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RE: General Vikes Talk - 2/5/2021 7:35:27 AM

Todd M

Posts: 40668
Joined: 7/14/2007
Status: offline

I'd rather give them a 2 year window at this point SB or bust. Not ready to shed players or picks. Is use our 1st pick on a guard, our 2nd and 3rd picks on DL. Pray Hunter returns hungry and health so we actually have a pass rush. Be a dominant run team that can hurt you in the passing game. Play solid D. Blow it all up in 2 years if we don't win it all or am damn close.

Post #: 626

RE: General Vikes Talk - 2/5/2021 7:42:52 AM

Bill Johanesen

Posts: 28600
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: bohumm

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Daniel Lee Young

Bold:
adjective
1.
(of a person, action, or idea) showing an ability to take risks; confident and courageous.
"a bold attempt to solve the crisis"

Luck:
success or failure apparently brought by chance rather than through one's own actions.

“ picking the right guys is the definition of ̷B̷ ̷o̷ ̷l̷ ̷d̷ luck...”

Moving up to get Harrison Smith? Just another example....but continue to agree with Sweens. I don't on this one.

He should have held his spot and taken Bobby Wagner, but go ahead.....

Staying put and taking Wagner would have been a successful, ahem, I mean a bold move.

Post #: 627

RE: General Vikes Talk - 2/5/2021 7:45:39 AM

Bill Johanesen

Posts: 28600
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

22 dead in 2021, 17 in 2022, 6 in 2023.

Not sure any of those years warrant a trade for a guy that's worth just over 8 cents....if RB's are a dime a dozen.

The Jets, Texans, Falcons and Eagles all need a running back. That gets you a high pick for one of the top quarterbacks. You live for one more year with Cousins and then dump him.

Why would they give up their high picks for Cook if RBs are a dime a dozen?

Post #: 628

RE: General Vikes Talk - 2/5/2021 8:00:40 AM

Daniel Lee Young

Posts: 14000
Status: offline

I really hate it personally, this management philosophy, but, unfortunately, the Wilf’s seem to agree, that the current GM and coaching philosophy is on the right track..

They can point to the number of Rough diamonds, that spiel an has found outside the first round, the “developmental ability” of Zimmer’s system to produce extraordinary value out of UDFA and mid round or lower picks..

We see smoke and mirrors, while the rest of the league takes full advantage of rule changes that favor passing offense and big plays.

The Wilf’s see old school football that grinds out close wins and suffers close losses.. ignoring the beat down bad losses by teams that are far more aggressive.

The fact that we rarely, if ever, even compete for our own division, and are constantly “ in the hunt” for a flippin wild card spot in the playoffs shows me how badly the Wilf’s have put too much trust and money into mediocre management.

They went all in on Favrey, 13 years ago.. with Brad The Albatross Childress and his Kick Ass offense.

Nothing since that debacle has ever, ever made me believe we had a legitimate shot.

When Fn Walsh yanked a gimme in the playoffs, a cancer took hold, and I have died a little more every season since.

Some day, maybe in a couple years when Covid is muted, cap hell is in the rear view, and the chiefs have won 4 straight Superbowls, maybe a light will go of in the super Mario brothers empty lighthouse and they may consider building for the future of the NFL, instead of clinging to the 60’s and 70’s style of football.

< Message edited by Daniel Lee Young -- 2/5/2021 8:02:52 AM >

_____________________________

**** you all.

Post #: 629

RE: General Vikes Talk - 2/5/2021 8:03:29 AM

Phil Riewer

Posts: 27426
Joined: 8/24/2007
From: MN
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Daniel Lee Young

Bold:
adjective
1.
(of a person, action, or idea) showing an ability to take risks; confident and courageous.
"a bold attempt to solve the crisis"

Luck:
success or failure apparently brought by chance rather than through one's own actions.

“ picking the right guys is the definition of ̷B̷ ̷o̷ ̷l̷ ̷d̷ luck...”

Moving up to get Harrison Smith? Just another example....but continue to agree with Sweens. I don't on this one.

So by your definition, if Smith would've been a bust, it wouldn't have been a bold move?

Nope...you are bitching that the bold moves he makes are luck or normal....success at the ones I mentioned actually prove my point.

_____________________________

SSG Riewer, Greg A Co 2/136 CAB
KIA 23 March 2007 Habbaniyah Iraq

Post #: 630

RE: General Vikes Talk - 2/5/2021 8:14:58 AM

Daniel Lee Young

Posts: 14000
Status: offline

This group is just plain lucky.., they have the boldness of ranch dressing on white corn tortillas with milk and toast on the side...

Bold was taking a chance on Jared Allen, bold was going all in with Favrey and shitty relievers,

Nothing , in the past decade sniffs of bold..

Luck?

By the bushels,
good cap and contract management?
Not even close.

_____________________________

**** you all.

Post #: 631

RE: General Vikes Talk - 2/5/2021 8:28:08 AM

Bill Jandro

Posts: 17928
Joined: 8/13/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

Anybody know what the cap hit is if we trade Dalvin Cook? If people are seriously looking at a trade, that's the guy with the most value who is going to get you the most return. Running backs are a dime-a-dozen in the NFL, but some clubs still think it's 1975. Who are the two starting running backs in the Super Bowl? Who were the two starters the year before that? And the year before that?

I said the same thing about Peterson when he was here. Trade Cook now while he has value. He's one more knee injury away from being just a guy.

Dalvin Cook dead cap

2021 22.2ml
2022 17.6ml

POTENTIAL OUT: 2023, 3 YR, $27,262,500; $6,200,000 DEAD CAP

Cook is untradable due to the severe cap hit until 2023

_____________________________

Oline...early and often this draft

Post #: 632

RE: General Vikes Talk - 2/5/2021 8:32:29 AM

TJSweens

Posts: 45016
Joined: 7/16/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Levine

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Daniel Lee Young

Bold:
adjective
1.
(of a person, action, or idea) showing an ability to take risks; confident and courageous.
"a bold attempt to solve the crisis"

Luck:
success or failure apparently brought by chance rather than through one's own actions.

“ picking the right guys is the definition of ̷B̷ ̷o̷ ̷l̷ ̷d̷ luck...”

Moving up to get Harrison Smith? Just another example....but continue to agree with Sweens. I don't on this one.

So by your definition, if Smith would've been a bust, it wouldn't have been a bold move?

Nope...you are bitching that the bold moves he makes are luck or normal....success at the ones I mentioned actually prove my point.

No they don't prove your point in any way shape or form, Phil. As many have pointed out already, you don't grasp the concept of bold at all. Moving up a few spots from early second to late first is not particularly bold. GM's make moves like that routinely. If you do what your peers do on a regular basis, it isn't bold. It's par for the course. Especially when you put in the context of Spielman's yearly crusade to trade out of better picks to acquire more late picks because he figures with more picks he has a better chance of hitting on one of them. That sounds to me like a guy who is not confident in his ability to select players. That is the opposite of bold.

_____________________________

"The eternal fate of the noble and enlightened: to be brutally crushed by the armed and dumb."

Post #: 633

RE: General Vikes Talk - 2/5/2021 8:33:48 AM

TJSweens

Posts: 45016
Joined: 7/16/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

I'd rather give them a 2 year window at this point SB or bust. Not ready to shed players or picks. Is use our 1st pick on a guard, our 2nd and 3rd picks on DL. Pray Hunter returns hungry and health so we actually have a pass rush. Be a dominant run team that can hurt you in the passing game. Play solid D. Blow it all up in 2 years if we don't win it all or am damn close.

I don't consider the window to be open right now.

_____________________________

"The eternal fate of the noble and enlightened: to be brutally crushed by the armed and dumb."

Post #: 634

RE: General Vikes Talk - 2/5/2021 8:35:44 AM

Bill Johanesen

Posts: 28600
Status: offline

Time to write Phil off.

Post #: 635

RE: General Vikes Talk - 2/5/2021 8:40:04 AM

Brad H

Posts: 22986
Joined: 8/16/2007
From: Parts Unknown
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

22 dead in 2021, 17 in 2022, 6 in 2023.

Not sure any of those years warrant a trade for a guy that's worth just over 8 cents....if RB's are a dime a dozen.

The Jets, Texans, Falcons and Eagles all need a running back. That gets you a high pick for one of the top quarterbacks. You live for one more year with Cousins and then dump him.

Why would they give up their high picks for Cook if RBs are a dime a dozen?

Like I said earlier, some still think running back is important. Dime-a-dozen is my theory.

_____________________________

Defense starts at the corners!

Post #: 636

RE: General Vikes Talk - 2/5/2021 8:42:32 AM

TJSweens

Posts: 45016
Joined: 7/16/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

Time to write Phil off.

I guess the concept of boldness is more nuanced than we all realized.

_____________________________

"The eternal fate of the noble and enlightened: to be brutally crushed by the armed and dumb."

Post #: 637

RE: General Vikes Talk - 2/5/2021 8:43:44 AM

McMurfy

Posts: 13792
Joined: 7/31/2007
From: Portland, Oregon
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

Time to write Phil off.

Time to?
Man that is so 2018.

_____________________________

The Curse of Mauer is gone!

Post #: 638

RE: General Vikes Talk - 2/5/2021 8:44:33 AM

McMurfy

Posts: 13792
Joined: 7/31/2007
From: Portland, Oregon
Status: offline

It’s not that dumb is so bad.
It’s that he doubles down on dumb.

_____________________________

The Curse of Mauer is gone!

Post #: 639

RE: General Vikes Talk - 2/5/2021 8:48:44 AM

TJSweens

Posts: 45016
Joined: 7/16/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: McMurfy

It’s not that dumb is so bad.
It’s that he doubles down on dumb.

Much like his orange hero.

_____________________________

"The eternal fate of the noble and enlightened: to be brutally crushed by the armed and dumb."

Post #: 640

RE: General Vikes Talk - 2/5/2021 9:47:26 AM

Phil Riewer

Posts: 27426
Joined: 8/24/2007
From: MN
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: TJSweens

quote:

ORIGINAL: McMurfy

It’s not that dumb is so bad.
It’s that he doubles down on dumb.

Much like his orange hero.

I don't know who has an orange hero...but I know where you can go with that comment outside of the political thread. He is as much my hero as Schiff is yours.

_____________________________

SSG Riewer, Greg A Co 2/136 CAB
KIA 23 March 2007 Habbaniyah Iraq

Post #: 641

RE: General Vikes Talk - 2/5/2021 9:49:21 AM

Phil Riewer

Posts: 27426
Joined: 8/24/2007
From: MN
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

22 dead in 2021, 17 in 2022, 6 in 2023.

Not sure any of those years warrant a trade for a guy that's worth just over 8 cents....if RB's are a dime a dozen.

The Jets, Texans, Falcons and Eagles all need a running back. That gets you a high pick for one of the top quarterbacks. You live for one more year with Cousins and then dump him.

Why would they give up their high picks for Cook if RBs are a dime a dozen?

Like I said earlier, some still think running back is important. Dime-a-dozen is my theory.

Dime a dozen works unless you have a top 3-5 RB.

_____________________________

SSG Riewer, Greg A Co 2/136 CAB
KIA 23 March 2007 Habbaniyah Iraq

Post #: 642

RE: General Vikes Talk - 2/5/2021 9:58:08 AM

bohumm

Posts: 5705
Joined: 10/28/2007
From: Altadena, CA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

22 dead in 2021, 17 in 2022, 6 in 2023.

Not sure any of those years warrant a trade for a guy that's worth just over 8 cents....if RB's are a dime a dozen.

The Jets, Texans, Falcons and Eagles all need a running back. That gets you a high pick for one of the top quarterbacks. You live for one more year with Cousins and then dump him.

Why would they give up their high picks for Cook if RBs are a dime a dozen?

Like I said earlier, some still think running back is important. Dime-a-dozen is my theory.

Dime a dozen works unless you have a top 3-5 RB.

I may be wrong, but I think the last team to win a Super Bowl because of their running game was Denver in the late 1990s.

If the Vikings' defense got better instead of worse (significantly) after 2017 and the OL didn't get worse, Zim's philosophy may have had a chance.

And if my aunt had balls she'd be my uncle.

Post #: 643

RE: General Vikes Talk - 2/5/2021 10:02:02 AM

TJSweens

Posts: 45016
Joined: 7/16/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: bohumm

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

22 dead in 2021, 17 in 2022, 6 in 2023.

Not sure any of those years warrant a trade for a guy that's worth just over 8 cents....if RB's are a dime a dozen.

The Jets, Texans, Falcons and Eagles all need a running back. That gets you a high pick for one of the top quarterbacks. You live for one more year with Cousins and then dump him.

Why would they give up their high picks for Cook if RBs are a dime a dozen?

Like I said earlier, some still think running back is important. Dime-a-dozen is my theory.

Dime a dozen works unless you have a top 3-5 RB.

I may be wrong, but I think the last team to win a Super Bowl because of their running game was Denver in the late 1990s.

If the Vikings' defense got better instead of worse (significantly) after 2017 and the OL didn't get worse, Zim's philosophy may have had a chance.

And if my aunt had balls she'd be my uncle.

God damn! That is deep.

_____________________________

"The eternal fate of the noble and enlightened: to be brutally crushed by the armed and dumb."

Post #: 644

RE: General Vikes Talk - 2/5/2021 10:27:09 AM

thebigo

Posts: 28303
Joined: 7/14/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

22 dead in 2021, 17 in 2022, 6 in 2023.

Not sure any of those years warrant a trade for a guy that's worth just over 8 cents....if RB's are a dime a dozen.

Damn, what's a dime worth up there in Canada?

Post #: 645

RE: General Vikes Talk - 2/5/2021 10:53:18 AM

Brad H

Posts: 22986
Joined: 8/16/2007
From: Parts Unknown
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Todd M

22 dead in 2021, 17 in 2022, 6 in 2023.

Not sure any of those years warrant a trade for a guy that's worth just over 8 cents....if RB's are a dime a dozen.

The Jets, Texans, Falcons and Eagles all need a running back. That gets you a high pick for one of the top quarterbacks. You live for one more year with Cousins and then dump him.

Why would they give up their high picks for Cook if RBs are a dime a dozen?

Like I said earlier, some still think running back is important. Dime-a-dozen is my theory.

Dime a dozen works unless you have a top 3-5 RB.

When was the last time a team with a top 3-5 running back in the league won a Super Bowl? The reality is, top 3-5 running backs sell a lot of jerseys but they don't win a lot of championships.

< Message edited by Brad H -- 2/5/2021 10:58:50 AM >

_____________________________

Defense starts at the corners!

Post #: 646

RE: General Vikes Talk - 2/5/2021 11:05:12 AM

David F.

Posts: 10864
Joined: 12/31/2007
Status: offline

2020 NFL leaders in rushing attempts:

Derrick Henry 378 attempts 2027 yards Tenn
Dalvin Cook 312 attempts 1557 yards Min
Josh Jacobs 273 attempts 1065 yards LV
David Montgomery 247 attempts 1070 yards Chi
Zeke 244 attempts 979 yards Dal
James Robinson 240 attempts 1070 yards Jax
Kenyan Drake 239 attempts 955 yards Ari
Jonathan Taylor 232 attempts 1169 yards Ind
Melvin Gordon 215 attempts 1169 yards Den
Aaron Jones 201 attempts 986 yards GB

Only two playoff teams in that whole bunch and both eliminated. I'm not counting Chi and Ind as they were 7 seeds and would not have been in the playoffs any other year but this one. If we do count them then I'd add that the playoff record of the teams that made this list was 1-4.

< Message edited by David F. -- 2/5/2021 11:07:58 AM >

_____________________________

I wouldn't give ANY qb $30-50+ mil unless that QB had won me a Super Bowl. Did you win a Super Bowl on your rookie deal? Yes? Great! Here's your hugenormous contract. F it let's just run victory laps and love life. No? Good luck. Next!

Post #: 647

RE: General Vikes Talk - 2/5/2021 11:07:01 AM

joejitsu

Posts: 15424
Joined: 3/21/2010
From: 60411
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Daniel Lee Young

I really hate it personally, this management philosophy, but, unfortunately, the Wilf’s seem to agree, that the current GM and coaching philosophy is on the right track..

They can point to the number of Rough diamonds, that spiel an has found outside the first round, the “developmental ability” of Zimmer’s system to produce extraordinary value out of UDFA and mid round or lower picks..

We see smoke and mirrors, while the rest of the league takes full advantage of rule changes that favor passing offense and big plays.

The Wilf’s see old school football that grinds out close wins and suffers close losses.. ignoring the beat down bad losses by teams that are far more aggressive.

The fact that we rarely, if ever, even compete for our own division, and are constantly “ in the hunt” for a flippin wild card spot in the playoffs shows me how badly the Wilf’s have put too much trust and money into mediocre management.

They went all in on Favrey, 13 years ago.. with Brad The Albatross Childress and his Kick Ass offense.

Nothing since that debacle has ever, ever made me believe we had a legitimate shot.

When Fn Walsh yanked a gimme in the playoffs, a cancer took hold, and I have died a little more every season since.

Some day, maybe in a couple years when Covid is muted, cap hell is in the rear view, and the chiefs have won 4 straight Superbowls, maybe a light will go of in the super Mario brothers empty lighthouse and they may consider building for the future of the NFL, instead of clinging to the 60’s and 70’s style of football.

Super Mario Brothers! That made me laugh, Daniel!

Post #: 648

RE: General Vikes Talk - 2/5/2021 11:09:48 AM

David F.

Posts: 10864
Joined: 12/31/2007
Status: offline

Now let's look at the leaders in passing attempts:

1 Tom Brady Tampa Bay Buccaneers QB 719
2 Josh Allen Buffalo Bills QB 692
3 Ben Roethlisberger Pittsburgh Steelers QB 676
4 Patrick Mahomes Kansas City Chiefs QB 656
5 Matt Ryan Atlanta Falcons QB 626
6 Aaron Rodgers Green Bay Packers QB 610
7 Jared Goff Los Angeles Rams QB 598
8 Justin Herbert Los Angeles Chargers QB 595
9 Philip Rivers Indianapolis Colts QB 589
10 Russell Wilson Seattle Seahawks QB 58

_____________________________

I wouldn't give ANY qb $30-50+ mil unless that QB had won me a Super Bowl. Did you win a Super Bowl on your rookie deal? Yes? Great! Here's your hugenormous contract. F it let's just run victory laps and love life. No? Good luck. Next!

Post #: 649

RE: General Vikes Talk - 2/5/2021 11:12:43 AM

Bill Johanesen

Posts: 28600
Status: offline

RS loves his RBs as much as Thor loves his hammer. $150+ million to featured RBs.

During his time with the Vikings, Peterson took home a hair under $95 million in salary, with $86 million of that stemming from one contract extension.

The Minnesota Vikings have signed Pro Bowl running back Dalvin Cook to a five-year contract extension worth $63 million.

Post #: 650