame today, catch you later"?? I guess that mentality is more of a societal thing but it certainly effects my time at the ballpark. The games are also far too long. So many meaningless substitutions because the game has become over specialized. Back in the day you could sit through a game watching it on the TV without it eating up almost four hours of your life. Interleague play is a huge pain in the ass as well. There are plenty of things that have diminished the entertainment value of the product. Again, agree 100%. And the younger people cannot argue this because they have nothing to compare it to. They weren't around in the 80's, let alone the 60's and 70's.

CPAMAN -> RE: MLB General Information PT 4 (2/16/2014 1:33:02 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Black 47 Interleague play and imbalanced schedule were implemented to make more money. Thats how money ruined the game. Just because it made the game more profitable doesn't mean it made the game better. MLB sold it's soul to the devil. There was a certain level of mystique, for lack of a better word, when the only times the leagues met was in the world series. No way do I agree the game is amazing right now. I can only stomach going to a game if I'm wearing headphones listening to it, and now I can't even listen Carneal and Gordon anymore. The endless promotions to entertain today's casual ADD fan is really very sickening to me. The game takes a backseat to everything else. 110% agree. [sm=thumb.gif] So true that 90% of young fans are playing with their cell phones or Ipads during the game. I have observed some who hardly ever lift their head up during the game to watch other than to get out of their seat and go to the concession stand, the restrooms, or to walk around the concourse. And don't get me going on fans moving around their seats and in the aisles during the play of an inning. [X(]

CPAMAN -> RE: MLB General Information PT 4 (2/16/2014 1:35:24 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Black 47 Nailed it Ewen. The specialization and endless substitutions is like a slow death. And gardy is one of the worst offenders. Nobody can empty a bullpen like gardy, and I'm not even referring to the last three years when the starting pitching has stunk. He gets aroused if he can bring in a lefty to face one batter in the 6th inning. One rule I'm in favor of would be any reliever who enters the game has to face atleast three batters. Four hour games are killing baseball. In addition to the mass pitching changes, the shrinking strike zone is a disgrace. And now they're adding replay to slow things down even more. This should have been a rule years ago. The worst situation is the relief pitcher who throws only one or two pitches to one batter and then is replaced. [sm=soapbox.gif]

Dave E -> RE: MLB General Information PT 4 (2/17/2014 8:49:13 AM)
[&:] Honestly, you can't make up these posts. Seriously, I often wonder why any of you follow the Twins. What's the upside for you guys? You hate everything about baseball, and in particular, everything about the Twins, from the owners down to the players. Why do you waste your time on something so unpleasant? Truly, though, there is no better argument than "you're to young to know what you're missing!!" That one wins every time. [&:]

Dave E -> RE: MLB General Information PT 4 (2/17/2014 8:50:09 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: CPAMAN quote: ORIGINAL: ewen21 The music at the ballpark is ridiculous. It's so damn loud and such a distraction. Give me an organ over that piped in nonsense. Screw the Kiss Cams and all the other gimmicky BS. Matter of fact, there are too many damn distractions and distracted people at the ballpark. People noodling around with handheld devices nonstop and what have you. It is thoroughly annoying. What ever happened to..... "I'll be at the ballgame today, catch you later"?? I guess that mentality is more of a societal thing but it certainly effects my time at the ballpark. The games are also far too long. So many meaningless substitutions because the game has become over specialized. Back in the day you could sit through a game watching it on the TV without it eating up almost four hours of your life. Interleague play is a huge pain in the ass as well. There are plenty of things that have diminished the entertainment value of the product. Again, agree 100%. And the younger people cannot argue this because they have nothing to compare it to. They weren't around in the 80's, let alone the 60's and 70's. Uh...I wasn't around in the 80s?

Mr. Ed -> RE: MLB General Information PT 4 (2/17/2014 8:50:59 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Dave E quote: ORIGINAL: CPAMAN quote: ORIGINAL: ewen21 The music at the ballpark is ridiculous. It's so damn loud and such a distraction. Give me an organ over that piped in nonsense. Screw the Kiss Cams and all the other gimmicky BS. Matter of fact, there are too many damn distractions and distracted people at the ballpark. People noodling around with handheld devices nonstop and what have you. It is thoroughly annoying. What ever happened to..... "I'll be at the ballgame today, catch you later"?? I guess that mentality is more of a societal thing but it certainly effects my time at the ballpark. The games are also far too long. So many meaningless substitutions because the game has become over specialized. Back in the day you could sit through a game watching it on the TV without it eating up almost four hours of your life. Interleague play is a huge pain in the ass as well. There are plenty of things that have diminished the entertainment value of the product. Again, agree 100%. And the younger people cannot argue this because they have nothing to compare it to. They weren't around in the 80's, let alone the 60's and 70's. Uh...I wasn't around in the 80s? Stop trying to confuse the issue...and get the hell off my lawn!! [:D]

Dave E -> RE: MLB General Information PT 4 (2/17/2014 8:56:28 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Mr. Ed quote: ORIGINAL: Dave E quote: ORIGINAL: CPAMAN quote: ORIGINAL: ewen21 The music at the ballpark is ridiculous. It's so damn loud and such a distraction. Give me an organ over that piped in nonsense. Screw the Kiss Cams and all the other gimmicky BS. Matter of fact, there are too many damn distractions and distracted people at the ballpark. People noodling around with handheld devices nonstop and what have you. It is thoroughly annoying. What ever happened to..... "I'll be at the ballgame today, catch you later"?? I guess that mentality is more of a societal thing but it certainly effects my time at the ballpark. The games are also far too long. So many meaningless substitutions because the game has become over specialized. Back in the day you could sit through a game watching it on the TV without it eating up almost four hours of your life. Interleague play is a huge pain in the ass as well. There are plenty of things that have diminished the entertainment value of the product. Again, agree 100%. And the younger people cannot argue this because they have nothing to compare it to. They weren't around in the 80's, let alone the 60's and 70's. Uh...I wasn't around in the 80s? Stop trying to confuse the issue...and get the hell off my lawn!! [:D] What the heck was wrong with the telegraph, anyway? Now the kids with their fancy "telephones"...don't even get me started on email, as if the Pony Express wasn't good enough...[8\|]

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