RE: Predictions for Next Week (and maybe beyond) (Full Version)

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kgdabom -> RE: Predictions for Next Week (and maybe beyond) (7/29/2024 10:19:15 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

I don’t think JJM is going to start a game this year. Maybe one at the end of were eliminated or seeding is set. I hope he gets some opportunities to wrap up a game or 2 though.

I see KOC being pretty firm on sitting JJM for the year.

Would you still make this prediction today?




Ricky J -> RE: Predictions for Next Week (and maybe beyond) (7/29/2024 10:45:15 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

I don’t think JJM is going to start a game this year. Maybe one at the end of were eliminated or seeding is set. I hope he gets some opportunities to wrap up a game or 2 though.

I see KOC being pretty firm on sitting JJM for the year.

Would you still make this prediction today?

Why, what's happened that he'd change his mind?




Dave Odle -> RE: Predictions for Next Week (and maybe beyond) (7/29/2024 5:10:20 PM)

I haven't been following training camp as ardently this year. It sounds like JJ is holding his own and Darnold is looking better, but not by a ton.




Mark C. Johnson -> RE: Predictions for Next Week (and maybe beyond) (7/30/2024 3:02:33 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

I don’t think JJM is going to start a game this year. Maybe one at the end of were eliminated or seeding is set. I hope he gets some opportunities to wrap up a game or 2 though.

I see KOC being pretty firm on sitting JJM for the year.

Would you still make this prediction today?



If Darnold is playing at a high level, then I could see JJ sitting all year if we're in realistic contention for a playoff spot. But, I've got serious reservations that Darnold is capable of playing at that level. There is no evidence from his career thus far that he can do so. It's certainly "possible" but seems unlikely. If Darnold plays poorly, what is the point of sitting the rookie for an entire year? What does that achieve if the guy ahead of him is playing poorly? Don't even start with Mullens. Why is that guy even on the team? There is NO WAY I'd play Mullens over JJ.




Jeff Jesser -> RE: Predictions for Next Week (and maybe beyond) (7/30/2024 4:05:31 PM)

I fully expect Mullens to be traded before the deadline. You're right. Not a single reason to start him. He's not good enough to play long stretches but he's good enough to get you a couple wins.

If it's comes down to that just play JJ, let him grow and pick up a better draft pick. It's basically a learning year anyway.




thebigo -> RE: Predictions for Next Week (and maybe beyond) (7/30/2024 7:30:47 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeff Jesser

I fully expect Mullens to be traded before the deadline. You're right. Not a single reason to start him. He's not good enough to play long stretches but he's good enough to get you a couple wins.

If it's comes down to that just play JJ, let him grow and pick up a better draft pick. It's basically a learning year anyway.

I can't imagine us getting More than like a conditional seventh rounder for Mullins




David Levine -> RE: Predictions for Next Week (and maybe beyond) (7/30/2024 7:33:19 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: thebigo

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeff Jesser

I fully expect Mullens to be traded before the deadline. You're right. Not a single reason to start him. He's not good enough to play long stretches but he's good enough to get you a couple wins.

If it's comes down to that just play JJ, let him grow and pick up a better draft pick. It's basically a learning year anyway.

I can't imagine us getting More than like a conditional seventh rounder for Mullins


We need whatever picks we can get.




kgdabom -> RE: Predictions for Next Week (and maybe beyond) (7/31/2024 11:18:47 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

I don’t think JJM is going to start a game this year. Maybe one at the end of were eliminated or seeding is set. I hope he gets some opportunities to wrap up a game or 2 though.

I see KOC being pretty firm on sitting JJM for the year.

Would you still make this prediction today?

Why, what's happened that he'd change his mind?

Everything. [&:]
Not recognizing that is like....
[sm=10057110.jpg]




kgdabom -> RE: Predictions for Next Week (and maybe beyond) (7/31/2024 11:21:30 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dave Odle

I haven't been following training camp as ardently this year. It sounds like JJ is holding his own and Darnold is looking better, but not by a ton.

Recently according to virtually everybody who's watching IE the media, the YouTubers/VLOGgers and plain old fans McCarthy is looking quite a bit better.




Ricky J -> RE: Predictions for Next Week (and maybe beyond) (7/31/2024 11:36:43 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

I don’t think JJM is going to start a game this year. Maybe one at the end of were eliminated or seeding is set. I hope he gets some opportunities to wrap up a game or 2 though.

I see KOC being pretty firm on sitting JJM for the year.

Would you still make this prediction today?

Why, what's happened that he'd change his mind?

Everything. [&:]
Not recognizing that is like....
[sm=10057110.jpg]

What's "everything?" Just assume I haven't been paying attention?




kgdabom -> RE: Predictions for Next Week (and maybe beyond) (7/31/2024 1:17:11 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

I don’t think JJM is going to start a game this year. Maybe one at the end of were eliminated or seeding is set. I hope he gets some opportunities to wrap up a game or 2 though.

I see KOC being pretty firm on sitting JJM for the year.

Would you still make this prediction today?

Why, what's happened that he'd change his mind?

Everything. [&:]
Not recognizing that is like....
[sm=10057110.jpg]

What's "everything?" Just assume I haven't been paying attention?

McCarthy's training camp performance. Much of it against the Vikings #1 defense. 4 out of 5 red zone play simulations for TDs one day then 4 out of 6 the next day. Bombs to Jalen Nailor against the first team D. Darnold struggling big time on intermediate routes. Jefferson showing frustration with Darnold missing him. Go to the Purple Pain forum and just look at the Vikings Training Camp thread and the When does JJ start thread for articles and video cliips.




Ricky J -> RE: Predictions for Next Week (and maybe beyond) (7/31/2024 4:58:45 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

I don’t think JJM is going to start a game this year. Maybe one at the end of were eliminated or seeding is set. I hope he gets some opportunities to wrap up a game or 2 though.

I see KOC being pretty firm on sitting JJM for the year.

Would you still make this prediction today?

Why, what's happened that he'd change his mind?

Everything. [&:]
Not recognizing that is like....
[sm=10057110.jpg]

What's "everything?" Just assume I haven't been paying attention?

McCarthy's training camp performance. Much of it against the Vikings #1 defense. 4 out of 5 red zone play simulations for TDs one day then 4 out of 6 the next day. Bombs to Jalen Nailor against the first team D. Darnold struggling big time on intermediate routes. Jefferson showing frustration with Darnold missing him. Go to the Purple Pain forum and just look at the Vikings Training Camp thread and the When does JJ start thread for articles and video cliips.

Ok. Thanks. And Todd did say sit for a year.

wts, it's pretty early to start "crowning his ass" ;)




David Levine -> RE: Predictions for Next Week (and maybe beyond) (8/1/2024 10:15:56 AM)

Sounds like it’s McCarthy and the 2s against the #1 defense.

By Matthew Coller

EAGAN — JJ McCarthy dropped back to pass, looked around for somewhere to throw the ball and before you could even say “10th overall pick,” the play was over. Josh Metellus isn’t allowed to deck McCarthy into next Tuesday but if Vikings practice on Wednesday had been a matchup with the Packers then he would have been sacked hard.

For many of McCarthy’s 11-on-11 reps in the two padded practices so far, Kevin O’Connell has pitted the rookie up against the first-team defense. That means facing off with proven NFL starters like Metellus, Harrison Smith, Cam Bynum, Jonathan Greenard, Andrew Van Ginkel, Blake Cashman, Ivan Pace Jr. and Byron Murphy Jr.

If he was doing battle against those fellas with Christian Darrisaw, Brian O’Neill, Justin Jefferson and Jordan Addison at his side, it would be a fair fight. Instead McCarthy is running the second team against that list of quality defenders.

Why isn’t it 2s versus 2s?

Offensive coordinator Wes Phillips explained that the goal is to better simulate game action for a player who has never played an NFL game before.

“I think it puts you in some situations where you play like you play really in the NFL against some muddy pockets, sometimes where you might have to escape, sometimes where you might have to find the checkdown maybe not in rhythm of the read because you’re trying to go through your read and sometimes the pocket collapses,” Phillips said.

The Vikings OC pointed out that the second-team offensive line having veteran players like David Quessenberry, Dan Feeney and Dalton Risner allows for McCarthy to still get reasonable pass protection but facing the first-team forces the young quarterback to see things quicker than if they were going up against the second-team defense. The idea is that when McCarthy does get behind O’Neill and Darrisaw and has receivers that get open quicker then it will feel easier. Almost like putting the donut weight on a baseball bat so it feels lighter at the plate.

“The processing might have to speed up a little bit and hopefully when you are in there with the first group then things slow down a little bit for you and you’re used to going up against a picked-up pace and a little more pressure at times,” Phillips said.

Schematically speaking, defensive coordinator Brian Flores isn’t one to take it easy on quarterbacks. In fact, he even frustrated veteran QB Kirk Cousins at times during last year’s training camp. The Vikings like seeing McCarthy get a chance to go up against all the things Flores can throw at QB rather than a dialed-back version.

“Flo might not make all of his calls with the 2s that he may call with the 1s,” Phillips said. “So you’re seeing some challenging looks as well.

Flores has been mixing up looks routinely versus the rookie. The Vikings’ DC has also had meetings with McCarthy to help him better understand how to analyze the defense pre and post snap.

“Hopefully the mix allows him to look at a defense, have an idea of what it is initially but there are always tells, there is always somebody who is giving it away and hopefully he can start to find who those guys are,” Flores said. “Whether it’s a tell on a safety that it’s cover-2 or a corner that it’s cover-3 or leverage that tells him it’s cover-1 or when that guy is blitzing he’s always looking [in the backfield]. There’s little things like that.”

McCarthy hasn’t exclusively faced the first team. When the Vikings do their two-minute drills, McCarthy takes on the second team defense. It’s been noticeably less difficult on him, as you might expect.

The final-drive simulations are particularly important when it comes to the young quarterback’s development.

“The one thing you want to see from the start — it’s the old John Wooden, ‘be quick but don’t hurry,’” Phillips said. “You don’t want to see a frantic group out there and it all starts with the quarterback. You want to see clear communication, guys getting to the line. The operation first and foremost, let alone the execution of all the plays.”

He continued…

“We have a whole menu of codes and code words and numbers that these guys have to remember across the board and you want to see a clean operation. And then, can we process what Flo and his defense are doing at a faster pace?”

All parts of McCarthy’s reps against the 1s and 2s were on display on Wednesday. On a number of reps, Flores’ defense did not allow for an easy in-rhythm throw and McCarthy was forced to scramble or check down. When he went up against the 2s in the final two-minute drill, he ripped a pass to Lucky Jackson along the sideline for a first down that was among his most impressive throws of camp.

It wasn’t clear from O’Connell’s discussion with the media on Tuesday when McCarthy will get with the 1s and get a few more resources against the first-team defense but the head coach thinks his work with the 2s vs. 1s will help him better work into the first-team offense eventually.

“He might not be out there with the [first-team] offense, but he's certainly seeing some of the things that will allow him to start phasing into getting into the huddle,” O’Connell said. “We're making it almost harder than it will be when he gets into that first group.” ...




kgdabom -> RE: Predictions for Next Week (and maybe beyond) (8/1/2024 10:22:23 AM)

McCarthy doing what he's been doing with 2nd string players against the #1 defense makes it all the more impressive.




Ricky J -> RE: Predictions for Next Week (and maybe beyond) (8/1/2024 12:50:23 PM)

Good stuff, DL -- thank you!




marty -> RE: Predictions for Next Week (and maybe beyond) (8/1/2024 10:04:03 PM)

It's impressive what McCarthy is doing, but we should also be cautious in that even the #1 defense might be weak at the CB spots.




marty -> RE: Predictions for Next Week (and maybe beyond) (8/18/2024 9:14:23 PM)

I still think my prediction of Darnold playing well for one game, and then getting knocked out for the season against SF, will still come true.

But instead of McCarthy playing the rest of the way, it will be Mullens, or maybe a rotation of several backups playing QB, like last year.




Brad H -> RE: Predictions for Next Week (and maybe beyond) (8/19/2024 7:48:23 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: marty

I still think my prediction of Darnold playing well for one game, and then getting knocked out for the season against SF, will still come true.

But instead of McCarthy playing the rest of the way, it will be Mullens, or maybe a rotation of several backups playing QB, like last year.

This will easily be the most talent Sam Darnold has had around him since entering the NFL. He was the top pick for a reason. It didn't happen by accident. He has no more excuses.

My personal feeling is that Darnold will play okay. He's never going to be Mahomes or one of the top quarterbacks in the league, but he's got enough talent around him to win more games than he loses.

Here is the bottom line. Darnold is every bit as talented as Jared Goff, and has more talent around him than Jordan Love or Caleb Williams.

From what I've seen from these training camps, Williams is going to be a star at some point (provided he can avoid getting killed by his offensive line). That kid looks like a dude!




marty -> RE: Predictions for Next Week (and maybe beyond) (8/20/2024 12:05:32 AM)

With Hock and Addison out, I am not sure this is easily the most talent Darnold has worked with, defenses can key on JJ.

I hope Darnold does well, he can throw long, but his short game seems to have lots of weaknesses.

Williams could be a stud early on, the questions on him are his size , which could mean he is injury prone, and some have claimed he has some personality issues. He should be fun to watch.




Brad H -> RE: Predictions for Next Week (and maybe beyond) (8/20/2024 9:26:35 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: marty

With Hock and Addison out, I am not sure this is easily the most talent Darnold has worked with, defenses can key on JJ.

I hope Darnold does well, he can throw long, but his short game seems to have lots of weaknesses.

Williams could be a stud early on, the questions on him are his size , which could mean he is injury prone, and some have claimed he has some personality issues. He should be fun to watch.

The Hockenson thing is a bit concerning.




marty -> RE: Predictions for Next Week (and maybe beyond) (8/20/2024 2:02:45 PM)

KOC speaks highly of Mullens, I think he will end up starting the most games for the Vikings this season.

Darnold will either suck, and get benched by week 6, or he will get hurt, probably week 2 against SF.

It will be Mullens 2nd year in the system, so he should do better than last season. The defense should be improved with a good group of rookies and FAs, and the 2nd season for some in the Flore's system.

This is anywhere from a 6-10 win team, I lean towards a 7 win season. They should be battling the Bears for 3rd place, unless Williams catches fire early, and get the Bears to 11 or 12 wins.




Bill Johanesen -> RE: Predictions for Next Week (and maybe beyond) (8/20/2024 2:17:47 PM)

It will be Mullens 3rd year in the system. He regressed in year two so the number of years in the system might not mean diddily.




David Levine -> RE: Predictions for Next Week (and maybe beyond) (8/20/2024 2:34:11 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: marty

KOC speaks highly of Mullens, I think he will end up starting the most games for the Vikings this season.

Darnold will either suck, and get benched by week 6, or he will get hurt, probably week 2 against SF.

It will be Mullens 2nd year in the system, so he should do better than last season. The defense should be improved with a good group of rookies and FAs, and the 2nd season for some in the Flore's system.

This is anywhere from a 6-10 win team, I lean towards a 7 win season. They should be battling the Bears for 3rd place, unless Williams catches fire early, and get the Bears to 11 or 12 wins.


Did you watch Mullens this past week.

Dude holds the ball FOREVER. He has a habit of turning good O-Line play into a pressured throw or sack.

He's fine with a very clean pocket, but he has absolutely no ability to manipulate or move around in the pocket.




Jeff Jesser -> RE: Predictions for Next Week (and maybe beyond) (8/20/2024 2:59:19 PM)

Going off memory but didn't Mullens basically toss the ball to the guy that was sacking him?




marty -> RE: Predictions for Next Week (and maybe beyond) (8/20/2024 3:00:30 PM)

I didn't see the game last week, just highlights.

It's too bad we don't have a better option. Is there still some potential with Hall ?




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