quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

Was holding that one ever since I read Bill's 'don't lump us all in the same boat' comment a few pages back.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

quote:

ORIGINAL: bohumm

I would hope the Vikings are at least proposing something like a restructure where they guarantee more of his next two years in the interest of showing good faith, just like they are likely asking him to be patient and they'll work out an extension after this year. That could go a long way toward building a bridge past this year, which is a difficult time to extend because of his injury and the time left on his contract. His is one of the more egregiously undervalued contracts in the league, since at the point he signed it he'd only been a starter for one year (through no fault of his own). It was clear where he was headed, but his progress had been stunted by a degree of underuse.

Why not work with him to try to pay him what he's earned, since if it were the other way around they'd have no problem cutting him.

You best be careful, Bill and KG have lumped together in one boat and are out there just waiting to attack that kind of one-sided Hunter interpretation.

For my money ... Hunter was a completely ineffective college player. The Vikings took a chance on him in the 3rd rd ... gave him the perfect opportunity which he has taken full advantage of.

He did not step into the pros as an elite player ... he has risen very fast. We know he's capable of being elite but he hasn't put up the dominating numbers of Donald or Miller, year after year – hence the 2018 contract based on where he came from, not the dominance he could potentially achieve.

HE undervalued his own potential when Hunter signed the contract for 5 YEARS. So I'm not going to blame the Vikings for that.

The injury puts a hold on any negotiation. As a cornerstone of the defense, the team would be wise NOT to play hardball and just say, 'screw you, suck it up for two more years' (as the law office of KG-Bill would have us do).

We have already taken a huge chance on him twice ... by drafting a below avg. college player and then by extending him to a, at the time, substantial contract. Is it time for the next step - no, the injury is neither Hunter's nor the Viking's fault but it is a cold reality of the game (both understand). It directly ties into the contract game as well.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

Great post. Tom you are an enjoying read.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

the law office of KG-Bill would have us doLOL

I'm in the middle on this one. Prefer he plays on existing contract through this season with the promise of entering good faith negotiations next off season.

1. Hunter needs to prove he's not damaged goods.
2. Current Covid cap restrictions are also something Hunter's team needs to take in for account.
3. Viking brass need to acknowledge Hunter has vastly out played his current deal.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

Great post. Tom you are an enjoying read.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

By the way, you've got it made Tom. Your partner KGB is known nationally for dragging out cases for years so he's able to bring in 4-5 times the normal billable legal hours.

And in the courtroom... wow! When other lawyers say "Object your honor" and the judge sternly says "Sustained, you're on thin ice here.", he has an uncanny and unique ability to brush it off and go right back to the SAME point! Don't even get me started on his singular ability to go down obscure rabbit holes. Buku court hours!!

quote:

ORIGINAL: bohumm

Remember, the reason Hunter is so integral is that he plays Zimmer's system perfectly: stop the run first, rush the passer second. If he were on a team where he could just go upfield to seal the edge (maybe) on the way to the passer, he'd get a lot more sacks. If he were on a team that would start/play a youngster over a declining vet just because he's better, he would have had a lot more snaps and an extra year as a starter under his belt when he negotiated his second contract. Yes, he signed it, but reward him and recognize the entire context.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: bohumm

Remember, the reason Hunter is so integral is that he plays Zimmer's system perfectly: stop the run first, rush the passer second. If he were on a team where he could just go upfield to seal the edge (maybe) on the way to the passer, he'd get a lot more sacks. If he were on a team that would start/play a youngster over a declining vet just because he's better, he would have had a lot more snaps and an extra year as a starter under his belt when he negotiated his second contract. Yes, he signed it, but reward him and recognize the entire context.

Not seeing where we held him back.

He had 4.5 total sacks at LSU in 3 seasons. He had 6 sacks his rookie year with the Vikings.

Without the neck injury, it is probably a slam dunk that we up his pay into 18-20M a year range.

I would say that we have some sort of compromise. Convert some future money to signing bonus this year(instead of 12M in actual money this year, up it to 17-18M). If he proves that he is healthy and will stay healthy(neck-wise) and plays well, re-do the contract with an appropriate raise.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

the law office of KG-Bill would have us doLOL

I'm in the middle on this one. Prefer he plays on existing contract through this season with the promise of entering good faith negotiations next off season.

1. Hunter needs to prove he's not damaged goods.
2. Current Covid cap restrictions are also something Hunter's team needs to take in for account.
3. Viking brass need to acknowledge Hunter has vastly out played his current deal.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

Great post. Tom you are an enjoying read.

Thanks, I appreciate that really - but the lumping of KG with Bill into KGBill just seems so ... natural. LOL.

Digging on two for the price of one.

With one feeling the brunt of the dig (as evidenced by the 3 post legal squirming above).

Deservedly so.

No need to reprint signage.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pager

Objection your honor.

Overruled.

But I strenuously object.

Oh. Well, if you strenuously object then I should take some time to reconsider.

quote:

ORIGINAL: thebigo

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pager

Objection your honor.

Overruled.

But I strenuously object.

Oh. Well, if you strenuously object then I should take some time to reconsider.

Must have been sick the day they taught law at law school.

Must have been sick the day they taught logic at logic school.

quote:

ORIGINAL: thebigo

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pager

Objection your honor.

Overruled.

But I strenuously object.

Oh. Well, if you strenuously object then I should take some time to reconsider.

Must have been sick the day they taught law at law school.

Must have been sick the day they taught logic at logic school.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

Great post. Tom you are an enjoying read.

Thanks, I appreciate that really - but the lumping of KG with Bill into KGBill just seems so ... natural. LOL.

Digging on two for the price of one.

With one feeling the brunt of the dig (as evidenced by the 3 post legal squirming above).

Deservedly so.

No need to reprint signage.

Now that you're established with the big guy KGB, no need for seedy, back-alley hotels to see Rudolph and Hughes. You're going to the Ritz! And no more one-nighters with circa 2020 Stevie Nicks. The 1978 version shacks up with you until you tell her to hit the street!

But yeah, in the meantime go forth with your swarmy attacks...

quote:

ORIGINAL: bohumm

Remember, the reason Hunter is so integral is that he plays Zimmer's system perfectly: stop the run first, rush the passer second. If he were on a team where he could just go upfield to seal the edge (maybe) on the way to the passer, he'd get a lot more sacks. If he were on a team that would start/play a youngster over a declining vet just because he's better, he would have had a lot more snaps and an extra year as a starter under his belt when he negotiated his second contract. Yes, he signed it, but reward him and recognize the entire context.

quote:

ORIGINAL: bohumm

I guess I just don't see it as a given that Hunter is only this good because he was with the Vikings. I think that's helped, but he was extremely young when drafted and likely would be as good anywhere, with even more sacks in a system that allowed him to focus more on rushing the passer. But maybe not. As for college, apples to oranges. If it were all about sacks, he likely wouldn't have been drafted at all.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

quote:

ORIGINAL: bohumm

Remember, the reason Hunter is so integral is that he plays Zimmer's system perfectly: stop the run first, rush the passer second. If he were on a team where he could just go upfield to seal the edge (maybe) on the way to the passer, he'd get a lot more sacks. If he were on a team that would start/play a youngster over a declining vet just because he's better, he would have had a lot more snaps and an extra year as a starter under his belt when he negotiated his second contract. Yes, he signed it, but reward him and recognize the entire context.

quote:

ORIGINAL: bohumm

I guess I just don't see it as a given that Hunter is only this good because he was with the Vikings. I think that's helped, but he was extremely young when drafted and likely would be as good anywhere, with even more sacks in a system that allowed him to focus more on rushing the passer. But maybe not. As for college, apples to oranges. If it were all about sacks, he likely wouldn't have been drafted at all.

This is all conjecture assuming Hunter would have overcome any obstacle thrown in his path.

I could also speculate that if Hunter had not been drafted by the Vikings, he might have lasted until the 5th rd by a team with no DL coach named Patterson ... who can say where he'd be in his development ... a lot of world class athletes and much better college players than Hunter fall through the cracks in their transition to the nfl because they land in the wrong situation. Or, he might have been drafted by a team with a Von Miller instead of a Robison, and played even less his first two years.

Yes, he has transformed himself into a great football player ... over time, with the help of the people around him, not in spite of.

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

the law office of KG-Bill would have us doLOL

I'm in the middle on this one. Prefer he plays on existing contract through this season with the promise of entering good faith negotiations next off season.

1. Hunter needs to prove he's not damaged goods.
2. Current Covid cap restrictions are also something Hunter's team needs to take in for account.
3. Viking brass need to acknowledge Hunter has vastly out played his current deal.

All this vastly outplaying his current deal is simply not true. In 2019 he outplayed it, but in 2020 he didn't even take the field for us. That is not vastly outplaying his current deal.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

quote:

ORIGINAL: bohumm

Remember, the reason Hunter is so integral is that he plays Zimmer's system perfectly: stop the run first, rush the passer second. If he were on a team where he could just go upfield to seal the edge (maybe) on the way to the passer, he'd get a lot more sacks. If he were on a team that would start/play a youngster over a declining vet just because he's better, he would have had a lot more snaps and an extra year as a starter under his belt when he negotiated his second contract. Yes, he signed it, but reward him and recognize the entire context.

quote:

ORIGINAL: bohumm

I guess I just don't see it as a given that Hunter is only this good because he was with the Vikings. I think that's helped, but he was extremely young when drafted and likely would be as good anywhere, with even more sacks in a system that allowed him to focus more on rushing the passer. But maybe not. As for college, apples to oranges. If it were all about sacks, he likely wouldn't have been drafted at all.

This is all conjecture assuming Hunter would have overcome any obstacle thrown in his path.

I could also speculate that if Hunter had not been drafted by the Vikings, he might have lasted until the 5th rd by a team with no DL coach named Patterson ... who can say where he'd be in his development ... a lot of world class athletes and much better college players than Hunter fall through the cracks in their transition to the nfl because they land in the wrong situation. Or, he might have been drafted by a team with a Von Miller instead of a Robison, and played even less his first two years.

Yes, he has transformed himself into a great football player ... over time, with the help of the people around him, not in spite of.

Patterson seemingly gets put on a pedestal by most posters on this board. But should he be?

He has failed to develop more players than vice versa. I think more of the onus of success is on the player than the coach.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

quote:

ORIGINAL: bohumm

Remember, the reason Hunter is so integral is that he plays Zimmer's system perfectly: stop the run first, rush the passer second. If he were on a team where he could just go upfield to seal the edge (maybe) on the way to the passer, he'd get a lot more sacks. If he were on a team that would start/play a youngster over a declining vet just because he's better, he would have had a lot more snaps and an extra year as a starter under his belt when he negotiated his second contract. Yes, he signed it, but reward him and recognize the entire context.

quote:

ORIGINAL: bohumm

I guess I just don't see it as a given that Hunter is only this good because he was with the Vikings. I think that's helped, but he was extremely young when drafted and likely would be as good anywhere, with even more sacks in a system that allowed him to focus more on rushing the passer. But maybe not. As for college, apples to oranges. If it were all about sacks, he likely wouldn't have been drafted at all.

This is all conjecture assuming Hunter would have overcome any obstacle thrown in his path.

I could also speculate that if Hunter had not been drafted by the Vikings, he might have lasted until the 5th rd by a team with no DL coach named Patterson ... who can say where he'd be in his development ... a lot of world class athletes and much better college players than Hunter fall through the cracks in their transition to the nfl because they land in the wrong situation. Or, he might have been drafted by a team with a Von Miller instead of a Robison, and played even less his first two years.

Yes, he has transformed himself into a great football player ... over time, with the help of the people around him, not in spite of.

Patterson seemingly gets put on a pedestal by most posters on this board. But should he be?

He has failed to develop more players than vice versa. I think more of the onus of success is on the player than the coach.