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Phil Riewer -> RE: General Vikes Talk (2/5/2021 11:13:37 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H quote: ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H quote: ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H quote: ORIGINAL: Todd M 22 dead in 2021, 17 in 2022, 6 in 2023. Not sure any of those years warrant a trade for a guy that's worth just over 8 cents....if RB's are a dime a dozen. The Jets, Texans, Falcons and Eagles all need a running back. That gets you a high pick for one of the top quarterbacks. You live for one more year with Cousins and then dump him. Why would they give up their high picks for Cook if RBs are a dime a dozen? Like I said earlier, some still think running back is important. Dime-a-dozen is my theory. Dime a dozen works unless you have a top 3-5 RB. When was the last time a team with a top 3-5 running back in the league won a Super Bowl? The reality is, top 3-5 running backs sell a lot of jerseys but they don't win a lot of championships. We are in the Tom Brady and Patrick Mahomes era.....that is a factor. When have we had a QB make 10 SB in his career.....before you trade a top 3-5 QB you better grab a similar QB. Denver (Def and RB, Terrell Davis, Baltimore (Def and RB). Best answer is 2018-19 Todd Gurley.

Brad H -> RE: General Vikes Talk (2/5/2021 11:26:07 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H quote: ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H quote: ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H quote: ORIGINAL: Todd M 22 dead in 2021, 17 in 2022, 6 in 2023. Not sure any of those years warrant a trade for a guy that's worth just over 8 cents....if RB's are a dime a dozen. The Jets, Texans, Falcons and Eagles all need a running back. That gets you a high pick for one of the top quarterbacks. You live for one more year with Cousins and then dump him. Why would they give up their high picks for Cook if RBs are a dime a dozen? Like I said earlier, some still think running back is important. Dime-a-dozen is my theory. Dime a dozen works unless you have a top 3-5 RB. When was the last time a team with a top 3-5 running back in the league won a Super Bowl? The reality is, top 3-5 running backs sell a lot of jerseys but they don't win a lot of championships. We are in the Tom Brady and Patrick Mahomes era.....that is a factor. When have we had a QB make 10 SB in his career.....before you trade a top 3-5 QB you better grab a similar QB. Denver (Def and RB, Terrell Davis, Baltimore (Def and RB). Best answer is 2018-19 Todd Gurley. Todd Gurley won a Super Bowl?

bohumm -> RE: General Vikes Talk (2/5/2021 11:32:08 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H quote: ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H quote: ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H quote: ORIGINAL: Todd M 22 dead in 2021, 17 in 2022, 6 in 2023. Not sure any of those years warrant a trade for a guy that's worth just over 8 cents....if RB's are a dime a dozen. The Jets, Texans, Falcons and Eagles all need a running back. That gets you a high pick for one of the top quarterbacks. You live for one more year with Cousins and then dump him. Why would they give up their high picks for Cook if RBs are a dime a dozen? Like I said earlier, some still think running back is important. Dime-a-dozen is my theory. Dime a dozen works unless you have a top 3-5 RB. When was the last time a team with a top 3-5 running back in the league won a Super Bowl? The reality is, top 3-5 running backs sell a lot of jerseys but they don't win a lot of championships. We are in the Tom Brady and Patrick Mahomes era.....that is a factor. When have we had a QB make 10 SB in his career.....before you trade a top 3-5 QB you better grab a similar QB. Denver (Def and RB, Terrell Davis, Baltimore (Def and RB). Best answer is 2018-19 Todd Gurley. NE 13 LA 3 So that's enough about that. Baltimore averaged 3.3 YPC in that Super Bowl. So that's enough said about that. BOLD attempt, but your points actually argue more for the other side.

David Levine -> RE: General Vikes Talk (2/5/2021 11:34:16 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H quote: ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H quote: ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H quote: ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H quote: ORIGINAL: Todd M 22 dead in 2021, 17 in 2022, 6 in 2023. Not sure any of those years warrant a trade for a guy that's worth just over 8 cents....if RB's are a dime a dozen. The Jets, Texans, Falcons and Eagles all need a running back. That gets you a high pick for one of the top quarterbacks. You live for one more year with Cousins and then dump him. Why would they give up their high picks for Cook if RBs are a dime a dozen? Like I said earlier, some still think running back is important. Dime-a-dozen is my theory. Dime a dozen works unless you have a top 3-5 RB. When was the last time a team with a top 3-5 running back in the league won a Super Bowl? The reality is, top 3-5 running backs sell a lot of jerseys but they don't win a lot of championships. We are in the Tom Brady and Patrick Mahomes era.....that is a factor. When have we had a QB make 10 SB in his career.....before you trade a top 3-5 QB you better grab a similar QB. Denver (Def and RB, Terrell Davis, Baltimore (Def and RB). Best answer is 2018-19 Todd Gurley. Todd Gurley won a Super Bowl? He lost a SB. 10 Carries, 35 yards. 1 reception, -1 yard for the game. In the NFCCG he had 4 caries for 10 yards and 1 reception for 3 yards.

David Levine -> RE: General Vikes Talk (2/5/2021 11:38:24 AM)
The Baltimore "rushing and defense" SB was 20 years ago. The Broncos ones were 2 and 3 yers before that. The 2012 Ravens and 2015 Broncos won with passing.

Bill Johanesen -> RE: General Vikes Talk (2/5/2021 11:38:49 AM)
OMG what a quick beatdown. Phil should STAY down on the canvas for the TKO.... but the three knockdown rule is in effect and he will probably take full advantage of it [&:]

Trekgeekscott -> RE: General Vikes Talk (2/5/2021 11:51:34 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: David Levine The Baltimore "rushing and defense" SB was 20 years ago. The Broncos ones were 2 and 3 yers before that. The 2012 Ravens and 2015 Broncos won with passing. 2015 Broncos winning with passing was amazing considering the QB could barely throw the ball 10 yards

thebigo -> RE: General Vikes Talk (2/5/2021 11:55:34 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: bohumm quote: ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H quote: ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H quote: ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H quote: ORIGINAL: Todd M 22 dead in 2021, 17 in 2022, 6 in 2023. Not sure any of those years warrant a trade for a guy that's worth just over 8 cents....if RB's are a dime a dozen. The Jets, Texans, Falcons and Eagles all need a running back. That gets you a high pick for one of the top quarterbacks. You live for one more year with Cousins and then dump him. Why would they give up their high picks for Cook if RBs are a dime a dozen? Like I said earlier, some still think running back is important. Dime-a-dozen is my theory. Dime a dozen works unless you have a top 3-5 RB. When was the last time a team with a top 3-5 running back in the league won a Super Bowl? The reality is, top 3-5 running backs sell a lot of jerseys but they don't win a lot of championships. We are in the Tom Brady and Patrick Mahomes era.....that is a factor. When have we had a QB make 10 SB in his career.....before you trade a top 3-5 QB you better grab a similar QB. Denver (Def and RB, Terrell Davis, Baltimore (Def and RB). Best answer is 2018-19 Todd Gurley. NE 13 LA 3 So that's enough about that. Baltimore averaged 3.3 YPC in that Super Bowl. So that's enough said about that. BOLD attempt, but your points actually argue more for the other side. But it wasn't successful, so it can't have been bold.

David Levine -> RE: General Vikes Talk (2/5/2021 12:00:31 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Trekgeekscott quote: ORIGINAL: David Levine The Baltimore "rushing and defense" SB was 20 years ago. The Broncos ones were 2 and 3 yers before that. The 2012 Ravens and 2015 Broncos won with passing. 2015 Broncos winning with passing was amazing considering the QB could barely throw the ball 10 yards I'll walk that one back a little. They were incredibly mediocre passing and rushing. they basically won with defense. But the Hillman/Anderson RB tandem were definitely not studs.

Trekgeekscott -> RE: General Vikes Talk (2/5/2021 12:02:34 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: David Levine quote: ORIGINAL: Trekgeekscott quote: ORIGINAL: David Levine The Baltimore "rushing and defense" SB was 20 years ago. The Broncos ones were 2 and 3 yers before that. The 2012 Ravens and 2015 Broncos won with passing. 2015 Broncos winning with passing was amazing considering the QB could barely throw the ball 10 yards I'll walk that one back a little. They were incredibly mediocre passing and rushing. they basically won with defense. Yup. And the 1997 and 98 versions that won two straight Superbowls did run well but they also had McCaffrey and Smith and IIRC Shannon Sharpe at TE and a QB, albeit one at the end of a HOF career who could still sling it.

Brad H -> RE: General Vikes Talk (2/5/2021 1:03:15 PM)
My point being, Super Bowls are no longer won with great rushing attacks. Haven't been for a long time. So if you have a good back, he could be tremendous trade bait.

bstinger -> RE: General Vikes Talk (2/5/2021 1:25:41 PM)
My point would be, upgrading the roster won't mean much until you replace the coaching staff.

Pager -> RE: General Vikes Talk (2/5/2021 1:55:13 PM)
I might do a research project at some point - if I have time, which I def do not at this point. The SB ran through NE for a long time. It will through KC for as long as Mahomes stays healthy. A good rushing attack is supposed to keep the opponents high scoring offense off the field. Has that been the case vs Mahomes so far? Is that the way to beat him? Shouldn't take long to look up all the losses and break down the rushing game. I think to the first time the Bills played Mahomes. They dared KC to beat them with the run, and so KC did. Rushing for over 200 yards. I remember NE having very effective running games when they needed to. While it is a passing game - more now than ever before, a good defense & scheme can take an element away from an offense. Super bowl offenses are able to adjust and win however needed. That doesn't mean I'm ok with the Cook contract. I thought and think it was stupid.

Mark Anderson -> RE: General Vikes Talk (2/5/2021 2:18:23 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H My point being, Super Bowls are no longer won with great rushing attacks. Haven't been for a long time. So if you have a good back, he could be tremendous trade bait. You contradicted yourself in one post. SB teams don't need great RBs but teams hoping to build a SB team(which is the goal of all teams) should trade for a RB.

David Levine -> RE: General Vikes Talk (2/5/2021 2:24:34 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H My point being, Super Bowls are no longer won with great rushing attacks. Haven't been for a long time. So if you have a good back, he could be tremendous trade bait. You contradicted yourself in one post. SB teams don't need great RBs but teams hoping to build a SB team(which is the goal of all teams) should trade for a RB. No contradiction. He's hoping one of the bad teams w/o a RB will overvalue the position: "Like I said earlier, some still think running back is important."

Mark Anderson -> RE: General Vikes Talk (2/5/2021 2:36:35 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: David Levine quote: ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H My point being, Super Bowls are no longer won with great rushing attacks. Haven't been for a long time. So if you have a good back, he could be tremendous trade bait. You contradicted yourself in one post. SB teams don't need great RBs but teams hoping to build a SB team(which is the goal of all teams) should trade for a RB. No contradiction. He's hoping one of the bad teams w/o a RB will overvalue the position: "Like I said earlier, some still think running back is important." Like a SB winning Coach and GM in New Orleans and a well respected coach in Tennessee.

David Levine -> RE: General Vikes Talk (2/5/2021 2:40:39 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson quote: ORIGINAL: David Levine quote: ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H My point being, Super Bowls are no longer won with great rushing attacks. Haven't been for a long time. So if you have a good back, he could be tremendous trade bait. You contradicted yourself in one post. SB teams don't need great RBs but teams hoping to build a SB team(which is the goal of all teams) should trade for a RB. No contradiction. He's hoping one of the bad teams w/o a RB will overvalue the position: "Like I said earlier, some still think running back is important." Like a SB winning Coach and GM in New Orleans and a well respected coach in Tennessee. I don't see him mentioning those teams, maybe I can't find the post you're referring to? All I see is: quote: The Jets, Texans, Falcons and Eagles all need a running back. That gets you a high pick for one of the top quarterbacks. You live for one more year with Cousins and then dump him.

Mark Anderson -> RE: General Vikes Talk (2/5/2021 3:13:19 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: David Levine quote: ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson quote: ORIGINAL: David Levine quote: ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H My point being, Super Bowls are no longer won with great rushing attacks. Haven't been for a long time. So if you have a good back, he could be tremendous trade bait. You contradicted yourself in one post. SB teams don't need great RBs but teams hoping to build a SB team(which is the goal of all teams) should trade for a RB. No contradiction. He's hoping one of the bad teams w/o a RB will overvalue the position: "Like I said earlier, some still think running back is important." Like a SB winning Coach and GM in New Orleans and a well respected coach in Tennessee. I don't see him mentioning those teams, maybe I can't find the post you're referring to? All I see is: quote: The Jets, Texans, Falcons and Eagles all need a running back. That gets you a high pick for one of the top quarterbacks. You live for one more year with Cousins and then dump him. My point was: Are you going to take advice on building a team from a SB winning Coach or a guy who trolls Viking fans when the team struggles?

David Levine -> RE: General Vikes Talk (2/5/2021 3:15:24 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson quote: ORIGINAL: David Levine quote: ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson quote: ORIGINAL: David Levine quote: ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H My point being, Super Bowls are no longer won with great rushing attacks. Haven't been for a long time. So if you have a good back, he could be tremendous trade bait. You contradicted yourself in one post. SB teams don't need great RBs but teams hoping to build a SB team(which is the goal of all teams) should trade for a RB. No contradiction. He's hoping one of the bad teams w/o a RB will overvalue the position: "Like I said earlier, some still think running back is important." Like a SB winning Coach and GM in New Orleans and a well respected coach in Tennessee. I don't see him mentioning those teams, maybe I can't find the post you're referring to? All I see is: quote: The Jets, Texans, Falcons and Eagles all need a running back. That gets you a high pick for one of the top quarterbacks. You live for one more year with Cousins and then dump him. My point was: Are you going to take advice on building a team from a SB winning Coach or a guy who trolls Viking fans when the team struggles? Any RB is going to look good playing with Drew Brees. Just like NE never had a stud RB with Brady, but everyone they plugged in did just fine.

David Levine -> RE: General Vikes Talk (2/5/2021 3:18:02 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: David Levine quote: ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson quote: ORIGINAL: David Levine quote: ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson quote: ORIGINAL: David Levine quote: ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H My point being, Super Bowls are no longer won with great rushing attacks. Haven't been for a long time. So if you have a good back, he could be tremendous trade bait. You contradicted yourself in one post. SB teams don't need great RBs but teams hoping to build a SB team(which is the goal of all teams) should trade for a RB. No contradiction. He's hoping one of the bad teams w/o a RB will overvalue the position: "Like I said earlier, some still think running back is important." Like a SB winning Coach and GM in New Orleans and a well respected coach in Tennessee. I don't see him mentioning those teams, maybe I can't find the post you're referring to? All I see is: quote: The Jets, Texans, Falcons and Eagles all need a running back. That gets you a high pick for one of the top quarterbacks. You live for one more year with Cousins and then dump him. My point was: Are you going to take advice on building a team from a SB winning Coach or a guy who trolls Viking fans when the team struggles? Any RB is going to look good playing with Drew Brees. Just like NE never had a stud RB with Brady, but everyone they plugged in did just fine. I'm not sure Tennessee is the best example either considering how their running game performed in the Playoffs.

Trekgeekscott -> RE: General Vikes Talk (2/5/2021 3:21:26 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: David Levine quote: ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson quote: ORIGINAL: David Levine quote: ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson quote: ORIGINAL: David Levine quote: ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H My point being, Super Bowls are no longer won with great rushing attacks. Haven't been for a long time. So if you have a good back, he could be tremendous trade bait. You contradicted yourself in one post. SB teams don't need great RBs but teams hoping to build a SB team(which is the goal of all teams) should trade for a RB. No contradiction. He's hoping one of the bad teams w/o a RB will overvalue the position: "Like I said earlier, some still think running back is important." Like a SB winning Coach and GM in New Orleans and a well respected coach in Tennessee. I don't see him mentioning those teams, maybe I can't find the post you're referring to? All I see is: quote: The Jets, Texans, Falcons and Eagles all need a running back. That gets you a high pick for one of the top quarterbacks. You live for one more year with Cousins and then dump him. My point was: Are you going to take advice on building a team from a SB winning Coach or a guy who trolls Viking fans when the team struggles? Any RB is going to look good playing with Drew Brees. Just like NE never had a stud RB with Brady, but everyone they plugged in did just fine. You still have to be able to run the ball effectively. Without a running attack the Defense pins its ears back and comes full bore after the QB on every play. Now, I'm not saying you next the next Walter Payton or Barry Sanders to do this. No, I would say you want a back that can contribute in the passing game as well as run the ball well, like Marshall Faulk or Thurman Thomas. Dalvin Cook does that. But the Vikings rely to heavily on him....and when he goes down (which he does every season) it puts a strain on the offense. Anyway. Running Backs are still important and with everyone trying to pass pass pass, defenses are built to stop the pass. so Maybe running the ball isn't such a bad idea....

Bill Johanesen -> RE: General Vikes Talk (2/5/2021 3:32:53 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Pager I might do a research project at some point - if I have time, which I def do not at this point. The SB ran through NE for a long time. It will through KC for as long as Mahomes stays healthy. A good rushing attack is supposed to keep the opponents high scoring offense off the field. Has that been the case vs Mahomes so far? Is that the way to beat him? Shouldn't take long to look up all the losses and break down the rushing game. I think to the first time the Bills played Mahomes. They dared KC to beat them with the run, and so KC did. Rushing for over 200 yards. I remember NE having very effective running games when they needed to. While it is a passing game - more now than ever before, a good defense & scheme can take an element away from an offense. Super bowl offenses are able to adjust and win however needed. That doesn't mean I'm ok with the Cook contract. I thought and think it was stupid. The problem is you don't know if the opponent built up a lead passing on key downs, etc then ran out the clock in the 4th quarter. An extra 50, 75, or more yards can skew things to make it look like rushing won the game. I used to try and make that point with a poster who left. I think Todd M paid him a vist. Seemed later Todd was peeved because the guy went and took a nap while Todd was visiting. [&:]

David Levine -> RE: General Vikes Talk (2/5/2021 3:33:44 PM)
No one is saying you shouldn't run the ball or that its not important. Just pushing back on spending premium picks and/or money on RBs. The better you can throw the ball, the better your running game will be.

Bill Jandro -> RE: General Vikes Talk (2/5/2021 3:35:45 PM)
Trading Cook however is not an option due to the dead cap hit.

Bill Johanesen -> RE: General Vikes Talk (2/5/2021 3:38:26 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro Trading Cook however is not an option due to the dead cap hit. It would be bold though. Well, to most of us.

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