RE: Vikes talk for Twins fans

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Dave E -> RE: Vikes talk for Twins fans (4/23/2014 10:45:29 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SoMnFan Bingo Best way to say it Todd. These are all just feelings about what we've seen. The NFL is such a different animal, no one really knows what will translate. It really is amazing how much guesswork is involved in scouting...even for the professionals. I mean, there's no way even a guy like Belicheck, who can get the most out of anybody, had any idea Brady was going to be as good as he was.

SoMnFan -> RE: Vikes talk for Twins fans (4/23/2014 10:55:16 AM)
Russell Wilson still floors me, too. Anyone saying "I knew" is full of it. Thinking back, tho ... You are right ... Brady will probably be the all-time .... NO WAY guy. When he was drafted I guarantee no one was saying "there's a future HOFer"

McMurfy -> RE: Vikes talk for Twins fans (4/23/2014 12:01:45 PM)
So who do you guys want, I like Mack and Bortles. I see Mack as Patrick Willis and Bortles as Phillip Rivers. I'd also be Ok with best defensive player at 8 and trade up for Derek Carr (a 2nd and one of the 3rds)

TJSweens -> RE: Vikes talk for Twins fans (4/23/2014 12:32:10 PM)
Mack is going to be a defensive force. He is that rare defensive player who is just going to blow up plays everywhere. He will be one the elite defensive players in the NFL and ain't no way in hell he is going to be there at #8. Might as well just accept that fact and move on. I like Bortles less than Bridgewater and Manziel even though he may arguably have the highest ceiling. If you're going to ask me who I realistically hope will be there at #8 it would be Bridgewater. I believe he is the surest thing among the QB's. My hope is as it always has been that who ever it turns out is the player left on the board that will have the biggest positive impact for years to come, I hope that's the guy the Vikings pick.

ronhextall -> RE: Vikes talk for Twins fans (4/23/2014 12:32:21 PM)
not a Teddy fan at all. He wasn't good at his pro day. Missed receivers and showed a lack of a strong arm by some reports. Your pro day is a day where you get to script everything. The throws, receivers, the environment are all under the players controlled. He could have practiced it a 1000 times leading up to the event. With all of that he still failed to impress. He has small hands, fumble machine waiting to happen in the NFL. 28 is the lowest wonderlic score for any currently playing NFL Quarterback that has won a Super Bowl. Teddy's is 8 points below that. Plenty of Red flags for me. I am a Manziel guy, am 45 years old have been a Vikings fan forever and this is the first time I have ever really wanted to Vikings to draft a particular player. Manziel kicked ass in the SEC, has big hands, scored very high on the Wonderlic, was awesome at his pro day, and has the "It" factor (what ever "it" is makes teammates want to run through walls for the guy). I think Manziel has magic, probably the first this team has had since Tarkenton if the Vikings take him. Vikings have had a HOF Defensive lineman and HOF running back the past few years, neither of which helped the team much at all achieve the ultimate goal. If you don't have a QB in the NFL you have almost nothing. Granted if everything is perfect on your team you can probably squeak by on an average QB but that is very rare. I am not a linebacker fan..in a pass happy league I would rather have studs up front to pressure the QB and studs in the secondary to cover.

TJSweens -> RE: Vikes talk for Twins fans (4/23/2014 12:40:45 PM)
Screw the choreographed workouts in T-shirts and shorts. Look at the career. Bridge is a completion machine. Career 68%, final year year 71% with 31-4 TD-interception. Russel Wilson has small hands too. Again look at his career. Hand size doesn't seem to have affected him. The wonderlick is probably the only evaluation tool more worthless than individual workouts. Look at his adjustments during games over his career. He ran a pro style offense, was great at making reads at the line of scrimmage and went through his check downs effortlessly. The guy has a great football IQ. And best of all, Jeff Allen thinks he sucks. I like Manziel too because he had a great career and improved from year 1 to year 2. I think all the size worries about him are crap. He does have some mechanical issues to work out and I do have some concerns about him being injured because of the way he plays. All in all, I would have no problems with Manziel being the pick.

ronhextall -> RE: Vikes talk for Twins fans (4/23/2014 12:44:15 PM)
I doubt Bridge faced the defensive speed that Manziel did in the SEC. Not of the faults I mentioned about TB mean that much when looked at individually, combine them all together and a lot of the shine gets too dull for me.

McMurfy -> RE: Vikes talk for Twins fans (4/23/2014 12:48:52 PM)
I hated Peps small hands and don't want that again. Big hands not only help for grip/fumbles, but also pump fake and play action stuff. I also like a big, strong, fast QB. Bortles has all of that, I'm not sure how it will translate to the NFL game, but I at least like the measurables. He reminds me of Tannehill and the jury is still out on whether or not that is a good thing.

TJSweens -> RE: Vikes talk for Twins fans (4/23/2014 12:49:00 PM)
I think the quality of competition is over-hyped. Watch Bridge play. Watch the reads. Watch the execution. The things thrown out against Teddy are not impressive individually or collectively. I'm sorry, but individual workouts and wonderlick are absolutely worthless to me. Especially when you match them up against the on field, game situation performance.

David Levine -> RE: Vikes talk for Twins fans (4/23/2014 12:56:49 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ronhextall I doubt Bridge faced the defensive speed that Manziel did in the SEC. Judd Zulgad: Andrew Luck was 0-3 against top 10 defenses. Terry Bridgewater was 3-0, Johnny Manziel was 1-5. Aaron Murray was 1-8.

ronhextall -> RE: Vikes talk for Twins fans (4/23/2014 1:25:04 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: David Levine quote: ORIGINAL: ronhextall I doubt Bridge faced the defensive speed that Manziel did in the SEC. Judd Zulgad: Andrew Luck was 0-3 against top 10 defenses. Terry Bridgewater was 3-0, Johnny Manziel was 1-5. Aaron Murray was 1-8. I would take an SEC bottom feeding defense any day over something from the American Athletic Conference. Even if Manziel lost he still put up great numbers against the best competition college football has to offer. My opinion doesn't matter much, time will tell which QB's tank or deliver. Fun to debate and I look forward to the draft. I hope the Vikings draft picks do great, regardless of name.

JT2 -> RE: Vikes talk for Twins fans (4/23/2014 1:33:02 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TJSweens Screw the choreographed workouts in T-shirts and shorts. Look at the career. Bridge is a completion machine. Career 68%, final year year 71% with 31-4 TD-interception. Russel Wilson has small hands too. Again look at his career. Hand size doesn't seem to have affected him. The wonderlick is probably the only evaluation tool more worthless than individual workouts. Look at his adjustments during games over his career. He ran a pro style offense, was great at making reads at the line of scrimmage and went through his check downs effortlessly. The guy has a great football IQ. And best of all, Jeff Allen thinks he sucks. I like Manziel too because he had a great career and improved from year 1 to year 2. I think all the size worries about him are crap. He does have some mechanical issues to work out and I do have some concerns about him being injured because of the way he plays. All in all, I would have no problems with Manziel being the pick. Russell Wilson has huge hands. 7th biggest hand size at the combine (for QB) since they started measuring.

TJSweens -> RE: Vikes talk for Twins fans (4/23/2014 1:37:05 PM)
Wait a minute is he the guy in Seattle or San Fran? For some reason, I can't keep the 2 of them straight.

JT2 -> RE: Vikes talk for Twins fans (4/23/2014 1:38:41 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TJSweens Wait a minute is he the guy in Seattle or San Fran? For some reason, I can't keep the 2 of them straight. Seattle. 5' 10" but huge hands.

TJSweens -> RE: Vikes talk for Twins fans (4/23/2014 1:38:54 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ronhextall quote: ORIGINAL: David Levine quote: ORIGINAL: ronhextall I doubt Bridge faced the defensive speed that Manziel did in the SEC. Judd Zulgad: Andrew Luck was 0-3 against top 10 defenses. Terry Bridgewater was 3-0, Johnny Manziel was 1-5. Aaron Murray was 1-8. I would take an SEC bottom feeding defense any day over something from the American Athletic Conference. Even if Manziel lost he still put up great numbers against the best competition college football has to offer. My opinion doesn't matter much, time will tell which QB's tank or deliver. Fun to debate and I look forward to the draft. I hope the Vikings draft picks do great, regardless of name. The point being that Bridgewater is undefeated against top 10 defenses in college football. I think David's point was not that Manziel isn't good, it's that Bridgewater is in no way over matched against tough defenses.

Todd M -> RE: Vikes talk for Twins fans (4/23/2014 2:18:30 PM)
quote: In 2013, Texas A&M’s Manziel fumbled the ball out of his 9 7/8-inch hands just twice. Louisville quarterback Teddy Bridgewater had three fumbles during that time. His hands are 9 1/4 inches. UCF QB Blake Bortles has 9 3/8-inch mitts and fumbled the ball 8 times in 2013. To give you some context, Super Bowl-winning quarterback Russell Wilson has hands that measure 10.25 inches. In the rainy, sometimes misty conditions of Seattle, the Seahawks needed someone with a good grip. Mine, on the other hand (get it?), are about 8 inches. That may explain, in part, why I am not a star NFL quarterback. Many of my coworkers also have paws in the 8-inch range. Makes sense since the average hand size for a man is 7.4 inches.

TJSweens -> RE: Vikes talk for Twins fans (4/23/2014 2:47:26 PM)
And there you have another example of over-analyzing. Somehow a few eights of an inch is the difference between being sure handed and a "fumble machine".

Jim Frenette -> RE: Vikes talk for Twins fans (4/23/2014 3:33:26 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: David Levine quote: ORIGINAL: ronhextall I doubt Bridge faced the defensive speed that Manziel did in the SEC. Judd Zulgad: Andrew Luck was 0-3 against top 10 defenses. Terry Bridgewater was 3-0, Johnny Manziel was 1-5. Aaron Murray was 1-8. But that only really works in a close low scoring game. If A&M defense gives up 30 some points and lose by just a couple, can't blame the QB. Oh wait, the Vikings defense did that and Ponder got all the blame

SoMnFan -> RE: Vikes talk for Twins fans (4/23/2014 3:35:45 PM)
I KNEW there was one Ponder-Lover left out there! [&:][&:][&:]

Jim Frenette -> RE: Vikes talk for Twins fans (4/23/2014 3:42:26 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SoMnFan I KNEW there was one Ponder-Lover left out there! [&:][&:][&:] Oh he has his faults, but a lot could have been because of the system also. Everybody says he stared down his receiver and yet we have no idea how many were even given in his progression. While Percy was here, I'd bet that he was the only one considered

Jeff Jesser -> RE: Vikes talk for Twins fans (4/23/2014 8:39:28 PM)
I'm a big TB fan. That guy stood tall in the face of massive pressure at times and fired darts. Yeah, he doesn't have the flashy SC highlight plays that Manziel has but he's going to be the best pro IMO. Hodge (who is an idiot, btw, but made some really solid points the other day) broke down JM's film and it was U_G_L_Y. He was very Pondereque in the fact that he had 2nd and 3rd reads WIDE OPEN and tucked and ran. Yeah, he ran well but damn. He had 2 TD's on the same play if he went through his reads. That "Fran style" gambling in today's NFL will get you killed.

Jeff Jesser -> RE: Vikes talk for Twins fans (4/23/2014 8:41:01 PM)
My ideal situation and less than but good with either: TB@8 Shazier in 2nd _____________________ D stud@8 (or slight trade down and D stud) Z Met in the 2nd if we don't trade down in the first to move up.

Corleone -> RE: Vikes talk for Twins fans (4/24/2014 11:10:17 AM)
@STL NE @NO ATL @GB DET @BUF @TB WAS BYE @CHI GB CAR NYJ @DET @MIA CHI Brutal start to the schedule....0-5 is very possible.

SoMnFan -> RE: Vikes talk for Twins fans (4/24/2014 11:32:12 AM)
Ouchhhhhhhhh

Jim Frenette -> RE: Vikes talk for Twins fans (4/24/2014 1:27:49 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Corleone @STL NE @NO ATL @GB DET @BUF @TB WAS BYE @CHI GB CAR NYJ @DET @MIA CHI Brutal start to the schedule....0-5 is very possible. Brutal finish also since Vikings don't have the warm Dome anymore

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