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RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2024 9:39:32 AM

TJSweens

Posts: 45088
Joined: 7/16/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

You've got three quarterbacks to choose from for next year.

One has never played a down in the NFL and comes from a run-first college offense. One has had a disastrous start to his NFL career. The third is 11-2 in 2024 with the #3 passer rating among starters.

If we are going to pay anyone next season, it should be the guy currently playing quarterback. I would pay Darnold $50-million a year (for three years) and keep McCarthy as a backup. Anything else should be considered general manager malpractice. The other two options are completely unproven commodities.

If your talking $50M a year, I'm sure we can get him for lower.

_____________________________

"The eternal fate of the noble and enlightened: to be brutally crushed by the armed and dumb."

Post #: 3576

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2024 9:39:43 AM

Todd M

Posts: 40956
Joined: 7/14/2007
Status: offline

Oh. I didn’t think it was total speculation. Kinda dumb to want to put your name on that if not true.

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The ego holds on to pain from the past to prevent pain in the future, which causes pain in the present.

Keith Crossley

Post #: 3577

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2024 9:41:37 AM

Bill Johanesen

Posts: 28969
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

Some of last year's signees with void year money:

Greenard
Van Ginkel
Cashman
Darnold
Jones
"Gillmore"
Bradbury (restructure with void year money)
Harrison Smith (restructure with void year money)

Pump enough into void years, backloading, or "etc" and a lot can be done. Kwesi is the man for making my case

You were right about the void years and nobody is happy with that but not having any money to make moves....you were not on point on that one.

The two go together but Kwesi surprised me that he used void years so extensively.

Post #: 3578

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2024 9:44:47 AM

Phil Riewer

Posts: 27677
Joined: 8/24/2007
From: MN
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

Some of last year's signees with void year money:

Greenard
Van Ginkel
Cashman
Darnold
Jones
"Gillmore"
Bradbury (restructure with void year money)
Harrison Smith (restructure with void year money)

Pump enough into void years, backloading, or "etc" and a lot can be done. Kwesi is the man for making my case

You were right about the void years and nobody is happy with that but not having any money to make moves....you were not on point on that one.

The two go together but Kwesi surprised me that he used void years so extensively.

It may have involved our good old cap guru too.....Brzezinski

Plus what Spielman did to our cap situation.......it was way uglier....

< Message edited by Phil Riewer -- 12/11/2024 10:29:49 AM >

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Post #: 3579

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2024 9:45:29 AM

TJSweens

Posts: 45088
Joined: 7/16/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

Oh. I didn’t think it was total speculation. Kinda dumb to want to put your name on that if not true.

From Thaddeus Moss to Larry Fitzgerald:

“This is disgusting,” Thaddeus tweeted to Fitzgerald. Sr. “You have no right to try to make private matters public for the sake of engagement. I do not believe my father talks to you, so check your f–king sources.”

TM to Brett Favre after Favre posted his best wishes to Randy Moss:

“Brett, the support is appreciated, truly. This is not true. My father will address the world when he is ready to.”

_____________________________

"The eternal fate of the noble and enlightened: to be brutally crushed by the armed and dumb."

Post #: 3580

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2024 9:50:17 AM

Bill Johanesen

Posts: 28969
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

You've got three quarterbacks to choose from for next year.

One has never played a down in the NFL and comes from a run-first college offense. One has had a disastrous start to his NFL career. The third is 11-2 in 2024 with the #3 passer rating among starters.

If we are going to pay anyone next season, it should be the guy currently playing quarterback. I would pay Darnold $50-million a year (for three years) and keep McCarthy as a backup. Anything else should be considered general manager malpractice. The other two options are completely unproven commodities.

There is an article in the Daily Norseman highlighting a podcast that included choosing between Darnold and JJM. And it ended the summary by saying "This situation gives the Vikings an enviable position with two capable quarterbacks."

Huh? When did JJM become a capable QB?

Not agreeing or disagreeing with your pro-Darnold stance, just pointing out something related.

Post #: 3581

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2024 10:08:08 AM

Jeff Jesser

Posts: 19527
Joined: 7/16/2007
From: Southern Cal
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

You've got three quarterbacks to choose from for next year.

One has never played a down in the NFL and comes from a run-first college offense. One has had a disastrous start to his NFL career. The third is 11-2 in 2024 with the #3 passer rating among starters.

If we are going to pay anyone next season, it should be the guy currently playing quarterback. I would pay Darnold $50-million a year (for three years) and keep McCarthy as a backup. Anything else should be considered general manager malpractice. The other two options are completely unproven commodities.

If your talking $50M a year, I'm sure we can get him for lower.

I was higher on Darnold than most before the season but I can't go there. 50 Mil? IF they decide to stick with him (which I'm not convinced they will, yet). i cap out around a Baker Mayfield type contract. Inflation considered. 35 mil a year for 3 with about 60 in guarantees and even that would make my stomach churn.

Their whole plan was to model after the 9-ers. Cheap QB and build a monster roster around him. We'd be back to a "KC-lite" model.

Post #: 3582

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2024 10:22:02 AM

Bill Johanesen

Posts: 28969
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeff Jesser

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

You've got three quarterbacks to choose from for next year.

One has never played a down in the NFL and comes from a run-first college offense. One has had a disastrous start to his NFL career. The third is 11-2 in 2024 with the #3 passer rating among starters.

If we are going to pay anyone next season, it should be the guy currently playing quarterback. I would pay Darnold $50-million a year (for three years) and keep McCarthy as a backup. Anything else should be considered general manager malpractice. The other two options are completely unproven commodities.

If your talking $50M a year, I'm sure we can get him for lower.

I was higher on Darnold than most before the season but I can't go there. 50 Mil? IF they decide to stick with him (which I'm not convinced they will, yet). i cap out around a Baker Mayfield type contract. Inflation considered. 35 mil a year for 3 with about 60 in guarantees and even that would make my stomach churn.

Their whole plan was to model after the 9-ers. Cheap QB and build a monster roster around him. We'd be back to a "KC-lite" model.

Yep.

The 49ers were lucky that Purdy showed up out of nowhere guns a'blazing. I don't know what happened to them, but the monster roster led to the monster contract years coming due.

Everyone is probably sitting back and waiting to see what Darnold does as the pressure to play well increases. But man, LEAD the team to a SB win and he will own the franchise, be the mayor, pillage when and where he wants, and be the centerpiece on the Vikings Mt. Rushmore.

Post #: 3583

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2024 10:57:41 AM

Phil Riewer

Posts: 27677
Joined: 8/24/2007
From: MN
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeff Jesser

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

You've got three quarterbacks to choose from for next year.

One has never played a down in the NFL and comes from a run-first college offense. One has had a disastrous start to his NFL career. The third is 11-2 in 2024 with the #3 passer rating among starters.

If we are going to pay anyone next season, it should be the guy currently playing quarterback. I would pay Darnold $50-million a year (for three years) and keep McCarthy as a backup. Anything else should be considered general manager malpractice. The other two options are completely unproven commodities.

If your talking $50M a year, I'm sure we can get him for lower.

I was higher on Darnold than most before the season but I can't go there. 50 Mil? IF they decide to stick with him (which I'm not convinced they will, yet). i cap out around a Baker Mayfield type contract. Inflation considered. 35 mil a year for 3 with about 60 in guarantees and even that would make my stomach churn.

Their whole plan was to model after the 9-ers. Cheap QB and build a monster roster around him. We'd be back to a "KC-lite" model.

Yep.

The 49ers were lucky that Purdy showed up out of nowhere guns a'blazing. I don't know what happened to them, but the monster roster led to the monster contract years coming due.

Everyone is probably sitting back and waiting to see what Darnold does as the pressure to play well increases. But man, LEAD the team to a SB win and he will own the franchise, be the mayor, pillage when and where he wants, and be the centerpiece on the Vikings Mt. Rushmore.

One thing that hasn't been discussed but it seems like the FO and Coaching staff is building some equity in how they are signing UDFA/rebuilding careers/treating players who struggled on other teams.....we have seen it with Darnold and now Daniel Jones now wanting to come here but also players seem to want to play for Flores. Redmond and now signing Jamin Davis and what was done with Ivan Pace.

< Message edited by Phil Riewer -- 12/11/2024 10:59:23 AM >

_____________________________

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KIA 23 March 2007 Habbaniyah Iraq

Post #: 3584

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2024 11:04:39 AM

David Levine

Posts: 78059
Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Las Vegas
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: beo

I would bet they resign Byron Murphy and let Cam Bynum walk.
Murphy is young and finally started playing decent 2nd half of this season.
Bynum I think gets a big contract somewhere else... young too... but I don't think Kwesi will spend big on safety.

We kind of have to sign Bynum.

Smith has little left and can not, in any way, be your #1 safety.

I love Metellus, but not as a full-time safety.

Post #: 3585

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2024 11:52:21 AM

TJSweens

Posts: 45088
Joined: 7/16/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: beo

I would bet they resign Byron Murphy and let Cam Bynum walk.
Murphy is young and finally started playing decent 2nd half of this season.
Bynum I think gets a big contract somewhere else... young too... but I don't think Kwesi will spend big on safety.

We kind of have to sign Bynum.

Smith has little left and can not, in any way, be your #1 safety.

I love Metellus, but not as a full-time safety.

I'm also lukewarm on Murphy. The picks are nice, but he has a knack for getting beat in coverage and picking off the poorly thrown ball.

_____________________________

"The eternal fate of the noble and enlightened: to be brutally crushed by the armed and dumb."

Post #: 3586

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2024 12:52:17 PM

Bill Johanesen

Posts: 28969
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: beo

I would bet they resign Byron Murphy and let Cam Bynum walk.
Murphy is young and finally started playing decent 2nd half of this season.
Bynum I think gets a big contract somewhere else... young too... but I don't think Kwesi will spend big on safety.

We kind of have to sign Bynum.

Smith has little left and can not, in any way, be your #1 safety.

I love Metellus, but not as a full-time safety.

I'm also lukewarm on Murphy. The picks are nice, but he has a knack for getting beat in coverage and picking off the poorly thrown ball.

Agree with the above two posts.

If Bynum isn't signed it becomes a rebuild for the entire secondary. And Murphy can go.

Get some speed and quickness in there. Too often WRs are running free with the DBs three yards behind.

Post #: 3587

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2024 2:24:20 PM

ratoppenheimer

Posts: 9627
Joined: 12/9/2007
From: cascais, portugal...still in exile
Status: offline

.
andrew bynum has a pff grade of 62.4 and is ranked 83rd out of 152 safety candidates....

top safeties are making between $16mm to $21mm/yr....

franchise tag in '24 was $17.1mm....

kwesi would probably be willing to give bynum $12mm/yr....

_____________________________

the journey...is paradise.

Post #: 3588

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2024 3:03:36 PM

David Levine

Posts: 78059
Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Las Vegas
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: ratoppenheimer

.
andrew bynum has a pff grade of 62.4 and is ranked 83rd out of 152 safety candidates....

top safeties are making between $16mm to $21mm/yr....

franchise tag in '24 was $17.1mm....

kwesi would probably be willing to give bynum $12mm/yr....

So instead of signing a retired Lakers center, we should focus on resigning Cam Bynum...

PFF grades mean little too me. I doubt they have any idea what Flores is asking of his players on a play-by-play basis.

Post #: 3589

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2024 3:24:42 PM

beo

Posts: 2410
Joined: 3/18/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: beo

I would bet they resign Byron Murphy and let Cam Bynum walk.
Murphy is young and finally started playing decent 2nd half of this season.
Bynum I think gets a big contract somewhere else... young too... but I don't think Kwesi will spend big on safety.

We kind of have to sign Bynum.

Smith has little left and can not, in any way, be your #1 safety.

I love Metellus, but not as a full-time safety.

I'm also lukewarm on Murphy. The picks are nice, but he has a knack for getting beat in coverage and picking off the poorly thrown ball.

I'm wouldn't say i'm super high on Murphy... agreed his ints tend to be more luck than skill
but
1) I think Vikes are going to want at least 1 guy carrying over that knows the Flores system.
2) I think Murphy has played better as the season goes on... could be getting Flores system down

Cam will be interesting.
Reports say no talks about extension.
Maybe he agrees to something reasonable in the offseason, maybe he gets a bag elsewhere.

Both guys are average/slightly above average guys to me.
But I'd much rather have average nickel than having Chandon Sullivan, Evans, Booth type scrub that gives opponent sometime to just pick apart.

Post #: 3590

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2024 3:31:00 PM

Bill Johanesen

Posts: 28969
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: ratoppenheimer

.
andrew bynum has a pff grade of 62.4 and is ranked 83rd out of 152 safety candidates....

top safeties are making between $16mm to $21mm/yr....

franchise tag in '24 was $17.1mm....

kwesi would probably be willing to give bynum $12mm/yr....

So instead of signing a retired Lakers center, we should focus on resigning Cam Bynum...

PFF grades mean little too me. I doubt they have any idea what Flores is asking of his players on a play-by-play basis.

Sign Andrew Bynum as a Hail Mary defender. Plus he could recruit Pao to step in when needed.

Post #: 3591

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2024 3:33:26 PM

ratoppenheimer

Posts: 9627
Joined: 12/9/2007
From: cascais, portugal...still in exile
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: ratoppenheimer

.
andrew bynum has a pff grade of 62.4 and is ranked 83rd out of 152 safety candidates....

top safeties are making between $16mm to $21mm/yr....

franchise tag in '24 was $17.1mm....

kwesi would probably be willing to give bynum $12mm/yr....

So instead of signing a retired Lakers center, we should focus on resigning Cam Bynum...

PFF grades mean little too me. I doubt they have any idea what Flores is asking of his players on a play-by-play basis.

.
yeah, I'm a laker fan...it seemed weird when I wrote it....

pff is just more information...this is an off-year for mr. bynum - i'd say that he's better than average - maybe top 20-25....

i'd try to keep him if the price works....

_____________________________

the journey...is paradise.

Post #: 3592

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2024 3:35:44 PM

David Levine

Posts: 78059
Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Las Vegas
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: ratoppenheimer

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: ratoppenheimer

.
andrew bynum has a pff grade of 62.4 and is ranked 83rd out of 152 safety candidates....

top safeties are making between $16mm to $21mm/yr....

franchise tag in '24 was $17.1mm....

kwesi would probably be willing to give bynum $12mm/yr....

So instead of signing a retired Lakers center, we should focus on resigning Cam Bynum...

PFF grades mean little too me. I doubt they have any idea what Flores is asking of his players on a play-by-play basis.

.
yeah, I'm a laker fan...it seemed weird when I wrote it....

pff is just more information...this is an off-year for mr. bynum - i'd say that he's better than average - maybe top 20-25....

i'd try to keep him if the price works....

Is it a down year? He's set a career high for INTs and matched his career high in INTs. His tackles are a bit down, but is that because more tackles are being made in front of him?

Post #: 3593

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2024 3:43:16 PM

marty

Posts: 13089
Joined: 12/28/2007
Status: offline

Don't you have to keep the guy that does great dances ?

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SKOL to the BOWL !!!

Post #: 3594

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2024 6:26:37 PM

David Levine

Posts: 78059
Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Las Vegas
Status: online

Lions, Vikings and Packers are 28-3 against non-NFCN teams.

Post #: 3595

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2024 9:00:55 PM

marty

Posts: 13089
Joined: 12/28/2007
Status: offline

So the Vikings, Lions and Packers will probably all win this weekend?

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SKOL to the BOWL !!!

Post #: 3596

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/12/2024 11:25:07 AM

Todd M

Posts: 40956
Joined: 7/14/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

Between 10 and 12 wins.

This was optimistic. Now anything less than 14-3 is going to going to be a bit disappointing

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The ego holds on to pain from the past to prevent pain in the future, which causes pain in the present.

Keith Crossley

Post #: 3597

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/12/2024 11:27:50 AM

Todd M

Posts: 40956
Joined: 7/14/2007
Status: offline

I don’t want to be the best #5 seed going in.

Unless we win 3 away games…

_____________________________

The ego holds on to pain from the past to prevent pain in the future, which causes pain in the present.

Keith Crossley

Post #: 3598

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/12/2024 1:42:12 PM

Bill Johanesen

Posts: 28969
Status: offline

A solid, confident team doesn't care about the seed, home vs away, etc. KOC may need to do some of that Denny Green magic and create an us against them mentality. On a higher scale, Jordan was similar in that he even took certain indirect things as a personal affront to get motivated.

It's definitely the one-game-at-a-time 4th quarter. The current leaders of the team need to step up and maybe others will emerge. Under no circumstances do you lose to the Bears on Monday night. You play well enough to overcome any turnovers, bad calls by the refs, weird bounces, etc. Zero excuses!

Post #: 3599

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/12/2024 1:51:13 PM

Todd M

Posts: 40956
Joined: 7/14/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

A solid, confident team doesn't care about the seed, home vs away, etc. KOC may need to do some of that Denny Green magic and create an us against them mentality. On a higher scale, Jordan was similar in that he even took certain indirect things as a personal affront to get motivated.

It's definitely the one-game-at-a-time 4th quarter. The current leaders of the team need to step up and maybe others will emerge. Under no circumstances do you lose to the Bears on Monday night. You play well enough to overcome any turnovers, bad calls by the refs, weird bounces, etc. Zero excuses!

Well said.

_____________________________

The ego holds on to pain from the past to prevent pain in the future, which causes pain in the present.

Keith Crossley

Post #: 3600