quote:

ORIGINAL: ronhextall

If Ziggy thinks he might fire Speilman after the season he would be foolish to let him trade away guys that could fetch high draft picks.

quote:

ORIGINAL: odin

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

Pretty simple...get us the damn ball if you want to win. Put us in the game plan as you haven't much so far. Don't mind both Diggs and Thielen speaking up. Usually you don't give both a big contract and then take the ball completely away from them.

Diggs had 44 targets the first 4 games of 2018, 19 so far.
Thielen had 56 targets the first 4 games of 2018, 22 so far.

I believe they both have achievable production-based incentives in their contracts that they are almost sure to miss that will likely cost them millions, not to mention the impact this will have on their next contract. Their point of view is likely 'I gave them a hometown discount but with incentives that would help make up for much of that, and end up getting screwed due to shitty and timid QB play and throwing less than all other teams'.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ragnarök

quote:

ORIGINAL: odin

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

Pretty simple...get us the damn ball if you want to win. Put us in the game plan as you haven't much so far. Don't mind both Diggs and Thielen speaking up. Usually you don't give both a big contract and then take the ball completely away from them.

Diggs had 44 targets the first 4 games of 2018, 19 so far.
Thielen had 56 targets the first 4 games of 2018, 22 so far.

I believe they both have achievable production-based incentives in their contracts that they are almost sure to miss that will likely cost them millions, not to mention the impact this will have on their next contract. Their point of view is likely 'I gave them a hometown discount but with incentives that would help make up for much of that, and end up getting screwed due to shitty and timid QB play and throwing less than all other teams'.

This is a great thought and huge valid point!

If the current offensive philosophy and QB play are going to cost them big time that would be a legit reason, not to mention both these guys have a great love for the game, and both were under dogs who elevated their careers by working their ass off and proving themselves only to see it go this way...

Imagine being a team mate, knowing your QB is making a fully guaranteed pay check, eclipsing your own pay, and far under preforming, to the point it is now costing you money out of your pocket... As well as the highly competitive nature and drive these guys to not only win but be at top of their game at their positions... It is being wasted and they have every right to be vocal for change just as us fans do as well...

Zimmer and company with his directive on we all need to just shut up can go kick rocks somewhere else...

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

quote:

ORIGINAL: bohumm

Jones was horrible last year. If he was better this preseason, maybe (or maybe not, true) it's because he's a vet reserve playing against young guys and/or guys who can't actually play in the league. Bradbury obviously has some issues, but he does good things, particularly in the run game, too. One of the best things about the Patriots is that they use the early part of the regular season to actually get better. Even as critical as I've been of the OLine over the years, I think it's likely they will improve significantly over the course of this season; whether they improve enough, soon enough remains to be seen. Bradbury should get better this year and next year; replacing him with a bad player won't help that process.

Jones didn't play well in two and a half games last year. The prior year (2017), PFF gave him their 3rd highest pass-blocking grade for a center (83.2) as a 13-game starter. Giants got rid of him to clear cap space.

PFF is meaningless.

We gave the Giants a 7th rd pick for Jones (or he would have been released). That was his veteran worth to us and the Giants.

Jones stunk it up in the three games he played last year. Then he backed up Elflein who had a terrible season. It's not like Jones played or practiced well enough to get another shot.

Then we released him in Sept. We resigned him a week later but that is not the path you take when a team values your starting potential.

He's an emergency backup.

Our team doesn't value getting the ball into our playmakers hands on offense either. I wouldn't put a whole lot of stock into what this team values as far as how right or wrong it is. Things we do are strange lately.

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

Ben Goessling@GoesslingStrib·
56m
My understanding is Stefon Diggs wasn’t in the building on Monday, either. As the Vikings continue preparation for the Giants, today is a key day to see if Diggs shows up, or if what sources have described as disenchantment with the organization continues to keep him away.

Andrew Krammer@Andrew_Krammer
16m
Stefon Diggs' frustration with #Vikings has simmered, and it came to a head so far this week when deciding not to show up.

Remember, Diggs did not attend a week of OTAs this spring that, while voluntary, were out of character. Referenced "house problems" then.

quote:

ORIGINAL: CPAMAN

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

Ben Goessling@GoesslingStrib·
56m
My understanding is Stefon Diggs wasn’t in the building on Monday, either. As the Vikings continue preparation for the Giants, today is a key day to see if Diggs shows up, or if what sources have described as disenchantment with the organization continues to keep him away.

Andrew Krammer@Andrew_Krammer
16m
Stefon Diggs' frustration with #Vikings has simmered, and it came to a head so far this week when deciding not to show up.

Remember, Diggs did not attend a week of OTAs this spring that, while voluntary, were out of character. Referenced "house problems" then.

No surprise there is team dissension in the Vikings locker room. The Vikings treat ignorance as bliss.

quote:

ORIGINAL: CPAMAN

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

quote:

ORIGINAL: bohumm

Jones was horrible last year. If he was better this preseason, maybe (or maybe not, true) it's because he's a vet reserve playing against young guys and/or guys who can't actually play in the league. Bradbury obviously has some issues, but he does good things, particularly in the run game, too. One of the best things about the Patriots is that they use the early part of the regular season to actually get better. Even as critical as I've been of the OLine over the years, I think it's likely they will improve significantly over the course of this season; whether they improve enough, soon enough remains to be seen. Bradbury should get better this year and next year; replacing him with a bad player won't help that process.

Jones didn't play well in two and a half games last year. The prior year (2017), PFF gave him their 3rd highest pass-blocking grade for a center (83.2) as a 13-game starter. Giants got rid of him to clear cap space.

PFF is meaningless.

We gave the Giants a 7th rd pick for Jones (or he would have been released). That was his veteran worth to us and the Giants.

Jones stunk it up in the three games he played last year. Then he backed up Elflein who had a terrible season. It's not like Jones played or practiced well enough to get another shot.

Then we released him in Sept. We resigned him a week later but that is not the path you take when a team values your starting potential.

He's an emergency backup.

Our team doesn't value getting the ball into our playmakers hands on offense either. I wouldn't put a whole lot of stock into what this team values as far as how right or wrong it is. Things we do are strange lately.

Why did they sign both Diggs and Thielen to huge, long-term contracts along with the guaranteed money to Cousins if the Vikings were going to change their philosophy to a run first offense? This is probably one of the most ill franchises in professional sports.

quote:

ORIGINAL: thebigo

The Bears were favored to win all 4 of their games, 2 home, 2 on the road against bottom feeders. They only won 3 of those games.

The Packers were favored to win 3 of their 4 games, and have won 3.

The Vikes were favored to win 2 games, dogs in 2. Won the 2 they were supposed to win, lost the 2 they were supposed to win.

It's hardly time for the mass bridge jumping we are seeing.

Most people understood that with a new blocking scheme and 3 positions with new starters, the OL would be something of a work in progress until around midseason. It's been good enough against weaker opponents early on. The Vikings should be favored to win the next 4 games. Do that, and we are talking 6-2 after 8 games. And potentially the OL could be rounding into form by then, by the time we roll into KC with a 10 day break people could well be singing a different tune. Who knows, maybe Samia and/or Udoh are contributing by then.

quote:

ORIGINAL: thebigo

quote:

ORIGINAL: CPAMAN

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

quote:

ORIGINAL: bohumm

Jones was horrible last year. If he was better this preseason, maybe (or maybe not, true) it's because he's a vet reserve playing against young guys and/or guys who can't actually play in the league. Bradbury obviously has some issues, but he does good things, particularly in the run game, too. One of the best things about the Patriots is that they use the early part of the regular season to actually get better. Even as critical as I've been of the OLine over the years, I think it's likely they will improve significantly over the course of this season; whether they improve enough, soon enough remains to be seen. Bradbury should get better this year and next year; replacing him with a bad player won't help that process.

Jones didn't play well in two and a half games last year. The prior year (2017), PFF gave him their 3rd highest pass-blocking grade for a center (83.2) as a 13-game starter. Giants got rid of him to clear cap space.

PFF is meaningless.

We gave the Giants a 7th rd pick for Jones (or he would have been released). That was his veteran worth to us and the Giants.

Jones stunk it up in the three games he played last year. Then he backed up Elflein who had a terrible season. It's not like Jones played or practiced well enough to get another shot.

Then we released him in Sept. We resigned him a week later but that is not the path you take when a team values your starting potential.

He's an emergency backup.

Our team doesn't value getting the ball into our playmakers hands on offense either. I wouldn't put a whole lot of stock into what this team values as far as how right or wrong it is. Things we do are strange lately.

Why did they sign both Diggs and Thielen to huge, long-term contracts along with the guaranteed money to Cousins if the Vikings were going to change their philosophy to a run first offense? This is probably one of the most ill franchises in professional sports.

Did I mention it's been 29 years since the Twins won more than 1 game in a playoff series?

quote:

ORIGINAL: geoffrey greitzer

Quiet in here given the circumstances...
Giants loss...
Shit hits fan....

quote:

ORIGINAL: CPAMAN

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

quote:

ORIGINAL: bohumm

Jones was horrible last year. If he was better this preseason, maybe (or maybe not, true) it's because he's a vet reserve playing against young guys and/or guys who can't actually play in the league. Bradbury obviously has some issues, but he does good things, particularly in the run game, too. One of the best things about the Patriots is that they use the early part of the regular season to actually get better. Even as critical as I've been of the OLine over the years, I think it's likely they will improve significantly over the course of this season; whether they improve enough, soon enough remains to be seen. Bradbury should get better this year and next year; replacing him with a bad player won't help that process.

Jones didn't play well in two and a half games last year. The prior year (2017), PFF gave him their 3rd highest pass-blocking grade for a center (83.2) as a 13-game starter. Giants got rid of him to clear cap space.

PFF is meaningless.

We gave the Giants a 7th rd pick for Jones (or he would have been released). That was his veteran worth to us and the Giants.

Jones stunk it up in the three games he played last year. Then he backed up Elflein who had a terrible season. It's not like Jones played or practiced well enough to get another shot.

Then we released him in Sept. We resigned him a week later but that is not the path you take when a team values your starting potential.

He's an emergency backup.

Our team doesn't value getting the ball into our playmakers hands on offense either. I wouldn't put a whole lot of stock into what this team values as far as how right or wrong it is. Things we do are strange lately.

Why did they sign both Diggs and Thielen to huge, long-term contracts along with the guaranteed money to Cousins if the Vikings were going to change their philosophy to a run first offense? This is probably one of the most ill franchises in professional sports.

quote:

ORIGINAL: thebigo

The Bears were favored to win all 4 of their games, 2 home, 2 on the road against bottom feeders. They only won 3 of those games.

The Packers were favored to win 3 of their 4 games, and have won 3.

The Vikes were favored to win 2 games, dogs in 2. Won the 2 they were supposed to win, lost the 2 they were supposed to win.

It's hardly time for the mass bridge jumping we are seeing.

Most people understood that with a new blocking scheme and 3 positions with new starters, the OL would be something of a work in progress until around midseason. It's been good enough against weaker opponents early on. The Vikings should be favored to win the next 4 games. Do that, and we are talking 6-2 after 8 games. And potentially the OL could be rounding into form by then, by the time we roll into KC with a 10 day break people could well be singing a different tune. Who knows, maybe Samia and/or Udoh are contributing by then.

quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

quote:

ORIGINAL: thebigo

quote:

ORIGINAL: CPAMAN

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

quote:

ORIGINAL: bohumm

Jones was horrible last year. If he was better this preseason, maybe (or maybe not, true) it's because he's a vet reserve playing against young guys and/or guys who can't actually play in the league. Bradbury obviously has some issues, but he does good things, particularly in the run game, too. One of the best things about the Patriots is that they use the early part of the regular season to actually get better. Even as critical as I've been of the OLine over the years, I think it's likely they will improve significantly over the course of this season; whether they improve enough, soon enough remains to be seen. Bradbury should get better this year and next year; replacing him with a bad player won't help that process.

Jones didn't play well in two and a half games last year. The prior year (2017), PFF gave him their 3rd highest pass-blocking grade for a center (83.2) as a 13-game starter. Giants got rid of him to clear cap space.

PFF is meaningless.

We gave the Giants a 7th rd pick for Jones (or he would have been released). That was his veteran worth to us and the Giants.

Jones stunk it up in the three games he played last year. Then he backed up Elflein who had a terrible season. It's not like Jones played or practiced well enough to get another shot.

Then we released him in Sept. We resigned him a week later but that is not the path you take when a team values your starting potential.

He's an emergency backup.

Our team doesn't value getting the ball into our playmakers hands on offense either. I wouldn't put a whole lot of stock into what this team values as far as how right or wrong it is. Things we do are strange lately.

Why did they sign both Diggs and Thielen to huge, long-term contracts along with the guaranteed money to Cousins if the Vikings were going to change their philosophy to a run first offense? This is probably one of the most ill franchises in professional sports.

Did I mention it's been 29 years since the Twins won more than 1 game in a playoff series?

They beat the A's 3 games to 2 in 2002, so 17 years, a long time.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ragnarök

quote:

ORIGINAL: ronhextall

If Ziggy thinks he might fire Speilman after the season he would be foolish to let him trade away guys that could fetch high draft picks.

Unfortunately I dont get the feeling Ziggy and company have any mind for the game or personel moves from a player standpoint

quote:

ORIGINAL: marty

In that scenario, if Sloter did well, Zimmer/Spielman would look like imbeciles in terms of their ability to evaluate QB talent and get good value.

But if success is the bottom line, wouldn't they be ok with admitting they whiffed on Cousins like they did with Bradford, and accept what nearly worked in the past with Keenum, do the same thing with Sloter, except the young Sloter takes them farther than Keenum.

They would look like the Eagles winning with Foles, and look smart for having a good backup plan.