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RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/14/2026 6:29:31 PM

Phil Riewer

Posts: 32044
Joined: 8/24/2007
From: MN
Status: online

I know that this is the sixth straight game the Pack has lost. They didn’t put us away. They are not a good team.

Chicago gave up a ton of points last week so we might get by with Wentz for another week if needed.

_____________________________

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KIA 23 March 2007 Habbaniyah Iraq

Post #: 26

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/14/2026 7:01:39 PM

David Levine

Posts: 81259
Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Las Vegas
Status: online

I'd be kicking the tires on Joe Milton about now.

Or even Will Levis.

Post #: 27

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/14/2026 7:17:52 PM

Tom Sykes

Posts: 6410
Joined: 7/27/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

Murray looked lost, uncomfortable and completely unprepared. It became clear to me why he is "injury prone". He scrambles at the drop of a hat and leaves himself open to potential injury. He doesn't slide appropriately to prevent getting hit - he just kind of slumps. Like he's bracing for impact instead of trying to avoid it. Not to mention that he needs to play out of the shotgun or pistol because he needs the extra space to see over his line.

The offense looked like a complete clown show until Wentz came in. It took him a few plays/drives to get comfortable and in rhythm.

Right … agree on everything. I suppose Murray could get more comfortable but he is so non-KOC type I wonder how that summer fling got consummated so quickly. He is at best back-up material and then gone next year.

We are not a legit contender with either Murray or Wentz and, anyways, neither will survive for long even if they played better than expectations. Which Wentz did second half, as you say.

Is Garappolo hurt? Milton, Levis … there is certainly nobody out there to upgrade our situation but again, without a starter I would at least add a back-up then shuffle, try to win close games … keep veterans from a mutiny etc.

you just dont have to be that good to make the playoffs anymore so who knows …

Just to clarify, I am pulling for Dead-Man-Walking Wentz to endure for as long as the Geneva Conventions will allow it. Its really all there is at this point.

Thank God KOC went for broke making the most competitive qb room possible.

Post #: 28

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/14/2026 7:20:15 PM

Tom Sykes

Posts: 6410
Joined: 7/27/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

I'd be kicking the tires on Joe Milton about now.

Or even Will Levis.

Joe Milton would instantly pique interest if not roster talent.

Post #: 29

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/14/2026 7:46:02 PM

Bill Johanesen

Posts: 33241
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

Kyler Murray is 29 years old. There isn't anything left to develop.

Wentz is the least bad option.

3 series isn't enough to know.

How about 7 years?

You can have your opinion......IMO Wentz is a good backup and his best was probably 8 years ago? I would be fine with 2024 Murray.

So you want to develop a 29 year old QB and/or turn back the clock to 2024 for said QB

And he would be, based on your definition of merely being on the roster, another QBOTF.

Post #: 30

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/14/2026 8:08:35 PM

Bill Johanesen

Posts: 33241
Status: offline

There was a glimpse of Murray's future with his 3 passes, a pick, and two runs. With his injury, it was all encapsulated in less than a quarter.

Teasley has to figure out how to get a real QBOTF or a legit QB. All the other stuff is secondary.

Post #: 31

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/14/2026 8:15:04 PM

Bill Johanesen

Posts: 33241
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

Murray looked lost, uncomfortable and completely unprepared. It became clear to me why he is "injury prone". He scrambles at the drop of a hat and leaves himself open to potential injury. He doesn't slide appropriately to prevent getting hit - he just kind of slumps. Like he's bracing for impact instead of trying to avoid it. Not to mention that he needs to play out of the shotgun or pistol because he needs the extra space to see over his line.

The offense looked like a complete clown show until Wentz came in. It took him a few plays/drives to get comfortable and in rhythm.

Right … agree on everything. I suppose Murray could get more comfortable but he is so non-KOC type I wonder how that summer fling got consummated so quickly. He is at best back-up material and then gone next year.

We are not a legit contender with either Murray or Wentz and, anyways, neither will survive for long even if they played better than expectations. Which Wentz did second half, as you say.

Is Garappolo hurt? Milton, Levis … there is certainly nobody out there to upgrade our situation but again, without a starter I would at least add a back-up then shuffle, try to win close games … keep veterans from a mutiny etc.

you just dont have to be that good to make the playoffs anymore so who knows …

Just to clarify, I am pulling for Dead-Man-Walking Wentz to endure for as long as the Geneva Conventions will allow it. Its really all there is at this point.

Thank God KOC went for broke making the most competitive qb room possible.

Murray was the best of the trash heap, and it was a shotgun wedding on the cheap. Lowered Expectations: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SK8GGm3KlAY

This is the fallout when a team burns a #10 overall pick on a QB who is, by all accounts, a bust.

Post #: 32

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/14/2026 9:39:43 PM

David Levine

Posts: 81259
Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Las Vegas
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

Murray looked lost, uncomfortable and completely unprepared.

The biggest issue plaguing Kyler Murray throughout his career has always been his work ethic. That's largely why he was available to Minnesota, to begin with, this offseason.

The Cardinals (hilariously) included an "independent study" clause in his five-year, $230.5 million contract signed in July 2022. The pact created restrictions to ensure he wasn't distracted by video games, watching TV, or going on the internet while studying film on his own.

Pro Football Talk's Mike Florio reignited the fire surrounding concerns over his work ethic on PFT Live this morning. He heard from a trusted source that said, "The starting quarterback [Kyler Murray] is showing up right on time, and leaving as soon as the bell rings."

He also added that, "To the extent that we thought, all of a sudden, he was going to be the guy who gets there well before anyone, and the guy who burns the midnight oil, that's not happening, at least for now, in Minnesota."

https://sports.yahoo.com/articles/kyler-murray-ethic-already-being-225913907.html

Post #: 33

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/15/2026 8:02:36 AM

Bill Johanesen

Posts: 33241
Status: offline

That's a bad look, but can you imagine how brutal those meeting are with KOC?

Next, let's break down 20% of play #88, the 'X Go Slant Bravo Ringo V Check 9 Reverse' portion. And as an added bonus, we'll again have lunch deskside!

Murray looks at his watch.

JJM says let's modify that play because he "saw something".

Wentz is at a two-martini lunch downtown.

Post #: 34

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/15/2026 8:19:55 AM

Todd M

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Joined: 7/14/2007
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To me Murray looked just like you might expect a QB to look after a bogus QB competition and ONE preseason series

Post #: 35

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/15/2026 9:46:24 AM

Jeff Jesser

Posts: 20290
Joined: 7/16/2007
From: Southern Cal
Status: online

It's pretty crazy, to me, that the national media is still pushing the "KOC is a QB guru" thingy. I would give him a pause on 1 or 2-ish misses but:

Cousins - track record of 'meh'
Dobbs
Mullins
Hall
Darnold - the best of the lot who was reportedly low balled
Jones - who said "thanks bro and bolted asap" (probably a good move on our part but is also a rumor of why KAM was kicked to the curb)
JJM
Wentz
Brosmer

My gosh, we are becoming the Cleveland Browns under this "whisperer"

Post #: 36

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/15/2026 9:51:09 AM

Phil Riewer

Posts: 32044
Joined: 8/24/2007
From: MN
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

Kyler Murray is 29 years old. There isn't anything left to develop.

Wentz is the least bad option.

3 series isn't enough to know.

How about 7 years?

You can have your opinion......IMO Wentz is a good backup and his best was probably 8 years ago? I would be fine with 2024 Murray.

So you want to develop a 29 year old QB and/or turn back the clock to 2024 for said QB

And he would be, based on your definition of merely being on the roster, another QBOTF.

You couldn't be more inaccurate.....how about you just try posting your own opinion and not misquoting others to make yourself feel better?

The point is we won't win a playoff game with Wentz at QB. So your only choice at this point is building up Murray or JJ even if in your dumbass opinion you don't think that is possible. Chicago's Defense is worse than GB so it might work with Wentz for another game or two. Next three games are Bears, Bucs, and Dolphins. So make it three?

< Message edited by Phil Riewer -- 9/15/2026 10:05:45 AM >

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KIA 23 March 2007 Habbaniyah Iraq

Post #: 37

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/15/2026 10:14:30 AM 1 votes

Trekgeekscott

Posts: 40472
Joined: 7/16/2007
From: United Federation of Planets
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeff Jesser

It's pretty crazy, to me, that the national media is still pushing the "KOC is a QB guru" thingy. I would give him a pause on 1 or 2-ish misses but:

Cousins - track record of 'meh'
Dobbs
Mullins
Hall
Darnold - the best of the lot who was reportedly low balled
Jones - who said "thanks bro and bolted asap" (probably a good move on our part but is also a rumor of why KAM was kicked to the curb)
JJM
Wentz
Brosmer

My gosh, we are becoming the Cleveland Browns under this "whisperer"

Cousins had his best years under KOC.
Dobbs had the only good games of his career.
Mullins is a career backup. And played his best in limited time (which isn't saying much) under KOC
Hall hasn't played a snap for anyone else. and not really an NFL QB by any means. You can't make butter with a toothpick.
Darnold was a draft bust until he got here.
JJM hasn't shown much and will give you this one, but still has only played 10 games and has been hurt a lot. and he has shown flashes. but at this point I wouldn't cry any tears if he were let go.
Wentz was the definition of journeyman, played most of his games hurt last year and is probably playing his best since his rookie season at this point.
Brosmer is not an NFL QB by any means. You can't make butter with a toothpick.
Jones never played a snap for us so we can't judge how he would have done under KOC. I know the only reason Jones didn't sign with us was because he wasn't guaranteed the starting job.

He's actually done pretty well with the shit he's been given if you ask me.

Now if they could give him a real QB for a change....this team would probably take off. and they should have signed one of Darnold or Jones after 2024 but KAM screwed the pooch there. I am thinking Teasley will try to address the position more permanently after this season.

Browns situation is far worse than ours....

< Message edited by Trekgeekscott -- 9/15/2026 10:16:29 AM >

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Post #: 38

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/15/2026 10:36:04 AM

Phil Riewer

Posts: 32044
Joined: 8/24/2007
From: MN
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: Trekgeekscott

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeff Jesser

It's pretty crazy, to me, that the national media is still pushing the "KOC is a QB guru" thingy. I would give him a pause on 1 or 2-ish misses but:

Cousins - track record of 'meh'
Dobbs
Mullins
Hall
Darnold - the best of the lot who was reportedly low balled
Jones - who said "thanks bro and bolted asap" (probably a good move on our part but is also a rumor of why KAM was kicked to the curb)
JJM
Wentz
Brosmer

My gosh, we are becoming the Cleveland Browns under this "whisperer"

Cousins had his best years under KOC.
Dobbs had the only good games of his career.
Mullins is a career backup. And played his best in limited time (which isn't saying much) under KOC
Hall hasn't played a snap for anyone else. and not really an NFL QB by any means. You can't make butter with a toothpick.
Darnold was a draft bust until he got here.
JJM hasn't shown much and will give you this one, but still has only played 10 games and has been hurt a lot. and he has shown flashes. but at this point I wouldn't cry any tears if he were let go.
Wentz was the definition of journeyman, played most of his games hurt last year and is probably playing his best since his rookie season at this point.
Brosmer is not an NFL QB by any means. You can't make butter with a toothpick.
Jones never played a snap for us so we can't judge how he would have done under KOC. I know the only reason Jones didn't sign with us was because he wasn't guaranteed the starting job.

He's actually done pretty well with the shit he's been given if you ask me.

Now if they could give him a real QB for a change....this team would probably take off. and they should have signed one of Darnold or Jones after 2024 but KAM screwed the pooch there. I am thinking Teasley will try to address the position more permanently after this season.

Browns situation is far worse than ours....

It seems many are more upset that KOC can't magically produce top QB play and be QB whisperer with garbage now than wins. They want him to reincarnate Wentz which seems less possible than JJ or Kyler. Lets also give KOC equal credit for figuring out how to win the game.

< Message edited by Phil Riewer -- 9/15/2026 10:39:41 AM >

_____________________________

SSG Riewer, Greg A Co 2/136 CAB
KIA 23 March 2007 Habbaniyah Iraq

Post #: 39

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/15/2026 10:36:10 AM

Ricky J

Posts: 18459
Joined: 7/19/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Trekgeekscott

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeff Jesser

It's pretty crazy, to me, that the national media is still pushing the "KOC is a QB guru" thingy. I would give him a pause on 1 or 2-ish misses but:

Cousins - track record of 'meh'
Dobbs
Mullins
Hall
Darnold - the best of the lot who was reportedly low balled
Jones - who said "thanks bro and bolted asap" (probably a good move on our part but is also a rumor of why KAM was kicked to the curb)
JJM
Wentz
Brosmer

My gosh, we are becoming the Cleveland Browns under this "whisperer"

Cousins had his best years under KOC.
Dobbs had the only good games of his career.
Mullins is a career backup. And played his best in limited time (which isn't saying much) under KOC
Hall hasn't played a snap for anyone else. and not really an NFL QB by any means. You can't make butter with a toothpick.
Darnold was a draft bust until he got here.
JJM hasn't shown much and will give you this one, but still has only played 10 games and has been hurt a lot. and he has shown flashes. but at this point I wouldn't cry any tears if he were let go.
Wentz was the definition of journeyman, played most of his games hurt last year and is probably playing his best since his rookie season at this point.
Brosmer is not an NFL QB by any means. You can't make butter with a toothpick.
Jones never played a snap for us so we can't judge how he would have done under KOC. I know the only reason Jones didn't sign with us was because he wasn't guaranteed the starting job.

He's actually done pretty well with the shit he's been given if you ask me.

Now if they could give him a real QB for a change....this team would probably take off. and they should have signed one of Darnold or Jones after 2024 but KAM screwed the pooch there. I am thinking Teasley will try to address the position more permanently after this season.

Browns situation is far worse than ours....

Thank you! The negativity has been off the charts lately ...

< Message edited by Ricky J -- 9/15/2026 10:37:10 AM >

Post #: 40

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/15/2026 10:53:17 AM

Bill Johanesen

Posts: 33241
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

Kyler Murray is 29 years old. There isn't anything left to develop.

Wentz is the least bad option.

3 series isn't enough to know.

How about 7 years?

You can have your opinion......IMO Wentz is a good backup and his best was probably 8 years ago? I would be fine with 2024 Murray.

So you want to develop a 29 year old QB and/or turn back the clock to 2024 for said QB

And he would be, based on your definition of merely being on the roster, another QBOTF.

You couldn't be more inaccurate.....how about you just try posting your own opinion and not misquoting others to make yourself feel better?

The point is we won't win a playoff game with Wentz at QB. So your only choice at this point is building up Murray or JJ even if in your dumbass opinion you don't think that is possible. Chicago's Defense is worse than GB so it might work with Wentz for another game or two. Next three games are Bears, Bucs, and Dolphins. So make it three?

Those were literally YOUR words.

If your point is we won't win a playoff game with Wentz, why not just say that instead of thinking the Wilf's will purchase a time machine for Murray.

The fact is, in today's NFL there is very little time to develop someone on the 53 man roster. There are meetings, days off, walk throughs, practices, and travel time all dedicated just to get ready for the next game.

At best, the hope is Murray can translate all that to on-field performance.

Post #: 41

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/15/2026 11:02:05 AM

Bill Johanesen

Posts: 33241
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Trekgeekscott

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeff Jesser

It's pretty crazy, to me, that the national media is still pushing the "KOC is a QB guru" thingy. I would give him a pause on 1 or 2-ish misses but:

Cousins - track record of 'meh'
Dobbs
Mullins
Hall
Darnold - the best of the lot who was reportedly low balled
Jones - who said "thanks bro and bolted asap" (probably a good move on our part but is also a rumor of why KAM was kicked to the curb)
JJM
Wentz
Brosmer

My gosh, we are becoming the Cleveland Browns under this "whisperer"

Cousins had his best years under KOC.
Dobbs had the only good games of his career.
Mullins is a career backup. And played his best in limited time (which isn't saying much) under KOC
Hall hasn't played a snap for anyone else. and not really an NFL QB by any means. You can't make butter with a toothpick.
Darnold was a draft bust until he got here.
JJM hasn't shown much and will give you this one, but still has only played 10 games and has been hurt a lot. and he has shown flashes. but at this point I wouldn't cry any tears if he were let go.
Wentz was the definition of journeyman, played most of his games hurt last year and is probably playing his best since his rookie season at this point.
Brosmer is not an NFL QB by any means. You can't make butter with a toothpick.
Jones never played a snap for us so we can't judge how he would have done under KOC. I know the only reason Jones didn't sign with us was because he wasn't guaranteed the starting job.

He's actually done pretty well with the shit he's been given if you ask me.

Now if they could give him a real QB for a change....this team would probably take off. and they should have signed one of Darnold or Jones after 2024 but KAM screwed the pooch there. I am thinking Teasley will try to address the position more permanently after this season.

Browns situation is far worse than ours....

Right off the bat, Cousins' best years were NOT with KOC.

And your conclusion that the Browns situation is worse... that has to be the lowest bar ever set.

Post #: 42

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/15/2026 11:10:17 AM

David Levine

Posts: 81259
Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Las Vegas
Status: online

Cousins was exactly the same player his last 3 years in Washington that he was here. His stats were remarkably the same. The only difference is he got more regular season wins because he had way more talent.

Darnold was struck on horrible teams, but he showed signs when he had a little talent around him. My guess is Shanahan had a lot to do with getting him ready for us. But the real credit goes to Seattle's coaching staff. They absolutely broke him of a few really bad habits he had with us.

Dobbs was super fun, until he learned KOC's system. Then he crashed and burned.

Post #: 43

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/15/2026 11:13:31 AM

Bill Johanesen

Posts: 33241
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Trekgeekscott

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeff Jesser

It's pretty crazy, to me, that the national media is still pushing the "KOC is a QB guru" thingy. I would give him a pause on 1 or 2-ish misses but:

Cousins - track record of 'meh'
Dobbs
Mullins
Hall
Darnold - the best of the lot who was reportedly low balled
Jones - who said "thanks bro and bolted asap" (probably a good move on our part but is also a rumor of why KAM was kicked to the curb)
JJM
Wentz
Brosmer

My gosh, we are becoming the Cleveland Browns under this "whisperer"

Cousins had his best years under KOC.
Dobbs had the only good games of his career.
Mullins is a career backup. And played his best in limited time (which isn't saying much) under KOC
Hall hasn't played a snap for anyone else. and not really an NFL QB by any means. You can't make butter with a toothpick.
Darnold was a draft bust until he got here.
JJM hasn't shown much and will give you this one, but still has only played 10 games and has been hurt a lot. and he has shown flashes. but at this point I wouldn't cry any tears if he were let go.
Wentz was the definition of journeyman, played most of his games hurt last year and is probably playing his best since his rookie season at this point.
Brosmer is not an NFL QB by any means. You can't make butter with a toothpick.
Jones never played a snap for us so we can't judge how he would have done under KOC. I know the only reason Jones didn't sign with us was because he wasn't guaranteed the starting job.

He's actually done pretty well with the shit he's been given if you ask me.

Now if they could give him a real QB for a change....this team would probably take off. and they should have signed one of Darnold or Jones after 2024 but KAM screwed the pooch there. I am thinking Teasley will try to address the position more permanently after this season.

Browns situation is far worse than ours....

It seems many are more upset that KOC can't magically produce top QB play and be QB whisperer with garbage now than wins. They want him to reincarnate Wentz which seems less possible than JJ or Kyler. Lets also give KOC equal credit for figuring out how to win the game.

Many want KOC to reincarnate Wentz? That's a new one. Who has even alluded to that? Or did you just make it up?

Wentz is simply an independent contractor. He said he didn't get any first team snaps this offseason. He sorta hangs around and his sole responsibility is to make sure he can find his helmet when called on to enter the game. He is the very embodiment of journeyman.

Anyway, show some quotes about this KOC-Wentz reincarnation you claim many want.

< Message edited by Bill Johanesen -- 9/15/2026 11:16:26 AM >

Post #: 44

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/15/2026 11:19:31 AM

Jeff Jesser

Posts: 20290
Joined: 7/16/2007
From: Southern Cal
Status: online

I think my msg was lost on some.....

KOC went on record as saying "he's the QB killer, because the GM's wanted to bring in guys and was like 'nope', not good enough"

Ok, that's fine. Lets take him at face value. My list stands.....Why hasn't he "killed" that list of 'meh' guys at best? Does he not have a voice in the situation or is he a fraud? It can't be both.

Post #: 45

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/15/2026 11:24:02 AM

Jeff Jesser

Posts: 20290
Joined: 7/16/2007
From: Southern Cal
Status: online

Again, I like him as a culture building HC, but we have to honest, he appears to stink as an OC/playcaller. It is what it is. We are winning games because of the D. I do agree that he's better in the 2nd half and he has a knack for pulling wins out of is A&&. That's why I would really like him to do a Chargers thing and bring in a new OC with fresh ideas or to collaborate.

Post #: 46

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/15/2026 11:25:18 AM

Jeff Jesser

Posts: 20290
Joined: 7/16/2007
From: Southern Cal
Status: online

And, before you go there, I realize the Chargers sucked this week.

Post #: 47

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/15/2026 11:32:32 AM

Bill Johanesen

Posts: 33241
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeff Jesser

Again, I like him as a culture building HC, but we have to honest, he appears to stink as an OC/playcaller. It is what it is. We are winning games because of the D. I do agree that he's better in the 2nd half and he has a knack for pulling wins out of is A&&. That's why I would really like him to do a Chargers thing and bring in a new OC with fresh ideas or to collaborate.

It's job security. What would he then do? Be in charge of clock management and timeouts? Heck, he'd be fired after one game.

It would be like one of the two Bob's in The Office movie saying "What would you say... you do here?"

Post #: 48

RE: General Vikes Talk - 9/15/2026 11:35:46 AM

Tom Sykes

Posts: 6410
Joined: 7/27/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Trekgeekscott
He's actually done pretty well with the shit he's been given if you ask me.

So as head coach / OC (in reality) / playcaller ... he doesn't deserve any credit for 'the shit he's been given'? It's their fault if they suck or shut it down in the playoffs but KOC's fault for only the good stuff?

Try giving KOC credit for his impact on both the positive and negative.

Spinning everything one way doesn't contribute.

EVERYBODY was happy to get out of Zimmer and into KOC.

But at some point, getting it done or not getting it done deserves to be called out.