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RE: General Vikes Talk

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RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/23/2019 9:07:29 PM   
bstinger


Posts: 16530
Joined: 7/20/2007
Status: offline 		Keenum sucks.

_____________________________

"You guys are true athletes!"

--twinsfan
Post #: 1101
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/23/2019 9:11:09 PM   
hagar

 

Posts: 2757
Joined: 3/3/2014
From: fresburg, ca
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson

I was critical of re-signing Kyle Rudolph, but a couple things are making me think I was wrong. Reportedly he showed up in the best shape of his career. That's one, but number two is bigger for me. Reportedly he has never blocked as well as he is doing thus far this season. He did almost score a TD yesterday and did set one up with a first down near the goal line. I'm thinking that the drafting of Irv Smith and the subsequent discussions of cutting or re-sign him have motivated him and he looks the part of being a solid TE to me. Next year? I don't know. Let's see how this year pans out.

I think Rudolph being such a good dude in the community was a major factor with this extension.


He's a good looking white guy that played at Notre Dame. These 'reports' of his good blocking have been mentioned for years. They aren't real. He's a poor blocker - always has been.

Sometimes its just easier to go with a bias.



Chris Tomasson
‏ @christomasson
59m59 minutes ago

Mike Zimmer on Dalvin Cook: "Dalvin's a great player but he's getting a lot of help from a lot of people. ... It's not a one-man show.'' Zimmer said Kyle Rudolph and WRs were among those to block well.



Yes, why trust what I see with my own eyes when I can take the word of the coach with the abysmal record with successful challenges. Had he even watched the game back when he made that comment?



Just out of curiosity, how does challenging a call by the ref have anything to do with knowing which of your players are blocking well?
Post #: 1102
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/23/2019 9:12:47 PM   
bstinger


Posts: 16530
Joined: 7/20/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

quote:

ORIGINAL: thebigo

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pager

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pager

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Steve Lentz

Was fortunate to be at the game yesterday. Dominating performance overall.
Cook is the REAL DEAL. So explosive, so shifty and real speed.
The Raiders went after Wilson and he more than handled himself. Got fooled once bad, but overall was very active and disruptive.
Fun to see Carlson miss and the Defense control Jacobs.
Smith looks to be a big addition.
Fun to dominate offensive genius Gruden.
Loved seeing the 1969 NFC Champions honored.
Got to meet "Hardware Hank" Henry Thomas.
On to the Bears.


The biggest thing with Cook is you don't have to hold your blocks (like they did with AP)....he gets to and thru the hole so fast.


But not as fast as Robert Smith or Moss


I am not so sure (if you are talking 10 yard dashes versus 40). Cook is really fast that first 5-10 yards. Smith needed blocking also and if I remember correctly he liked the I formation also.


It was tongue in cheek or as bigo likes to say, I was being swarmy. I posted a few weeks back that Cook reminded me "a bit" of Smith with how fast he hit and was through the hole.

It got turned into something it was not.

Cook though is lot more elusive.


Don't you mean "swarthy"?

I think Cook is definitely faster to and through the holes than Smith. Also I'm pretty sure we are no longer surprised to see end of the week "top speed attained" results attributed to one or more of Cooks runs, more than just the first 5 to 10 yards.

Loving Cook, but for speed to or through or to the house not in Robert Smith's class. With Smith if you blinked you would never find him again.

Smith probably had more straightline speed than Cook, but Cook is a better RB. Smith couldn't take a hit and keep going like Cookie Montster can.

_____________________________

"You guys are true athletes!"

--twinsfan
Post #: 1103
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/23/2019 9:19:46 PM   
Ragnarök


Posts: 2274
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: bstinger

Keenum sucks.

Case has got this... he plays best from behind when he has to carry the team...
Post #: 1104
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/23/2019 9:44:21 PM   
Ragnarök


Posts: 2274
Status: offline 		Scrubisky has some fatal flaws we can exploit

The Bears D wears down and their speed can be used against them...

Play a quick paced sugar huddle O with base sets that dont give a tell, heavy dose of play action stuff to outside as they flood center field, quick hitters and then choose shots down field when open... Kirk must have a count in his head, one, two... fire to receiver or throw it away...

< Message edited by Ragnarök -- 9/23/2019 9:54:40 PM >
Post #: 1105
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/23/2019 10:00:21 PM   
bstinger


Posts: 16530
Joined: 7/20/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Ragnarök

quote:

ORIGINAL: bstinger

Keenum sucks.

Case has got this... he plays best from behind when he has to carry the team...

You were saying...

_____________________________

"You guys are true athletes!"

--twinsfan
Post #: 1106
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/23/2019 10:02:30 PM   
Ragnarök


Posts: 2274
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: bstinger

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ragnarök

quote:

ORIGINAL: bstinger

Keenum sucks.

Case has got this... he plays best from behind when he has to carry the team...

You were saying...

I was being quite sarcastic... Case was playing his ass off though you have to admit, Trevathan has been an animal on D in this game, we must have an answer for that...
Post #: 1107
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/23/2019 10:14:33 PM   
bstinger


Posts: 16530
Joined: 7/20/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Ragnarök

quote:

ORIGINAL: bstinger

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ragnarök

quote:

ORIGINAL: bstinger

Keenum sucks.

Case has got this... he plays best from behind when he has to carry the team...

You were saying...

I was being quite sarcastic... Case was playing his ass off though you have to admit, Trevathan has been an animal on D in this game, we must have an answer for that...

Case gave us an exciting season, but Kirk is a better QB. Maybe not what he signed for guaranteed, but still a better QB.

_____________________________

"You guys are true athletes!"

--twinsfan
Post #: 1108
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/23/2019 10:17:33 PM   
Ragnarök


Posts: 2274
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: bstinger

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ragnarök

quote:

ORIGINAL: bstinger

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ragnarök

quote:

ORIGINAL: bstinger

Keenum sucks.

Case has got this... he plays best from behind when he has to carry the team...

You were saying...

I was being quite sarcastic... Case was playing his ass off though you have to admit, Trevathan has been an animal on D in this game, we must have an answer for that...

Case gave us an exciting season, but Kirk is a better QB. Maybe not what he signed for guaranteed, but still a better QB.


Two very different styles of QBs and both have flaws in their game and both heavily dependent on the offensive system they are operating under...

Neither will ever win a Super Bowl (bold but sound prediction)

Q-- If Kirk never sniffs the playoffs or goes one and done, and Case took us to the NFCCG does that still make Kirk a better QB in his Viking tenure?

Likely still jaded by the Cinderella Season with Case, but honestly Keenum plays with far more heart than the Tin Man could ever conjure up...

< Message edited by Ragnarök -- 9/23/2019 10:34:09 PM >
Post #: 1109
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/23/2019 11:37:12 PM   
JT2

 

Posts: 13742
Joined: 2/15/2011
From: United States
Status: offline 		If you think Cousins sucks, who should you really be mad at? We have a great track record identifying, acquiring and developing QB's, right? Hell, we paid Favre 13 million for his second season. Remember that one?

I think I had reasonable expectations of Cousins as a Viking. Not gonna' lie, he has yet to meet those expectations. I like that we were aggressive going after a QB. I hate that we were in a position to have to. And that's the real issue.

Get that slug TE off the field. Get even a mediocre #3 WR.

Cousins had arguably his best season in the NFL in 2015. Yes, for the lowly Redskins. He should be better now, on this team, right?
Post #: 1110
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/23/2019 11:48:34 PM   
David F.


Posts: 10864
Joined: 12/31/2007
Status: online 		In three games he has four catches for twenty yards.

_____________________________

I wouldn't give ANY qb $30-50+ mil unless that QB had won me a Super Bowl. Did you win a Super Bowl on your rookie deal? Yes? Great! Here's your hugenormous contract. F it let's just run victory laps and love life. No? Good luck. Next!
Post #: 1111
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/23/2019 11:49:36 PM   
Ragnarök


Posts: 2274
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: JT2

If you think Cousins sucks, who should you really be mad at? We have a great track record identifying, acquiring and developing QB's, right? Hell, we paid Favre 13 million for his second season. Remember that one?

I think I had reasonable expectations of Cousins as a Viking. Not gonna' lie, he has yet to meet those expectations. I like that we were aggressive going after a QB. I hate that we were in a position to have to. And that's the real issue.

Get that slug TE off the field. Get even a mediocre #3 WR.

Cousins had arguably his best season in the NFL in 2015. Yes, for the lowly Redskins. He should be better now, on this team, right?

Me thinking Cousins sucks has no causation in being mad or directing blame. He is what he is and was to this point a mistake but seen as best situation at time, Yes we as Vikings fans have a long tenure of watching our team sign stop gap type QBs and not developing our own in house talents. Is what it is...

Here is why 2015 was kind to Kirk besides a decent OL Kirk was an unknown and teams had little previous tape of his tendencies! THAT IS A BIG DEAL...

Offensive coaches

Offensive Coordinator – Sean McVay
Quarterbacks – Matt Cavanaugh
Running Backs – Randy Jordan
Wide Receivers – Ike Hilliard
Tight Ends – Wes Phillips
Offensive Line – Bill Callahan
Offensive Quality Control/Assistant Offensive Line – Shane Day
Offensive Quality Control – Dave Ragone

< Message edited by Ragnarök -- 9/23/2019 11:59:52 PM >
Post #: 1112
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/24/2019 12:05:51 AM   
Dana Turner


Posts: 1958
Joined: 7/27/2007
Status: offline 		I just watched a replay of a TD thrown by Rogers this weekend. He hard counts the Broncos in to jumping off sides, but the problem I have is that the offensive linemen move before the ball is snapped. They (the refs) let the play go and the Packers score a 40 yard TD, but that play should have been stopped when the O-line guys moved because of the defensive guy jumping into the neutral zone. This is of course not reviewable, but it's an obvious miss by the guys in the stripes and since they are playing in GB, it just adds to the legacy of calls going the Packers way when they are at home. As soon as an offensive guy moves prior to the ball being snapped the play is dead, doesn't matter if there is a defensive linemen in the neutral zone or not, that play should have been blown dead, what were the line judges watching, hell it's an easy spot, I saw it ib a replay and they are right there on the field looking down the line, sheesh, just bad.

< Message edited by Dana Turner -- 9/24/2019 12:10:23 AM >
Post #: 1113
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/24/2019 3:15:46 AM   
JT2

 

Posts: 13742
Joined: 2/15/2011
From: United States
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Ragnarök

quote:

ORIGINAL: JT2

If you think Cousins sucks, who should you really be mad at? We have a great track record identifying, acquiring and developing QB's, right? Hell, we paid Favre 13 million for his second season. Remember that one?

I think I had reasonable expectations of Cousins as a Viking. Not gonna' lie, he has yet to meet those expectations. I like that we were aggressive going after a QB. I hate that we were in a position to have to. And that's the real issue.

Get that slug TE off the field. Get even a mediocre #3 WR.

Cousins had arguably his best season in the NFL in 2015. Yes, for the lowly Redskins. He should be better now, on this team, right?

Me thinking Cousins sucks has no causation in being mad or directing blame. He is what he is and was to this point a mistake but seen as best situation at time, Yes we as Vikings fans have a long tenure of watching our team sign stop gap type QBs and not developing our own in house talents. Is what it is...

Here is why 2015 was kind to Kirk besides a decent OL Kirk was an unknown and teams had little previous tape of his tendencies! THAT IS A BIG DEAL...

Offensive coaches

Offensive Coordinator – Sean McVay
Quarterbacks – Matt Cavanaugh
Running Backs – Randy Jordan
Wide Receivers – Ike Hilliard
Tight Ends – Wes Phillips
Offensive Line – Bill Callahan
Offensive Quality Control/Assistant Offensive Line – Shane Day
Offensive Quality Control – Dave Ragone


That's a ridiculous statement. No current QB in the league has been more "tape"-studied than Tom Brady. How's that working for opposing defenses?

I doubt Luke Falk's "tape" has been studied much. Struggling to find the advantage he gained.

Brady is approaching 10,000 passes attempted in the NFL. What are his tendencies?
Post #: 1114
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/24/2019 7:26:14 AM   
thebigo


Posts: 28303
Joined: 7/14/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: JT2

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ragnarök

quote:

ORIGINAL: JT2

If you think Cousins sucks, who should you really be mad at? We have a great track record identifying, acquiring and developing QB's, right? Hell, we paid Favre 13 million for his second season. Remember that one?

I think I had reasonable expectations of Cousins as a Viking. Not gonna' lie, he has yet to meet those expectations. I like that we were aggressive going after a QB. I hate that we were in a position to have to. And that's the real issue.

Get that slug TE off the field. Get even a mediocre #3 WR.

Cousins had arguably his best season in the NFL in 2015. Yes, for the lowly Redskins. He should be better now, on this team, right?

Me thinking Cousins sucks has no causation in being mad or directing blame. He is what he is and was to this point a mistake but seen as best situation at time, Yes we as Vikings fans have a long tenure of watching our team sign stop gap type QBs and not developing our own in house talents. Is what it is...

Here is why 2015 was kind to Kirk besides a decent OL Kirk was an unknown and teams had little previous tape of his tendencies! THAT IS A BIG DEAL...

Offensive coaches

Offensive Coordinator – Sean McVay
Quarterbacks – Matt Cavanaugh
Running Backs – Randy Jordan
Wide Receivers – Ike Hilliard
Tight Ends – Wes Phillips
Offensive Line – Bill Callahan
Offensive Quality Control/Assistant Offensive Line – Shane Day
Offensive Quality Control – Dave Ragone


That's a ridiculous statement. No current QB in the league has been more "tape"-studied than Tom Brady. How's that working for opposing defenses?

I doubt Luke Falk's "tape" has been studied much. Struggling to find the advantage he gained.

Brady is approaching 10,000 passes attempted in the NFL. What are his tendencies?


From what I've seen, he tends to throw 'em.
Post #: 1115
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/24/2019 7:46:15 AM   
Ragnarök


Posts: 2274
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: JT2

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ragnarök

quote:

ORIGINAL: JT2

If you think Cousins sucks, who should you really be mad at? We have a great track record identifying, acquiring and developing QB's, right? Hell, we paid Favre 13 million for his second season. Remember that one?

I think I had reasonable expectations of Cousins as a Viking. Not gonna' lie, he has yet to meet those expectations. I like that we were aggressive going after a QB. I hate that we were in a position to have to. And that's the real issue.

Get that slug TE off the field. Get even a mediocre #3 WR.

Cousins had arguably his best season in the NFL in 2015. Yes, for the lowly Redskins. He should be better now, on this team, right?

Me thinking Cousins sucks has no causation in being mad or directing blame. He is what he is and was to this point a mistake but seen as best situation at time, Yes we as Vikings fans have a long tenure of watching our team sign stop gap type QBs and not developing our own in house talents. Is what it is...

Here is why 2015 was kind to Kirk besides a decent OL Kirk was an unknown and teams had little previous tape of his tendencies! THAT IS A BIG DEAL...

Offensive coaches

Offensive Coordinator – Sean McVay
Quarterbacks – Matt Cavanaugh
Running Backs – Randy Jordan
Wide Receivers – Ike Hilliard
Tight Ends – Wes Phillips
Offensive Line – Bill Callahan
Offensive Quality Control/Assistant Offensive Line – Shane Day
Offensive Quality Control – Dave Ragone


That's a ridiculous statement. No current QB in the league has been more "tape"-studied than Tom Brady. How's that working for opposing defenses?

I doubt Luke Falk's "tape" has been studied much. Struggling to find the advantage he gained.

Brady is approaching 10,000 passes attempted in the NFL. What are his tendencies?


Exactly my point, Brady has high talent and lack of tells and tendencies that make him a far superior QB as well as some of best coaching and game planning in league...

Kirk Cousins in 2015 benefited from a solid lack of exposure and game film of his flaws as well as superior coaching that set him up for success and built confidence in that system. Brady has Belechick, in 2015 Cousinns had Sean McVay and company.... we saw what pairing a incorrect OC did with Kirks skill set in DeFlippo experiment last year.

My point was it is the quality of system and coaching much of the time that a QB is operating in but that said QB must also possess skill set to make him excel. There is no comparing Brady to Cousins in that respect...

< Message edited by Ragnarök -- 9/24/2019 7:50:23 AM >
Post #: 1116
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/24/2019 8:00:28 AM   
Phil Riewer


Posts: 27431
Joined: 8/24/2007
From: MN
Status: offline 		I think Kirk is going to have a great year. Why you ask? New system with Stepanski and 2 Super Bowl Coaches in Kubiak and Dennison that is helping make Cook a star(with better health to start) plus they have an improved oline and a nice fast, athletic 2nd TE and a very athletic 2nd and 3rd RB to boot. Now if Beebe, Johnson, and later in the year Doctson can provide just a little (500 yards and a few scores) it will be tough to stop this offense.

Now many are still calling for Case but they forget about Shurmur.....Shurmur play calling made Case...not the other way around.

Shurmur masked Case's faults and our oline, rb (after the cook injury), and lack of talent on the Oline. Everyone talks about that 2017 team but they forget the man that made it happen on offense.....it was Shurmur. He was masterful in his game plans.

If you look back at one of the main reasons for not giving Case a big contract was that Shurmur was leaving for NY.

< Message edited by Phil Riewer -- 9/24/2019 8:07:27 AM >

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Post #: 1117
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/24/2019 8:03:01 AM   
Bill Jandro

 

Posts: 17929
Joined: 8/13/2007
Status: offline 		Hicks suffered a knee injury last night and Gabriel left game with a concussion.

Wash turned the ball over 5 times. We need to have a turnover free game in order to escape Chi town with a win.

_____________________________

Oline...early and often this draft
Post #: 1118
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/24/2019 9:05:15 AM   
TJSweens


Posts: 45022
Joined: 7/16/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

I think Kirk is going to have a great year. Why you ask? New system with Stepanski and 2 Super Bowl Coaches in Kubiak and Dennison that is helping make Cook a star(with better health to start) plus they have an improved oline and a nice fast, athletic 2nd TE and a very athletic 2nd and 3rd RB to boot. Now if Beebe, Johnson, and later in the year Doctson can provide just a little (500 yards and a few scores) it will be tough to stop this offense.

Now many are still calling for Case but they forget about Shurmur.....Shurmur play calling made Case...not the other way around.

Shurmur masked Case's faults and our oline, rb (after the cook injury), and lack of talent on the Oline. Everyone talks about that 2017 team but they forget the man that made it happen on offense.....it was Shurmur. He was masterful in his game plans.

If you look back at one of the main reasons for not giving Case a big contract was that Shurmur was leaving for NY.

That was only a part of the equation. Case led a charmed life at a level very few QB enjoy at any point in their careers. He threw a ton blind passes, a couple where he even had back turned, that receivers were able to run down, out hustle and out fight defenders to either catch or break up.

_____________________________

"The eternal fate of the noble and enlightened: to be brutally crushed by the armed and dumb."
Post #: 1119
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/24/2019 9:08:14 AM   
Bill Jandro

 

Posts: 17929
Joined: 8/13/2007
Status: offline 		Beebe will undergo an MRI on his injured ankle after Sunday's 34-14 win against the Raiders, Tom Pelissero of NFL Network reports.

Prior to leaving the contest, Beebe muffed a punt, committed a 15-yard penalty for an illegal block above the waist, and didn't contribute anything on offense. The upcoming examination will determine if Beebe will require any time away from the field.

Beebe has been a disappointment to say the least.

_____________________________

Oline...early and often this draft
Post #: 1120
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/24/2019 9:35:06 AM   
Bruce Johnson

 

Posts: 16353
Joined: 8/27/2007
Status: offline 		I want to see what Olabisi Johnson can do. Still, I want to see lots of multiple tight end formations even more. That seems to be the strength of our team.

_____________________________

We live in a world where we depend upon each other. In other words, we need each other just as God needs us and we need Him. How wonderful it would be if we could unite and live in harmony. Wouldn't it be better that way?
Post #: 1121
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/24/2019 9:37:54 AM   
jbusse

 

Posts: 1309
Joined: 9/11/2013
From: Atlanta, GA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

Beebe will undergo an MRI on his injured ankle after Sunday's 34-14 win against the Raiders, Tom Pelissero of NFL Network reports.

Prior to leaving the contest, Beebe muffed a punt, committed a 15-yard penalty for an illegal block above the waist, and didn't contribute anything on offense. The upcoming examination will determine if Beebe will require any time away from the field.

Beebe has been a disappointment to say the least.

Torn ligaments per Pelissero.
Post #: 1122
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/24/2019 9:43:08 AM   
jbusse

 

Posts: 1309
Joined: 9/11/2013
From: Atlanta, GA
Status: offline 		Signing Laquon per Courtney Cronin.
Post #: 1123
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/24/2019 9:55:50 AM   
Bruce Johnson

 

Posts: 16353
Joined: 8/27/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

Signing Laquon per Courtney Cronin.


Wow!

_____________________________

We live in a world where we depend upon each other. In other words, we need each other just as God needs us and we need Him. How wonderful it would be if we could unite and live in harmony. Wouldn't it be better that way?
Post #: 1124
RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/24/2019 9:59:40 AM   
jbusse

 

Posts: 1309
Joined: 9/11/2013
From: Atlanta, GA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson

quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

Signing Laquon per Courtney Cronin.


Wow!

Or Wow!
Post #: 1125
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