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RE: General Vikes Talk

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RE: General Vikes Talk - 3/6/2023 12:08:25 PM   
David Levine


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From: Las Vegas
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quote:

ORIGINAL: ratoppenheimer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

So much for Reggie Wilson's take, huh, Rat?


if they want, there's a way to keep him for less; cut him and then give him a new 1yr deal...would not surprise me if they signed him back for
$4mm/'23....


But why?

He's clearly on a fast downward spiral as a player. Time to try out some young blood.
Post #: 6251
RE: General Vikes Talk - 3/6/2023 12:11:01 PM   
David Levine


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Daniel Lee Young

The axe man cometh..

I’m all in on ending cap hell by eating dead 2023 2024 money.. we ain’t doing shit anyway as long as our Quarterback remains Kirk Cousins..

The Kirk Stan’s can believe whatever they want.. but you know who DIDN’T get converted to Jesus and baptized, while wearing a purple sequined, ass hanging out, thong?

The guy who knows cousins is a mistake at QB, just like Favrey was…


Agreed.

It'll kill the "kick the can down the road" posters, but I don't want any more future money added - especially for players that won't be here to see it.

This whole idea that if you keep opening new credit cards, your debt will never catch up to you is a fallacy.
Post #: 6252
RE: General Vikes Talk - 3/6/2023 1:24:14 PM   
mikelado

 

Posts: 126
Joined: 7/31/2007
From: florida
Status: offline 		How about trading Cousins to Jets for 2 1sts and a swap of 2nd 3rd picks? Now that Carr is in N.O., there are no QB'S out there. Would Cousins waive his no trade to do it? Then pick Richardson or move up for Stroud?

Just some fun speculating to throw out there!
Post #: 6253
RE: General Vikes Talk - 3/6/2023 1:27:50 PM   
David Levine


Posts: 77939
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mikelado

How about trading Cousins to Jets for 2 1sts and a swap of 2nd 3rd picks? Now that Carr is in N.O., there are no QB'S out there. Would Cousins waive his no trade to do it? Then pick Richardson or move up for Stroud?

Just some fun speculating to throw out there!


I'd do it in a heartbeat - and even happily take even less than that.

I'd imagine the only way Kirk would agree is if the Jets gave him a FAT extension.
Post #: 6254
RE: General Vikes Talk - 3/6/2023 1:34:56 PM   
mikelado

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: mikelado

How about trading Cousins to Jets for 2 1sts and a swap of 2nd 3rd picks? Now that Carr is in N.O., there are no QB'S out there. Would Cousins waive his no trade to do it? Then pick Richardson or move up for Stroud?

Just some fun speculating to throw out there!


I'd do it in a heartbeat - and even happily take even less than that.

I'd imagine the only way Kirk would agree is if the Jets gave him a FAT extension.


I would too. After looking at Carr's deal, they could offer him 4yr / 160mil.
I would maybe take less, but in this market, he is worth at least 2 1st's...probably much more.
Post #: 6255
RE: General Vikes Talk - 3/6/2023 1:36:33 PM   
Todd M

 

Posts: 40689
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Status: offline 		If anyone wouldn't trade Kirk for all that I'd seriously question them.

Keep dreaming.
Post #: 6256
RE: General Vikes Talk - 3/6/2023 1:38:28 PM   
Todd M

 

Posts: 40689
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Status: offline 		If someone offers ONE 1st and solves a huge $ issue for us you take it and run.
Post #: 6257
RE: General Vikes Talk - 3/6/2023 1:39:36 PM   
mikelado

 

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From: florida
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

If anyone wouldn't trade Kirk for all that I'd seriously question them.

Keep dreaming.


Well, yeah...that's what all this is right now, right? Just speculation to drum up conversation.
Post #: 6258
RE: General Vikes Talk - 3/6/2023 1:45:43 PM   
mikelado

 

Posts: 126
Joined: 7/31/2007
From: florida
Status: offline 		I think you have seriously undervalued Cousins in this market. Statistically, he was top 5 last yr. He's probably closer to a top 10 qb.

One 1st for a top 10 qb? You would be fired for making that deal.
Post #: 6259
RE: General Vikes Talk - 3/6/2023 1:57:01 PM   
David Levine


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

If someone offers ONE 1st and solves a huge $ issue for us you take it and run.


100%
Post #: 6260
RE: General Vikes Talk - 3/6/2023 2:02:05 PM   
David Levine


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quote:

ORIGINAL: mikelado

I think you have seriously undervalued Cousins in this market. Statistically, he was top 5 last yr. He's probably closer to a top 10 qb.

One 1st for a top 10 qb? You would be fired for making that deal.


He's also 35 with a poor postseason history.

Although I guess if the Rams gave up two #1s, a 3rd and Goff for a 32 year-old Stafford, maybe its possible?

And the JETS would have to believe they're a SB contender the next 2-3 years with Cousins...
Post #: 6261
RE: General Vikes Talk - 3/6/2023 2:11:26 PM   
mikelado

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: mikelado

I think you have seriously undervalued Cousins in this market. Statistically, he was top 5 last yr. He's probably closer to a top 10 qb.

One 1st for a top 10 qb? You would be fired for making that deal.


He's also 35 with a poor postseason history.

Although I guess if the Rams gave up two #1s, a 3rd and Goff for a 32 year-old Stafford, maybe its possible?

And the JETS would have to believe they're a SB contender the next 2-3 years with Cousins...


Well, to be honest, he doesn't have much of a postseason history...what? 4 games? 5 games?

I do think the Jets believe they are a good QB away from being a SB contender, absolutely. I'd say Carolina thinks that way as well.
Post #: 6262
RE: General Vikes Talk - 3/6/2023 2:14:55 PM   
mikelado

 

Posts: 126
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From: florida
Status: offline 		Also, his contract is over after this yr....it would be VERY easy to restructure his contract and make it a 4yr deal.
Post #: 6263
RE: General Vikes Talk - 3/6/2023 2:19:58 PM   
David Levine


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quote:

ORIGINAL: mikelado

Also, his contract is over after this yr....it would be VERY easy to restructure his contract and make it a 4yr deal.


Sure. But that assumes a lot.

That the JETS want Cousins at a HUGE amount for the next 4 years - and likely without any "cheap outs". And that Cousins would even be willing to go.

I think the latter is probably more likely than the former because if Cousins has shown anything over his career, its that he's all about maximizing his earnings.
Post #: 6264
RE: General Vikes Talk - 3/6/2023 2:34:27 PM   
Todd M

 

Posts: 40689
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Status: offline 		I'll sign off for a 1st and a promising defensive player whomever that may be stuck behind their depth. DL, CB, LB...don't matter.
Post #: 6265
RE: General Vikes Talk - 3/6/2023 2:35:32 PM   
Todd M

 

Posts: 40689
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Status: offline 		The Jets are totally a QB away ..they should do it.
Post #: 6266
RE: General Vikes Talk - 3/6/2023 2:39:11 PM   
mikelado

 

Posts: 126
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quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: mikelado

Also, his contract is over after this yr....it would be VERY easy to restructure his contract and make it a 4yr deal.


Sure. But that assumes a lot.

That the JETS want Cousins at a HUGE amount for the next 4 years - and likely without any "cheap outs". And that Cousins would even be willing to go.

I think the latter is probably more likely than the former because if Cousins has shown anything over his career, its that he's all about maximizing his earnings.


Yes, I am assuming a lot...what else is this time for than making speculations and hoping for the best? Lol

I'm not so sure it is a huge amount anymore though...just the going rate for a good, not elite, starting QB...which Cousins is. He's better than Carr, and will make 40+ mil/yr. That's a lot of money, but no longer huge.

I think the most realistic scenario is 1. we extend him. 2. We trade him to a team of his choice. 3. He plays out his contract and we get nothing for him but cap relief in 2024.
Post #: 6267
RE: General Vikes Talk - 3/6/2023 2:41:17 PM   
David Levine


Posts: 77939
Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Las Vegas
Status: offline 		I also think the massive difference between the Rams and JETS situations is that the Rams really looked like they might be a QB away from a SB win. Hell, they were in the SB just 2 years before acquiring Stafford and they were pretty loaded on both sides of the ball.

They went all-in on the best available QB - probably overpaying in the process.

The JETS haven't even made the Playoffs in 13 years, and have finished dead last in their division 7 of the past 8 years (just sneaking in a single 3rd place finish 4 years ago).

Is Joe Douglas delusional enough to believe he's one Kirk Cousins away from contending?
Post #: 6268
RE: General Vikes Talk - 3/6/2023 2:42:48 PM   
mikelado

 

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From: florida
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

The Jets are totally a QB away ..they should do it.


I agree. They have a top defense, a great young WR, really good OL, solid RB and TE...just need a top 10 QB, and they would definitely be in the SB conversation.
Post #: 6269
RE: General Vikes Talk - 3/6/2023 2:43:45 PM   
Todd M

 

Posts: 40689
Joined: 7/14/2007
Status: offline 		#13 #23 and next year's 1st gets us to #3.

If Chicago doesn't sell that'll likely leave us with the 2nd choice of QB.

A bit frustrating for me BC I don't know these guys. With few available last year the talk was getting one of the top 2 guys this year but now that we're here the talk is next year's the year.

The question is; is the 2nd best QB in this class worth it? That is of course assuming the #1is properly identified.

< Message edited by Todd M -- 3/6/2023 2:45:35 PM >
Post #: 6270
RE: General Vikes Talk - 3/6/2023 2:45:45 PM   
ratoppenheimer


Posts: 9563
Joined: 12/9/2007
From: cascais, portugal...still in exile
Status: offline 		.
.
some journalists don't really understand why thielen's cap hit is so high, or they blame thielen, himself....

2022…$12.6mm
2021…$6mm
2020…$12.7mm...the last 3 years averaging $10.5mm/yr - very low


2023…$19.9mm...only $12mm new money in '23 because we pre-paid him bonus money to keep the cap low in earlier years....


in 2023 there are 12 players with cap hits over $20mm, and 2 with cap hits over $30mm...dig this, in 2024 michael thomas has a cap hit of $59.5mm

_____________________________

the journey...is paradise.
Post #: 6271
RE: General Vikes Talk - 3/6/2023 2:47:51 PM   
David Levine


Posts: 77939
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quote:

ORIGINAL: ratoppenheimer

2023…$19.9mm...only $12mm new money in '23 because we pre-paid him bonus money to keep the cap low in earlier years....



And we need to stop doing this as a regular practice.
Post #: 6272
RE: General Vikes Talk - 3/6/2023 2:56:25 PM   
Bill Johanesen


Posts: 28604
Status: offline 		Cousins' options:
- Trade him. Get something for him.
- He plays out his contract.

I don't think extending him (in the $35 million range) is even an option. O'Neill will be getting $20 million. Hock will get half a Brinks truck. Darrisaw will get an entire Brinks truck. JJ will get two of them.

Say roughly 20+12+20+28, or 80 million for those four. It goes to $115 with Cousins. Say $120-125 for those five (all offense) and dead cap.

Need a mobile QB on a rookie deal.

< Message edited by Bill Johanesen -- 3/6/2023 2:57:32 PM >
Post #: 6273
RE: General Vikes Talk - 3/6/2023 3:00:35 PM   
Bill Johanesen


Posts: 28604
Status: offline 		The Jets.

Reminds me of when NY had the Jets, Mets, Nets (ABA), and Sets (a pro tennis team).
Post #: 6274
RE: General Vikes Talk - 3/6/2023 3:01:32 PM   
ratoppenheimer


Posts: 9563
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From: cascais, portugal...still in exile
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

Cousins' options:
- Trade him. Get something for him.
- He plays out his contract.

I don't think extending him (in the $35 million range) is even an option. O'Neill will be getting $20 million. Hock will get half a Brinks truck. Darrisaw will get an entire Brinks truck. JJ will get two of them.

Say roughly 20+12+20+28, or 80 million for those four. It goes to $115 with Cousins. Say $120-125 for those five (all offense) and dead cap.

Need a mobile QB on a rookie deal.


the rate we're going with o'neill's restructures, his cap will be at $25mm in two years....

_____________________________

the journey...is paradise.
Post #: 6275
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