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RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/30/2018 11:46:47 PM  1 votes
Brad H


Posts: 22989
Joined: 8/16/2007
From: Parts Unknown
Status: offline 		Sign Nick Foles, cut Cousins

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RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/30/2018 11:51:52 PM   
marty


Posts: 13049
Joined: 12/28/2007
Status: online 		New HC, Cousins on a short leash [1 year prove it, otherwise dump him and eat the money loss the final season], Sloter either as the starter or 2nd string, draft a QB.

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SKOL to the BOWL !!!
Post #: 1477
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/30/2018 11:53:11 PM   
Brad H


Posts: 22989
Joined: 8/16/2007
From: Parts Unknown
Status: offline 		Sign Johnny Manziel, cut Cousins. Christ, anything is worth a try.

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Post #: 1478
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/30/2018 11:54:20 PM   
marty


Posts: 13049
Joined: 12/28/2007
Status: online 		Foles has usually been clutch, Cousins usually not, but I am guessing the price for Foles is going to be too high, and doubt you can do that and afford the loss of eating Cousin's contract right now.

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SKOL to the BOWL !!!
Post #: 1479
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/30/2018 11:55:22 PM   
Rob Viking

 

Posts: 2069
Joined: 8/8/2007
Status: offline 		We simply don't deserve it simple as that. 9-7 would have gotten the 6th seed and even that couldn't be achieved. I knew we'd have to win out after the Rams lost to the Eagles on that Sunday night.

Credit the Bears for not laying down. They aren't a team which has a culture of winning in recent times so Nagy wanted to change that not to mention put the team through a playoff atmosphere. He wanted to send the message to the team they don't care who they play in the playoffs, even if they do wind up losing to the Eagles. Similar to when we beat the Pack for the division in 2015 up in Lambeau.

The OLine again crumbled giving the offense no chance in the 1st half. This just added to Cousins pressing. The 2 units just couldn't string together any consistency whcih never got the ball rolling, despite the crowd being in full voice. Nagy out foxed Zimmer again, and the DLine got owned a second time by the Bears. I don't know if the D ever put the Bears in a tough spot, they went 8/14 on 3rd down, including 4/4 on the back breaking 9 min drive in the 4th. Zim can destroy dysfunctional teams like the Dolphins and Lions but teams like the Bears and the Eagles last year had a counter to what he was doing. Howard's 42 yard run was all about scheming against Zim's tendencies. Reminded me when we lost up in Soldier in 2016, first drive and a big run by Howard really knocked the D off balance for the rest of the game.

Eagles have knocked us out 3 straight years basically, throw in 2008 and 2004 as well.
Post #: 1480
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/30/2018 11:55:52 PM   
Brad H


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quote:

ORIGINAL: marty

Foles has usually been clutch, Cousins usually not, but I am guessing the price for Foles is going to be too high, and doubt you can do that and afford the loss of eating Cousin's contract right now.

I say eat the contract. This guy is not a winner in crunch time. He's a turnover machine.

What was really alarming was the spat between him and Thielen on the sidelines. It's the beginning of the end. They've lost confidence in him. That was not a good look.

< Message edited by Brad H -- 12/30/2018 11:59:54 PM >

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Post #: 1481
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/31/2018 12:01:48 AM   
Brad H


Posts: 22989
Joined: 8/16/2007
From: Parts Unknown
Status: offline 		The Bears have one of the best o-lines in football and two great corners. The two most important units on the field.

< Message edited by Brad H -- 12/31/2018 12:02:50 AM >

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Defense starts at the corners!
Post #: 1482
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/31/2018 12:10:45 AM   
Rob Viking

 

Posts: 2069
Joined: 8/8/2007
Status: offline 		I am willing to give Zimmer another year. This team is the toughest they've been since the 70s, you can see that there is a culture in place, something I didn't feel was there under Green, Tice or Chilly. There was plenty of turnover this season, not to mention teams were gunning for us, guys like Payton, McVay and Nagy spent the extra effort I am sure to find ways to attack Zimmer's D. 2 division titles in 4 years, a 40-23-1 record in that span, he earns another year IMO. As good as the team played last season it was a little smoke and mirrors and we played teams at the right time.
Post #: 1483
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/31/2018 12:11:56 AM   
Rob Viking

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

The Bears have one of the best o-lines in football and two great corners. The two most important units on the field.


They also have the best DLine, good LBs and a great safety.
Post #: 1484
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/31/2018 2:52:42 AM   
Russell Timmons


Posts: 865
Joined: 8/19/2007
From: Guanajuato City, Mexico
Status: offline 		Re: Bengals

...And here’s where things could get very, very interesting. What if Brown decides to make a play for someone who used to be on the coaching staff? Someone who owns a large ranch in nearby Kentucky? Someone who may want to end his career without the never-ending stress and strain of a close-but-not-close-enough team that annually knocks on the door but can’t kick it in?

Yes, some think that the Mike Brown may try to hire Mike Zimmer (if Marvin goes), and some think Zimmer possibly would be interested. Much would depend on whether the Vikings would be willing to let Zimmer leave, and on whether the Vikings would want significant compensation for doing so.

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2018/12/30/will-marvin-lewis-stay-or-go/#comment-6580136

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Post #: 1485
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/31/2018 2:53:42 AM   
Todd M

 

Posts: 40694
Joined: 7/14/2007
Status: online 		Any talk that includes 'cut Cousins' is so beyond ridiculous that it doesn't even deserve reply...but hey - those are the takes that people are 'missing' when Brad gets muscled away by the meanies.
Post #: 1486
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/31/2018 3:41:40 AM   
Todd M

 

Posts: 40694
Joined: 7/14/2007
Status: online 		Not looking to make a snap judgement his first year but Hill looked very Waynes like in his coverage...back to the play...chasing...hoping to be near at the end and break up a play with flailing arms...not showing any ball awareness.
Post #: 1487
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/31/2018 4:17:20 AM   
ratoppenheimer


Posts: 9563
Joined: 12/9/2007
From: cascais, portugal...still in exile
Status: offline 		.
.
i think spielman and zimmer get one more season - cousins isn't going anywhere either...with sparano's death and offensive coordinator issues...the wilfs are not going to do anything too dramatic....

chicago's lines - offensive and defensive just crushed us - just as they did the first game this year...what happened to joseph and richardson? - how could they be so dominated?....

what is most disappointing to me is that we were beaten by chicago the same way both games - destroyed at the line's...we should have blitzed trubisky every down - run blitz to the quarterback...also, put in another o-lineman if needed on obvious passing plays....

rudolph has absolutely zero value against good defenses - he's too slow to challenge defenders - he has to be gone next year....

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Post #: 1488
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/31/2018 6:56:53 AM   
Bill Jandro

 

Posts: 17929
Joined: 8/13/2007
Status: offline 		Our SB opened in 2016

The oline has been the demise (weak link) of this team

Spielman hasn't shown he can or is willing to fix it

The only scary part is the Wilf's hiring a new GM

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Oline...early and often this draft
Post #: 1489
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/31/2018 7:01:03 AM   
Bill Jandro

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

The Bears have one of the best o-lines in football and two great corners. The two most important units on the field.


Bears oline is good but not the best in football

Their Dline is absolutely terrific

CB's are marginal at best

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Oline...early and often this draft
Post #: 1490
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/31/2018 7:04:52 AM   
Bill Jandro

 

Posts: 17929
Joined: 8/13/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: ratoppenheimer

.
.
i think spielman and zimmer get one more season - cousins isn't going anywhere either...with sparano's death and offensive coordinator issues...the wilfs are not going to do anything too dramatic....

chicago's lines - offensive and defensive just crushed us - just as they did the first game this year...what happened to joseph and richardson? - how could they be so dominated?....

what is most disappointing to me is that we were beaten by chicago the same way both games - destroyed at the line's...we should have blitzed trubisky every down - run blitz to the quarterback...also, put in another o-lineman if needed on obvious passing plays....

rudolph has absolutely zero value against good defenses - he's too slow to challenge defenders - he has to be gone next year....


Exactly. Games are won and lost in the trenches and Chi kicked our ass rather easily.

We were never even in this game

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Oline...early and often this draft
Post #: 1491
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/31/2018 7:06:45 AM   
Richard Neussendorfer

 

Posts: 19617
Joined: 12/7/2007
From: Alamogordo, NM
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

quote:

ORIGINAL: ratoppenheimer

.
.
i think spielman and zimmer get one more season - cousins isn't going anywhere either...with sparano's death and offensive coordinator issues...the wilfs are not going to do anything too dramatic....

chicago's lines - offensive and defensive just crushed us - just as they did the first game this year...what happened to joseph and richardson? - how could they be so dominated?....

what is most disappointing to me is that we were beaten by chicago the same way both games - destroyed at the line's...we should have blitzed trubisky every down - run blitz to the quarterback...also, put in another o-lineman if needed on obvious passing plays....

rudolph has absolutely zero value against good defenses - he's too slow to challenge defenders - he has to be gone next year....


Exactly. Games are won and lost in the trenches and Chi kicked our ass rather easily.

We were never even in this game

I have yet to see any of these offensive linemen improve under this staff. Every single one has gone backwards. Even Elf. At some point you gotta know the coaching is underwhelming.
Post #: 1492
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/31/2018 7:50:59 AM   
Brad H


Posts: 22989
Joined: 8/16/2007
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Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Rob Viking

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

The Bears have one of the best o-lines in football and two great corners. The two most important units on the field.


They also have the best DLine, good LBs and a great safety.

It wasn't the d-line that won the game for them yesterday. It was their corners blanketing our wide receivers. Akiem Hicks was a marginal player before he showed up in Chicago. The corners have made him a Pro Bowler. Fuller and Amukamara are both very good. Fuller was sensational on Sunday.

Conversely, where was the high-priced defensive line for the Vikings yesterday without Rhodes and Hughes? Completely manhandled by the Chicago offensive line.

< Message edited by Brad H -- 12/31/2018 8:04:02 AM >

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Defense starts at the corners!
Post #: 1493
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/31/2018 7:57:59 AM   
SteveR

 

Posts: 3574
Joined: 1/24/2011
Status: offline 		I am okay with moving on from Zimmer and Rick and onto the next regime. I just don't see a lot to lose. What's the worse that could happen? We don't go to the Super Bowl for 40 years? We wait 10 years between NFC championship appearances? Stuck in a pattern like that, I see nothing wrong with rolling the dice and seeing what the cleaning-house tactic does. Just, boom. Zimmer gone. Rick gone. Let the chips fall where they may.

It will probably take a couple seasons to build the OL anyway, so I don't see the benefit of keeping Zimmer through that process. What is he going to do? Overcome it and lead us to the Super Bowl? Maybe he will prove us wrong, but I'm sure Vegas would love to take our money on that bet. Might as well bring in a new guy and see if he (or she, if you are particularly progressive) can finagle his (or her) way around our weaknesses with new ideas.

I am okay with Kirk, but he is not a mudder. Case was a mudder. With a bad OL, Case is probably the better guy, but Case is not here. Kirk is here. Maybe Sloter is a mudder, but Kirk will still be the guy next season. Got to find some way to get results out of him. I don't have a lot of confidence in the present regime to maximize Kirk.

So I'm for rolling the dice. Then again, I don't get anything from the ticket sales. When it comes to ticket sales, treading water is better than face-planting with a regime change.
Post #: 1494
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/31/2018 7:59:16 AM   
Brad H


Posts: 22989
Joined: 8/16/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

The Bears have one of the best o-lines in football and two great corners. The two most important units on the field.


Bears oline is good but not the best in football

Their Dline is absolutely terrific

CB's are marginal at best

They now have Long back from injury. IMO, when healthy, he's the best guard in pro football. That was a huge addition to get in week 17. They went from good to great.

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Defense starts at the corners!
Post #: 1495
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/31/2018 8:00:24 AM   
Brad H


Posts: 22989
Joined: 8/16/2007
From: Parts Unknown
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

Any talk that includes 'cut Cousins' is so beyond ridiculous that it doesn't even deserve reply...but hey - those are the takes that people are 'missing' when Brad gets muscled away by the meanies.

Cut Cousins

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Defense starts at the corners!
Post #: 1496
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/31/2018 8:02:26 AM   
Karl Juhnke


Posts: 13029
Joined: 7/28/2007
Status: online
quote:

ORIGINAL: Steve Lentz

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: Steve Lentz

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bruce Johnson

I don't care who wins the Super Bowl as long as it's not the Patriots. So the Patriots will probably win it. Sigh. I take these losses really hard.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but it looks like we get the 17 pick in the draft each round.

Or the Bears, or the Eagles, or the Saints.
I could maybe handle the Rams?

I'm going AFC no matter who gets in there. Preferably KC or Houston.

Screw the Chiefs. I'm still bitter about 1970.


Nothing to be be bitter about there. There wasn't anything dirty or of a cheating nature. We weren't robbed of anything. We just got thoroughly outcoached and outplayed.
Post #: 1497
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/31/2018 8:05:03 AM   
Brad H


Posts: 22989
Joined: 8/16/2007
From: Parts Unknown
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Rob Viking

I am willing to give Zimmer another year. This team is the toughest they've been since the 70s, you can see that there is a culture in place, something I didn't feel was there under Green, Tice or Chilly. There was plenty of turnover this season, not to mention teams were gunning for us, guys like Payton, McVay and Nagy spent the extra effort I am sure to find ways to attack Zimmer's D. 2 division titles in 4 years, a 40-23-1 record in that span, he earns another year IMO. As good as the team played last season it was a little smoke and mirrors and we played teams at the right time.

Tough is not a word I would use to describe the Vikings.

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Post #: 1498
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/31/2018 8:05:30 AM   
CPAMAN

 

Posts: 36324
Joined: 3/17/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: CPAMAN

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: CPAMAN

quote:

ORIGINAL: Russell Timmons

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Russell Timmons

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

Chris Tomasson@christomasson
Vikings owners Zygi and Mark Wilf both declined comment after the game

They're signing the paychecks, so I would imagine they are a little concerned with their investment, i.e., this team.

It's not even worth caring about who this team picks up until we have a staff in place that can get something out of them. Hopefully the Wilfs see it too.

I'm hoping they are having those conversations right now. They've given a lot of bright shiny objects for this head coach to play with. They gave this team the "missing link" with tens of millions spent on a QB. They've listened to a GM who is incompetent at putting together an offensive line. And they just watched their investment digress into mediocrity. They're not stupid. I'm sure they are discussing some of these same issues.


I agree. RS is like a stock broker who was managing a very wealthy client on how to spend approximately $100 million. He encouraged his client to dump about 85% of his funds into one "can't miss" investment. In four months time, $84 million spent on one pony has turned into an investment it would be difficult to get 50 cents on a dollar for the next two years.


I hope you do better math for your clients...


What the heck does this comment mean? Explain asshole


It means you have no idea what you're talking about. As usual.

Cousins salary is nowhere near 85% of anything salary related. Nor would it hurt us as a team if we'd just simply make smarter decisions before, during and after it.

I wasn't talking about the entire payroll. The investment in Kirk Cousins while not investing in an O-LINE was a bad owner investment.

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Post #: 1499
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/31/2018 8:10:10 AM   
Brad H


Posts: 22989
Joined: 8/16/2007
From: Parts Unknown
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: CPAMAN

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: CPAMAN

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: CPAMAN

quote:

ORIGINAL: Russell Timmons

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Russell Timmons

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

Chris Tomasson@christomasson
Vikings owners Zygi and Mark Wilf both declined comment after the game

They're signing the paychecks, so I would imagine they are a little concerned with their investment, i.e., this team.

It's not even worth caring about who this team picks up until we have a staff in place that can get something out of them. Hopefully the Wilfs see it too.

I'm hoping they are having those conversations right now. They've given a lot of bright shiny objects for this head coach to play with. They gave this team the "missing link" with tens of millions spent on a QB. They've listened to a GM who is incompetent at putting together an offensive line. And they just watched their investment digress into mediocrity. They're not stupid. I'm sure they are discussing some of these same issues.


I agree. RS is like a stock broker who was managing a very wealthy client on how to spend approximately $100 million. He encouraged his client to dump about 85% of his funds into one "can't miss" investment. In four months time, $84 million spent on one pony has turned into an investment it would be difficult to get 50 cents on a dollar for the next two years.


I hope you do better math for your clients...


What the heck does this comment mean? Explain asshole


It means you have no idea what you're talking about. As usual.

Cousins salary is nowhere near 85% of anything salary related. Nor would it hurt us as a team if we'd just simply make smarter decisions before, during and after it.

I wasn't talking about the entire payroll. The investment in Kirk Cousins while not investing in an O-LINE was a bad owner investment.

Agree entirely. Cousins has never been known as a mobile guy. His biggest problem is that he rarely eats the ball, or tries to force it into places he shouldn't. It leads to interceptions, batted balls and strip sacks. Every now and then you just need to throw one into the Tuba section. Russell Wilson is great at it. Patrick Mahomes is great at it. Drew Brees is great at it. You name it. If Cousins hasn't figured it out by now, he never will.

I used to think he was a decent player. Now, seeing it up close, he's not a guy that can lead a team to a title. Not this team anyways.

< Message edited by Brad H -- 12/31/2018 8:14:05 AM >

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