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RE: Free Agency 2021

 
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RE: Free Agency 2021 - 3/24/2021 10:38:39 AM   
Bill Johanesen


Posts: 27640
Status: offline
If Cleveland is moving to LT (which I believe will occur), I still go Paye at #14 then do what needs to be done to move up with the next pick and take Leatherwood or even Wyatt Davis (and hope Davis never faces Barmore!).

Paye + Leatherwood + FA G vs.
Vera-Tucker + X draftee(s) + FA G

With the Paye option you lose some of the mid round picks in order to move up. And you end up with less projected talent at G (Vera-Tucker vs. Leatherwood/Davis type) but you end up with the best DE vs. X from whatever the second pick is.
Post #: 751
RE: Free Agency 2021 - 3/24/2021 10:41:52 AM   
Bill Johanesen


Posts: 27640
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pager

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

At this point LT has to be the #1 priority. I know we do have some options for moving O'Neal or Ezra over there.

A trade for Orlando Brown appears to have stalled due to balt's asking price.

I think a Slater or Darrisaw will fall to #14 but that's a bit of a gamble.



I view LT exactly the same as I did after the draft last year. I would be very ok if we didn't trade for a T, sign 1, or draft one in the first two rounds.

Same reasons why I thought we should cut Reiff last year prior to the season. I don't want the cost of a vet T, or to give up draft picks/players. We still have to resign Oneill, and while getting through this and next year caps crisis, spending a lot money on LT isn't worth it to me.

We have Ezra - athletic skills and showed progress out of position (imo) at guard. We have ONeill, former LT, and we have Udoh. If Ezra was inserted at LT and bombed (unlikely imo) we have Hill on the roster whose shown he can be at minimum "not a train wreck". Or if Udoh shows he can handle RT, there's another option (moving Oneill to LT).

We still have literally nothing at guard. Hyperbole, I'd like to see Udoh given a chance at RG, and curious to see Hinton but it's not much of an exaggeration AND have no safety net (like Hill at T).

I view Guard, Safety, and DE as bigger needs than LT. I really hope we don't give up assets for Brown Jr (or trade for a T) and then have to sign him to a massive extension.

But it's the Vikings which means they'll do something exactly along these lines.

LT is not a position to be toyed with nor fall asleep on. Not having a competent LT can derail a season by itself (see 2016) or TJ Clemmings.

I was wondering why Ezra wasn't given a chance to play LT week 17 when Reiff was put on covid list. This seemed liked a huge missed opportunity. Why play Hill a career backup?

This either was a complete oversight on our coaching staff or they have zero plans on playing Cleveland at LT. The evidence seems to point to this so we are either moving O'Neal over to LT or our future LT isn't on the roster yet.


Not playing Erza for just the last game doesn't mean they have zero plans for him at LT. He would have had like two days practice at LT which is nothing. What realistic development or analysis can you get from that.

Plus RG would have been manned by..... nobody?

Yep. Putting him in at LT after he had practiced exclusively at G all season would have been setting him up to fail. What pisses me off is that the Vikings should know at this point if he is going to be their LT or not.


They may know their plan but won't divulge it due to the draft. Or they say something and one is left to wonder if it is the proverbial/standard smokescreen or the super-sneaky double smokescreen.
Post #: 752
RE: Free Agency 2021 - 3/24/2021 10:56:37 AM   
Bill Johanesen


Posts: 27640
Status: offline
Unless Spielman is happy with a bunch of OL players all equally rated knowing he can get one at #14, what sucks is who we draft at G seems to have zero effect on who we sign as a FA.

IOW, we could miss out on our top candidates in the draft and in hindsight RS would/should be thinking damn I should have signed a better FA G for the opposite side.

I can hear Spielman's press release comments now "Yeah, we did our due diligence and ranked the players. And we stayed true to our board! But wow we never expected such a run on those players. Something that happens once in decades. Nonetheless, we like our guy a lot. He wrestled in 9th grade so that's a plus. Plus he took dance lessons so you know the footwork is there. We can't wait for our coaches to mold him, get him the reps. Ugh, where he starts is unknown because we will put our best five out there."
Post #: 753
RE: Free Agency 2021 - 3/24/2021 10:57:01 AM   
Tom Sykes

 

Posts: 5711
Joined: 7/27/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pager

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

At this point LT has to be the #1 priority. I know we do have some options for moving O'Neal or Ezra over there.

A trade for Orlando Brown appears to have stalled due to balt's asking price.

I think a Slater or Darrisaw will fall to #14 but that's a bit of a gamble.



I view LT exactly the same as I did after the draft last year. I would be very ok if we didn't trade for a T, sign 1, or draft one in the first two rounds.

Same reasons why I thought we should cut Reiff last year prior to the season. I don't want the cost of a vet T, or to give up draft picks/players. We still have to resign Oneill, and while getting through this and next year caps crisis, spending a lot money on LT isn't worth it to me.

We have Ezra - athletic skills and showed progress out of position (imo) at guard. We have ONeill, former LT, and we have Udoh. If Ezra was inserted at LT and bombed (unlikely imo) we have Hill on the roster whose shown he can be at minimum "not a train wreck". Or if Udoh shows he can handle RT, there's another option (moving Oneill to LT).

We still have literally nothing at guard. Hyperbole, I'd like to see Udoh given a chance at RG, and curious to see Hinton but it's not much of an exaggeration AND have no safety net (like Hill at T).

I view Guard, Safety, and DE as bigger needs than LT. I really hope we don't give up assets for Brown Jr (or trade for a T) and then have to sign him to a massive extension.

But it's the Vikings which means they'll do something exactly along these lines.

LT is not a position to be toyed with nor fall asleep on. Not having a competent LT can derail a season by itself (see 2016) or TJ Clemmings.

I was wondering why Ezra wasn't given a chance to play LT week 17 when Reiff was put on covid list. This seemed liked a huge missed opportunity. Why play Hill a career backup?

This either was a complete oversight on our coaching staff or they have zero plans on playing Cleveland at LT. The evidence seems to point to this so we are either moving O'Neal over to LT or our future LT isn't on the roster yet.


Not playing Erza for just the last game doesn't mean they have zero plans for him at LT. He would have had like two days practice at LT which is nothing. What realistic development or analysis can you get from that.

Plus RG would have been manned by..... nobody?

Yep. Putting him in at LT after he had practiced exclusively at G all season would have been setting him up to fail. What pisses me off is that the Vikings should know at this point if he is going to be their LT or not.

They probably have a 'firm' idea of their flexible plan, we just have no clue.

('plan' relative to our Vikings and not, say, other teams with decent OLs).

It's not like we have Tice anymore spilling every last proprietary detail of the regime's thought process.

The 'plan' has to be reworked every time a FA target wants too much or signs elsewhere, a draft target gets taken before our pick, etc. so it's possible they might be on plan C or X by now, we just don't know it.

Cleveland should give us flexibility to sign or draft an OT or G we rate highly and use him (Cleveland) for the other position ... but for all we know they liked him/didn't like him at G / they only view him as a T long-term, etc.

Regardless, there is still one completely vacant Guard starter position with no possible solution on the roster. I can see Rick and his perverted OL draft approach taking a G or T in the draft and then waiting until June or later to pick up a scrub.

Frustrating.

EDIT: GZUZ I see Bill covered this stuff.

< Message edited by Tom Sykes -- 3/24/2021 11:01:36 AM >
Post #: 754
RE: Free Agency 2021 - 3/24/2021 11:01:13 AM   
TJSweens


Posts: 44484
Joined: 7/16/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

Two scenarios revolving around Cleveland.

Cleveland stays at G (IMO a bad move)
- They draft a projected top talent LT at #14
- They sign a mid-low tier FA G

Cleveland moves to LT
- They draft a pure G or a LT that can and will play G (or knowing them they draft another tall, thin OT that ends up at G)
- They sign a mid-low tier FA G

I have a feeling it's going to be option 1, for better or worse. If Cleveland is going to be their LT, I would think they would have stated it by now and they wouldn't be looking at trade and FA options to fill the spot. The Vikings value athleticism at G more than anything else. My gut says that they believe with some quality time in the weight room and work on his technique, they can shore up his pass blocking. They already like his ability to get to next level of the defense when run blocks and they place a high value on that. Of course they also thought Elflein and Bradbury would get stronger and more effective on the inside too.

_____________________________

"The eternal fate of the noble and enlightened: to be brutally crushed by the armed and dumb."
Post #: 755
RE: Free Agency 2021 - 3/24/2021 11:03:23 AM   
TJSweens


Posts: 44484
Joined: 7/16/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pager

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

At this point LT has to be the #1 priority. I know we do have some options for moving O'Neal or Ezra over there.

A trade for Orlando Brown appears to have stalled due to balt's asking price.

I think a Slater or Darrisaw will fall to #14 but that's a bit of a gamble.



I view LT exactly the same as I did after the draft last year. I would be very ok if we didn't trade for a T, sign 1, or draft one in the first two rounds.

Same reasons why I thought we should cut Reiff last year prior to the season. I don't want the cost of a vet T, or to give up draft picks/players. We still have to resign Oneill, and while getting through this and next year caps crisis, spending a lot money on LT isn't worth it to me.

We have Ezra - athletic skills and showed progress out of position (imo) at guard. We have ONeill, former LT, and we have Udoh. If Ezra was inserted at LT and bombed (unlikely imo) we have Hill on the roster whose shown he can be at minimum "not a train wreck". Or if Udoh shows he can handle RT, there's another option (moving Oneill to LT).

We still have literally nothing at guard. Hyperbole, I'd like to see Udoh given a chance at RG, and curious to see Hinton but it's not much of an exaggeration AND have no safety net (like Hill at T).

I view Guard, Safety, and DE as bigger needs than LT. I really hope we don't give up assets for Brown Jr (or trade for a T) and then have to sign him to a massive extension.

But it's the Vikings which means they'll do something exactly along these lines.

LT is not a position to be toyed with nor fall asleep on. Not having a competent LT can derail a season by itself (see 2016) or TJ Clemmings.

I was wondering why Ezra wasn't given a chance to play LT week 17 when Reiff was put on covid list. This seemed liked a huge missed opportunity. Why play Hill a career backup?

This either was a complete oversight on our coaching staff or they have zero plans on playing Cleveland at LT. The evidence seems to point to this so we are either moving O'Neal over to LT or our future LT isn't on the roster yet.


Not playing Erza for just the last game doesn't mean they have zero plans for him at LT. He would have had like two days practice at LT which is nothing. What realistic development or analysis can you get from that.

Plus RG would have been manned by..... nobody?

Yep. Putting him in at LT after he had practiced exclusively at G all season would have been setting him up to fail. What pisses me off is that the Vikings should know at this point if he is going to be their LT or not.


They may know their plan but won't divulge it due to the draft. Or they say something and one is left to wonder if it is the proverbial/standard smokescreen or the super-sneaky double smokescreen.

It's almost like he is their fall back plan if they can't add a LT by other means.

_____________________________

"The eternal fate of the noble and enlightened: to be brutally crushed by the armed and dumb."
Post #: 756
RE: Free Agency 2021 - 3/24/2021 11:04:06 AM   
Bill Jandro

 

Posts: 17862
Joined: 8/13/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pager

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

At this point LT has to be the #1 priority. I know we do have some options for moving O'Neal or Ezra over there.

A trade for Orlando Brown appears to have stalled due to balt's asking price.

I think a Slater or Darrisaw will fall to #14 but that's a bit of a gamble.



I view LT exactly the same as I did after the draft last year. I would be very ok if we didn't trade for a T, sign 1, or draft one in the first two rounds.

Same reasons why I thought we should cut Reiff last year prior to the season. I don't want the cost of a vet T, or to give up draft picks/players. We still have to resign Oneill, and while getting through this and next year caps crisis, spending a lot money on LT isn't worth it to me.

We have Ezra - athletic skills and showed progress out of position (imo) at guard. We have ONeill, former LT, and we have Udoh. If Ezra was inserted at LT and bombed (unlikely imo) we have Hill on the roster whose shown he can be at minimum "not a train wreck". Or if Udoh shows he can handle RT, there's another option (moving Oneill to LT).

We still have literally nothing at guard. Hyperbole, I'd like to see Udoh given a chance at RG, and curious to see Hinton but it's not much of an exaggeration AND have no safety net (like Hill at T).

I view Guard, Safety, and DE as bigger needs than LT. I really hope we don't give up assets for Brown Jr (or trade for a T) and then have to sign him to a massive extension.

But it's the Vikings which means they'll do something exactly along these lines.

LT is not a position to be toyed with nor fall asleep on. Not having a competent LT can derail a season by itself (see 2016) or TJ Clemmings.

I was wondering why Ezra wasn't given a chance to play LT week 17 when Reiff was put on covid list. This seemed liked a huge missed opportunity. Why play Hill a career backup?

This either was a complete oversight on our coaching staff or they have zero plans on playing Cleveland at LT. The evidence seems to point to this so we are either moving O'Neal over to LT or our future LT isn't on the roster yet.


Not playing Erza for just the last game doesn't mean they have zero plans for him at LT. He would have had like two days practice at LT which is nothing. What realistic development or analysis can you get from that.

Plus RG would have been manned by..... nobody?

Yep. Putting him in at LT after he had practiced exclusively at G all season would have been setting him up to fail. What pisses me off is that the Vikings should know at this point if he is going to be their LT or not.


They may know their plan but won't divulge it due to the draft. Or they say something and one is left to wonder if it is the proverbial/standard smokescreen or the super-sneaky double smokescreen.

Not buying putting your LTOTF at RG. just doesn't make a lick of sense.

In fact I don't think they have a plan at all.

_____________________________

Oline...early and often this draft
Post #: 757
RE: Free Agency 2021 - 3/24/2021 11:08:35 AM   
Bill Johanesen


Posts: 27640
Status: offline
The uncertainty wouldn't be so bad if the regime had shown half a clue the past decade. Instead it's more like wondering how they will screw things up this time.
Post #: 758
RE: Free Agency 2021 - 3/24/2021 11:09:39 AM   
TJSweens


Posts: 44484
Joined: 7/16/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pager

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

At this point LT has to be the #1 priority. I know we do have some options for moving O'Neal or Ezra over there.

A trade for Orlando Brown appears to have stalled due to balt's asking price.

I think a Slater or Darrisaw will fall to #14 but that's a bit of a gamble.



I view LT exactly the same as I did after the draft last year. I would be very ok if we didn't trade for a T, sign 1, or draft one in the first two rounds.

Same reasons why I thought we should cut Reiff last year prior to the season. I don't want the cost of a vet T, or to give up draft picks/players. We still have to resign Oneill, and while getting through this and next year caps crisis, spending a lot money on LT isn't worth it to me.

We have Ezra - athletic skills and showed progress out of position (imo) at guard. We have ONeill, former LT, and we have Udoh. If Ezra was inserted at LT and bombed (unlikely imo) we have Hill on the roster whose shown he can be at minimum "not a train wreck". Or if Udoh shows he can handle RT, there's another option (moving Oneill to LT).

We still have literally nothing at guard. Hyperbole, I'd like to see Udoh given a chance at RG, and curious to see Hinton but it's not much of an exaggeration AND have no safety net (like Hill at T).

I view Guard, Safety, and DE as bigger needs than LT. I really hope we don't give up assets for Brown Jr (or trade for a T) and then have to sign him to a massive extension.

But it's the Vikings which means they'll do something exactly along these lines.

LT is not a position to be toyed with nor fall asleep on. Not having a competent LT can derail a season by itself (see 2016) or TJ Clemmings.

I was wondering why Ezra wasn't given a chance to play LT week 17 when Reiff was put on covid list. This seemed liked a huge missed opportunity. Why play Hill a career backup?

This either was a complete oversight on our coaching staff or they have zero plans on playing Cleveland at LT. The evidence seems to point to this so we are either moving O'Neal over to LT or our future LT isn't on the roster yet.


Not playing Erza for just the last game doesn't mean they have zero plans for him at LT. He would have had like two days practice at LT which is nothing. What realistic development or analysis can you get from that.

Plus RG would have been manned by..... nobody?

Yep. Putting him in at LT after he had practiced exclusively at G all season would have been setting him up to fail. What pisses me off is that the Vikings should know at this point if he is going to be their LT or not.


They may know their plan but won't divulge it due to the draft. Or they say something and one is left to wonder if it is the proverbial/standard smokescreen or the super-sneaky double smokescreen.

Not buying putting your LTOTF at RG. just doesn't make a lick of sense.

In fact I don't think they have a plan at all.

BINGO! When they drafted Cleveland, everyone assumed he was the LT of the future. It was just a matter of whether he started right away or groomed for a year behind Reif. Then, right away, Spielman starts talking about his ability to play guard or tackle. Why do you draft a guy when you have no idea where you are going to play him? Reif took the pay cut and they immediately moved Cleveland to the #3 RG. And they wonder why this line is so screwed up.

_____________________________

"The eternal fate of the noble and enlightened: to be brutally crushed by the armed and dumb."
Post #: 759
RE: Free Agency 2021 - 3/24/2021 11:17:08 AM   
Tom Sykes

 

Posts: 5711
Joined: 7/27/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pager

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

At this point LT has to be the #1 priority. I know we do have some options for moving O'Neal or Ezra over there.

A trade for Orlando Brown appears to have stalled due to balt's asking price.

I think a Slater or Darrisaw will fall to #14 but that's a bit of a gamble.



I view LT exactly the same as I did after the draft last year. I would be very ok if we didn't trade for a T, sign 1, or draft one in the first two rounds.

Same reasons why I thought we should cut Reiff last year prior to the season. I don't want the cost of a vet T, or to give up draft picks/players. We still have to resign Oneill, and while getting through this and next year caps crisis, spending a lot money on LT isn't worth it to me.

We have Ezra - athletic skills and showed progress out of position (imo) at guard. We have ONeill, former LT, and we have Udoh. If Ezra was inserted at LT and bombed (unlikely imo) we have Hill on the roster whose shown he can be at minimum "not a train wreck". Or if Udoh shows he can handle RT, there's another option (moving Oneill to LT).

We still have literally nothing at guard. Hyperbole, I'd like to see Udoh given a chance at RG, and curious to see Hinton but it's not much of an exaggeration AND have no safety net (like Hill at T).

I view Guard, Safety, and DE as bigger needs than LT. I really hope we don't give up assets for Brown Jr (or trade for a T) and then have to sign him to a massive extension.

But it's the Vikings which means they'll do something exactly along these lines.

LT is not a position to be toyed with nor fall asleep on. Not having a competent LT can derail a season by itself (see 2016) or TJ Clemmings.

I was wondering why Ezra wasn't given a chance to play LT week 17 when Reiff was put on covid list. This seemed liked a huge missed opportunity. Why play Hill a career backup?

This either was a complete oversight on our coaching staff or they have zero plans on playing Cleveland at LT. The evidence seems to point to this so we are either moving O'Neal over to LT or our future LT isn't on the roster yet.


Not playing Erza for just the last game doesn't mean they have zero plans for him at LT. He would have had like two days practice at LT which is nothing. What realistic development or analysis can you get from that.

Plus RG would have been manned by..... nobody?

Yep. Putting him in at LT after he had practiced exclusively at G all season would have been setting him up to fail. What pisses me off is that the Vikings should know at this point if he is going to be their LT or not.


They may know their plan but won't divulge it due to the draft. Or they say something and one is left to wonder if it is the proverbial/standard smokescreen or the super-sneaky double smokescreen.

Not buying putting your LTOTF at RG. just doesn't make a lick of sense.

In fact I don't think they have a plan at all.

LTOTF? There's a lot of confidence in here that Cleveland is a LTOTF ... he was a second rd pick who got moved to G his first year. Remains to be seen.

To use your words: 'what we know right now' is that we have one good OT in O'Neil, a 2nd yr OL that looks promising, a C with his nose just above water, and one good back-up OT in Hill. That's it. So any decent OL at any position signed traded or drafted will fit perfectly into our 'grand design'.

There's a plan for certain. Unfortunately, until / if / when they start adding pieces (they will, won't they?), we won't know how good or shitty it is.

< Message edited by Tom Sykes -- 3/24/2021 11:19:33 AM >
Post #: 760
RE: Free Agency 2021 - 3/24/2021 11:20:43 AM   
Tom Sykes

 

Posts: 5711
Joined: 7/27/2007
Status: offline
Chris Tomasson
@christomasson
·
3m
#Vikings to re-sign RB Ameer Abdullah. With Mike Boone gone, he's in line to be the No. 3 back after Dalvin Cook and Alexander Mattison.
Post #: 761
RE: Free Agency 2021 - 3/24/2021 11:35:08 AM   
Bruce Johnson

 

Posts: 16353
Joined: 8/27/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

Chris Tomasson
@christomasson
·
3m
#Vikings to re-sign RB Ameer Abdullah. With Mike Boone gone, he's in line to be the No. 3 back after Dalvin Cook and Alexander Mattison.


I thought we could draft a running back since we have so many draft picks in the middle of the draft. Maybe we still will.

Question: Does Abdullah contribute well on special teams? I would think a third string any position would have to contribute on special teams, so he probably does.

_____________________________

We live in a world where we depend upon each other. In other words, we need each other just as God needs us and we need Him. How wonderful it would be if we could unite and live in harmony. Wouldn't it be better that way?
Post #: 762
RE: Free Agency 2021 - 3/24/2021 11:41:11 AM   
David Levine


Posts: 76914
Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Las Vegas
Status: online
quote:

ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

Chris Tomasson
@christomasson
·
3m
#Vikings to re-sign RB Ameer Abdullah. With Mike Boone gone, he's in line to be the No. 3 back after Dalvin Cook and Alexander Mattison.


I thought we could draft a running back since we have so many draft picks in the middle of the draft. Maybe we still will.

Question: Does Abdullah contribute well on special teams? I would think a third string any position would have to contribute on special teams, so he probably does.


He had half our KRs last year - and he was better than Osborn.

And he was 3rd on the team in ST snaps (just 2 tackles).

On offense he had 16 touches, 100 yards and 2 TDs.
Post #: 763
RE: Free Agency 2021 - 3/24/2021 11:43:42 AM   
Bill Johanesen


Posts: 27640
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pager

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

At this point LT has to be the #1 priority. I know we do have some options for moving O'Neal or Ezra over there.

A trade for Orlando Brown appears to have stalled due to balt's asking price.

I think a Slater or Darrisaw will fall to #14 but that's a bit of a gamble.



I view LT exactly the same as I did after the draft last year. I would be very ok if we didn't trade for a T, sign 1, or draft one in the first two rounds.

Same reasons why I thought we should cut Reiff last year prior to the season. I don't want the cost of a vet T, or to give up draft picks/players. We still have to resign Oneill, and while getting through this and next year caps crisis, spending a lot money on LT isn't worth it to me.

We have Ezra - athletic skills and showed progress out of position (imo) at guard. We have ONeill, former LT, and we have Udoh. If Ezra was inserted at LT and bombed (unlikely imo) we have Hill on the roster whose shown he can be at minimum "not a train wreck". Or if Udoh shows he can handle RT, there's another option (moving Oneill to LT).

We still have literally nothing at guard. Hyperbole, I'd like to see Udoh given a chance at RG, and curious to see Hinton but it's not much of an exaggeration AND have no safety net (like Hill at T).

I view Guard, Safety, and DE as bigger needs than LT. I really hope we don't give up assets for Brown Jr (or trade for a T) and then have to sign him to a massive extension.

But it's the Vikings which means they'll do something exactly along these lines.

LT is not a position to be toyed with nor fall asleep on. Not having a competent LT can derail a season by itself (see 2016) or TJ Clemmings.

I was wondering why Ezra wasn't given a chance to play LT week 17 when Reiff was put on covid list. This seemed liked a huge missed opportunity. Why play Hill a career backup?

This either was a complete oversight on our coaching staff or they have zero plans on playing Cleveland at LT. The evidence seems to point to this so we are either moving O'Neal over to LT or our future LT isn't on the roster yet.


Not playing Erza for just the last game doesn't mean they have zero plans for him at LT. He would have had like two days practice at LT which is nothing. What realistic development or analysis can you get from that.

Plus RG would have been manned by..... nobody?

Yep. Putting him in at LT after he had practiced exclusively at G all season would have been setting him up to fail. What pisses me off is that the Vikings should know at this point if he is going to be their LT or not.


They may know their plan but won't divulge it due to the draft. Or they say something and one is left to wonder if it is the proverbial/standard smokescreen or the super-sneaky double smokescreen.

Not buying putting your LTOTF at RG. just doesn't make a lick of sense.

In fact I don't think they have a plan at all.

LTOTF? There's a lot of confidence in here that Cleveland is a LTOTF ... he was a second rd pick who got moved to G his first year. Remains to be seen.

To use your words: 'what we know right now' is that we have one good OT in O'Neil, a 2nd yr OL that looks promising, a C with his nose just above water, and one good back-up OT in Hill. That's it. So any decent OL at any position signed traded or drafted will fit perfectly into our 'grand design'.

There's a plan for certain. Unfortunately, until / if / when they start adding pieces (they will, won't they?), we won't know how good or shitty it is.


Assuming they are going to play him at LT (which who knows), I think it's a semantics thing as far as ability. IOW, he IS going to play LT for at least a couple of years unless he totally bombs.
Post #: 764
RE: Free Agency 2021 - 3/24/2021 11:47:47 AM   
Bill Johanesen


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So any decent OL at any position signed traded or drafted will fit perfectly into our 'grand design'.

Right. If Cleveland moves to LT, the next G we sign or draft is going to immediately be penciled in as a starter. Maybe the next TWO guards. No battling it out in camp. No nothing. That's how bad things are.
Post #: 765
RE: Free Agency 2021 - 3/24/2021 12:56:08 PM   
Bruce Johnson

 

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My current FA big board

SAF
1) Hooker
2) Woods
3) Jackson

OG
1) Turner
2) Lamp
3) Kelemete/Osemele

DE
1) Clowney
2) Dunlap
3) Ingram

(Spencer Thompson on Twitter)

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Post #: 766
RE: Free Agency 2021 - 3/24/2021 2:19:46 PM   
Tom Sykes

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

So any decent OL at any position signed traded or drafted will fit perfectly into our 'grand design'.

Right. If Cleveland moves to LT, the next G we sign or draft is going to immediately be penciled in as a starter. Maybe the next TWO guards. No battling it out in camp. No nothing. That's how bad things are.

My prediction is we sign Lamp for RG and move Cleveland to LT. Then we draft Darrisaw for LT which moves Cleveland to LG.

So, as we stand right now our plan is completely set at LG (even though we currently don't have a warm body there).

< Message edited by Tom Sykes -- 3/24/2021 2:23:47 PM >
Post #: 767
RE: Free Agency 2021 - 3/24/2021 2:25:48 PM   
Tom Sykes

 

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What's worse is, they may bench Cleveland and use Udoh at LG because he has the better measurables or caloric intake or something for a LG.
Post #: 768
RE: Free Agency 2021 - 3/24/2021 2:35:34 PM   
Pauldiercks1

 

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I agree, many seem to assume Cleveland is out LT of the future and I'm not sure where that vote of confidence is coming from. Playing LT in college doesn't mean a whole lot in the NFL.

He hasn't shown me anything all that great just yet. I'm not sure if he's the future LT, current guard, or future backup versatile lineman.
I do know that if Penei Sewell lasts until 9 we better go get him. I don't give a crap where Cleveland fits in.

But I'd be shocked to see him available at 9
Post #: 769
RE: Free Agency 2021 - 3/24/2021 2:47:26 PM   
ratoppenheimer


Posts: 9334
Joined: 12/9/2007
From: cascais, portugal...still in exile
Status: offline
.
.
draft micah parsons, and then go all-in on moving up for two of the best five 'pure' guards...and sign the best FA guard remaining....

this is what spielman really whats to do....

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Post #: 770
RE: Free Agency 2021 - 3/24/2021 2:52:50 PM   
thebigo


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Pauldiercks1

I agree, many seem to assume Cleveland is out LT of the future and I'm not sure where that vote of confidence is coming from. Playing LT in college doesn't mean a whole lot in the NFL.

He hasn't shown me anything all that great just yet. I'm not sure if he's the future LT, current guard, or future backup versatile lineman.
I do know that if Penei Sewell lasts until 9 we better go get him. I don't give a crap where Cleveland fits in.

But I'd be shocked to see him available at 9


Playing LT in college doesn't mean a whole lot in the NFL.
Post #: 771
RE: Free Agency 2021 - 3/24/2021 3:49:49 PM   
The Happy Norseman

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

So any decent OL at any position signed traded or drafted will fit perfectly into our 'grand design'.

Right. If Cleveland moves to LT, the next G we sign or draft is going to immediately be penciled in as a starter. Maybe the next TWO guards. No battling it out in camp. No nothing. That's how bad things are.


As usual, Spielman is approaching the Oline with a wing and a prayer. That said, it seems like there's a "smart" way to approach the problem, namely, sign Eric Fisher to a 1 yr deal at LT, then draft Alijah Vera-Tucker at 14 and Ben Cleveland in the 3rd. If Fisher is fully recovered from his injury, then we're set at LT. We're also set at LG with AVT and Ben Cleveland provides quality backup at G. If Fisher isn't 100%, we start AVT at LT and slide Ben Cleveland in at LG. While plan B could go south as starting 2 rookies is a big risk, at least we'd still have the possibility of competing. Conversely, if plan A works out, we could actually field a decent oline and have some depth. Of course, every year folks on this board come up with completely viable options to address the oline, and every year the line is a dumpster fire....

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Post #: 772
RE: Free Agency 2021 - 3/24/2021 3:59:07 PM   
Trekgeekscott


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From: United Federation of Planets
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: The Happy Norseman

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

So any decent OL at any position signed traded or drafted will fit perfectly into our 'grand design'.

Right. If Cleveland moves to LT, the next G we sign or draft is going to immediately be penciled in as a starter. Maybe the next TWO guards. No battling it out in camp. No nothing. That's how bad things are.


As usual, Spielman is approaching the Oline with a wing and a prayer. That said, it seems like there's a "smart" way to approach the problem, namely, sign Eric Fisher to a 1 yr deal at LT, then draft Alijah Vera-Tucker at 14 and Ben Cleveland in the 3rd. If Fisher is fully recovered from his injury, then we're set at LT. We're also set at LG with AVT and Ben Cleveland provides quality backup at G. If Fisher isn't 100%, we start AVT at LT and slide Ben Cleveland in at LG. While plan B could go south as starting 2 rookies is a big risk, at least we'd still have the possibility of competing. Conversely, if plan A works out, we could actually field a decent oline and have some depth. Of course, every year folks on this board come up with completely viable options to address the oline, and every year the line is a dumpster fire....


This would be a smart plan. Which is why it wont happen.

Mike Zimmer likes his defensive backs. There is no way one of this top two picks isn't going to be a Safety.

Further, I seriously doubt we will be picking at 14, and we wont be moving up. RS will look to add a 2nd rounder and a handful of 7th rounders by trading down.

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Post #: 773
RE: Free Agency 2021 - 3/24/2021 5:13:32 PM   
Phil Riewer


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From: MN
Status: offline
Judd Zulgad Retweeted
Chris Tomasson
@christomasson
·
10m
Turns out the #Vikings did make a contract offer to free-agent guard Nick Easton to return to the team. But that offer made wasn't to the liking of Easton, who played for Minnesota from 2015-18. He is continuing to look around and has visited this week to Houston.

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Post #: 774
RE: Free Agency 2021 - 3/24/2021 5:47:47 PM   
Bill Johanesen


Posts: 27640
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

So any decent OL at any position signed traded or drafted will fit perfectly into our 'grand design'.

Right. If Cleveland moves to LT, the next G we sign or draft is going to immediately be penciled in as a starter. Maybe the next TWO guards. No battling it out in camp. No nothing. That's how bad things are.

My prediction is we sign Lamp for RG and move Cleveland to LT. Then we draft Darrisaw for LT which moves Cleveland to LG.

So, as we stand right now our plan is completely set at LG (even though we currently don't have a warm body there).


Gold, and finally LG is miraculously solved. Plan B is Lamp for LG, O'Neill to LT, Cleveland to RT, LT Darrisaw to the "tryout" lazy susan/round robin/musical chairs/purgatory spot at RG.

As a bonus feature, Bradbury (aka Elflein II) to LG, Lamp to C.
Post #: 775
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