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RE:NFL News - 10/9/2007 10:22:35 PM

Jeff Jesser

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I don't think it would matter who they put on him. Moss loves sticking it to the Boys. Can you imagine his motivation on that stage?

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RE:NFL News - 10/9/2007 10:40:07 PM

Trekgeekscott

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And Terrell Owens will falter again in a game he thinks will define who the best WR is. Where Randy Moss will just do what he always does, go about his business and catch balls thrown to him.

Post #: 302

RE:NFL News - 10/9/2007 10:48:03 PM

David Levine

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[quote="John Childress"]Newman is a decent CB but I don't know if he has the speed to stay with Moss. Roy Williams is brutal at pass coverage.[/quote] Wasn't he the guy who got run down after the INT last night? No way he has the speed.

Post #: 303

RE:NFL News - 10/10/2007 1:54:35 PM

Duane Sampson

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Phillips Ticked About Last Second Timeout Wed Oct 10, 2007 The Dallas Morning News reports a wild and long Monday night at Ralph Wilson Stadium needed clarity Tuesday. HC Wade Phillips was seeking it when he called the league office to complain about a timeout being called just before PK Nick Folk attempted a field goal in the closing seconds against Buffalo. The Bills called timeout prior to Folk making a 53-yard field goal attempt. Folk had to rekick, and he made it again, sealing a Cowboys' 25-24 victory that goes down as one of the greatest comebacks in franchise history. While Phillips was pleased with the victory, he didn't like the timeout being called. "I don't think it's fair," Phillips said. "I think No. 1, safety. To call a timeout on the sidelines where nobody can hear it and nobody know about it, they just run right over you on the first play. The guy's got to kick a 50-yard field goal, which takes a lot of energy. I think it's unfair to the kicker to have to kick it twice, no matter what happens." Phillips was asked if he would ice the kicker in the same way that was done to Folk. "I mean, I don't know why you wouldn't," he said. "It's unfair, but everybody is using an unfair rule against you."

Post #: 304

RE:NFL News - 10/10/2007 1:55:02 PM

Duane Sampson

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Giants' John Mara Wants Timeout Rule on Kicking Plays Changed Wed Oct 10, 2007 The Star-Ledger reports if Giants co-owner John Mara has his way, the latest NFL coaching craze will have a short shelf life. A member of the league's influential competition committee, Mara has seen enough of coaches "icing" the opposing kicker by calling a timeout just before the ball is snapped on game-deciding field-goal attempts, as Buffalo's Dick Jauron did Monday night as Dallas rookie Nick Folk lined up for a 53-yarder. Folk made his first attempt as an official blew the whistle and ran in from the Bills' sideline. After the stoppage, Folk hit his attempt again to give the Cowboys a 25-24 victory and thwart the tactic that had been used successfully twice before during this season. Timeouts have long been called by coaches to give kickers extra time to stew over big kicks, but it wasn't until this season that anyone came up with the latest twist -- waiting until the last possible nanosecond before asking an official to step in. Mara said he doesn't appreciate what he is seeing in the name of gamesmanship, and said he hopes the competition committee can use the off-season to come up with an appropriate change to the rule. The league gave coaches the right to call timeouts from the sideline in 2004; previously, timeouts could only be called by players on the field. "I don't particularly like it," Mara said last night. "I just don't think that it looks right. We need to discuss changing that particular rule. There's just something about it that rubs me the wrong way now that everybody's doing it." Nothing can be done about outlawing the tactics this season. Any rule change would have to wait until the off-season and would require the support of 24 of the 32 teams, not often an easy task. Another potential stumbling block, Mara concedes, is he's "not sure it can be written in such a way that it can be easily enforced by the officials." Mara proposes the most viable solution is to forbid timeouts from being called "after the kicking team is set."

Post #: 305

RE:NFL News - 10/10/2007 2:28:26 PM

John Childress

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I agree I think it is a bush league move. Man up and win the game without that crap. I agree with Mara

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RE:NFL News - 10/10/2007 3:14:40 PM

Trekgeekscott

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[quote="John Childress"]I agree I think it is a bush league move. Man up and win the game without that crap. I agree with Mara[/quote] I don't understand why this is a big deal all of a sudden. This has been going on for years, YEARS in the NFL, decades even. Now it's ticky tack? Now it's bush league? Icing the kicker in this way is nothing new. It has been part of the game for a long time. And now since a few fans have had their hopes dashed by a last second FG miss, everyone wants to change the rules. I don't agree one little bit. It's part of the game. This isn't new, folks. A kicker should be prepared for the icing. They should know it is coming and be ready. Their job is simple, kick the ball through the uprights. This is a stupid rule to even be discussing or suggesting.

Post #: 307

RE:NFL News - 10/10/2007 5:04:52 PM

Duane Sampson

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NFL Won't Fine Travis Johnson Wed Oct 10, 2007 The Miami Herald reports Houston Texans DT Travis Johnson will not be fined for taunting Dolphins QB Trent Green, who was knocked unconscious Sunday when he tried to throw a block on Johnson. The NFL decided the 15-yard penalty for taunting was punishment enough, NFL representative Greg Aiello said Tuesday. Johnson was penalized after he stood over Green's motionless body and repeatedly pointed at Green. NFL director of football operations Gene Washington came to the conclusion that although the taunting did warrant a penalty, it did not merit a fine. "Not every taunting penalty warrants a fine," Aiello said. "[Johnson] was upset about what he thought was an illegal block." After Sunday's game, Johnson went into a tirade about the play, accusing Green -- who suffered a severe concussion as a result -- of a cheap shot because Green attempted to block Johnson at his knees. Texans HC Gary Kubiak also contacted the NFL to get an interpretation of Green's block, but he was informed that it was legal. Kubiak told reporters he believed it might be time for the league's rules committee to look into banning such blocks at the knees. Nearly every Dolphins players spoke out against Johnson's taunting and reaction, and also defended Green's block. HC Cam Cameron attempted to take a more neutral position. "Sometimes in the heat of the moment, all of us do things we probably wish we wouldn't do or say," Cameron said. "Let's say it like it is: You live and you learn."

Post #: 308

RE:NFL News - 10/10/2007 5:06:55 PM

Jim Frenette

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[quote="Duane Sampson"]Phillips Ticked About Last Second Timeout Wed Oct 10, 2007 The Dallas Morning News reports a wild and long Monday night at Ralph Wilson Stadium needed clarity Tuesday. HC Wade Phillips was seeking it when he called the league office to complain about a timeout being called just before PK Nick Folk attempted a field goal in the closing seconds against Buffalo. The Bills called timeout prior to Folk making a 53-yard field goal attempt. Folk had to rekick, and he made it again, sealing a Cowboys' 25-24 victory that goes down as one of the greatest comebacks in franchise history. While Phillips was pleased with the victory, he didn't like the timeout being called. "I don't think it's fair," Phillips said. "I think No. 1, safety. To call a timeout on the sidelines where nobody can hear it and nobody know about it, they just run right over you on the first play. The guy's got to kick a 50-yard field goal, which takes a lot of energy. I think it's unfair to the kicker to have to kick it twice, no matter what happens." Phillips was asked if he would ice the kicker in the same way that was done to Folk. "I mean, I don't know why you wouldn't," he said. "It's unfair, but everybody is using an unfair rule against you." [/quote] I wonder what they would do if the defense knowing his coach would call a TO would then run into the kicker knowing that with a TO he would not be penalized and then the kicker would have to limp up to the ball to re kick.

Post #: 309

RE:NFL News - 10/10/2007 5:08:58 PM

John Childress

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The difference is before they called the timeouts before the snap. Now the timeouts are not being called, or least word of it isn't reaching the field, until after the ball is snapped and the kicker has kicked. My feeling is that if the ref doesn't get word out to the field in time to stop the snap then it is too late.

Post #: 310

RE:NFL News - 10/10/2007 5:20:41 PM

Trekgeekscott

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[quote="John Childress"]The difference is before they called the timeouts before the snap. Now the timeouts are not being called, or least word of it isn't reaching the field, until after the ball is snapped and the kicker has kicked. My feeling is that if the ref doesn't get word out to the field in time to stop the snap then it is too late.[/quote] If the timeout is called before the ball is snapped. It is not too late. I remember a few years ago something like this happening in the playoffs, and Bill Cowher losing his mind when his team didn't get a last second time out that was called to late or something. The Steelers lost to the Titans as a result. I think there was an attempt to call a timeout and it wasn't allowed because it was too late, the Steelers player barrelled into the kicker and the Titans ended up getting another shot from closer range or something like that. This is not a new tactic this year. This has been going on for years. Why is it such a big deal now? Because the media is now making a big deal of it, that's why. This is nothing new. Apparently the media has nothing better to gripe about.

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RE:NFL News - 10/10/2007 5:45:07 PM

John Childress

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It is new. It is a new deal now because in three games the refs did not signal timeout before the kick was kicked. That is the difference.

Post #: 312

RE:NFL News - 10/10/2007 5:56:34 PM

Trekgeekscott

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The rule hasn't changed. If the timeout is called before the ball is snapped. It is honored. This is not new. The rules have been the same for decades, and opposing teams have been trying to ice kickers for decades. Sometimes it works. Sometimes it doesn't. The only reason this is an issue is because the attempt to ice the other team's kicker has worked twice this year, changing the apparent outcome of the game. There is no reason to change the rules. There is nothing unfair about it. The rules are simple. If a TO is called before the ball is snapped, then the TO is honored. I still don't see why this is such a big deal.

Post #: 313

RE:NFL News - 10/10/2007 9:59:58 PM

Guest

What has changed about this is the fact just recently coaches have been allowed to call timeout. In the past it had to be done on the field by a player and of course everybody could see it. Now the coach simply has to whisper in the officials ear and none of the players are aware of it until the ball is kicked.

Post #: 314

RE:NFL News - 10/10/2007 10:16:24 PM

Trekgeekscott

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Big difference. and it doesn't change the fact that teams have been icing the other team's kicker for decades. playing head games with them. the kickers should expect it. And no one should be crying about it.

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RE:NFL News - 10/10/2007 10:19:22 PM

Todd M

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When there's just as much chance of the kicker missing the first one and making the second one as vice verca I don't see what all the fuss is about.

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RE:NFL News - 10/10/2007 10:30:26 PM

Trekgeekscott

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[quote="Todd Mallett"]When there's just as much chance of the kicker missing the first one and making the second one as vice verca I don't see what all the fuss is about.[/quote] Exactly. That's what I said when this whole conversation started. I don't see what the fuss is all about.

Post #: 317

RE:NFL News - 10/11/2007 5:05:05 AM

thebigo

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[quote="Trekgeekscott"]Big difference. and it doesn't change the fact that teams have been icing the other team's kicker for decades. playing head games with them. the kickers should expect it. And no one should be crying about it.[/quote] How many times prior to this year did you see a FG attempted after the TO was called?

Post #: 318

RE:NFL News - 10/11/2007 5:08:50 AM

thebigo

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[quote="Todd Mallett"]When there's just as much chance of the kicker missing the first one and making the second one as vice verca I don't see what all the fuss is about.[/quote] Could you post a link with the stat that backs that statement up?

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RE:NFL News - 10/11/2007 6:45:37 AM

Todd M

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[quote="thebigo"][quote="Todd Mallett"]When there's just as much chance of the kicker missing the first one and making the second one as vice verca I don't see what all the fuss is about.[/quote] Could you post a link with the stat that backs that statement up?[/quote] No, all the stats I could find only get into the success rate of icing the kicker. It's a small percentage. http://www.sciencenews.org/articles/20041113/mathtrek.asp Using their model, Berry and Wood calculate that, for an average kicker, the estimated probability of a successful 40-yard kick in sunny weather is 0.759. The estimated probability under the same conditions for an average kicker who has been iced is 0.659. 1 in 4 he misses anyway. If the kicker misses the kick w/o knowing he's been iced, has he been? Think about that. 25% of the time you give a guy another chance to be 66% successful all on the 10% gamble that the icing will be successful. Basically 50-50 like I said. :D

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RE:NFL News - 10/11/2007 7:37:09 AM

djskillz

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A 10 % difference is pretty significant, seeing that most NFL games these days seem to be decided by a FG. I'm with JC on this one; the whole thing just smacks of being childish. Steve Young and Emmit Smith both said as much on Monday as well.

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RE:NFL News - 10/11/2007 2:46:25 PM

John Childress

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RE:NFL News - 10/11/2007 7:29:58 PM

Trekgeekscott

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TO isn't going to spout off about Randy Moss like the last time the two met. TO Keeping quiet about Moss http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/spt/stories/101107dnspocowbriefs.26c002c.html Maybe that's because the last time he did, Moss said nothing, went out and had a huge day including 2 tds and all TO was remembered for was a tirade on the sidelines at his OC.

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RE:NFL News - 10/11/2007 8:09:19 PM

Toby Stumbo

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That was awesome the way I remember it. :)

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RE:NFL News - 10/11/2007 8:25:20 PM

So.Mn.Fan

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CHARLOTTE, N.C. -- Carolina Panthers quarterback David Carr missed practice for a second straight day Thursday with a sore back, increasing the chances 43-year-old Vinny Testaverde could start on Sunday at Arizona. No word on whether or not George Blanda will be able to back up Vinny. :roll: Otto Graham has a nap scheduled that day and will be unavailable.

Post #: 325