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RE: MLB General Information PT 4

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RE: MLB General Information PT 4 - 10/12/2017 11:58:08 AM   
ewen21

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

Kneeling is not killing the NFL by any stretch of the imagination. Why do you think the NFL is not enforcing anything? Disrespectful is your opinion, not a fact. The protesters see it as an accurate reflection of what America is. Two Americas. One for the white and affluent. Another one for the minorities. The flag stands for all the rights granted under the constitution. And I will condemn anyone for exercising those rights. You want to end the protests? Do something about the issues that are behind them.


See, I have actually taught in an inner city classroom. I've also worked in two different RTFs with a lot of minority teens.

This opens the door for so much more shit and thus far the protests have accomplished nothing after 14 months. I suggest people start reading more and going over the statistics. I would also tell the players to chose some leaders to represent the league and get to the dialogue portion of this, otherwise this is just silliness

_____________________________

The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is its natural manure"

--Thom Jefferson"
Post #: 9751
RE: MLB General Information PT 4 - 10/12/2017 12:05:48 PM   
TJSweens


Posts: 45028
Joined: 7/16/2007
Status: offline 		I agree, we need to move the discussion forward. Granted NFL stars have more leverage because let's face it, the owners are not going to bench star players over it. The problem is that the whole situation becomes a catch 22. Exercise free speech in a way garners attention and the method of speech becomes the issue instead of the underlying cause of the protest. Utilize a method that doesn't offend and nobody pays attention and nothing gets done. These players have apparently decided to stay the course until the topic turns to the underlying cause instead of the method of expression. I would probably be a bit more sympathetic to the people expressing outrage if I thought they were actually standing in their living rooms with their hands over their hearts while the anthem plays. But let's face it; they are sitting in their recliners with a beer and a sandwich or making a last minute trip to the kitchen or taking a pre game leak. The vast majority of them couldn't have cared less about the anthem until they heard players were kneeling.

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Post #: 9752
RE: MLB General Information PT 4 - 10/12/2017 12:56:54 PM   
SoMnFan


Posts: 94902
Status: offline 		Great posts this morning people.
So tired of it all, but glad people are somewhat calmly discussing it.

Colin Kapernick had outstanding intentions IMO.
He screwed up a couple times along the way. The pig socks was a horrible decision.
I support his original intentions one thousand percent.
I also admire that he consulted With respected veterans and THEY suggested he kneel rather than his original sitting.
It appears all of us look at the national anthem being played at sporting events differently.
Some love it. Some accept it. Some ignore it. Some find it completely out of place and unnecessary.
We will never agree on its importance or need.

The current President had a right to express his opinion about the subject, but it is not his place to force anyone to react or behave a certain way, IMO.
He completely crossed the line when he spoke of firing the "sons of bitches"
He played divider when we desperately needed a Uniter.
IMO soldiers fought for the rights of all of us, to do what we choose at times like this.
IMO, Kapernicks only gripe was with Social injustice. It had nothing to do with a flag or a soldier or a tradition.
He wanted people to know what he was upset with. It took a year for most, but it did speak to many, it just took awhile.

My only gripe with him is that he started a fight and now many young men and women minorities feel the same way are fighting FOR him, instead of beside him. Where is he now? Of course he's being blackballed, but he could get air time on any network he chooses (except Fox of course). Stand up now, and explain once again why you did what you did and what you hoped for. They need you. Be the Uniter they need.

< Message edited by SoMnFan -- 10/12/2017 1:00:26 PM >
Post #: 9753
RE: MLB General Information PT 4 - 10/12/2017 12:59:22 PM   
SoMnFan


Posts: 94902
Status: offline 		The Dallas Cowboys PLAYERS will make a huge statement the next time they take the field.
This could blow up. This could go away.
It will be an interesting Sunday. We keep saying that. But no ones fixing it.

< Message edited by SoMnFan -- 10/12/2017 1:09:35 PM >
Post #: 9754
RE: MLB General Information PT 4 - 10/12/2017 1:19:26 PM   
JT2

 

Posts: 13742
Joined: 2/15/2011
From: United States
Status: offline 		Great stuff Scott.
Post #: 9755
RE: MLB General Information PT 4 - 10/12/2017 1:32:23 PM   
MDK


Posts: 8647
Status: offline 		They don't play the anthem before golf matches.

_____________________________

2-3-1959
The day the music died
11-5-2025
The day US Democracy died
Post #: 9756
RE: MLB General Information PT 4 - 10/12/2017 1:38:21 PM   
JT2

 

Posts: 13742
Joined: 2/15/2011
From: United States
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MDK

They don't play the anthem before golf matches.



Golfers are tremendously unpatriotic.
Post #: 9757
RE: MLB General Information PT 4 - 10/12/2017 2:22:33 PM   
Trekgeekscott


Posts: 39296
Joined: 7/16/2007
From: United Federation of Planets
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Aaron Cross

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aaron Cross

Or maybe they should just follow the NFL rule that says players must stand for the anthem. The anthem is not the time or place for protests. It’s disrespectful whether they intend it to be or not.

Strange how the person who started this movement wore socks depicting cops as pigs. He also said the flag is a symbol of oppression. Yet the kneelers say they’re not protesting the flag?


Who are you to decide the proper time for protests? Get pulled over 50 times in 10 years for driving while black and get back to me on disrespectful. The words and deeds of one man do not necessarily reflect the opinions of all the kneelers. This is no different to me than Muhammad Ali throwing his Olympic gold medal in the river after returning from representing his country and being refused service in a restaurant. Or the black power salutes during the anthem at the 68 Olympics. These are a people who 50 years later still feel like there are two Americas. If they want to exercise the ultimate form of freedom, freedom of speech, to make their point they should go right ahead.

NFL rules state you stand for the national anthem. Don’t like it, change the rule. But as I said, kneeling for the anthem is disrespectful whether they intend it to be or not. On foreign soil kneeling for our anthem and standing for God bless the queen? That’s blatant disrespect.

If they want to protest racial inequality, how in thee hell do they hope to bring change by offending more than half the country?

The whole point of protest is to draw attention to a cause. Four guys sit a lunch counter not because they are hungry but to protest that they aren't allow to eat there because of the color of their skin. Rosa parks refuses to give a seat on the bus. That offends more than half of the local population...etc.

The protest is peaceful, it is not disrespectful. I served in the US Military for what that flag symbolizes. and their peaceful protest is right in line with the first amendment of the Constitution.

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Post #: 9758
RE: MLB General Information PT 4 - 10/12/2017 3:34:22 PM   
SoMnFan


Posts: 94902
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: JT2

quote:

ORIGINAL: MDK

They don't play the anthem before golf matches.



Golfers are tremendously unpatriotic.

Sons a Bitches!!!!!!
Post #: 9759
RE: MLB General Information PT 4 - 10/12/2017 3:35:09 PM   
SoMnFan


Posts: 94902
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MDK

They don't play the anthem before golf matches.

Interesting, aint it?
The angst towards spoiled white folk stays quiet most days, apparently ......
Post #: 9760
RE: MLB General Information PT 4 - 10/12/2017 3:41:04 PM   
MDK


Posts: 8647
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SoMnFan

quote:

ORIGINAL: MDK

They don't play the anthem before golf matches.

Interesting, aint it?
The angst towards spoiled white folk stays quiet most days, apparently ......


We call them job creators.

_____________________________

2-3-1959
The day the music died
11-5-2025
The day US Democracy died
Post #: 9761
RE: MLB General Information PT 4 - 10/12/2017 4:43:06 PM   
ewen21

 

Posts: 12293
Joined: 4/14/2013
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

I agree, we need to move the discussion forward. Granted NFL stars have more leverage because let's face it, the owners are not going to bench star players over it. The problem is that the whole situation becomes a catch 22. Exercise free speech in a way garners attention and the method of speech becomes the issue instead of the underlying cause of the protest. Utilize a method that doesn't offend and nobody pays attention and nothing gets done. These players have apparently decided to stay the course until the topic turns to the underlying cause instead of the method of expression. I would probably be a bit more sympathetic to the people expressing outrage if I thought they were actually standing in their living rooms with their hands over their hearts while the anthem plays. But let's face it; they are sitting in their recliners with a beer and a sandwich or making a last minute trip to the kitchen or taking a pre game leak. The vast majority of them couldn't have cared less about the anthem until they heard players were kneeling.


When people are at home they are supposed to stand? I'm old enough to remember stations signing off with the Anthem playing. You don't stand in from of a TV and do it. At the event you darn well know the people who are offended will remove their caps, stand and put their hands on their heart. I always do. Now all of a sudden that's a problem?

Sorry. I won't apologize for being turned off by this. I can't even watch on principle, and you know what?? That's just fine with me. I am far from the only one tuning out. This has gone on for over a year and there doesn't seem to be an end in site and that bothers me. I teach and my students all stand for the pledge. Many recite it. That's a moment were there is some modicum of unity and these players want to take a dump on it. The fact that this has gone on for over a year and no dialogue has been initiated tells me that so far they are more interested in pointing the finger and guilting people with this.

You don't protest at work. If you do they call that a strike. I know of no other field of employment where people do this. The Anthem was part and parcel of sporting events. It was a moment for reflection and appreciation. I don't like what's going on and I won't support the NFL because of it. These guys need to cut the crap and organized. It's gotten all the attention it's gonna get. Now what? If this is all they plan on doing indefinitely then I'll never watch. Call it what you will. Label me if you must.

_____________________________

The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is its natural manure"

--Thom Jefferson"
Post #: 9762
RE: MLB General Information PT 4 - 10/12/2017 5:11:10 PM   
ewen21

 

Posts: 12293
Joined: 4/14/2013
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MDK

They don't play the anthem before golf matches.


They with team sports. Not sure what is being insinuated?
White people who think kneeling during the Anthem are hypocrites?

Should I say I'm sorry? Maybe I can write a letter to nothing

_____________________________

The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is its natural manure"

--Thom Jefferson"
Post #: 9763
RE: MLB General Information PT 4 - 10/12/2017 5:17:06 PM   
JT2

 

Posts: 13742
Joined: 2/15/2011
From: United States
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ewen21

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

I agree, we need to move the discussion forward. Granted NFL stars have more leverage because let's face it, the owners are not going to bench star players over it. The problem is that the whole situation becomes a catch 22. Exercise free speech in a way garners attention and the method of speech becomes the issue instead of the underlying cause of the protest. Utilize a method that doesn't offend and nobody pays attention and nothing gets done. These players have apparently decided to stay the course until the topic turns to the underlying cause instead of the method of expression. I would probably be a bit more sympathetic to the people expressing outrage if I thought they were actually standing in their living rooms with their hands over their hearts while the anthem plays. But let's face it; they are sitting in their recliners with a beer and a sandwich or making a last minute trip to the kitchen or taking a pre game leak. The vast majority of them couldn't have cared less about the anthem until they heard players were kneeling.


When people are at home they are supposed to stand? I'm old enough to remember stations signing off with the Anthem playing. You don't stand in from of a TV and do it. At the event you darn well know the people who are offended will remove their caps, stand and put their hands on their heart. I always do. Now all of a sudden that's a problem?

Sorry. I won't apologize for being turned off by this. I can't even watch on principle, and you know what?? That's just fine with me. I am far from the only one tuning out. This has gone on for over a year and there doesn't seem to be an end in site and that bothers me. I teach and my students all stand for the pledge. Many recite it. That's a moment were there is some modicum of unity and these players want to take a dump on it. The fact that this has gone on for over a year and no dialogue has been initiated tells me that so far they are more interested in pointing the finger and guilting people with this.

You don't protest at work. If you do they call that a strike. I know of no other field of employment where people do this. The Anthem was part and parcel of sporting events. It was a moment for reflection and appreciation. I don't like what's going on and I won't support the NFL because of it. These guys need to cut the crap and organized. It's gotten all the attention it's gonna get. Now what? If this is all they plan on doing indefinitely then I'll never watch. Call it what you will. Label me if you must.



Just out of curiosity, did you support the Twins two years ago when the majority of them didn't stand on the field for the anthem?

Maybe that was different, because it wasn't a protest, they were just too busy tying shoes, tarring bats and adjusting cups.
Post #: 9764
RE: MLB General Information PT 4 - 10/12/2017 5:40:43 PM   
ewen21

 

Posts: 12293
Joined: 4/14/2013
Status: offline 		Bad post. At the eye doctor my pupils are dilated

Cut me a break

_____________________________

The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is its natural manure"

--Thom Jefferson"
Post #: 9765
RE: MLB General Information PT 4 - 10/12/2017 6:45:27 PM   
ewen21

 

Posts: 12293
Joined: 4/14/2013
Status: offline 		Why not just ask me...Are you more upset because the NFL is mostly black?
Is that the thought process here?

Let's go back to the genesis of all this and stop trying to draw parallels to golf and baseball. Makes no sense. It's comparing apples to trout. This started as a protest against law enforcement and an accusation was made that law enforcement was systemically racist. I don't agree with that. I also don't see an epidemic of white cops indiscriminately killing black people. Twice as many white people were killed, as a matter of fact. I understand blacks are about 1/6th the population compared to whites, but they do commit a disproportionate amount of violent crimes. This is just factual and I like to think I can cite that information because it serves to explain a big part of the issue. We can point the finger at the police, but I feel nervous stating a fact around here. How are we have going to look toward a solution when these essential facts aren't allowed in the conversation?

I've honestly been very much on this issue for years. I read the statitics and lots of other things regarding race and crime over the years. Maybe too much. I'm not saying anything that isn't true. Im interested in a solution so I really can't be shamed for disagreeing with these players. I'd be willing to talk to them. I don't think they study the numbers. These players need to familiarize themselves with the raw numbers. I really do want these players to take this to Congress. Bring the cameras in. Let's REALLY bring awareness to the substantive issue. Right now they at doing this without any real commitment to anything but putting on a display. Do something productive already. This is now embarrassing

_____________________________

The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is its natural manure"

--Thom Jefferson"
Post #: 9766
RE: MLB General Information PT 4 - 10/12/2017 6:52:55 PM   
SoMnFan


Posts: 94902
Status: offline 		Go Nats !!!
This will be a big one.
Post #: 9767
RE: MLB General Information PT 4 - 10/12/2017 6:59:20 PM   
twinsfan


Posts: 63642
Joined: 12/21/2009
Status: offline 		Just looked at the Cubs lineup for tonight's game. Not a good lineup.

_____________________________

“We are an unserious nation that's in serious $hit.”

-Me
Post #: 9768
RE: MLB General Information PT 4 - 10/12/2017 7:06:00 PM   
SoMnFan


Posts: 94902
Status: offline 		Did I just hear the Nats have never won a playoff series?
I really hadn't even thought that possible.
They've been pretty damn good for quite awhile now.
Post #: 9769
RE: MLB General Information PT 4 - 10/12/2017 7:11:18 PM   
twinsfan


Posts: 63642
Joined: 12/21/2009
Status: offline 		Why are the Nats challenging this?!?! Very stupid.

_____________________________

“We are an unserious nation that's in serious $hit.”

-Me
Post #: 9770
RE: MLB General Information PT 4 - 10/12/2017 7:12:09 PM   
twinsfan


Posts: 63642
Joined: 12/21/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SoMnFan

Did I just hear the Nats have never won a playoff series?
I really hadn't even thought that possible.
They've been pretty damn good for quite awhile now.

Expos never won a playoff series either.

_____________________________

“We are an unserious nation that's in serious $hit.”

-Me
Post #: 9771
RE: MLB General Information PT 4 - 10/12/2017 7:12:48 PM   
SoMnFan


Posts: 94902
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: twinsfan

Why are the Nats challenging this?!?! Very stupid.

Joe Girardi Overreaction Syndrome.
Post #: 9772
RE: MLB General Information PT 4 - 10/12/2017 7:16:07 PM   
twinsfan


Posts: 63642
Joined: 12/21/2009
Status: offline 		Small ball

_____________________________

“We are an unserious nation that's in serious $hit.”

-Me
Post #: 9773
RE: MLB General Information PT 4 - 10/12/2017 7:17:31 PM   
twinsfan


Posts: 63642
Joined: 12/21/2009
Status: offline 		That damn wild pitch was a killer.

_____________________________

“We are an unserious nation that's in serious $hit.”

-Me
Post #: 9774
RE: MLB General Information PT 4 - 10/12/2017 7:18:14 PM   
twinsfan


Posts: 63642
Joined: 12/21/2009
Status: offline 		Let's see that pitch again. Looked like Strike 3 to me.

_____________________________

“We are an unserious nation that's in serious $hit.”

-Me
Post #: 9775
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