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RE: Our New Head Coach - 2/4/2022 12:32:19 PM

Tom Sykes

Posts: 6258
Joined: 7/27/2007
Status: online

I don't even know why we are still talking about Harbaugh. He's not 'the one that got away' if he wasn't a real option to begin with.

With no clue about what happened in the interview, its ironic that our conversation is centered on analytics.

Post #: 601

RE: Our New Head Coach - 2/4/2022 12:33:43 PM

Steve Lentz

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Joined: 7/19/2007
From: Omaha
Status: offline

Harbaugh wanted the job. He wanted to try the NFL one more time. He stated it frequently. Minnesota chose to go another direction.
I leaned to Harbaugh , but WTH do I know? After the interview Harbaugh stated he called the Michigan Athletic Director and asked him if he wanted him to be the Head Coach of Michigan. The answer was 100% Harbaugh told them that his discussion with the Vikes was a one-time thing and would not be a reoccurring theme every year.

_____________________________

" I believe empathy is the most essential quality of civilization"

Post #: 602

RE: Our New Head Coach - 2/4/2022 12:37:15 PM

jbusse

Posts: 1309
Joined: 9/11/2013
From: Atlanta, GA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

I think the angst and teeth gnashing over the Vikings not hiring Harbaugh is getting as over the top as Brad's objections to him.

You guys are really engaging in an incredible amount of speculation. How much he was asking for...did he even bring up money...how well would he have coached a completely different roster with a different organization...he would have assembled a staff of assistants who should all be head coaches themselves...

Come on people, you don't know any of this.

Kwesi's supposed to be all about analytics. What kind of analytics model favors O'Connell over Harbaugh? Past success is an excellent predictor of future success for NFL coaches. New head coaches are a mixed bag.

I think this is more confusion about analytics.

Analytics is not looking at boxscores, overall record, number of TDs thrown, etc. That's shit everyone knows and all you need is a newspaper or profootballreference.com to get your "data".

Analytics is trying to explain things that aren't so quantifiable. It's not "what happened?" it's "why did it happen?" and "how can I make this happen more regularly?".

Make no mistake, I'm not confused about analytics. Analytics doesn't ignore important quantifiable relationships, such as the relationship between past and future head coaching success, even if it is "shit everyone knows".

And I'm pretty sure KAM is fully aware of Harbaugh's past record.

As such, pretty easy to see that the Vikings did not use analytics to choose O'Connell over Harbaugh based on expected future wins and losses. Going with culture, personality, etc., i.e., hard to measure criteria that would be difficult to correlate with NFL wins, is pretty much anti-analytics.

Win/loss record is probably the most "anti-analytics" thing there is.

It's not anti-analytics, much less "the most anti-analytics".

Post #: 603

RE: Our New Head Coach - 2/4/2022 1:31:01 PM

bohumm

Posts: 5705
Joined: 10/28/2007
From: Altadena, CA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

I think the angst and teeth gnashing over the Vikings not hiring Harbaugh is getting as over the top as Brad's objections to him.

You guys are really engaging in an incredible amount of speculation. How much he was asking for...did he even bring up money...how well would he have coached a completely different roster with a different organization...he would have assembled a staff of assistants who should all be head coaches themselves...

Come on people, you don't know any of this.

Kwesi's supposed to be all about analytics. What kind of analytics model favors O'Connell over Harbaugh? Past success is an excellent predictor of future success for NFL coaches. New head coaches are a mixed bag.

Analytics is information, and if it emerged through the interview that there was misalignment between Harbaugh and the leadership of the team, those are data points that trump any number you could throw out there. From a great distance and with extremely limited information, I find the process the team went through to hire a coach VERY encouraging, from the initial interviews before Kwesi to the expansion of the list once he came on board to the flexibility and fluidity of the interviews with the finalists.

Post #: 604

RE: Our New Head Coach - 2/4/2022 1:48:06 PM

Tom Sykes

Posts: 6258
Joined: 7/27/2007
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: Steve Lentz

Harbaugh wanted the job. He wanted to try the NFL one more time. He stated it frequently. Minnesota chose to go another direction.
I leaned to Harbaugh , but WTH do I know? After the interview Harbaugh stated he called the Michigan Athletic Director and asked him if he wanted him to be the Head Coach of Michigan. The answer was 100% Harbaugh told them that his discussion with the Vikes was a one-time thing and would not be a reoccurring theme every year.

We know he had/has interest in the nfl. We know he was interested in the job. And we had interest him him.

Neither side is going to say the other party was rejected or we wanted them but they didn’t want us. It could have been mutual as well. We don’t know.

Post #: 605

RE: Our New Head Coach - 2/4/2022 1:51:42 PM 3 votes

thebigo

Posts: 28305
Joined: 7/14/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Daniel Lee Young

I highly doubt “ they turned down Harbaugh at a reasonable rate”..

I think Harbaugh was using the Vikings as leverage for his contract quibble with UofM…

It was an all day type interview.. I’m pretty sure that many things were discussed, and I’m equally as sure that there were issues that raised red flags, what those issues were, we will never know..

Never seen so much butthurt over not getting a particular coach..not so much here, but..

There’s a whole sub on Reddit of butthurt whiners gnashing their teeth and cursing the ownership and wanting KAM fired, already..

Unbelievable, how single minded and petty those people can be.

It’s not the end of the world…

If we can survive Tice, Childress, and Frazier, and the Zimmerball era, we will be ok without Harbaugh.
People are already calling the off season a “bust”..

Yeesh.

Being "OK" is good enough?

Post #: 606

RE: Our New Head Coach - 2/4/2022 1:56:33 PM

thebigo

Posts: 28305
Joined: 7/14/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: joejitsu

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

JJ should be happy with this hire.

KOC designs all the plays that the Rams run. Kupp keeps getting open with all the extra attention he receives.

JJ was always open this year too. We need KOC to force Cousins to throw to him more...

EXACTLY! We could have the second coming of the greatest show on turf in the playbook. If your qb can’t pull the trigger, it’s a futile effort.

Good point, DL and Joe.

The targets were 191 to 167. 24 more targets for Kupp. Need to get JJ into 185-200 range.

The JJ ratio.

Post #: 607

RE: Our New Head Coach - 2/4/2022 2:04:09 PM

Steve Lentz

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From: Omaha
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Per NFL.Com
Harbaugh stated " I'm gonna have 100% conviction on this, and if they (Minnesota) have 100 percent conviction on this, then it's something I'm gonna do".

_____________________________

" I believe empathy is the most essential quality of civilization"

Post #: 608

RE: Our New Head Coach - 2/4/2022 2:10:55 PM

Tom Sykes

Posts: 6258
Joined: 7/27/2007
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: Steve Lentz

Per NFL.Com
Harbaugh stated " I'm gonna have 100% conviction on this, and if they (Minnesota) have 100 percent conviction on this, then it's something I'm gonna do".

I posted a link to the full interview earlier. Again, I think Harbaugh was clearly 100% interested going in … that doesn’t mean unconditionally, regardless of what the vikings envisioned or were offering.

From both parties.

< Message edited by Tom Sykes -- 2/4/2022 2:12:22 PM >

Post #: 609

RE: Our New Head Coach - 2/4/2022 2:12:21 PM

David Levine

Posts: 80988
Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Las Vegas
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: Steve Lentz

Per NFL.Com
Harbaugh stated " I'm gonna have 100% conviction on this, and if they (Minnesota) have 100 percent conviction on this, then it's something I'm gonna do".

So basically if the Vikings vision exactly matched his (and vice-versa), he was going to take the job.

Post #: 610

RE: Our New Head Coach - 2/4/2022 2:25:20 PM

Steve Lentz

Posts: 36323
Joined: 7/19/2007
From: Omaha
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: Steve Lentz

Per NFL.Com
Harbaugh stated " I'm gonna have 100% conviction on this, and if they (Minnesota) have 100 percent conviction on this, then it's something I'm gonna do".

So basically if the Vikings vision exactly matched his (and vice-versa), he was going to take the job.

Seems that way. The Vikings vision was apparently different.

_____________________________

" I believe empathy is the most essential quality of civilization"

Post #: 611

RE: Our New Head Coach - 2/4/2022 3:07:52 PM

Daniel Lee Young

Posts: 16481
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: thebigo

quote:

ORIGINAL: Daniel Lee Young

I highly doubt “ they turned down Harbaugh at a reasonable rate”..

I think Harbaugh was using the Vikings as leverage for his contract quibble with UofM…

It was an all day type interview.. I’m pretty sure that many things were discussed, and I’m equally as sure that there were issues that raised red flags, what those issues were, we will never know..

Never seen so much butthurt over not getting a particular coach..not so much here, but..

There’s a whole sub on Reddit of butthurt whiners gnashing their teeth and cursing the ownership and wanting KAM fired, already..

Unbelievable, how single minded and petty those people can be.

It’s not the end of the world…

If we can survive Tice, Childress, and Frazier, and the Zimmerball era, we will be ok without Harbaugh.
People are already calling the off season a “bust”..

Yeesh.

Being "OK" is good enough?

Being ok without Jim “butthurt for not being hired” Harbaugh is Ok..

Being ok with anything is a difficult path for me so I take what I can get, and move on..

_____________________________

Deep Purple, Gand Funk Railroad, AC\DC, George and PinkFloyd, The Beetles, Jethro Tull, Rolling Stones, Aerosmith, The Who

Post #: 612

RE: Our New Head Coach - 2/4/2022 5:49:25 PM

thebigo

Posts: 28305
Joined: 7/14/2007
Status: offline

Maybe we should deep six the KOC initials/abbreviation for our new HC. Who doesn't prefer KO to KOC?

Post #: 613

RE: Our New Head Coach - 2/4/2022 5:50:27 PM

thebigo

Posts: 28305
Joined: 7/14/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Daniel Lee Young

quote:

ORIGINAL: thebigo

quote:

ORIGINAL: Daniel Lee Young

I highly doubt “ they turned down Harbaugh at a reasonable rate”..

I think Harbaugh was using the Vikings as leverage for his contract quibble with UofM…

It was an all day type interview.. I’m pretty sure that many things were discussed, and I’m equally as sure that there were issues that raised red flags, what those issues were, we will never know..

Never seen so much butthurt over not getting a particular coach..not so much here, but..

There’s a whole sub on Reddit of butthurt whiners gnashing their teeth and cursing the ownership and wanting KAM fired, already..

Unbelievable, how single minded and petty those people can be.

It’s not the end of the world…

If we can survive Tice, Childress, and Frazier, and the Zimmerball era, we will be ok without Harbaugh.
People are already calling the off season a “bust”..

Yeesh.

Being "OK" is good enough?

Being ok without Jim “butthurt for not being hired” Harbaugh is Ok..

Being ok with anything is a difficult path for me so I take what I can get, and move on..

I'm OK wit dat.

Post #: 614

RE: Our New Head Coach - 2/4/2022 5:52:47 PM

Todd M

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Joined: 7/14/2007
Status: offline

KO.
KO offense

Post #: 615

RE: Our New Head Coach - 2/4/2022 5:54:15 PM

thebigo

Posts: 28305
Joined: 7/14/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: Steve Lentz

Per NFL.Com
Harbaugh stated " I'm gonna have 100% conviction on this, and if they (Minnesota) have 100 percent conviction on this, then it's something I'm gonna do".

So basically if the Vikings vision exactly matched his (and vice-versa), he was going to take the job.

Maybe, I read it more like I'm 100% sold on the Vikings, if they are 100% sold on me, then I'm their man.

Post #: 616

RE: Our New Head Coach - 2/4/2022 5:54:45 PM

thebigo

Posts: 28305
Joined: 7/14/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

KO.
KO offense

KOO?

Post #: 617

RE: Our New Head Coach - 2/4/2022 5:56:37 PM

Todd M

Posts: 41778
Joined: 7/14/2007
Status: offline

KOO with Kirk.

Post #: 618

RE: Our New Head Coach - 2/4/2022 6:46:45 PM

marty

Posts: 14152
Joined: 12/28/2007
Status: offline

There are so many name abbreviations getting used, it can get a little hard to read if you don't immediately know to whom the abbreviation is referring.

KAM - Kick Ass Minnesota

KC - Kansas City

KO - Knock Out

Etc ....

_____________________________

SKOL to the BOWL !!!

Post #: 619

RE: Our New Head Coach - 2/4/2022 8:59:58 PM

Hats4Bats

Posts: 216
Joined: 2/27/2020
From: Austin, Minnesota
Status: offline

Mike Pettine --Vikings Territory UFFda Sports

Ex-Packers Coach in the Mix for Vikings Defensive Coordinator
Mike Pettine

Presumptive Minnesota Vikings head coach Kevin O’Connell will make a behemoth of a choice for defensive coordinator in the next couple of weeks.

By trade, O’Connell is an offense guy, so the man or woman he chooses to run his defense will largely be in charge of that side of the ball. Think Mike Zimmer with his array of offensive coordinators over the years. Zimmer took care of the defense personally; the same should be the case for O’Connell and the 2022 Vikings offense.

And a name that entered the fold on Thursday was a veteran defensive coordinator with plenty of experience – Mike Pettine.

Pettine has a fairly commendable defensive resume. His defenses have encountered doldrums here and there, but that often happens to journeyman coordinators. Pettine’s magnum opus – believe it or not – was his first season as a defensive coordinator with the New York Jets. Per EPA/Play, his Jets defense topped the NFL in 2009 en route to the AFC Championship. For context, it was the Mark Sanchez era.

Here’s a look at Pettine’s resume per defensive efficiency:

Mike Pettine Team Defense,
NFL Ranking,
Per EPA/Play:

2020 (GB) = 12th
2019 (GB) = 12th
2018 (GB) = 24th
2015 (CLE) = 31st
2014 (CLE) = 11th
2013 (BUF) = 6th
2012 (NYJ) = 14th
2011 (NYJ) = 4th
2010 (NYJ) = 6th
2009 (NYJ) = 1st

From Jason LaCanfora

With it all-but official that Kevin O’Connell will become the next head coach of the Vikings, there is a growing sense that his first defensive coordinator is soon to be named. CBS Sports’ Jason La Canfora tweets that Mike Pettine is the “likely” hire as DC.

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Hats for Bats - - Keep Bats warm

Post #: 620

RE: Our New Head Coach - 2/4/2022 9:13:06 PM

Richard Neussendorfer

Posts: 20937
Joined: 12/7/2007
From: Alamogordo, NM
Status: offline

Mike Pettine? Yuck! And the new head coach didn't even call any plays? This seems very Viking-like.

Post #: 621

RE: Our New Head Coach - 2/4/2022 9:52:59 PM

Daniel Lee Young

Posts: 16481
Status: offline

So I guess I should consider you one of the “ off season is a bust” so far with just a GM in actual place?

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Deep Purple, Gand Funk Railroad, AC\DC, George and PinkFloyd, The Beetles, Jethro Tull, Rolling Stones, Aerosmith, The Who

Post #: 622

RE: Our New Head Coach - 2/4/2022 10:23:15 PM

thebigo

Posts: 28305
Joined: 7/14/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

KOO with Kirk.

KOOK

Post #: 623

RE: Our New Head Coach - 2/4/2022 11:24:26 PM

Richard Neussendorfer

Posts: 20937
Joined: 12/7/2007
From: Alamogordo, NM
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Daniel Lee Young

So I guess I should consider you one of the “ off season is a bust” so far with just a GM in actual place?

It may or may not work out. But so far it doesn't look good. I like that the new coach is young and has an offensive mind. I don't like that he wasn't good enough to call the plays. I very much dislike choosing Pettine for DC. Although hes probably an improvement over Zimmer. Yeah I'm skeptical of a team that always gets it wrong.

Post #: 624

RE: Our New Head Coach - 2/5/2022 7:06:43 AM

marty

Posts: 14152
Joined: 12/28/2007
Status: offline

Pettine's defense was better than Capers, but it always seemed to give up the big play, especially in the playoffs.

The GB seemed better this last season, and played well in the post season, I am guessing that is due to Joe Barry, along with Kenny Clark and a few others. I wish someone would have snatched up Joe Barry for HC.

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SKOL to the BOWL !!!

Post #: 625