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RE: 2024 Draft - 4/6/2024 11:55:57 AM 1 votes

Daniel Lee Young

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I ve had that moron on block since he started spewing his “ the moment god changed my life” story.

You can’t stop dementia nor can you treat those who have been blinded by a fairy tale that fits the narrative of something beyond their ability to understand or grasp. Intellectually.

Jim Jones, Jesus, Muhammad. KGDB, David Koresh…

The list of those fully committed to an ideal, no matter how flawed or far from the reality of a given set of circumstances, is indeed endless..

Thankfully his obsession and opinion has nothing to do with actual team management..

Do yourselves a favor.. block him, then all you have to do is read the quotes of his gullible believers, which are few, or the posts by those who enjoy pounding sand into a rat hole of insanity.

Not one single person on this board has any idea or influence on the draft.

Talk is cheap, and stupid talk is free…

I personally don’t care who our starting QB is,( especially since it won’t be KFC), although I’d avoid old, often injured, one dimensional “ system” doinks, without the ability to understand that every player and defense they will face in the NFL is, by a factor of at least 10-1, far better than anything they have ever seen on 80% of the teams they will play against.

The draft can’t be over and done soon enough for me.

For those of you unable to grasp my meaning…

Flat out no to PENIX.

< Message edited by Daniel Lee Young -- 4/6/2024 11:58:35 AM >

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**** you all.

Post #: 1051

RE: 2024 Draft - 4/7/2024 6:20:25 PM

kgdabom

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I finally Warner's Bo Nix breakdown. I'm posting it before even listening to it, because for better or worse I think most of us respect his evals.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_u4IbevSgO8

< Message edited by kgdabom -- 4/7/2024 7:11:52 PM >

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Post #: 1052

RE: 2024 Draft - 4/7/2024 7:16:37 PM

kgdabom

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quote:

ORIGINAL: kgdabom

I finally Warner's Bo Nix breakdown. I'm posting it before even listening to it, because for better or worse I think most of us respect his evals.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_u4IbevSgO8

30 seconds in Warner says that the Oregon offense is the most pro style one of the QBs he's covered this year due to the complexity of the passing concepts. Same criticism that Simms has that he doesn't step into passes as much as he should. In conclusion he praises his decision making and accuracy, but says he needs some technique work. To be continued in part 2.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zXkHHot6TcA

< Message edited by kgdabom -- 4/7/2024 7:50:03 PM >

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Post #: 1053

RE: 2024 Draft - 4/8/2024 5:28:49 AM

kgdabom

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Brendan Donahue has been the most accurate draft prognosticator over the last 5 years according to some analysis. He has the Vikings moving up to 4 drafting Maye in a 3 way trade with the Cards and Chargers using nothing more than our 11 and 23. The Cards get 5 for 11 and 27 drafting MHJ.
https://www.sharpfootballanalysis.com/analysis/2024-nfl-mock-draft-brendan-donahue/

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"So let it be written.
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Post #: 1054

RE: 2024 Draft - 4/8/2024 8:50:25 AM

Trekgeekscott

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Daniel Lee Young

The draft can’t be over and done soon enough for me.

Amen!

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Post #: 1055

RE: 2024 Draft - 4/8/2024 9:19:37 AM

Phil Riewer

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Trekgeekscott

quote:

ORIGINAL: Daniel Lee Young

The draft can’t be over and done soon enough for me.

Amen!

Honestly, the first week of FA was the most fun/active ever for the franchise...the draft outside of the possible moving up and for whom will be a letdown.

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Post #: 1056

RE: 2024 Draft - 4/8/2024 10:27:03 AM

David Levine

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The Athletic's Mock (Just the QBs):

1. Chicago Bears (from CAR): Caleb Williams, QB, USC
Another new era in Chicago begins, this time with the best playmaker in the draft. Williams comes with his quirks and a pretty unique personality — but he’s even more unique on the field. A big day for the Bears.

2. Washington Commanders: Drake Maye, QB, North Carolina
Maye is still growing as a passer, particularly in his consistency processing from the pocket. When you stack him up next to Jayden Daniels, though, Maye’s strengths are stronger and the weaknesses are similar. This will be a preference decision for Adam Peters and the Washington front office. For me, Maye is QB2.

3. New England Patriots: Jayden Daniels, QB, LSU
If I’m New England, I’m trying to get out of this pick. However, Robert Kraft wants a quarterback — one he can market — and it doesn’t seem like he’d be willing to wait. Daniels has improved as much as any player in this class over the last two years, and he has rare dual-threat capability.

4. Minnesota Vikings (from ARI)*: J.J. McCarthy, QB, Michigan
Projected trade: Minnesota trades No. 11, No. 23 and a 2025 first-round pick to Arizona for No. 4

The first trade in our mock is the one everyone’s sort of waiting on — Minnesota clearly didn’t make all these moves to sit at No. 11. The Vikings need a QB. The only question is how high they’re willing to move up for one. Daniels doesn’t rank among my top 10 prospects this draft; McCarthy isn’t in my top 15. But the market is the market.

19. Denver Broncos (from LV)*: Bo Nix, QB, Oregon
Projected trade: Los Angeles Rams trade No. 19 and No. 52 to Denver for No. 12

The Broncos really need a quarterback. The Sean Payton plan will go nowhere without one. And though this might be too high for Nix, I’m still sending him to Payton. Denver trades down, gets a QB and acquires extra capital — tough to beat that.

44. Las Vegas Raiders: Michael Penix Jr., QB, Washington
Penix is QB6 here, and this might be too low on the board. The Raiders (or some other QB-needy team) may have to move up for him. Still, there are questions with Penix’s game — like his accuracy, age and injury history — that are very real.

99. Los Angeles Rams: Spencer Rattler, QB, South Carolina

https://theathletic.com/5394632/2024/04/08/nfl-mock-draft-2024-quarterbacks-drake-maye/?campaign=5888993&source=dailyemail&userId=114953

Post #: 1057

RE: 2024 Draft - 4/8/2024 10:43:35 AM

Todd M

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Been reading the move to 4 or 5 is going to cost 3 picks. So much for getting a pick back sending 2 1sts.

Penix at 11 starting to look like an ok fallback plan. If we don’t get snaked.

Post #: 1058

RE: 2024 Draft - 4/8/2024 11:13:07 AM

David Levine

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There is an absolute ton of info complied in this story. And a shocking (especially for DN) amount of good content in the comments.

NFL Draft Top QB Rankings Roundup

https://www.dailynorseman.com/2024/4/8/24122506/nfl-draft-top-qb-rankings-roundup

After digging through all of it, Nix might be the most polarizing candidate for me. Every time I read something that got me on his train, the next thing knocked me right off it...

< Message edited by David Levine -- 4/8/2024 11:14:57 AM >

Post #: 1059

RE: 2024 Draft - 4/8/2024 11:59:30 AM

Tom Sykes

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Some people find analysts that mirror their ideas and then tout them as superior analysts ... you know who you are.

I myself look for bad QB analysts that I disagree with completely and use that as a guide.

For instance, in my search for a poopoo town QB analyst ... I've settled on Spielman, the man that brought you Ponder and Cousins (more than once!).

Spencer Rattler: Pro comp: Minnesota Vikings QB Jaren Hall
"He is a little better athlete [than Jaren Hall], but ... statistically height, weight all that stuff, he is very similar to Brock Purdy," Spielman said.
[Uh ... Jaren Hall? No.]

Bo Nix: Pro comp: Los Angeles Rams QB Jimmy Garoppolo
"Sometimes he tries to almost aim the ball instead of just throw it when there are some easy touchdowns there, especially down in the red zone or near the goal line. Just throw the ball. Make a play."
[Uh ... Garoppolo? No.]

Michael Penix: Pro comp: New England Patriots QB Jacoby Brissett
"This may be a player, depending on how teams graded him medically, didn't hear anything negative about the medicals and he participated at the combine, which checks boxes. I wouldn't be surprised if a team that didn't get their quarterback moves up from the second round to the bottom of the first to get the fifth-year option like we did with Teddy Bridgewater [in 2014]. Like Baltimore did with Lamar Jackson. I could see someone doing that if he goes past the Raiders to get that fifth-year option on him just because of the throwing talent. He's not the athlete like some of these other guys, but he may be the best deep ball thrower. It's when the pocket isn't clean like in the national championship game ... To me, he has that knack to move around in the pocket to create some time, but if it gets noisy around his feet, does that bother his accuracy or is he as good? Especially with the way he got hit in the national championship game ... That was the last impression that you saw of him in college. You can't take that as your deciding factor, but it brings up the question on some of the getting the ball out when the pressure is coming at you."
[Brisset? ... No.]

JJ MCarthy: Pro comp: Athletic Kirk Cousins
"When I watched him finally throw live at the Combine, he is a more athletic Kirk Cousins," Spielman said. That was my out of the box comp."
[What the .. Cousins? NO!!!]

Jayden Daniels:Pro comp: Baltimore Ravens two-time NFL MVP QB Lamar Jackson
"I've been comparing him to Lamar since the Florida game when he made it look like a Madden football game where someone was playing a college defense, and he was running all over the place."

Drake Maye: Pro comp: Jacksonville Jaguars QB Trevor Lawrence
"I watched him play live against Miami two years ago, and I was really impressed with his demeanor and the way he throws the ball. I think he's an underrated athlete," Spielman said. "I think he is a good athlete that can make plays. The biggest things that I saw was the do too much mentality this year, trying to overcompensate because of the receivers that he had. Tez Walker didn't play until halfway through the year. He didn't have anyone else to throw to. The offensive line didn't protect him very well. I think he was trying to do too much. The other thing that stuck out to me that he is going to have to learn is the pre and post-snap reads. I think sometimes he gets a little hesitant in the pocket if the defense changes the look on the back end a little bit. He just tried to force too many plays that weren't there. He tried to overcompensate for things instead of trying to play within the scheme and system, but I think they just were undertalented compared to what he had a year ago [in 2022] and the way he played a year ago. I think this guy has huge upside."
[I actualy thought the comment about trying to do too much was interesting.]

Caleb Williams: Pro comp: Andrew Luck/New York Jets QB Aaron Rodgers
"I think he is a cut above everybody else. Everybody is going to poke holes at this time of year, this is the hole-poking season. Every NFL front office is like 'there is no one that can play in the NFL right now.'
[Yup but Rogers? Yuck]

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/news/2024-nfl-draft-former-general-managers-qb-tiers-pro-comps-landing-spots-and-best-fits-for-quality-class/

...

So just to prove my reverse draft analysis theory ...

Using Spielman's analysis (a big no no) and his comparison for Cousins (an annihilation of what traits are most important in a QB) ... I have every reason to NOT to like McCarthy.

But let's see ... he's more athletic than Cousins so removing the exasperating Cousins dork factor is a major plus. Harbaugh says he's an assassin when the game gets tight so removing the Cousins big game petrified robot factor is a plus. JJ has an unparalleled won loss record in college / HS while being accused of doing very little, so removing Cousins innate ability to compile big stats without affecting the outcome of games is golden.

Yes, today I'm all in on JJ.

< Message edited by Tom Sykes -- 4/8/2024 12:02:22 PM >

Post #: 1060

RE: 2024 Draft - 4/8/2024 12:02:14 PM

David Levine

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

So just to prove my reverse draft analysis theory ...

Using Spielman's analysis (a big no no) and his comparison for Cousins (an annihilation of what traits are most important in a QB) ... I have every reason to NOT to like McCarthy.

But let's see ... he's more athletic than Cousins so removing the exasperating Cousins dork factor is a major plus. Harbaugh says he's an assassin when the game gets tight so removing the Cousins big game petrified robot factor is a plus. JJ has an unparalleled won loss record in college / HS while being accused of doing very little, so removing Cousins innate ability to compile big stats without affecting the outcome of games is golden.

Yes, today I'm all in on JJ.

Hard to argue with that.

Post #: 1061

RE: 2024 Draft - 4/8/2024 3:07:47 PM

kgdabom

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

Been reading the move to 4 or 5 is going to cost 3 picks. So much for getting a pick back sending 2 1sts.

Penix at 11 starting to look like an ok fallback plan. If we don’t get snaked.

You read something and think it's true. I'm starting to believe that not even Kwesi would be idiotic enough to trade more than 11 and 23 for 4. We shall soon find out.

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Post #: 1062

RE: 2024 Draft - 4/8/2024 3:09:25 PM

David Levine

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A lot of good stuff here:

2024 NFL Draft: QBOPS previews J.J. McCarthy

https://www.acmepackingcompany.com/2024/4/2/24119068/2024-nfl-draft-qbops-preview-j-j-mccarthy-qb-michigan

Post #: 1063

RE: 2024 Draft - 4/8/2024 3:19:08 PM

kgdabom

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I'm guessing Tom is referring to me as a person who looks for analysts who agree with me and then quote them. That couldn't be further from the truth. I have no opinion until I check out the analysts and game film. I do give a lot of weight to Chris Simms because I think he's the best. I don't dismiss analysts that disagree with him. I try to learn from them. Playing QB in the NFL is mind blowing hard. So much to decipher on every play. I can barely fathom how they do it.

< Message edited by kgdabom -- 4/8/2024 3:20:41 PM >

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RE: 2024 Draft - 4/8/2024 3:19:48 PM

Todd M

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See if I change my mind but I’m pretty dialed in on McCarthy.

Post #: 1065

RE: 2024 Draft - 4/8/2024 4:18:48 PM

Mark Anderson

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

See if I change my mind but I’m pretty dialed in on McCarthy.

Yeah. I just read an article about his accuracy and anticipation(guys about to be open) throws. Probably 2nd to Williams and maybe equal.

Post #: 1066

RE: 2024 Draft - 4/8/2024 4:41:53 PM

kgdabom

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

See if I change my mind but I’m pretty dialed in on McCarthy.

I'm fine with McCarthy. At pick 11.

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Post #: 1067

RE: 2024 Draft - 4/8/2024 5:19:21 PM

Jeff Jesser

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

See if I change my mind but I’m pretty dialed in on McCarthy.

Yeah. I just read an article about his accuracy and anticipation(guys about to be open) throws. Probably 2nd to Williams and maybe equal.

They profiled him on NFL live today and they said the Vikings are the perfect destination for him because he has a lot of the same qualities and Purdy. Tons of weapons and can ease in. The 2 knocks against him were:

1. He throws every throw like it needs to be a 90+ MPH fastball.
2. He tends to just stick to the script too much. They wanted him to hang on to the ball a little longer if the scripted read wasn't open and find another option.

Post #: 1068

RE: 2024 Draft - 4/8/2024 5:23:21 PM

David Levine

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeff Jesser

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

See if I change my mind but I’m pretty dialed in on McCarthy.

Yeah. I just read an article about his accuracy and anticipation(guys about to be open) throws. Probably 2nd to Williams and maybe equal.

They profiled him on NFL live today and they said the Vikings are the perfect destination for him because he has a lot of the same qualities and Purdy. Tons of weapons and can ease in. The 2 knocks against him were:

1. He throws every throw like it needs to be a 90+ MPH fastball.
2. He tends to just stick to the script too much. They wanted him to hang on to the ball a little longer if the scripted read wasn't open and find another option.

Yeah, "a more athletic Purdy with a bigger arm" seems to be the comp a lot of people are making now.

The 2 knocks both sound like inexperience more than anything. Definitely coachable issues - especially if he sits a year.

Post #: 1069

RE: 2024 Draft - 4/8/2024 5:32:23 PM

Jeff Jesser

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quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeff Jesser

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

See if I change my mind but I’m pretty dialed in on McCarthy.

Yeah. I just read an article about his accuracy and anticipation(guys about to be open) throws. Probably 2nd to Williams and maybe equal.

They profiled him on NFL live today and they said the Vikings are the perfect destination for him because he has a lot of the same qualities and Purdy. Tons of weapons and can ease in. The 2 knocks against him were:

1. He throws every throw like it needs to be a 90+ MPH fastball.
2. He tends to just stick to the script too much. They wanted him to hang on to the ball a little longer if the scripted read wasn't open and find another option.

Yeah, "a more athletic Purdy with a bigger arm" seems to be the comp a lot of people are making now.

The 2 knocks both sound like inexperience more than anything. Definitely coachable issues - especially if he sits a year.

Yeap. I came in to this (at the time we only had the 11) thinking "yes to Penix but no to Nix or JJM". I have really come around on JJM the more I hear and read about him.

Post #: 1070

RE: 2024 Draft - 4/8/2024 5:55:06 PM

Daniel Lee Young

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Are we talking Josh freeman fastballs or Nolan Ryan fastballs?

Not a big fan of a guy with no concept of the touch throws, but maybe that can be learned…or coached.

and definitely not a fan of two acl and 2 rotator surgeries..which is PENIx in a nutshell.

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Post #: 1071

RE: 2024 Draft - 4/8/2024 6:48:55 PM

David Levine

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I'd be fine with PFF's Mock draft.

PICK 5: Minnesota. JJ MCCarthy

Projected trade: Vikings receive Pick No. 5; Chargers receive Pick Nos. 11 and 23 and a 2025 third-round pick

The Chargers could follow the Cardinals’ route and take one of the top receivers to address a glaring need, but they’ll instead accumulate more picks as Jim Harbaugh tries to build his roster.

The Vikings trading for the No. 23 pick in March signaled that they were doing so to likely move up and take a quarterback. While J.J. McCarthy has some work to do before he can reach his ceiling, it’s hard to find a better environment for him to flourish than Minnesota. As a bonus, Harbaugh gets to be the one to send his former quarterback to a fantastic situation and make him a top-five pick.

-------

1st Round QBs (No other trades):
#1 Williams
#2 Maye
#3 Daniels
#5 McCarthy
#12 Nix
#13 Penix

https://www.pff.com/news/draft-2024-nfl-mock-draft-record-six-qbs-top-15-brock-bowers-jets

Post #: 1072

RE: 2024 Draft - 4/8/2024 7:24:58 PM

kgdabom

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quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

I'd be fine with PFF's Mock draft.

PICK 5: Minnesota. JJ MCCarthy

Projected trade: Vikings receive Pick No. 5; Chargers receive Pick Nos. 11 and 23 and a 2025 third-round pick

The Chargers could follow the Cardinals’ route and take one of the top receivers to address a glaring need, but they’ll instead accumulate more picks as Jim Harbaugh tries to build his roster.

The Vikings trading for the No. 23 pick in March signaled that they were doing so to likely move up and take a quarterback. While J.J. McCarthy has some work to do before he can reach his ceiling, it’s hard to find a better environment for him to flourish than Minnesota. As a bonus, Harbaugh gets to be the one to send his former quarterback to a fantastic situation and make him a top-five pick.

-------

1st Round QBs (No other trades):
#1 Williams
#2 Maye
#3 Daniels
#5 McCarthy
#12 Nix
#13 Penix

https://www.pff.com/news/draft-2024-nfl-mock-draft-record-six-qbs-top-15-brock-bowers-jets

I've been calling that for almost a month now except McCarthy to the Vikings at 4. I sure hope it doesn't happen.

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Post #: 1073

RE: 2024 Draft - 4/8/2024 8:18:19 PM

TJSweens

Posts: 45016
Joined: 7/16/2007
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeff Jesser

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeff Jesser

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

See if I change my mind but I’m pretty dialed in on McCarthy.

Yeah. I just read an article about his accuracy and anticipation(guys about to be open) throws. Probably 2nd to Williams and maybe equal.

They profiled him on NFL live today and they said the Vikings are the perfect destination for him because he has a lot of the same qualities and Purdy. Tons of weapons and can ease in. The 2 knocks against him were:

1. He throws every throw like it needs to be a 90+ MPH fastball.
2. He tends to just stick to the script too much. They wanted him to hang on to the ball a little longer if the scripted read wasn't open and find another option.

Yeah, "a more athletic Purdy with a bigger arm" seems to be the comp a lot of people are making now.

The 2 knocks both sound like inexperience more than anything. Definitely coachable issues - especially if he sits a year.

Yeap. I came in to this (at the time we only had the 11) thinking "yes to Penix but no to Nix or JJM". I have really come around on JJM the more I hear and read about him.

I'm back on the McCarthy bandwagon too. The Giants are making me nervous again. I'm all for moving to 4 or 5 to get him.

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Post #: 1074

RE: 2024 Draft - 4/8/2024 8:26:45 PM

TJSweens

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Joined: 7/16/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

A lot of good stuff here:

2024 NFL Draft: QBOPS previews J.J. McCarthy

https://www.acmepackingcompany.com/2024/4/2/24119068/2024-nfl-draft-qbops-preview-j-j-mccarthy-qb-michigan

Nice breakdown. I like the comparisons to Nix in the deeper dive. The both had very high completion percentages, but achieved them in different ways against different levels of competition.

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"The eternal fate of the noble and enlightened: to be brutally crushed by the armed and dumb."

Post #: 1075