quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: bohumm

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

Here's the highlights from week 1.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bqkdUIOmxNc

At 3:38 there's a near unforgivable check down
At 8:44 our terrible defense sacks Burrows to force a fourth down from deep in their territory and have given up just 24 points in the middle of the fourth quarter
At 8:58 is the play I talked about earlier. Dude just stands there and takes a sack from pressure he pointed out just seconds earlier.
At 9:34 our terrible defense stops Cincinnati again giving us another chance

From there we use our 1:48 to hit a mix of check downs and one nice pass up the middle to Conklin to get just into field goal range. Was a TD possible with some extra risk taking? Was a TD possible with some extra risk taking or CHANGING THE PLAY when the blitzer was coming and we didn't have the numbers to stop him? Probably.

Also you'll notice that Breeland was ass for the entire game as well.

Kirk has no forward lean, stipulated. Risk averse, check. Poor pocket presence, ya buddy. That said:

On the "near unforgivable check down," he gets rid of the ball just before he gets munched by the DE. Unless you know there was a receiver to hit downfield, the check down is the throw that's available. I forgive him.

On the sack, I wonder with no clarity if he has the latitude to change plays. Zimmer wants an aggressive QB who never throws an interception and seems unlikely to tolerate any freelancing of any kind. I can see where this would be fine with Kirk, who strikes me as someone who has never seen a rule he isn't dying to follow. Bear in mind he may have been adjusting the blocking when he's pointing the blitz out, and no one seemed ready to receive a pass who was in the screen.

On the tying FG, come on. He drives them nearly 60 yards with no timeouts and gets the game to OT. And it wasn't the Vikings defense he was going against.

I get the frustration, but remember: He's Zimmer's chosen QB. Spielman and Zygi signed off on both contracts. That is who they wanted, and they can all leave together (though Cousins has to be traded). The premise was that we'd have an elite defense and a stellar running game, so Kirk just has to be good in play action and not throw INTs. He's the only one who held up his end of the bargain, and did so while Nero, er, Spielman, failed to upgrade the interior OL when he has a QB whose biggest flaw is a total inability to handle pressure up the middle.

He is their QB, not their excuse.

Your reply is sensible and valid. That being said, allow me to retort.

On the checkdown, Kirk is not under any pressure. Yes the DE gets near him after he throws but he had ample time to throw and he still could have used his internal clock (yes - I know he doesn't have one) to know it was time to step up or scramble to his right to buy even more time. Even average QBs do this all the time. As it sits, that play would not even qualify as a hurry for the Bengal defense.

On the sack, let's just ignore the whole "didn't/couldn't/not-allowed to change the play" element which is still a really big deal; he still needs to throw that ball deep regardless of coverage or who's open. Aaron Rodgers does this all the time. You can get a completion, and incompletion, a penalty or an interception. All four of those are just fine on third down throwing deep. Taking a sack with the same look on your face as a deer in the middle of a country road at nigh is not.

The tying FG: Here's the play-by-play:

1st & 10 at MIN 5
(1:47 - 4th) (Shotgun) K.Cousins pass short middle to D.Cook to MIN 12 for 7 yards (V.Bell; R.Allen).

2nd & 3 at MIN 12
(1:30 - 4th) (Shotgun) K.Cousins pass deep middle to T.Conklin to MIN 39 for 27 yards (J.Bates).

1st & 10 at MIN 39
(1:11 - 4th) (Shotgun) K.Cousins pass incomplete deep left to K.Osborn.

2nd & 10 at MIN 39
(1:07 - 4th) (Shotgun) K.Cousins pass short right to D.Cook pushed ob at MIN 39 for no gain (R.Allen).

3rd & 10 at MIN 39
(1:01 - 4th) (Shotgun) K.Cousins pass short right to K.Osborn to MIN 45 for 6 yards (C.Awuzie; R.Allen).

4th & 4 at MIN 45
(0:37 - 4th) (Shotgun) K.Cousins pass short middle to K.Osborn to CIN 49 for 6 yards (M.Hilton).

1st & 10 at CIN 49
(0:19 - 4th) (Shotgun) K.Cousins pass short right to A.Thielen to CIN 35 for 14 yards (E.Apple).

1st & 10 at CIN 35
(0:03 - 4th) K.Cousins spiked the ball to stop the clock.

(0:03 - 4th) Timeout #2 by CIN at 00:03.

2nd & 10 at CIN 35
(0:00 - 4th) G.Joseph 53 yard field goal is GOOD, Center-A.DePaola, Holder-J.Berry.

Look at all the completions for less than 10 yards that were in bounds. There are four pass plays that are completions that total 19 yards and ate up 65 or our 108 seconds. Weak.

There is nothing weak about driving a team 60 yards, including a crucial 4th down conversion, to tie the game. The goal is to get the points, not to be aesthetically pleasing.

A touchdown is both aesthetically pleasing and also wins the game. We were at our own 39 yard line with 1:30 remaining and Check Down Charlie checked down like the Checkdowniest Charlie that ever checked down. The big boys with balls try to win games not just do the minimum to keep alive.

The goal posts move again. Before the season all we heard was that Cousins couldn't get it done at the end of games. Now he is producing in the last 2 minutes and that isn't good enough either. The smart QB takes what the defense gives him in that scenario. That’s what he did. I would love a TD in that scenario too, bit the defense was taking away deep and the side lines and giving the middle.

I neither set nor moved the goal posts. If that's the best Cousins could do with nearly two minutes then his best is simply not good enough. I've watched lesser QBs with lesser teams move the ball with ease in the final two minutes. Cincinnati is the 19th ranked D in yards and 26th ranked D in points. Gotta get more than 19 yards in 65 of the 107 seconds.

Wasnt this the first game of the year and one of Cousin's worst games? #cherrypick

Yes it was week 1 and it was one of the games I picked where QB play cost us. I had brought up other games as well. For this particular game there was some coutner-argument disputing some of the specifics involved so I dug even deeper to present my cases. In my opinion I put a lot of time and effort into that post - more than 99.9% of other posts. Are you saying I should have done the same with the other 12 games as well in an effort to be "fair and balanced"? Cause guess what? I'm not going to.

You're like the shitty boss that walks by the workers once a day for two minutes and points out one thing they haven't done yet even though they've done a dozen other things already and then walks away thinking to himself "how would this place ever get by without me".

If we want to talk about it lets be realistic at least. Wasn't there a fumble by Cook that cost us that game in OT? Cousins moved us on another game winning drive if I remember correctly.

Yep. If you want to be picky, you could blame Herbert for losing game last night because he didn't take team down field for game winning FG at end of regulation. Just ignoring all the good that he did.

You can defend Cousins all you want ... extract positive stats ... compare with other QBs ...

Cousins overall record speaks for itself. That's not making an argument based on individual game situations ... the other players on the field ... the coaching ... that's a summation of 10 seasons with two different franchises and multiple coaching staffs AND his ability to affect the outcome of games.

He ain't got it.

I was defending his play this year. He's not the problem. Simple as that.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

Back in the day, many came to the conclusion that Culpepper needed everything around him to be top notch in order to win (and I liked Culpepper as a player who gave his all).

Endless excuses.

Cousins is the same with people. There will ALWAYS be something. "Oh, if we had a better backup long-snapper, Cousins wouldn't be so worried."

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

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ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: bohumm

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

Here's the highlights from week 1.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bqkdUIOmxNc

At 3:38 there's a near unforgivable check down
At 8:44 our terrible defense sacks Burrows to force a fourth down from deep in their territory and have given up just 24 points in the middle of the fourth quarter
At 8:58 is the play I talked about earlier. Dude just stands there and takes a sack from pressure he pointed out just seconds earlier.
At 9:34 our terrible defense stops Cincinnati again giving us another chance

From there we use our 1:48 to hit a mix of check downs and one nice pass up the middle to Conklin to get just into field goal range. Was a TD possible with some extra risk taking? Was a TD possible with some extra risk taking or CHANGING THE PLAY when the blitzer was coming and we didn't have the numbers to stop him? Probably.

Also you'll notice that Breeland was ass for the entire game as well.

Kirk has no forward lean, stipulated. Risk averse, check. Poor pocket presence, ya buddy. That said:

On the "near unforgivable check down," he gets rid of the ball just before he gets munched by the DE. Unless you know there was a receiver to hit downfield, the check down is the throw that's available. I forgive him.

On the sack, I wonder with no clarity if he has the latitude to change plays. Zimmer wants an aggressive QB who never throws an interception and seems unlikely to tolerate any freelancing of any kind. I can see where this would be fine with Kirk, who strikes me as someone who has never seen a rule he isn't dying to follow. Bear in mind he may have been adjusting the blocking when he's pointing the blitz out, and no one seemed ready to receive a pass who was in the screen.

On the tying FG, come on. He drives them nearly 60 yards with no timeouts and gets the game to OT. And it wasn't the Vikings defense he was going against.

I get the frustration, but remember: He's Zimmer's chosen QB. Spielman and Zygi signed off on both contracts. That is who they wanted, and they can all leave together (though Cousins has to be traded). The premise was that we'd have an elite defense and a stellar running game, so Kirk just has to be good in play action and not throw INTs. He's the only one who held up his end of the bargain, and did so while Nero, er, Spielman, failed to upgrade the interior OL when he has a QB whose biggest flaw is a total inability to handle pressure up the middle.

He is their QB, not their excuse.

Your reply is sensible and valid. That being said, allow me to retort.

On the checkdown, Kirk is not under any pressure. Yes the DE gets near him after he throws but he had ample time to throw and he still could have used his internal clock (yes - I know he doesn't have one) to know it was time to step up or scramble to his right to buy even more time. Even average QBs do this all the time. As it sits, that play would not even qualify as a hurry for the Bengal defense.

On the sack, let's just ignore the whole "didn't/couldn't/not-allowed to change the play" element which is still a really big deal; he still needs to throw that ball deep regardless of coverage or who's open. Aaron Rodgers does this all the time. You can get a completion, and incompletion, a penalty or an interception. All four of those are just fine on third down throwing deep. Taking a sack with the same look on your face as a deer in the middle of a country road at nigh is not.

The tying FG: Here's the play-by-play:

1st & 10 at MIN 5
(1:47 - 4th) (Shotgun) K.Cousins pass short middle to D.Cook to MIN 12 for 7 yards (V.Bell; R.Allen).

2nd & 3 at MIN 12
(1:30 - 4th) (Shotgun) K.Cousins pass deep middle to T.Conklin to MIN 39 for 27 yards (J.Bates).

1st & 10 at MIN 39
(1:11 - 4th) (Shotgun) K.Cousins pass incomplete deep left to K.Osborn.

2nd & 10 at MIN 39
(1:07 - 4th) (Shotgun) K.Cousins pass short right to D.Cook pushed ob at MIN 39 for no gain (R.Allen).

3rd & 10 at MIN 39
(1:01 - 4th) (Shotgun) K.Cousins pass short right to K.Osborn to MIN 45 for 6 yards (C.Awuzie; R.Allen).

4th & 4 at MIN 45
(0:37 - 4th) (Shotgun) K.Cousins pass short middle to K.Osborn to CIN 49 for 6 yards (M.Hilton).

1st & 10 at CIN 49
(0:19 - 4th) (Shotgun) K.Cousins pass short right to A.Thielen to CIN 35 for 14 yards (E.Apple).

1st & 10 at CIN 35
(0:03 - 4th) K.Cousins spiked the ball to stop the clock.

(0:03 - 4th) Timeout #2 by CIN at 00:03.

2nd & 10 at CIN 35
(0:00 - 4th) G.Joseph 53 yard field goal is GOOD, Center-A.DePaola, Holder-J.Berry.

Look at all the completions for less than 10 yards that were in bounds. There are four pass plays that are completions that total 19 yards and ate up 65 or our 108 seconds. Weak.

There is nothing weak about driving a team 60 yards, including a crucial 4th down conversion, to tie the game. The goal is to get the points, not to be aesthetically pleasing.

A touchdown is both aesthetically pleasing and also wins the game. We were at our own 39 yard line with 1:30 remaining and Check Down Charlie checked down like the Checkdowniest Charlie that ever checked down. The big boys with balls try to win games not just do the minimum to keep alive.

The goal posts move again. Before the season all we heard was that Cousins couldn't get it done at the end of games. Now he is producing in the last 2 minutes and that isn't good enough either. The smart QB takes what the defense gives him in that scenario. That’s what he did. I would love a TD in that scenario too, bit the defense was taking away deep and the side lines and giving the middle.

I neither set nor moved the goal posts. If that's the best Cousins could do with nearly two minutes then his best is simply not good enough. I've watched lesser QBs with lesser teams move the ball with ease in the final two minutes. Cincinnati is the 19th ranked D in yards and 26th ranked D in points. Gotta get more than 19 yards in 65 of the 107 seconds.

Wasnt this the first game of the year and one of Cousin's worst games? #cherrypick

Yes it was week 1 and it was one of the games I picked where QB play cost us. I had brought up other games as well. For this particular game there was some coutner-argument disputing some of the specifics involved so I dug even deeper to present my cases. In my opinion I put a lot of time and effort into that post - more than 99.9% of other posts. Are you saying I should have done the same with the other 12 games as well in an effort to be "fair and balanced"? Cause guess what? I'm not going to.

You're like the shitty boss that walks by the workers once a day for two minutes and points out one thing they haven't done yet even though they've done a dozen other things already and then walks away thinking to himself "how would this place ever get by without me".

If we want to talk about it lets be realistic at least. Wasn't there a fumble by Cook that cost us that game in OT? Cousins moved us on another game winning drive if I remember correctly.

Yep. If you want to be picky, you could blame Herbert for losing game last night because he didn't take team down field for game winning FG at end of regulation. Just ignoring all the good that he did.

You can defend Cousins all you want ... extract positive stats ... compare with other QBs ...

Cousins overall record speaks for itself. That's not making an argument based on individual game situations ... the other players on the field ... the coaching ... that's a summation of 10 seasons with two different franchises and multiple coaching staffs AND his ability to affect the outcome of games.

He ain't got it.

I was defending his play this year. He's not the problem. Simple as that.

quote:

ORIGINAL: ratoppenheimer

.
.
The National Football League (NFL) appears to have caved to pressure from the Chinese Communist Party, publishing on Wednesday a map that showed Taiwan belonging to China.

The map was published as part of the NFL’s announcement that “18 teams have been granted access to 26 International Home Marketing Areas (IHMA) across eight different countries.”



https://www.zerohedge.com/political/nfl-touts-chinese-propaganda-publishes-map-claiming-taiwan-belongs-china

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

As I have stated over and over, nobody in their right mind would say Cousins is ‘the’ problem this season.

But … to say he is blameless this season is not a realistic view of what a QB does … its not just throwing the ball to open WRs.

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

So what is “the” problem?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

So what is “the” problem?

You could put together some 'drive analysis' of defensive breakdowns and bad coaching decisions but you would take up 20 pages and wouldn't get it done until the season was over.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

As I have stated over and over, nobody in their right mind would say Cousins is ‘the’ problem this season.

But … to say he is blameless this season is not a realistic view of what a QB does … its not just throwing the ball to open WRs.

Then what are we arguing about.

My consistent stance is we need to find the next great mobile QB. Especially have one with a team friendly cap number.

But, Cousins is having a career year in TD to turnover ratio and late game drives. And he has a Top 10 Yards per pass average.

The defense and coaching decisions have been atrocious all year.

If these facts make me a Cousins apologist, so be it.

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

So what is “the” problem?

You could put together some 'drive analysis' of defensive breakdowns and bad coaching decisions but you would take up 20 pages and wouldn't get it done until the season was over.

I could give that a try but it’s a lot easier to just use a couple of sentences and an argument based on no facts or analysis- just whatever I happen to ‘think’ at the moment.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

So what is “the” problem?

You could put together some 'drive analysis' of defensive breakdowns and bad coaching decisions but you would take up 20 pages and wouldn't get it done until the season was over.

I could give that a try but it’s a lot easier to just use a couple of sentences and an argument based on no facts or analysis- just whatever I happen to ‘think’ at the moment.

Okay. My facts are the Vikings are the 25th ranked defense in the NFL. Fox Sports overall ranking. Historically bad at the end of 1st halves.

My other facts(which would take up too much space) is every David F post ripping Zimmer and staff. Unless you don't stand by your posts.

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

So what is “the” problem?

You could put together some 'drive analysis' of defensive breakdowns and bad coaching decisions but you would take up 20 pages and wouldn't get it done until the season was over.

I could give that a try but it’s a lot easier to just use a couple of sentences and an argument based on no facts or analysis- just whatever I happen to ‘think’ at the moment.

Okay. My facts are the Vikings are the 25th ranked defense in the NFL. Fox Sports overall ranking. Historically bad at the end of 1st halves.

My other facts(which would take up too much space) is every David F post ripping Zimmer and staff. Unless you don't stand by your posts.

So ‘the’ problem is actually a whole bunch of problems but we can’t talk about a certain one of them who throws the ball out of the back of the end zone on fourth down.

Next time my mechanic tells me my brakes are getting worn I’ll tell him to never mention it again until every other aspect of my vehicle is perfect.

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

So what is “the” problem?

You could put together some 'drive analysis' of defensive breakdowns and bad coaching decisions but you would take up 20 pages and wouldn't get it done until the season was over.

I could give that a try but it’s a lot easier to just use a couple of sentences and an argument based on no facts or analysis- just whatever I happen to ‘think’ at the moment.

Okay. My facts are the Vikings are the 25th ranked defense in the NFL. Fox Sports overall ranking. Historically bad at the end of 1st halves.

My other facts(which would take up too much space) is every David F post ripping Zimmer and staff. Unless you don't stand by your posts.

So ‘the’ problem is actually a whole bunch of problems but we can’t talk about a certain one of them who throws the ball out of the back of the end zone on fourth down.

Next time my mechanic tells me my brakes are getting worn I’ll tell him to never mention it again until every other aspect of my vehicle is perfect.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

So what is “the” problem?

You could put together some 'drive analysis' of defensive breakdowns and bad coaching decisions but you would take up 20 pages and wouldn't get it done until the season was over.

I could give that a try but it’s a lot easier to just use a couple of sentences and an argument based on no facts or analysis- just whatever I happen to ‘think’ at the moment.

Okay. My facts are the Vikings are the 25th ranked defense in the NFL. Fox Sports overall ranking. Historically bad at the end of 1st halves.

My other facts(which would take up too much space) is every David F post ripping Zimmer and staff. Unless you don't stand by your posts.

So ‘the’ problem is actually a whole bunch of problems but we can’t talk about a certain one of them who throws the ball out of the back of the end zone on fourth down.

Next time my mechanic tells me my brakes are getting worn I’ll tell him to never mention it again until every other aspect of my vehicle is perfect.

Nobody said Cousins is perfect. IMO he is a Top 2 player on Vikings this year. I would agree that contract wise and position wise he should be #1.

1. Jefferson
2. Cousins
3. O'Neill
4. Cook
5. Kendricks

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

So what is “the” problem?

You could put together some 'drive analysis' of defensive breakdowns and bad coaching decisions but you would take up 20 pages and wouldn't get it done until the season was over.

I could give that a try but it’s a lot easier to just use a couple of sentences and an argument based on no facts or analysis- just whatever I happen to ‘think’ at the moment.

Okay. My facts are the Vikings are the 25th ranked defense in the NFL. Fox Sports overall ranking. Historically bad at the end of 1st halves.

My other facts(which would take up too much space) is every David F post ripping Zimmer and staff. Unless you don't stand by your posts.

So ‘the’ problem is actually a whole bunch of problems but we can’t talk about a certain one of them who throws the ball out of the back of the end zone on fourth down.

Next time my mechanic tells me my brakes are getting worn I’ll tell him to never mention it again until every other aspect of my vehicle is perfect.

Nobody said Cousins is perfect. IMO he is a Top 2 player on Vikings this year. I would agree that contract wise and position wise he should be #1.

1. Jefferson
2. Cousins
3. O'Neill
4. Cook
5. Kendricks

Thats like ranking the deck chairs on the titanic.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

So what is “the” problem?

You could put together some 'drive analysis' of defensive breakdowns and bad coaching decisions but you would take up 20 pages and wouldn't get it done until the season was over.

I could give that a try but it’s a lot easier to just use a couple of sentences and an argument based on no facts or analysis- just whatever I happen to ‘think’ at the moment.

Okay. My facts are the Vikings are the 25th ranked defense in the NFL. Fox Sports overall ranking. Historically bad at the end of 1st halves.

My other facts(which would take up too much space) is every David F post ripping Zimmer and staff. Unless you don't stand by your posts.

So ‘the’ problem is actually a whole bunch of problems but we can’t talk about a certain one of them who throws the ball out of the back of the end zone on fourth down.

Next time my mechanic tells me my brakes are getting worn I’ll tell him to never mention it again until every other aspect of my vehicle is perfect.

Nobody said Cousins is perfect. IMO he is a Top 2 player on Vikings this year. I would agree that contract wise and position wise he should be #1.

1. Jefferson
2. Cousins
3. O'Neill
4. Cook
5. Kendricks

Thats like ranking the deck chairs on the titanic.

Cousins is still playing the violin as it sinks.

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

14 weeks too late vikings!