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RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/13/2022 8:27:58 PM

marty

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IF Donatell had won a Super Bowl as a DC, I might defend him. He hasn't.

There is little defense. Allowing a 4th and 26 completion in a playoff game, while rushing just 3 lineman, indefensible. Got himself fired for not being aggressive. Has he changed ?

I am surprised he wasn't fired this week. He will probably get the DL fired up for a week or 2, then they'll go right back to sucking.

< Message edited by marty -- 12/13/2022 8:29:22 PM >

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RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/13/2022 8:35:27 PM

Ricky J

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Not a chance our DC gets "canned" during the season.

Better off just getting used to the idea that he'll be here next year, too.

edit: Tweets saying O'Connell said Monday there's "a lot" coaches will look to adjust on a last-placed Vikings defense. AND Donatell will remain defensive play caller ... then it leads you to a link at the Startribune I can't get

Is KOC starting to get more vocal? That surprises me

Post #: 3502

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/13/2022 9:27:55 PM

Tom Sykes

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Joined: 7/27/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: thebigo

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

quote:

ORIGINAL: ratoppenheimer

.
.
truth is, even with our horrific defense this is a game we would have won in our normal crazy style - if we didn't make so many other bad decisions/errors....

hockenson dropped pass for a 1st down....
4th down conversion fail...gave detroit short field....
cook fumble on detroit three yard line....
two-point conversion fail....
jefferson touchdown that was called stepped out...would have saved vikes 50 seconds....
onside kick...gave Detroit short field....
.

Normal crazy is the outlier. A dropped pass, a fumble, a blown call by the ref, a couple of 'aggressive' plays that didn't work, a failed two-point conversion are all part of a normal game.

Let's hope the law of averages from 12 games don't totally equalize over the next month.

We have had an amazing season ... so far ... not by improving on either side of the ball ... not by looking better / more consistent than the other teams we have played ... not by getting on a roll or elevating into playoff form ...

We simply don't play better than any other team for more than a quarter or two. We have done it with the smoke and mirrors of not looking that good but making a few less mistakes, getting fewer bad breaks, and making a timely play or two in each game (that we didn't get blown out). Even our timely plays required help from the other team – like Jefferson's miracle catch, which required a miracle endzone fumble recovery. A lot of our timely plays were against another team's mediocre defense or offense + a mediocre starting / 2nd / 3rd string QB that still almost took the game from us.

Not all of it but a lot of it has been catching teams at the right moment.

10-3 ... its incredible how consistently we've risen to the top of a very diluted, watered-down, regular-season jar of cornichon pickles. But its playoff season now ... the law of averages does not favor our little pickle for success.

Flipping a penny, still got a 50-50 chance

Yes ... and anyway ... we have already defied the law of averages many times this season ...

I have no idea what to expect.

Post #: 3503

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/13/2022 11:29:23 PM

thebigo

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Joined: 7/14/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

Not a chance our DC gets "canned" during the season.

Better off just getting used to the idea that he'll be here next year, too.

edit: Tweets saying O'Connell said Monday there's "a lot" coaches will look to adjust on a last-placed Vikings defense. AND Donatell will remain defensive play caller ... then it leads you to a link at the Startribune I can't get

Is KOC starting to get more vocal? That surprises me

Maybe O'Connell will go all f-bomb Jerry Burns on us? 😆

Post #: 3504

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/14/2022 8:55:50 AM

Ricky J

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quote:

ORIGINAL: thebigo

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

Not a chance our DC gets "canned" during the season.

Better off just getting used to the idea that he'll be here next year, too.

edit: Tweets saying O'Connell said Monday there's "a lot" coaches will look to adjust on a last-placed Vikings defense. AND Donatell will remain defensive play caller ... then it leads you to a link at the Startribune I can't get

Is KOC starting to get more vocal? That surprises me

Maybe O'Connell will go all f-bomb Jerry Burns on us? 😆

Well i dont think he'll go that far. ha ha

I know it's writers posting one line and a link to go to the Strib but it seemed out of character. It's prob simple, someone asked about our horrible defense and he said we need to do better. Ya gotta give us that much or no one will ever buy into what your saying.

Doesn't anyone around read the Strib? Be nice to see the articles. I don't think you even get 2 free a month anymore

Post #: 3505

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/14/2022 9:40:47 AM

geoffrey greitzer

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anyone notice it was Sports Illustrated that asked questions about the horrible defense.

No one local, is it not OK to question why things are going so bad. Did it need the team sinking to last in the league for it to be asked?!?

Post #: 3506

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/14/2022 10:35:24 AM

Ricky J

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Ben Goessling

@BenGoessling
·

(1) Defensive coordinator Ed Donatell said the team hasn’t been up to the defensive standard for which the #Vikings have typically been known. He said there’s been “too much air in the coverage,” and pointed more to execution than scheme.

(2) Donatell said players “are doing what they’re being coached to do,” but it’s unrealistic to expect the scheme to change drastically at this point. They’ll work to get players tighter in coverage.

He also said Za’Darius Smith is fully healthy now after his knee injury.

-- the underlined text seems like simple comprehension skills but just in case, he means player error not coaching error, correct?

< Message edited by Ricky J -- 12/14/2022 10:44:57 AM >

Post #: 3507

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/14/2022 10:40:21 AM

Todd M

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I'm coaching them to suck and let me ask you...they are sucking are they not? ~ Ed Donatell.

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RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/14/2022 10:41:07 AM

Daniel Lee Young

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We are the only top “ seed rated “ team with a negative point differential.

All others have more points for than points against, by double digit numbers.

We are in the red.

Donatello has to go.

If KOC wants to run a 3-4 defense, the KAM draft was not predicated on what we needed for that scheme.

I’m happy we are in the hunt for a playoff run, but TBH, he Vikings have a tar pit right in front of the starting blocks called “Donnashello defense” on the playoffs track and field.

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RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/14/2022 10:42:06 AM

Todd M

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Who wanted the change to 3-4...KOM or KAM.

Probably another Kwesi knock.

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RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/14/2022 10:50:22 AM

Ricky J

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Daniel Lee Young

We are the only top “ seed rated “ team with a negative point differential.

All others have more points for than points against, by double digit numbers.

We are in the red.

Donatello has to go.

If KOC wants to run a 3-4 defense, the KAM draft was not predicated on what we needed for that scheme.

I’m happy we are in the hunt for a playoff run, but TBH, he Vikings have a tar pit right in front of the starting blocks called “Donnashello defense” on the playoffs track and field.

You'll have that with a 40-3 slap up side the head. But we get it, Bills (120), Chiefs (86), Eagles (138), '9ers (120), Vikes (-1)

Post #: 3511

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/14/2022 11:06:03 AM

Ricky J

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This sounds more fair:

Andrew Krammer
@Andrew_Krammer
·
18m
1. Ed Donatell: "We want to win the first second of the down to make it hard for the quarterback to see the pass scheme oriented. That’s a work in progress right now and we’re not accomplishing it, but it doesn’t mean there’s not a great opportunity coming."

2. Donatell (con't): "It is disguise and it's unveiling sameness and likeness looks to slow down the quarterback. When you do that with the coverage and rush, you have the picture you want. We have a vision out there. We know what it looks like. We're just not quite there..."

3. Donatell: "I don't think it's ever drastic" re: changes needed. "We'd like to take some of the air out of the coverage. You want to be tighter... whether in man or zone."

The long ball remains key issue: "That's way against the vision and standard of what we're looking for."

Post #: 3512

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/14/2022 11:45:55 AM

Jeff Jesser

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The podcast Purple Daily mentioned after the loss that they would be shocked if there was a firing but not if he was stripped of his play calling duties. It didn't happen that we know of but that's what I kinda expected too.

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RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/14/2022 11:49:35 AM

Jeff Jesser

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To give it color, if you will, I was at a birthday party and the hosts put the game on for me. They know i'm a diehard fan. I was watching the game with football fans but not fans of the Vikes so they don't see us much. The comments they were making started off making furious but then I just had to laugh. They were so spot on but we've (i've) just gotten numb to the insanity.

"why are your corners not even showing up on the screen? Never seen that before"

"was that an attempt at a screen or just a throw away?"

"why on earth would you go for 2 at this point?"

"you know you get zero pressure on Goff? Every NFL QB will succeed like that"

it went on and on and on......................................

Post #: 3514

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/14/2022 11:50:52 AM

Jeff Jesser

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Oh, and my actual favorite from a drive by Pats fan: "how the hell are you guys 10-2????"

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RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/14/2022 11:55:34 AM

thebigo

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeff Jesser

Oh, and my actual favorite from a drive by Pats fan: "how the hell are you guys 10-2????"

At the end of the game, did you say "That's how."?

< Message edited by thebigo -- 12/14/2022 11:57:06 AM >

Post #: 3516

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/14/2022 12:23:01 PM

Bill Johanesen

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Donatell may have a 2-3 year agreement to stay on as DC with the understanding it takes time to develop a new scheme, the D has aging players with high contracts, there is basically no cap space, etc.

Two years would not be a surprise at all. And the focus of the two years may be how well the D plays in the last quarter of the 2023 season.

Sure he could be fired sooner, but if that broke the understanding then Donatell could circulate things within the coaching fraternity... that Kwesi/KOC are backstabbers.

Post #: 3517

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/14/2022 12:25:35 PM

Bill Johanesen

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Conversely, Donatell could simply be the so-called wise sage (basically just a guy who has been to a few too many rodeos) to help KOC along for a year, with no promise of anything beyond that.

Post #: 3518

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/14/2022 12:52:12 PM

Trekgeekscott

Posts: 39725
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From: United Federation of Planets
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

Donatell may have a 2-3 year agreement to stay on as DC with the understanding it takes time to develop a new scheme, the D has aging players with high contracts, there is basically no cap space, etc.

Two years would not be a surprise at all. And the focus of the two years may be how well the D plays in the last quarter of the 2023 season.

Sure he could be fired sooner, but if that broke the understanding then Donatell could circulate things within the coaching fraternity... that Kwesi/KOC are backstabbers.

Which would sound like the utter failure he is is just spreading bullshit in petty arrogant fashion after his defense came in dead last.

They brought him in...he failed miserably...say he gets fired...

People are supposed to believe HIM that they are petty backstabbers? I think most people would see it the other way around. He failed badly, underimining what might have been a pretty good team otherwise and got fired for it and now he's trying to spread rumors about the team that fired him like it was their fault?

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RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/14/2022 1:17:26 PM

Phil Riewer

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Darren Wolfson
@DWolfsonKSTP
·
5h
Hear that the #Vikings are expected to add cornerback Kalon Barnes to their 53-man roster. He will be plucked off of Miami’s practice squad. Contract will run through 2024. Barnes was a #Skol pre-draft visit, ran a blazing 4.22 at the Combine.

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RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/14/2022 1:30:41 PM

marty

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Were the Packers backstabbers after they fired Donatell after a playoff game where his non-aggressive defense gave up a 4th and 26, while rushing just 3 guys ?

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RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/14/2022 2:13:57 PM

ratoppenheimer

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From: cascais, portugal...still in exile
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

Darren Wolfson
@DWolfsonKSTP
·
5h
Hear that the #Vikings are expected to add cornerback Kalon Barnes to their 53-man roster. He will be plucked off of Miami’s practice squad. Contract will run through 2024. Barnes was a #Skol pre-draft visit, ran a blazing 4.22 at the Combine.

quote:

Kalon Barnes

...and 6-0, 185

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RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/14/2022 3:04:48 PM

Bill Johanesen

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Trekgeekscott

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

Donatell may have a 2-3 year agreement to stay on as DC with the understanding it takes time to develop a new scheme, the D has aging players with high contracts, there is basically no cap space, etc.

Two years would not be a surprise at all. And the focus of the two years may be how well the D plays in the last quarter of the 2023 season.

Sure he could be fired sooner, but if that broke the understanding then Donatell could circulate things within the coaching fraternity... that Kwesi/KOC are backstabbers.

Which would sound like the utter failure he is is just spreading bullshit in petty arrogant fashion after his defense came in dead last.

They brought him in...he failed miserably...say he gets fired...

People are supposed to believe HIM that they are petty backstabbers? I think most people would see it the other way around. He failed badly, underimining what might have been a pretty good team otherwise and got fired for it and now he's trying to spread rumors about the team that fired him like it was their fault?

And you miss multiple points entirely.

In this hypothetical scenario, it is common knowledge it will easily take more than a year to install a viable defense... for reasons mentioned. Do you get that?

Secondly, the public wouldn't know. That is why I specifically said coaching fraternity. THEY understand the dynamics better than you/the public.

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RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/14/2022 5:44:08 PM

marty

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When the Ravens switched offensive coordinators in December, and went on to win the Super Bowl, didn't they realize it was going to take lot longer to install a viable offense ?

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RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/14/2022 5:53:48 PM

David Levine

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quote:

ORIGINAL: marty

When the Ravens switched offensive coordinators in December, and went on to win the Super Bowl, didn't they realize it was going to take lot longer to install a viable offense ?

Apples and oranges.

The Ravens promoted their QB coach to OC. He was already with the team and did not install an entirely new offense.

You're asking to bring in an outside coach and have him scrap the defense and start over from scratch - 13 games into the season.

Post #: 3525