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RE: General Vikes Talk

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RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/7/2022 11:19:18 AM   
Ricky J


Posts: 18188
Joined: 7/19/2007
Status: online 		It's more like we've flipped heads 10 out of 12 times. Now we're going to turn some tails over, kick some sorry asses for a bit, move up to #2 in the power rankings, head into the playoffs with respect we're not used to

Doesn't seem like anyone has a real good handle on why things turn out like they do. The results aren't very common

< Message edited by Ricky J -- 12/7/2022 12:38:32 PM >
Post #: 3351
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/7/2022 11:38:54 AM   
thebigo


Posts: 28246
Joined: 7/14/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

Trying to make sense of the disparity between the defense's yards allowed vs. points allowed and red zone efficiency. It seems reasonable to believe that the defense's lack of speed would be less detrimental in the red zone where they're defending less open space.


Damn good point. Also more experienced players knowing where to be.
Post #: 3352
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/7/2022 11:52:51 AM   
David F.


Posts: 10833
Joined: 12/31/2007
Status: offline 		A trait that many Super Bowl contenders have shared over the years is that they are top 10 in both points scored and points allowed. The Vikes are 11 in points scored per game and 21 in points scored against per game. So we're close - sort of. Make a run in the playoffs this year and come back next year looking to push the offense into the top 5 and defense near the top 10 and we'll be a legit contender. That being said - improvements could still show up THIS year yet. There's still five more games.

_____________________________

I wouldn't give ANY qb $30-50+ mil unless that QB had won me a Super Bowl. Did you win a Super Bowl on your rookie deal? Yes? Great! Here's your hugenormous contract. F it let's just run victory laps and love life. No? Good luck. Next!
Post #: 3353
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/7/2022 12:32:52 PM   
Bill Jandro

 

Posts: 17838
Joined: 8/13/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: thebigo

quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

Trying to make sense of the disparity between the defense's yards allowed vs. points allowed and red zone efficiency. It seems reasonable to believe that the defense's lack of speed would be less detrimental in the red zone where they're defending less open space.


Damn good point. Also more experienced players knowing where to be.

Or is it because Donnashell has no more real estate to back the secondary to?

_____________________________

Oline...early and often this draft
Post #: 3354
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/7/2022 1:46:53 PM   
Steve Lentz


Posts: 36132
Joined: 7/19/2007
From: Omaha
Status: offline 		Great weekend spent in the Twin Cities with my grandson and son.
Wild win in a shoot out.
Wolves lose but my grandson got a t-shirt thrown to him and was introduced to Ant.
Vikes win in the last minute and he gets fist bumped by dozens of excited Viking fans on the way out.
He's only 7 and doesn't yet understand the pain of being a Minnesota sports fan.

_____________________________

" I believe empathy is the most essential quality of civilization"
Post #: 3355
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/7/2022 2:27:24 PM   
GopherFan34

 

Posts: 537
Joined: 4/25/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Steve Lentz

Great weekend spent in the Twin Cities with my grandson and son.
Wild win in a shoot out.
Wolves lose but my grandson got a t-shirt thrown to him and was introduced to Ant.
Vikes win in the last minute and he gets fist bumped by dozens of excited Viking fans on the way out.
He's only 7 and doesn't yet understand the pain of being a Minnesota sports fan.



Great stuff Steve. Nothing like family time at sporting events. My son and I went to the AR game. Best part, he bought!
Post #: 3356
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/7/2022 2:35:45 PM   
ronhextall


Posts: 6271
Joined: 7/19/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

Trying to make sense of the disparity between the defense's yards allowed vs. points allowed and red zone efficiency. It seems reasonable to believe that the defense's lack of speed would be less detrimental in the red zone where they're defending less open space.


Robert Smith look to be as slow as molasses after his 1st Qtr INT.

I think you are correct, it's a big reason.
Post #: 3357
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/7/2022 2:49:56 PM  1 votes
Ricky J


Posts: 18188
Joined: 7/19/2007
Status: online
quote:

ORIGINAL: Steve Lentz

Great weekend spent in the Twin Cities with my grandson and son.
Wild win in a shoot out.
Wolves lose but my grandson got a t-shirt thrown to him and was introduced to Ant.
Vikes win in the last minute and he gets fist bumped by dozens of excited Viking fans on the way out.
He's only 7 and doesn't yet understand the pain of being a Minnesota sports fan.

Cool beans! Nothing like seeing a kid enjoy the games.
Post #: 3358
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/7/2022 2:52:45 PM   
Ricky J


Posts: 18188
Joined: 7/19/2007
Status: online 		Word leaking around Twitter Kirk may be a little more bang up than we all thought.
Post #: 3359
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/7/2022 2:55:11 PM   
marty


Posts: 12663
Joined: 12/28/2007
Status: offline 		That makes sense Paul, some good points.

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SKOL to the BOWL !!!
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RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/7/2022 3:08:13 PM   
jbusse

 

Posts: 1308
Joined: 9/11/2013
From: Atlanta, GA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: thebigo

quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

Trying to make sense of the disparity between the defense's yards allowed vs. points allowed and red zone efficiency. It seems reasonable to believe that the defense's lack of speed would be less detrimental in the red zone where they're defending less open space.


Damn good point. Also more experienced players knowing where to be.

Savvy vet less likely to forget to defend the goal line like Cam Dantzler last year against the Lions.
Post #: 3361
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/7/2022 3:58:31 PM   
Trekgeekscott


Posts: 38427
Joined: 7/16/2007
From: United Federation of Planets
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

quote:

ORIGINAL: thebigo

quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

Trying to make sense of the disparity between the defense's yards allowed vs. points allowed and red zone efficiency. It seems reasonable to believe that the defense's lack of speed would be less detrimental in the red zone where they're defending less open space.


Damn good point. Also more experienced players knowing where to be.

Savvy vet less likely to forget to defend the goal line like Cam Dantzler last year against the Lions.


You also seem to be forgetting they have a smaller field to defend...thus the soft shell Donatell defense is no longer so open. It squeezes down.

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I don't want to go through things that don't kill me and make me stronger anymore.
Post #: 3362
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/7/2022 4:23:24 PM   
Todd M

 

Posts: 39776
Joined: 7/14/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ronhextall

quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

Trying to make sense of the disparity between the defense's yards allowed vs. points allowed and red zone efficiency. It seems reasonable to believe that the defense's lack of speed would be less detrimental in the red zone where they're defending less open space.


Robert Smith look to be as slow as molasses after his 1st Qtr INT.



He's 50 and playing out of position.
Post #: 3363
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/7/2022 4:26:16 PM   
Daniel Lee Young


Posts: 12804
Joined: 9/21/2013
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

quote:

ORIGINAL: ronhextall

quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

Trying to make sense of the disparity between the defense's yards allowed vs. points allowed and red zone efficiency. It seems reasonable to believe that the defense's lack of speed would be less detrimental in the red zone where they're defending less open space.


Robert Smith look to be as slow as molasses after his 1st Qtr INT.



He's 50 and playing out of position.



_____________________________

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I am WRATH, incarnate.
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Post #: 3364
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/7/2022 4:36:40 PM   
Steve Lentz


Posts: 36132
Joined: 7/19/2007
From: Omaha
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: GopherFan34

quote:

ORIGINAL: Steve Lentz

Great weekend spent in the Twin Cities with my grandson and son.
Wild win in a shoot out.
Wolves lose but my grandson got a t-shirt thrown to him and was introduced to Ant.
Vikes win in the last minute and he gets fist bumped by dozens of excited Viking fans on the way out.
He's only 7 and doesn't yet understand the pain of being a Minnesota sports fan.



Great stuff Steve. Nothing like family time at sporting events. My son and I went to the AR game. Best part, he bought!

Nice!!!

_____________________________

" I believe empathy is the most essential quality of civilization"
Post #: 3365
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/7/2022 5:26:27 PM   
jbusse

 

Posts: 1308
Joined: 9/11/2013
From: Atlanta, GA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Trekgeekscott

quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

quote:

ORIGINAL: thebigo

quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

Trying to make sense of the disparity between the defense's yards allowed vs. points allowed and red zone efficiency. It seems reasonable to believe that the defense's lack of speed would be less detrimental in the red zone where they're defending less open space.


Damn good point. Also more experienced players knowing where to be.

Savvy vet less likely to forget to defend the goal line like Cam Dantzler last year against the Lions.


You also seem to be forgetting they have a smaller field to defend...thus the soft shell Donatell defense is no longer so open. It squeezes down.

Right, Jandro's point. Some combo perhaps. Making sense of it gives reason to believe it could continue to work.
Post #: 3366
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/7/2022 5:51:45 PM   
GopherFan34

 

Posts: 537
Joined: 4/25/2009
Status: offline 		Going against some mediocre defense's here on out should help to get our offense dialed in. Hopefully we figure out this 3rd quarter disaster.
Post #: 3367
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/7/2022 6:03:32 PM   
GopherFan34

 

Posts: 537
Joined: 4/25/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

quote:

ORIGINAL: ronhextall

quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

Trying to make sense of the disparity between the defense's yards allowed vs. points allowed and red zone efficiency. It seems reasonable to believe that the defense's lack of speed would be less detrimental in the red zone where they're defending less open space.


Robert Smith look to be as slow as molasses after his 1st Qtr INT.



He's 50 and playing out of position.



I would like to see a Harrison Smith vs Robert Smith foot race, I bet it's closer than you think.
Post #: 3368
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/7/2022 6:07:38 PM   
thebigo


Posts: 28246
Joined: 7/14/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

quote:

ORIGINAL: thebigo

quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

Trying to make sense of the disparity between the defense's yards allowed vs. points allowed and red zone efficiency. It seems reasonable to believe that the defense's lack of speed would be less detrimental in the red zone where they're defending less open space.


Damn good point. Also more experienced players knowing where to be.

Savvy vet less likely to forget to defend the goal line like Cam Dantzler last year against the Lions.

Cam Dantzler was a "savvy vet" in the middle of his second season, after missing half of his rookie season?
Post #: 3369
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/7/2022 6:12:53 PM   
thebigo


Posts: 28246
Joined: 7/14/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Jandro

quote:

ORIGINAL: thebigo

quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

Trying to make sense of the disparity between the defense's yards allowed vs. points allowed and red zone efficiency. It seems reasonable to believe that the defense's lack of speed would be less detrimental in the red zone where they're defending less open space.


Damn good point. Also more experienced players knowing where to be.

Or is it because Donnashell has no more real estate to back the secondary to?

That was basically jbusse's point, which I agreed with.

Ok, now I see that sly dig at Donnashell.

< Message edited by thebigo -- 12/7/2022 6:50:42 PM >
Post #: 3370
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/7/2022 6:34:01 PM   
jbusse

 

Posts: 1308
Joined: 9/11/2013
From: Atlanta, GA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: thebigo

quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

quote:

ORIGINAL: thebigo

quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

Trying to make sense of the disparity between the defense's yards allowed vs. points allowed and red zone efficiency. It seems reasonable to believe that the defense's lack of speed would be less detrimental in the red zone where they're defending less open space.


Damn good point. Also more experienced players knowing where to be.

Savvy vet less likely to forget to defend the goal line like Cam Dantzler last year against the Lions.

Cam Dantzler was a "savvy vet" in the middle of his second season, after missing half of his rookie season?

No, he was the unsavvy, inexperienced, but relatively fast dude that didn't know where to be. I'm agreeing with you that the slower savvy vets tend to be in the right place when their speed limitations aren't as problematic.
Post #: 3371
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/7/2022 6:37:40 PM   
Bill Johanesen


Posts: 27552
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Trekgeekscott

quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

quote:

ORIGINAL: thebigo

quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

Trying to make sense of the disparity between the defense's yards allowed vs. points allowed and red zone efficiency. It seems reasonable to believe that the defense's lack of speed would be less detrimental in the red zone where they're defending less open space.


Damn good point. Also more experienced players knowing where to be.

Savvy vet less likely to forget to defend the goal line like Cam Dantzler last year against the Lions.


You also seem to be forgetting they have a smaller field to defend...thus the soft shell Donatell defense is no longer so open. It squeezes down.


You also seem to be forgetting he already said "they're defending less open space."
Post #: 3372
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/7/2022 6:47:20 PM   
thebigo


Posts: 28246
Joined: 7/14/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

quote:

ORIGINAL: thebigo

quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

quote:

ORIGINAL: thebigo

quote:

ORIGINAL: jbusse

Trying to make sense of the disparity between the defense's yards allowed vs. points allowed and red zone efficiency. It seems reasonable to believe that the defense's lack of speed would be less detrimental in the red zone where they're defending less open space.


Damn good point. Also more experienced players knowing where to be.

Savvy vet less likely to forget to defend the goal line like Cam Dantzler last year against the Lions.

Cam Dantzler was a "savvy vet" in the middle of his second season, after missing half of his rookie season?

No, he was the unsavvy, inexperienced, but relatively fast dude that didn't know where to be. I'm agreeing with you that the slower savvy vets tend to be in the right place when their speed limitations aren't as problematic.

Sorry, I read your Dantzler post wrong, as a sarcastic question vs a statement, which you meant it as.
Post #: 3373
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/7/2022 6:51:38 PM   
Bill Johanesen


Posts: 27552
Status: offline 		Geez, people are trying to get in on the smaller field in the red zone bandwagon explanation to the point of knocking existing bandwagoneers clear off the wagon.

The real reason is the defenders have less territory to cover; surprised that hasn't even been alluded to.

This is so obvious one has to wonder how any TD passes ever occur from inside the one yard line. You have near double the amount of effective defenders that you do from the ten yard line.
Post #: 3374
RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/7/2022 7:17:45 PM   
Bill Johanesen


Posts: 27552
Status: offline 		It's weird on the surface that from the 50 yard line each of say seven pass defenders has to cover on average 4,114 SF (including the EZ).

Blitz two of them and it's 5,760 SF for the remaining five.

Hicks is like, hey I can give you 2,200 SF max.
Post #: 3375
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