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RE: General Vikes Talk - 10/4/2021 12:03:11 PM

David F.

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Joined: 12/31/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Arlowe84

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

1. Agreed. Pierce had a nice 1st game, but been absent since. I think I ready both rank near the bottom of PFF DT ratings.
FA's tend to be more hype than anything. Teams know who their best players are and prioritize them. Look as Stl without Peterson.

If I filter out anyone who has had less than 20% of snaps this season so far Tomlinson ranks #10 and Pierce ranks #36. They aren't the problem.

Do they break that out run vs pass? That's what someone posted, but they could have been blowing smoke

but considreing we have not held a team to under 100 yds rushing (not even close) and YPC is high, it would surprise me.

For pure run defense Tomlinson comes in at 34. Pierce and Watts are dead last at 49 and 50.

EDIT - sorry I messed that up. Tomlinson at 31, Pierce and Watts at 43 and 44.

< Message edited by David F. -- 10/4/2021 12:06:54 PM >

_____________________________

I wouldn't give ANY qb $30-50+ mil unless that QB had won me a Super Bowl. Did you win a Super Bowl on your rookie deal? Yes? Great! Here's your hugenormous contract. F it let's just run victory laps and love life. No? Good luck. Next!

Post #: 301

RE: General Vikes Talk - 10/4/2021 12:05:10 PM

David F.

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Joined: 12/31/2007
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As long as I was in PFF I took a look at CB. Again, filtering out any player who's seen less than 20% of all snaps, Dantzler comes in at #7 overall. Patrick Peterson 68, Macenzie Alexander 99, Brashaud Breeland DEAD LAST at 111. Zimmer needs to be asked about this.

_____________________________

I wouldn't give ANY qb $30-50+ mil unless that QB had won me a Super Bowl. Did you win a Super Bowl on your rookie deal? Yes? Great! Here's your hugenormous contract. F it let's just run victory laps and love life. No? Good luck. Next!

Post #: 302

RE: General Vikes Talk - 10/4/2021 12:13:17 PM

TJSweens

Posts: 44856
Joined: 7/16/2007
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

As long as I was in PFF I took a look at CB. Again, filtering out any player who's seen less than 20% of all snaps, Dantzler comes in at #7 overall. Patrick Peterson 68, Macenzie Alexander 99, Brashaud Breeland DEAD LAST at 111. Zimmer needs to be asked about this.

Zimmer wont care. He has nothing, but disdain for PFF.

_____________________________

"The eternal fate of the noble and enlightened: to be brutally crushed by the armed and dumb."

Post #: 303

RE: General Vikes Talk - 10/4/2021 12:24:23 PM

David F.

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Joined: 12/31/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

As long as I was in PFF I took a look at CB. Again, filtering out any player who's seen less than 20% of all snaps, Dantzler comes in at #7 overall. Patrick Peterson 68, Macenzie Alexander 99, Brashaud Breeland DEAD LAST at 111. Zimmer needs to be asked about this.

Zimmer wont care. He has nothing, but disdain for PFF.

Even if PFF were proven to be poor in their analysis (which hasn't happened) we're still talking about #7 vs dead last #111. If PFF was terrible (which they're not) what's the most off they could be? Dantzler at 30 and Breeland at 70? That's still significant. My own eyeballs told me a story yesterday at the game. Dantzler wasn't perfect but the difference between him and Breeland was noticeable to say the least.

_____________________________

I wouldn't give ANY qb $30-50+ mil unless that QB had won me a Super Bowl. Did you win a Super Bowl on your rookie deal? Yes? Great! Here's your hugenormous contract. F it let's just run victory laps and love life. No? Good luck. Next!

Post #: 304

RE: General Vikes Talk - 10/4/2021 12:27:29 PM

TJSweens

Posts: 44856
Joined: 7/16/2007
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

As long as I was in PFF I took a look at CB. Again, filtering out any player who's seen less than 20% of all snaps, Dantzler comes in at #7 overall. Patrick Peterson 68, Macenzie Alexander 99, Brashaud Breeland DEAD LAST at 111. Zimmer needs to be asked about this.

Zimmer wont care. He has nothing, but disdain for PFF.

Even if PFF were proven to be poor in their analysis (which hasn't happened) we're still talking about #7 vs dead last #111. If PFF was terrible (which they're not) what's the most off they could be? Dantzler at 30 and Breeland at 70? That's still significant. My own eyeballs told me a story yesterday at the game. Dantzler wasn't perfect but the difference between him and Breeland was noticeable to say the least.

It was painfully obvious that the pass coverage improved when Breeland did everyone a favor and got sick.

_____________________________

"The eternal fate of the noble and enlightened: to be brutally crushed by the armed and dumb."

Post #: 305

RE: General Vikes Talk - 10/4/2021 12:31:29 PM

Tom Sykes

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Joined: 7/27/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: The Happy Norseman

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: ronhextall

IMO firing a coach in the middle of the season is pointless. Way too many moving parts and they are not going to rattle off 6 or 6 wins in a row to make the playoffs.

I just hope the owners are researching new GM's and vetting their philosophy of football.

It would be one thing if they had a replacement available to them. The best candidates won't be available until after the playoffs.

Firing Zimmer and elevating Andre Patterson for 10 or 11 games would allow the team to give the guy a good look. Who knows, Patterson could be the next Bill Belichick. Unlikely, but at least it would take the guesswork out of it. The players all seem to love and respect the guy as well. Giving him an opportunity would be good for the franchise.

Its possible, but I really can't get excited about another 60-something defensive coach.

I also think we're in dire need of a fresh start/clean slate.

Agree although IF its a mid-season change that would probably come from inside ... at least non-Zimmer disciple Patterson gives you a chance to see Zimmer's defense without Zimmer. Which would be really helpful for end of year evaluations.

And in my opinion, any other coach on staff would be a leaping-frog insult to Patterson.

All you 'let's dump Zimmer now' -ers ... beware ... Spielman is the Jason Bourne of GMs, the slinkiest cunningest survivor in the GM world ... and if you don't fire Spiels with Zimmer, you know we are going to end up with Zim Jr. or the seed of Kubiak as interim HC. Guaranteed.

Post #: 306

RE: General Vikes Talk - 10/4/2021 1:02:24 PM

Daniel Lee Young

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Spielman needs to go…

His draft decisions and coaching/ personnel choices are abysmal.

Find a better GM..

Make him fire Zimmer, and let him,( the new GM), try to find a more modern coach and 21st century approach, top to bottom.

Spielman First and foremost, has to go.

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Post #: 307

RE: General Vikes Talk - 10/4/2021 1:04:58 PM

Richard Neussendorfer

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From: Alamogordo, NM
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Daniel Lee Young

Spielman needs to go…

His draft decisions and coaching/ personnel choices are abysmal.

Find a better GM..

Make him fire Zimmer, and let him,( the new GM), try to find a more modern coach and 21st century approach, top to bottom.

Spielman First and foremost, has to go.

I won't miss trading back for 10 7th rounders that's for sure! Agreed Danno!

Post #: 308

RE: General Vikes Talk - 10/4/2021 1:14:45 PM

Daniel Lee Young

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Status: offline

Buyout the contracts.. they are not cap hits anyway..

Dump Cousins.

I’m ready to blow this thing up, keep the good. Cook, Mattison, AT, JJ, Conk,, this punter we found, even The kicker is ok..There is a good core to work with, it’s just so obvious that the coaching, preparation, and adjustments to 2021 football is sorely lacking with our current staff.

… we’re stuck with H S., his cap # is untenable..But his experience has value, not contract value, but coaching value…

ditch, Barr, EG, Bradbury, Hill, Abdulla, Westbrook, Breeland, and some others.

I haven’t felt this way about a team since coach, He who shall not be named (2006-2010), and his boy toy Favrey, we’re giving me ulcers.

_____________________________

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I am WRATH, incarnate.
@RlyeeNicole’sDad

Post #: 309

RE: General Vikes Talk - 10/4/2021 1:23:15 PM

David Levine

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Phil Mackey@PhilMackey

Mike Zimmer is now 17-41 (29%) in his head coaching career against teams that finish with winning records (if we believe the Cardinals and Browns will finish the season above .500).

5-21 (19%) in the Kirk Cousins era.

The best coaches are all 50% or better (h/t @veith_daniel)

Post #: 310

RE: General Vikes Talk - 10/4/2021 1:45:17 PM

David Levine

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From: Las Vegas
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“I knew it was going to be a jump ball,” Cousins said. “I knew I was forcing it a little bit. It felt like with how we had been doing all day it was worth a shot.”

Apparently that same logic didn’t apply on the final drive of the game. Trailing by a touchdown, Cousins got the Vikings down to the Browns’ 32-yard line with 12 seconds left on the clock. Just enough time for a few shots at the end zone.

Instead, Cousins checked down to Tyler Conklin for a meaningless gain before his final pass of the game fell harmlessly to the turf.

“I can throw it over someone’s head, I can throw it up for grabs. or I can take the completion,” Cousins said when asked about the pass to Conklin that took the Vikings from the 32-yard line to the 26. “Let’s at least buy ourselves more time before we have to (go to the end zone) and potentially give it over the defense if it’s a tough look.”

That answer is Cousins in a nutshell. He’s almost robotic in the way he trusts his reads more than he trusts his weapons.

This is who he’s always been. This is who he always will be. Regardless of what a few weeks might suggest.

https://www.twincities.com/2021/10/03/dane-mizutani-vikings-qb-kirk-cousins-almost-had-everyone-fooled/

The bolded is a great example of why a team will never win it all with Cousins.

Post #: 311

RE: General Vikes Talk - 10/4/2021 2:07:33 PM

ronhextall

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quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

Phil Mackey@PhilMackey

Mike Zimmer is now 17-41 (29%) in his head coaching career against teams that finish with winning records (if we believe the Cardinals and Browns will finish the season above .500).

5-21 (19%) in the Kirk Cousins era.

The best coaches are all 50% or better (h/t @veith_daniel)

"Vikings are rolling" "Vikings are figuring it out" "Zimmer has them playing well".....

All of the above have always been complete B.S. it's just the phase of the schedule with Zimmer. The only exception being the Keenum year, and Zimmer couldn't wait to get rid of him.

Post #: 312

RE: General Vikes Talk - 10/4/2021 2:22:21 PM

thebigo

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Joined: 7/14/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: The Happy Norseman

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: ronhextall

IMO firing a coach in the middle of the season is pointless. Way too many moving parts and they are not going to rattle off 6 or 6 wins in a row to make the playoffs.

I just hope the owners are researching new GM's and vetting their philosophy of football.

It would be one thing if they had a replacement available to them. The best candidates won't be available until after the playoffs.

Firing Zimmer and elevating Andre Patterson for 10 or 11 games would allow the team to give the guy a good look. Who knows, Patterson could be the next Bill Belichick. Unlikely, but at least it would take the guesswork out of it. The players all seem to love and respect the guy as well. Giving him an opportunity would be good for the franchise.

So 5 years of mediocre at best Vikings football, moving on to another team for multiple SBs.

Post #: 313

RE: General Vikes Talk - 10/4/2021 2:45:13 PM

Trekgeekscott

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From: United Federation of Planets
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quote:

ORIGINAL: ronhextall

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

Phil Mackey@PhilMackey

Mike Zimmer is now 17-41 (29%) in his head coaching career against teams that finish with winning records (if we believe the Cardinals and Browns will finish the season above .500).

5-21 (19%) in the Kirk Cousins era.

The best coaches are all 50% or better (h/t @veith_daniel)

"Vikings are rolling" "Vikings are figuring it out" "Zimmer has them playing well".....

All of the above have always been complete B.S. it's just the phase of the schedule with Zimmer. The only exception being the Keenum year, and Zimmer couldn't wait to get rid of him.

Keenum was a disaster waiting to happen. He was lucky to have WR and TE targets that were good at contested catches. He threw up wounded ducks all the time.

If you think he was really any good then why did his career disappear after he left?

His year here was the outlier. Every other year of his career is what Case Keenum is. Kirk Cousins isn't the problem here.

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Post #: 314

RE: General Vikes Talk - 10/4/2021 3:03:05 PM 1 votes

ronhextall

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Trekgeekscott

quote:

ORIGINAL: ronhextall

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

Phil Mackey@PhilMackey

Mike Zimmer is now 17-41 (29%) in his head coaching career against teams that finish with winning records (if we believe the Cardinals and Browns will finish the season above .500).

5-21 (19%) in the Kirk Cousins era.

The best coaches are all 50% or better (h/t @veith_daniel)

"Vikings are rolling" "Vikings are figuring it out" "Zimmer has them playing well".....

All of the above have always been complete B.S. it's just the phase of the schedule with Zimmer. The only exception being the Keenum year, and Zimmer couldn't wait to get rid of him.

Keenum was a disaster waiting to happen. He was lucky to have WR and TE targets that were good at contested catches. He threw up wounded ducks all the time.

If you think he was really any good then why did his career disappear after he left?

His year here was the outlier. Every other year of his career is what Case Keenum is. Kirk Cousins isn't the problem here.

Some of it is salary cap. Few QB’s are good enough to take a massive chunk of the salary cap and still be effective. They can’t perform with the talent drain.

Another interesting stat is Super Bowl winning teams and percentage of cap the QB represents.

Post #: 315

RE: General Vikes Talk - 10/4/2021 3:10:56 PM 2 votes

Trekgeekscott

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ronhextall

quote:

ORIGINAL: Trekgeekscott

quote:

ORIGINAL: ronhextall

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

Phil Mackey@PhilMackey

Mike Zimmer is now 17-41 (29%) in his head coaching career against teams that finish with winning records (if we believe the Cardinals and Browns will finish the season above .500).

5-21 (19%) in the Kirk Cousins era.

The best coaches are all 50% or better (h/t @veith_daniel)

"Vikings are rolling" "Vikings are figuring it out" "Zimmer has them playing well".....

All of the above have always been complete B.S. it's just the phase of the schedule with Zimmer. The only exception being the Keenum year, and Zimmer couldn't wait to get rid of him.

Keenum was a disaster waiting to happen. He was lucky to have WR and TE targets that were good at contested catches. He threw up wounded ducks all the time.

If you think he was really any good then why did his career disappear after he left?

His year here was the outlier. Every other year of his career is what Case Keenum is. Kirk Cousins isn't the problem here.

Some of it is salary cap. Few QB’s are good enough to take a massive chunk of the salary cap and still be effective. They can’t perform with the talent drain.

Another interesting stat is Super Bowl winning teams and percentage of cap the QB represents.

Oh, I get it.

Unfortunately that is the market for QBs. Keenum was a FA and would have cost us a lot to revert back to his original suck like he eventually did....

Cousins is overpaid. But that is the market for QBs. Hell he's almost affordable by comparison to some of the contracts being doled out to the likes of Mahomes, Allen, Rodgers, Prescott...etc etc etc...

_____________________________

A mind is like a parachute. It doesn't work if it's not open. Frank Zappa

Post #: 316

RE: General Vikes Talk - 10/4/2021 3:20:36 PM

Bill Johanesen

Posts: 28109
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Arlowe84

quote:

ORIGINAL: David F.

quote:

1. Agreed. Pierce had a nice 1st game, but been absent since. I think I ready both rank near the bottom of PFF DT ratings.
FA's tend to be more hype than anything. Teams know who their best players are and prioritize them. Look as Stl without Peterson.

If I filter out anyone who has had less than 20% of snaps this season so far Tomlinson ranks #10 and Pierce ranks #36. They aren't the problem.

Do they break that out run vs pass? That's what someone posted, but they could have been blowing smoke

but considreing we have not held a team to under 100 yds rushing (not even close) and YPC is high, it would surprise me.

For pure run defense Tomlinson comes in at 34. Pierce and Watts are dead last at 49 and 50.

EDIT - sorry I messed that up. Tomlinson at 31, Pierce and Watts at 43 and 44.

Maybe it's time for Patterson to hit the road.

He can be the scout for mid-round DEs.

Post #: 317

RE: General Vikes Talk - 10/4/2021 3:33:22 PM 1 votes

Bill Johanesen

Posts: 28109
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Trekgeekscott

quote:

ORIGINAL: ronhextall

quote:

ORIGINAL: Trekgeekscott

quote:

ORIGINAL: ronhextall

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

Phil Mackey@PhilMackey

Mike Zimmer is now 17-41 (29%) in his head coaching career against teams that finish with winning records (if we believe the Cardinals and Browns will finish the season above .500).

5-21 (19%) in the Kirk Cousins era.

The best coaches are all 50% or better (h/t @veith_daniel)

"Vikings are rolling" "Vikings are figuring it out" "Zimmer has them playing well".....

All of the above have always been complete B.S. it's just the phase of the schedule with Zimmer. The only exception being the Keenum year, and Zimmer couldn't wait to get rid of him.

Keenum was a disaster waiting to happen. He was lucky to have WR and TE targets that were good at contested catches. He threw up wounded ducks all the time.

If you think he was really any good then why did his career disappear after he left?

His year here was the outlier. Every other year of his career is what Case Keenum is. Kirk Cousins isn't the problem here.

Some of it is salary cap. Few QB’s are good enough to take a massive chunk of the salary cap and still be effective. They can’t perform with the talent drain.

Another interesting stat is Super Bowl winning teams and percentage of cap the QB represents.

Oh, I get it.

Unfortunately that is the market for QBs. Keenum was a FA and would have cost us a lot to revert back to his original suck like he eventually did....

Cousins is overpaid. But that is the market for QBs. Hell he's almost affordable by comparison to some of the contracts being doled out to the likes of Mahomes, Allen, Rodgers, Prescott...etc etc etc...

Mahommes' cap number this year is 7.4 million. Next year 35.8. Yeah it gets obscene after that, but he got KC a ring.
Prescott: 17.2, 34.5, 45.5, etc
Allen: 10.2, 16.3, 39.7, etc.
Rodgers: 27.5, 46, 7.6.
Cousins: 31, 45.

Cousins has not, is not, and for this year and next will not be "almost affordable" in comparisons.

In fact, combining 2021 and 2022 salaries, Cousins total 76 million is about the same as Prescott and Allen TOGETHER.

< Message edited by Bill Johanesen -- 10/4/2021 3:45:06 PM >

Post #: 318

RE: General Vikes Talk - 10/4/2021 3:47:26 PM

Bill Johanesen

Posts: 28109
Status: offline

If one is to suggest a generation of QB salaries consists of about 5 years, Cousins is right up there with Jim Brown and Muhammad Ali in being a generation ahead of their competition.

Post #: 319

RE: General Vikes Talk - 10/4/2021 6:07:21 PM

ratoppenheimer

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From: cascais, portugal...still in exile
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.
.
Courtney Cronin@CourtneyRCronin
Vikings are running thin at cornerback again. The NFL's transaction wire has Cameron Dantzler on the COVID-19 reserve list. He finally played yesterday in place of Bashaud Breeland, who left the game with an illness in the first quarter. If Dantzler, who has apparently tested positive, can't go for Week 5, the Vikings may have to roll with Breeland again, assuming he's over the illness he's been dealing with.

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Post #: 320

RE: General Vikes Talk - 10/4/2021 6:37:17 PM

beo

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ratoppenheimer

.
.
Courtney Cronin@CourtneyRCronin
Vikings are running thin at cornerback again. The NFL's transaction wire has Cameron Dantzler on the COVID-19 reserve list. He finally played yesterday in place of Bashaud Breeland, who left the game with an illness in the first quarter. If Dantzler, who has apparently tested positive, can't go for Week 5, the Vikings may have to roll with Breeland again, assuming he's over the illness he's been dealing with.

What a sh*tshow of a season...

If the Vikes are a losing team I can sometimes still enjoy watching an individual player develop...

Cam likely out.
Darrisaw with probably sits and watches Hill for unknown reasons.

Great... get to watch leaky lines.

The ol' longship is taking on water!

Post #: 321

RE: General Vikes Talk - 10/4/2021 7:12:27 PM 1 votes

Brad H

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How was that two-minute offense yesterday folks?

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Post #: 322

RE: General Vikes Talk - 10/4/2021 7:41:53 PM

Richard Neussendorfer

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From: Alamogordo, NM
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

How was that two-minute offense yesterday folks?

They had 2 chances and looked terrible!

Post #: 323

RE: General Vikes Talk - 10/4/2021 7:55:34 PM

David Levine

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From: Las Vegas
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

How was that two-minute offense yesterday folks?

How was that three and a half quarter offense yesterday folks?

Post #: 324

RE: General Vikes Talk - 10/4/2021 8:25:23 PM

Richard Neussendorfer

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From: Alamogordo, NM
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quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

How was that two-minute offense yesterday folks?

How was that three and a half quarter offense yesterday folks?

Exactly! They took a lot of time off. Maybe they'll be ready to play next week.

Post #: 325