RE: General Vikes Talk

Talk Vikes and Other MN Sports

Forums Register Login My Profile Inbox Address Book My Subscription My Forums

Photo Gallery Member List Search Calendars FAQ Ticket List Log Out

RE: General Vikes Talk

Logged in as: Guest

Users viewing this topic: none

Printable Version

All Forums >> [The Minnesota Vikings] >> Vikes Talk >> RE: General Vikes Talk

Page: << < prev 155 156 157 158 [159]

Message

<< Older Topic Newer Topic >>

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/25/2024 6:58:15 PM

Pager

Posts: 10504
Joined: 7/19/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: marty

Are Greenard, Cashman and Van Ginkel all re-signed for next season?

Yes. Cashman and VG will be on their second year of a two year contract. Greenard the second of a four year contract.

_____________________________

Left picking up the pieces.

Post #: 3951

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/25/2024 7:59:34 PM

Bill Johanesen

Posts: 28964
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pager

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pager

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeff Jesser

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

I guess basically you can find a team that wants him, and tell them we won't franchise him if they give us a 2nd round pick?

And then what? We enter into a sign and trade where we don't get stuck with any cap hit in the process?

Then why is this done practically every offseason?

Brian Burns and LaDarius Sneed were both tagged and traded last off season

Jaguars tagged Ngakoue and traded him to us in 2021

5 months after tagging him. Which means The Jags had his money on their books throughout free agency that year.

Its not really that common.

I was listening to a pod and they talked extensively about this. According to them the big hang up with this is when the money is due. Sure, they can have an agreement all worked out with the Rams, for example. The problem is the money is on our books until the trade is official which eats in to the early FA period. It's doable but sounds a bit risky to me given our obvious needs.

You aren't grabbing a CB/DT worth the money in the 2nd tier of FA.

The tag can be rescinded at any time leading up to the summer trade deadline. It can also be converted to a long term contract. We have half a dozen existing contracts that can be restructured to free up cap this year (6th most in the NFL). New FA contracts can be structured to accommodate. It's not like the 41M exists in a vacuum, the cap is flexible and if it gets added back later, it will roll over to next year. I don't see the risk.

Provided the player doesn't sign it.

Just last offseason Jacobs refused to sign a tag tender. It's not in the interest of the player to be playing on a tag, better a multi-year contract with guarantees. Again, the Vikings will know before the window opens if there is trade interest for SD.

Point that I, and others, are making is that a tag and trade is a viable option.

Wrong, there was no tag and trade.

Vegas tagged Jacobs in 2023. After upping the tag/offer a bit, he played (poorly) for Vegas in 2023. Then in 2024 the Packers signed him as a UFA.

Post #: 3952

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/25/2024 8:07:29 PM

Bill Johanesen

Posts: 28964
Status: offline

So:

Tags and trades do NOT happen frequently, and has not happened to a QB for at least 12 years.

A tag can't just be withdrawn, because if a player signs it then it's a valid contract.

Jacobs wasn't a tag and trade.

Post #: 3953

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/25/2024 8:28:58 PM

Bill Johanesen

Posts: 28964
Status: offline

Not saying it will not happen, but perhaps the other (?) reason QBs are not franchised, let alone franchised then traded, is the sheer relative cost of doing so. The QB cost is roughly 4 times that of a RB and almost double that of most all the other positions (LB, i.e. Edge I guess, is the next highest at $24M in 2024).

Tagging and trading creates risk, can tie up cap, will mean ~$40M is fenced off for a QB, introduces a dependency on another team, and is something players hate. Other than that, it's wonderful! It would be great to check a couple of examples at QB to see how things went, but no examples exist.

I think too, since QBs are THE singular key position in all of team sports, the understanding is the team works things out with the QB first then works on the other positions. Not the other way around.

Also, it's true there are teams that need a QB, but what will their (projected) cap situations be? At least some might end up being tight on cap, and they assuredly will need to fork over picks or players. They will all look closely at drafting a QB. Then, what bloggers label a so-called 'QB thin' draft suddenly has several projected high first rounders. THAT happens frequently.

< Message edited by Bill Johanesen -- 12/25/2024 8:49:54 PM >

Post #: 3954

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/25/2024 9:08:23 PM

Bill Johanesen

Posts: 28964
Status: offline

Darnold's Exit Interview.

Hi Sam, thanks for the remarkable season and for how well you played!! One for the ages. Anyway, we're going to franchise you... not because we want to work out a multi-year deal, shoot we could have already done that, but to trade you. Now of course you realize we're going to take the best offer and work the margins so you won't have any say in where you will be playing. Hey bro, we're taking risk here too hoping we can get value for you and trade you! So Sam, that's the situation and I know you are excited. Word on the street is the Jets and Carolina may be in the hunt for a veteran QB, ha, ha. Get it Sam? The Jets and Panthers. How crazy would that be! What a reunion! Anyway Sam, we'll talk over a kale martini after we hopefully work out a trade. Hey, do you wear pennyloafers... cause I have an extra pair here.

Post #: 3955

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/26/2024 7:34:05 AM

Todd M

Posts: 40942
Joined: 7/14/2007
Status: online

I wonder if right now at 13 wins, possibly 15, if Sam has already done enough that the decision makers have already made up their minds on bringing him back?

I’d like to think not. 14-3, or 13-4 and a 1st round exit are still possible. Then this season was for squat and I roll with JJM.

It’s such a unique situation. One that will hopefully be a lot clearer when the final whistle blows to end our season. If there’s confetti flying Sam gets a blank check. And no I wouldn’t just shrug and wish him luck. Wasn’t thinking clearly on that before.

_____________________________

The ego holds on to pain from the past to prevent pain in the future, which causes pain in the present.

Keith Crossley

Post #: 3956

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/26/2024 9:11:56 AM

TJSweens

Posts: 45087
Joined: 7/16/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

I wonder if right now at 13 wins, possibly 15, if Sam has already done enough that the decision makers have already made up their minds on bringing him back?

I’d like to think not. 14-3, or 13-4 and a 1st round exit are still possible. Then this season was for squat and I roll with JJM.

It’s such a unique situation. One that will hopefully be a lot clearer when the final whistle blows to end our season. If there’s confetti flying Sam gets a blank check. And no I wouldn’t just shrug and wish him luck. Wasn’t thinking clearly on that before.

This is why I don't get the debates over tagging or tagging and trading or extending him right now. The next two games and the playoffs will tell us more about Sam than the first 15 games did.

He could officially join the ranks of the elite. He could be a guy who piles up a lot of stats and cash on the road to nowhere like Kirk. The Vikings will have time between the end of the season and the start of the legal tampering period to hash that out

< Message edited by TJSweens -- 12/26/2024 9:12:57 AM >

_____________________________

"The eternal fate of the noble and enlightened: to be brutally crushed by the armed and dumb."

Post #: 3957

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/26/2024 10:37:18 AM

Jeff Jesser

Posts: 19527
Joined: 7/16/2007
From: Southern Cal
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pager

quote:

ORIGINAL: marty

Are Greenard, Cashman and Van Ginkel all re-signed for next season?

Yes. Cashman and VG will be on their second year of a two year contract. Greenard the second of a four year contract.

I heard a while back that Cash and VG have player options. I don't know that for fact but I remember hearing it. If so, you can bank on them getting raises with the way they've played.

Post #: 3958

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/26/2024 10:40:17 AM

Phil Riewer

Posts: 27676
Joined: 8/24/2007
From: MN
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

I wonder if right now at 13 wins, possibly 15, if Sam has already done enough that the decision makers have already made up their minds on bringing him back?

I’d like to think not. 14-3, or 13-4 and a 1st round exit are still possible. Then this season was for squat and I roll with JJM.

It’s such a unique situation. One that will hopefully be a lot clearer when the final whistle blows to end our season. If there’s confetti flying Sam gets a blank check. And no I wouldn’t just shrug and wish him luck. Wasn’t thinking clearly on that before.

This is why I don't get the debates over tagging or tagging and trading or extending him right now. The next two games and the playoffs will tell us more about Sam than the first 15 games did.

He could officially join the ranks of the elite. He could be a guy who piles up a lot of stats and cash on the road to nowhere like Kirk. The Vikings will have time between the end of the season and the start of the legal tampering period to hash that out

Simply being 9 years younger and mobile is 2 pluses but yes we will see this postseason. Teams have given bigger contracts for less performance.

_____________________________

SSG Riewer, Greg A Co 2/136 CAB
KIA 23 March 2007 Habbaniyah Iraq

Post #: 3959