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Brad H -> RE: General Vikes Talk (1/2/2023 7:05:29 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H quote: ORIGINAL: Arlowe84 quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H quote: ORIGINAL: joejitsu It sounds like O’Neill’s calf injury is worse than evpected. That’s not what I wanted to hear. Calf injuries are not something to mess with. They should shut him down. The way he was carted off, I was assuming a tear, so not sure what "worse than expected" means Calf muscle leads to the achilles. You don't mess with that. I've torn a calf muscle before. Hurts like hell. No chance of playing for a couple of weeks, perhaps even a month, if that is what happened. If he's out season over. No chance of winning wild card weekend. This team is still 1-2 linemen short of being a good offensive line. They have no depth whatsoever. And that goes for a lot of positions. It partially comes from paying the quarterback three times as much as he is worth.

marty -> RE: General Vikes Talk (1/2/2023 7:51:00 PM)
Lots of great points and discussions, thanks for the good writings peoples. I have little bit of a queasy feeling with Mr. 4th and 26, just like I did with Richard Solomon (Denny Green's buddy that made the 2ndry suck for years). The feeling I have is that while both are awful, they mask the fact that the head coach isn't really a head coach that will win a Super Bowl. Maybe Denny Green and KOC were at their best as OCs ?

Arlowe84 -> RE: General Vikes Talk (1/2/2023 7:52:55 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H quote: ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H quote: ORIGINAL: Arlowe84 quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H quote: ORIGINAL: joejitsu It sounds like O’Neill’s calf injury is worse than evpected. That’s not what I wanted to hear. Calf injuries are not something to mess with. They should shut him down. The way he was carted off, I was assuming a tear, so not sure what "worse than expected" means Calf muscle leads to the achilles. You don't mess with that. I've torn a calf muscle before. Hurts like hell. No chance of playing for a couple of weeks, perhaps even a month, if that is what happened. If he's out season over. No chance of winning wild card weekend. This team is still 1-2 linemen short of being a good offensive line. They have no depth whatsoever. And that goes for a lot of positions. It partially comes from paying the quarterback three times as much as he is worth. Spielman did some nice things, but ultimately his demise is he made too many bad decisions. Sometimes the bad decisions impact the team more than the good ones. And this has followed him pretty much everywhere he's been He'll throw some gems in, but he also has some air balls. Cook contract was just a bad decision in today's NFL. You have to spend your money wisely, and he's not worth the money IMO He swung and missed on OL for years. Getting O'Neil, Cleveland and Darrisaw took like 5 years I'll admit I was calling Bradbury a bust, but the current coaching staff seems to have gotten him to an acceptable level IMO

Bill Jandro -> RE: General Vikes Talk (1/2/2023 8:37:14 PM)
KOC seems like the type that will give Donatell next year, to prove it with "his" players. How do you justify keeping a DC that has the 32nd ranked defense?

Daniel Lee Young -> RE: General Vikes Talk (1/2/2023 9:38:32 PM)
You don’t and shouldn’t do that. Ne excuses, no regurts…. Fire his ass at 00:00 of last game of this season. Period.. Fn dinosaur..

Daniel Lee Young -> RE: General Vikes Talk (1/2/2023 9:44:57 PM)
KAM needs to sit KOC and Donatello down and let them know that the defense is inexcusable and it changes immediately.

ratoppenheimer -> RE: General Vikes Talk (1/3/2023 1:28:42 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Daniel Lee Young KAM needs to sit KOC and Donatello down and let them know that the defense is inexcusable and it changes immediately. i agree with this; first order of business in to save this season....

Bill Johanesen -> RE: General Vikes Talk (1/3/2023 8:43:47 AM)
Maybe this offseason more than most it will be helpful to cage or qualify posts about plans & decisions: - I think the regime should... - I think the regime will... Two entirely different things. The latter is great when the replies stay on track because posters offer a broad range of pros and cons.

ronhextall -> RE: General Vikes Talk (1/3/2023 8:44:29 AM)
KOC would be making a huge gamble keeping Donatello. Assuming 11-0 in one score games isn't going to happen again the defense is going to have to improve by leaps and bounds to approach 12-13 wins. If next season tanks Donatello won't be the only once fans and media start questioning.

Bill Johanesen -> RE: General Vikes Talk (1/3/2023 9:42:30 AM)
Without a tremendous amount of luck in free agency and instant impact from a limited draft class this offseason, I don't understand how the defense can be good next year regardless of who the DC is. They can cut Harrison Smith, Kendricks, Hicks, and several others to gain cap, but the $30 million figure I've read here isn't very much. It's like the minimum you need to stay afloat, and we have to sign Hockensen. So they will have to strike gold on the couple of mid-tier and several low to mid-tier types they sign. That is fool's gold. And any draftees will have to be able to contribute right away or by default they are no help. Ugh, based on 2022 that is a sickening thought. Then you potentially have a new defensive scheme. No DT to provide a rush inside, scraps at DE. Za Smith with no position. Who would even want to be the DC of that mess? Just what expectations do people have even if we managed to somehow get a top flight DC??

Brad H -> RE: General Vikes Talk (1/3/2023 9:57:17 AM)
The worst thing the Vikings could do right now is give Cousins any type of extension (count your blessings we aren't 6-10 with this defense). They have been very fortunate that this team will reach the playoffs. In any other given year this team could just as easily be 7-9, 8-8 heading into the final week of the season. Cousins is under contract for one more year (as I understand it). I would bet almost every cent I have in the bank that he tries to renegotiate during the off-season. Management has to do everything it can to say no. That means we need to start looking at quarterbacks for the draft so we can get a guy in and groom him. Or, look at potential free agent quarterbacks to sign during the offseason. One more year until we can take off the 50-pound weight around our necks. Until then, the defense isn't going to be much better unless we have a witch running the defense. There isn't much talent there, and what is talented is pretty old. As I see it, there is at a minimum between 6-8 teams looking for a quarterback. IMO, the Vikings need to start thinking about this.

ronhextall -> RE: General Vikes Talk (1/3/2023 9:57:17 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen Without a tremendous amount of luck in free agency and instant impact from a limited draft class this offseason, I don't understand how the defense can be good next year regardless of who the DC is. They can cut Harrison Smith, Kendricks, Hicks, and several others to gain cap, but the $30 million figure I've read here isn't very much. It's like the minimum you need to stay afloat, and we have to sign Hockensen. So they will have to strike gold on the couple of mid-tier and several low to mid-tier types they sign. That is fool's gold. And any draftees will have to be able to contribute right away or by default they are no help. Ugh, based on 2022 that is a sickening thought. Then you potentially have a new defensive scheme. No DT to provide a rush inside, scraps at DE. Za Smith with no position. Who would even want to be the DC of that mess? Just what expectations do people have even if we managed to somehow get a top flight DC?? I would trade/sign FA for the best DB possible. Hope a new DC can generate a pass rush. Frankly, I think spending big money on Linebackers and Safeties is a waste of money. You need a pass rush and shutdown corners the rest just doesn't matter.

Bill Johanesen -> RE: General Vikes Talk (1/3/2023 10:00:48 AM)
Last offseason many predicted a roundabout .500 season. Some also said (and I totally agree) that without Kwesi making the tough decisions, we will only be good enough to string together several seasons of mediocrity thereby assuring mediocre draft slots. Due to a crazy range of uncanny things "unlikely to be earned" next year lol, we ended up with a far better record but IMO are essentially a team that plays like it is only "still in the hunt" for the last playoff spot. We will be going into the offseason perhaps 32nd (last) in terms of combined cap and draft assets. So related to expectations for the defense, just what do people expect for next year as a whole? Another playoff run? Barring an improbable SB run - or even with a SB run - I say this chapter of the Vikings needs to be blown up.

marty -> RE: General Vikes Talk (1/3/2023 10:02:37 AM)
Without a tremendous amount of luck in free agency and instant impact from a limited draft class this offseason, I don't understand how the defense can be good next year regardless of who the DC is Just a simple change back to a 4-3, and a more aggressive scheme that blitzes, could easily boost the defense up 15 spots. You could hit on a FA pickup, or the 1st round draft pick. And then there is also the possibility of the highly drafted safety and cornerback from the past draft coming back, and flourishing in the new system. And then you have an explosive offense to help you, with Cousins in the 2nd year of being in a great system. What great defensive coordinator would NOT want this position?

Brad H -> RE: General Vikes Talk (1/3/2023 10:04:51 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen Last offseason many predicted a roundabout .500 season. Some also said (and I totally agree) that without Kwesi making the tough decisions, we will only be good enough to string together several seasons of mediocrity thereby assuring mediocre draft slots. Due to a crazy range of uncanny things "unlikely to be earned" next year lol, we ended up with a far better record but IMO are essentially a team that plays like it is only "still in the hunt" for the last playoff spot. We will be going into the offseason perhaps 32nd (last) in terms of combined cap and draft assets. So related to expectations for the defense, just what do people expect for next year as a whole? Another playoff run? Barring an improbable SB run - or even with a SB run - I say this chapter of the Vikings needs to be blown up. I say the Vikes find a sucker to trade Cousins to. Heck, even Washington may want him back. The Raiders? The Jets always seem to have an appetite for bad quarterbacks. New Orleans?

marty -> RE: General Vikes Talk (1/3/2023 10:05:32 AM)
I think the Vikings have more studs on defense than the Giants, and the Giants are ranked #16, I think mostly from a more aggressive scheme. Get Vic Fangio at defensive coordinator next season, and this defense will be ranked no less than #15, and could be top 10.

Bill Johanesen -> RE: General Vikes Talk (1/3/2023 10:11:17 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ronhextall quote: ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen Without a tremendous amount of luck in free agency and instant impact from a limited draft class this offseason, I don't understand how the defense can be good next year regardless of who the DC is. They can cut Harrison Smith, Kendricks, Hicks, and several others to gain cap, but the $30 million figure I've read here isn't very much. It's like the minimum you need to stay afloat, and we have to sign Hockensen. So they will have to strike gold on the couple of mid-tier and several low to mid-tier types they sign. That is fool's gold. And any draftees will have to be able to contribute right away or by default they are no help. Ugh, based on 2022 that is a sickening thought. Then you potentially have a new defensive scheme. No DT to provide a rush inside, scraps at DE. Za Smith with no position. Who would even want to be the DC of that mess? Just what expectations do people have even if we managed to somehow get a top flight DC?? I would trade/sign FA for the best DB possible. Hope a new DC can generate a pass rush. Frankly, I think spending big money on Linebackers and Safeties is a waste of money. You need a pass rush and shutdown corners the rest just doesn't matter. Right now for 2023 we are 26th in cap space at $ -7.4 million. Top CBs sometimes do hit the market, but end up signing for obscene amounts. We will not be in the running for a star CB. Nor even an upper tier one. Maybe we will be able to be competitive in the mid-tier category. Our 'splash' signing. As for last in cap + draft assets, I misspoke. The Saints are $ -58 million AND Philly has at least their 1st round pick. The Bears have $ 119 million in cap space.

TJSweens -> RE: General Vikes Talk (1/3/2023 10:13:42 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: marty Just a simple change back to a 4-3, and a more aggressive scheme that blitzes, could easily boost the defense up 15 spots. Essentially the same personnel played an aggressive 4-3 last year. They weren't 15 spots better.

Bill Johanesen -> RE: General Vikes Talk (1/3/2023 10:14:10 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: marty Without a tremendous amount of luck in free agency and instant impact from a limited draft class this offseason, I don't understand how the defense can be good next year regardless of who the DC is Just a simple change back to a 4-3, and a more aggressive scheme that blitzes, could easily boost the defense up 15 spots. You could hit on a FA pickup, or the 1st round draft pick. And then there is also the possibility of the highly drafted safety and cornerback from the past draft coming back, and flourishing in the new system. And then you have an explosive offense to help you, with Cousins in the 2nd year of being in a great system. What great defensive coordinator would NOT want this position? Both sides of this coin are relying on opinion and speculation, but I at least am going off history, being realistic, considering odds, and factoring in cap implications.

Bill Johanesen -> RE: General Vikes Talk (1/3/2023 10:15:59 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H The worst thing the Vikings could do right now is give Cousins any type of extension (count your blessings we aren't 6-10 with this defense). They have been very fortunate that this team will reach the playoffs. In any other given year this team could just as easily be 7-9, 8-8 heading into the final week of the season. Cousins is under contract for one more year (as I understand it). I would bet almost every cent I have in the bank that he tries to renegotiate during the off-season. Management has to do everything it can to say no. That means we need to start looking at quarterbacks for the draft so we can get a guy in and groom him. Or, look at potential free agent quarterbacks to sign during the offseason. One more year until we can take off the 50-pound weight around our necks. Until then, the defense isn't going to be much better unless we have a witch running the defense. There isn't much talent there, and what is talented is pretty old. As I see it, there is at a minimum between 6-8 teams looking for a quarterback. IMO, the Vikings need to start thinking about this. Cousins extension last year is the sticking point in the 2023 rebuild option. He's not movable.

Bill Johanesen -> RE: General Vikes Talk (1/3/2023 10:18:16 AM)
More studs on defense than the Giants? I don't know nor care about speculation of the Giants D personnel, but who are our studs on defense?

Brad H -> RE: General Vikes Talk (1/3/2023 10:19:35 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H The worst thing the Vikings could do right now is give Cousins any type of extension (count your blessings we aren't 6-10 with this defense). They have been very fortunate that this team will reach the playoffs. In any other given year this team could just as easily be 7-9, 8-8 heading into the final week of the season. Cousins is under contract for one more year (as I understand it). I would bet almost every cent I have in the bank that he tries to renegotiate during the off-season. Management has to do everything it can to say no. That means we need to start looking at quarterbacks for the draft so we can get a guy in and groom him. Or, look at potential free agent quarterbacks to sign during the offseason. One more year until we can take off the 50-pound weight around our necks. Until then, the defense isn't going to be much better unless we have a witch running the defense. There isn't much talent there, and what is talented is pretty old. As I see it, there is at a minimum between 6-8 teams looking for a quarterback. IMO, the Vikings need to start thinking about this. Cousins extension last year is the sticking point in the 2023 rebuild option. He's not movable. Bummer. I know very little about contract issues.

TJSweens -> RE: General Vikes Talk (1/3/2023 10:21:45 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H The worst thing the Vikings could do right now is give Cousins any type of extension (count your blessings we aren't 6-10 with this defense). They have been very fortunate that this team will reach the playoffs. In any other given year this team could just as easily be 7-9, 8-8 heading into the final week of the season. Cousins is under contract for one more year (as I understand it). I would bet almost every cent I have in the bank that he tries to renegotiate during the off-season. Management has to do everything it can to say no. That means we need to start looking at quarterbacks for the draft so we can get a guy in and groom him. Or, look at potential free agent quarterbacks to sign during the offseason. One more year until we can take off the 50-pound weight around our necks. Until then, the defense isn't going to be much better unless we have a witch running the defense. There isn't much talent there, and what is talented is pretty old. As I see it, there is at a minimum between 6-8 teams looking for a quarterback. IMO, the Vikings need to start thinking about this. Cousins extension last year is the sticking point in the 2023 rebuild option. He's not movable. Why not? He will only cost $6M in dead cap if we move him after June 1.

bstinger -> RE: General Vikes Talk (1/3/2023 10:24:40 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H quote: ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen Last offseason many predicted a roundabout .500 season. Some also said (and I totally agree) that without Kwesi making the tough decisions, we will only be good enough to string together several seasons of mediocrity thereby assuring mediocre draft slots. Due to a crazy range of uncanny things "unlikely to be earned" next year lol, we ended up with a far better record but IMO are essentially a team that plays like it is only "still in the hunt" for the last playoff spot. We will be going into the offseason perhaps 32nd (last) in terms of combined cap and draft assets. So related to expectations for the defense, just what do people expect for next year as a whole? Another playoff run? Barring an improbable SB run - or even with a SB run - I say this chapter of the Vikings needs to be blown up. I say the Vikes find a sucker to trade Cousins to. Heck, even Washington may want him back. The Raiders? The Jets always seem to have an appetite for bad quarterbacks. New Orleans? He has a NTC.

Brad H -> RE: General Vikes Talk (1/3/2023 10:25:16 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: bstinger quote: ORIGINAL: Brad H quote: ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen Last offseason many predicted a roundabout .500 season. Some also said (and I totally agree) that without Kwesi making the tough decisions, we will only be good enough to string together several seasons of mediocrity thereby assuring mediocre draft slots. Due to a crazy range of uncanny things "unlikely to be earned" next year lol, we ended up with a far better record but IMO are essentially a team that plays like it is only "still in the hunt" for the last playoff spot. We will be going into the offseason perhaps 32nd (last) in terms of combined cap and draft assets. So related to expectations for the defense, just what do people expect for next year as a whole? Another playoff run? Barring an improbable SB run - or even with a SB run - I say this chapter of the Vikings needs to be blown up. I say the Vikes find a sucker to trade Cousins to. Heck, even Washington may want him back. The Raiders? The Jets always seem to have an appetite for bad quarterbacks. New Orleans? He has a NTC. Bummer. I would also add a no extension clause.

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