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RE: General Vikes Talk - 1/17/2023 8:14:31 AM

Brad H

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ronhextall

Problem with the defense is the drafts have been garbage.

You don’t build a defense via free agency and I don’t recall any studs leaving the Vikings because of cap space.

The defensive drafts have been garbage because we had to completely rebuild the worst offensive line in football. Now we have the worst defense in football (arguably).

During all of this, we had the most overpaid quarterback in all of football. That's the common denominator.

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RE: General Vikes Talk - 1/17/2023 8:14:45 AM

Mark Anderson

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

So lets see if I have this straight:

Eric Kendricks has one year remaining on his contract, that carries an $11.4-million cap hit. He is our best defender.

Kirk Cousins has one year remaining on his contract with a dead cap value of $48.5-million. He's the No. 14 rated QB on his best season.

Phil sounds like every Republican I've ever known. Completely careless with his money.

Eric Kendricks if cut carries 1.9 cap hit, saves 9.5. Hicks if Cut 1.5 cap hit, saves 4.

You aren't doing the math correctly. Once again.

Also Kendricks can't cover speedy RBs (Pollard, Barkley) or WR crossing routes any more. Neither can Hicks. We play home games on Turf plus 2-3 more at least on the road. That won't change with a 3-4 or 4-3.

My first 2 solutions carry 3.4 million cap chhit; Save 13.5 million and put us 5 million under the cap.

Kendricks and Hicks just finished 1-2 in tackles on the team (mostly playing out of position). You want to get rid of them for high-priced mercenaries looking for a pay day?

You may know some of the money aspects, but you certainly don't know much about football.

If you switch back to a 4-3, try to restructure Kendricks. If not, trade or cut.

Getting rid of Cousins just to do it makes no sense cap wise. You lose 12M in cap space and miss out on signing a good CB or LB in FA.

You can still draft QBOTF and make a play for Lance or Z. Wilson.

Post #: 4877

RE: General Vikes Talk - 1/17/2023 8:14:46 AM

Phil Riewer

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OK...about 14 not 15
Problem #1. Our main defense weakness is LB speed and DB speed and we play on Turf. That makes Kendricks, Hicks, and Harry. Problem 1-3
Problem #4. Center
Problem #5 Hunters Future
Problem #6 Zeds Future
Problem #7 Resign JJ
Problem #8. Resign TJ
Problem #9 # 2 WR
Problem #10 Restructure Thielen or Cut him
Problem #11 Cut Cook
Problem #12. Rushing OLB if we stay 3-4. DE if we move to 4-3.
Problem #13 PR
Problem #14 Kirk's future

_____________________________

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KIA 23 March 2007 Habbaniyah Iraq

Post #: 4878

RE: General Vikes Talk - 1/17/2023 8:16:25 AM

Mark Anderson

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

OK...about 14 not 15
Problem #1. Our main defense weakness is LB speed and DB speed and we play on Turf. That makes Kendricks, Hicks, and Harry. Problem 1-3
Problem #4. Center
Problem #5 Hunters Future
Problem #6 Zeds Future
Problem #7 Resign JJ
Problem #8. Resign TJ
Problem #9 # 2 WR
Problem #10 Restructure Thielen or Cut him
Problem #11 Cut Cook
Problem #12. Rushing OLB if we stay 3-4. DE if we move to 4-3.
Problem #13 PR
Problem #14 Kirk's future

We'll see if KAM is afraid of a hard day's work.

Post #: 4879

RE: General Vikes Talk - 1/17/2023 8:17:04 AM

bstinger

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7 & 8 are signed. They don't need to be resigned. You could work on extensions if you want.

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Post #: 4880

RE: General Vikes Talk - 1/17/2023 8:17:35 AM

bstinger

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Signing Duke Shelley? He's a FA.

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Post #: 4881

RE: General Vikes Talk - 1/17/2023 8:17:38 AM

Phil Riewer

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From: MN
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

OK...about 14 not 15
Problem #1. Our main defense weakness is LB speed and DB speed and we play on Turf. That makes Kendricks, Hicks, and Harry. Problem 1-3
Problem #4. Center
Problem #5 Hunters Future
Problem #6 Zeds Future
Problem #7 Resign JJ
Problem #8. Resign TJ
Problem #9 # 2 WR
Problem #10 Restructure Thielen or Cut him
Problem #11 Cut Cook
Problem #12. Rushing OLB if we stay 3-4. DE if we move to 4-3.
Problem #13 PR
Problem #14 Kirk's future

We'll see if KAM is afraid of a hard day's work.

I didn't put Dalvin Tomlinson in there...so Kirk might be 15 again.

_____________________________

SSG Riewer, Greg A Co 2/136 CAB
KIA 23 March 2007 Habbaniyah Iraq

Post #: 4882

RE: General Vikes Talk - 1/17/2023 8:18:33 AM

Phil Riewer

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quote:

ORIGINAL: bstinger

7 & 8 are signed. They don't need to be resigned. You could work on extensions if you want.

Signing bonuses free up current year contracts...so they are important. TJ especially not sure what JJeff makes in 2023.

< Message edited by Phil Riewer -- 1/17/2023 8:20:42 AM >

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Post #: 4883

RE: General Vikes Talk - 1/17/2023 8:21:14 AM

Phil Riewer

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quote:

ORIGINAL: bstinger

Signing Duke Shelley? He's a FA.

Pushing Kirk down to 16 now Brad....

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KIA 23 March 2007 Habbaniyah Iraq

Post #: 4884

RE: General Vikes Talk - 1/17/2023 8:21:35 AM

Brad H

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Option #1 for this management team should be to find a new home for Cousins? Does anyone disagree with this?

Never mind how tough it could be. I never said it would be easy. But it can be done. It was done with Russell Wilson. It can be done with Kirk Cousins. There is a ton of teams looking to frivolously spend money on a quarterback, and only so many quarterbacks to go around.

_____________________________

Defense starts at the corners!

Post #: 4885

RE: General Vikes Talk - 1/17/2023 8:22:56 AM

Mark Anderson

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

Option #1 for this management team should be to find a new home for Cousins? Does anyone disagree with this?

Never mind how tough it could be. I never said it would be easy. But it can be done. It was done with Russell Wilson. It can be done with Kirk Cousins. There is a ton of teams looking to frivolously spend money on a quarterback, and only so many quarterbacks to go around.

Who's our QB next year?

Post #: 4886

RE: General Vikes Talk - 1/17/2023 8:25:37 AM

Phil Riewer

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Once again...Kirk's cap wasn't the problem in 2022. 28 Million in Dead cap to Rudolph, Barr, Pierce, etc. was the issue.

Cap in 2023 will actually be better.

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SSG Riewer, Greg A Co 2/136 CAB
KIA 23 March 2007 Habbaniyah Iraq

Post #: 4887

RE: General Vikes Talk - 1/17/2023 8:26:11 AM

Brad H

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

Option #1 for this management team should be to find a new home for Cousins? Does anyone disagree with this?

Never mind how tough it could be. I never said it would be easy. But it can be done. It was done with Russell Wilson. It can be done with Kirk Cousins. There is a ton of teams looking to frivolously spend money on a quarterback, and only so many quarterbacks to go around.

Who's our QB next year?

I don't know. I don't have that answer. No matter, this team does not look like a playoff team to me next year and has no chance of winning the big prize.

Lets take one step at a time. The big albatross in the room is Cousins. Has been for five years. Lets solve that first and then rearrange the deck furniture on the Titanic.

_____________________________

Defense starts at the corners!

Post #: 4888

RE: General Vikes Talk - 1/17/2023 8:26:40 AM

bstinger

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Joined: 7/20/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

Option #1 for this management team should be to find a new home for Cousins? Does anyone disagree with this?

Never mind how tough it could be. I never said it would be easy. But it can be done. It was done with Russell Wilson. It can be done with Kirk Cousins. There is a ton of teams looking to frivolously spend money on a quarterback, and only so many quarterbacks to go around.

How do you get Kirk to waive the no trade?

_____________________________

"You guys are true athletes!"

--twinsfan

Post #: 4889

RE: General Vikes Talk - 1/17/2023 8:27:36 AM

Mark Anderson

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quote:

ORIGINAL: bstinger

Signing Duke Shelley? He's a FA.

Sign Shelley. Chandon Sullivan can go.

Peterson can go unless it is in 6M range.

Need a CB in FA and draft.

And hopefully 1 or 2 of these guys pans out. (Evans, Dantzler, Booth Jr)

Post #: 4890

RE: General Vikes Talk - 1/17/2023 8:27:41 AM

Brad H

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

Once again...Kirk's cap wasn't the problem in 2022. 28 Million in Dead cap to Rudolph, Barr, Pierce, etc. was the issue.

Cap in 2023 will actually be better.

At some point you need to quit kicking the can down the road on the future quarterback issue.

_____________________________

Defense starts at the corners!

Post #: 4891

RE: General Vikes Talk - 1/17/2023 8:28:18 AM

Phil Riewer

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From: MN
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You cut Hicks and Kendricks and resign TJ and JJefferson you could have 10 million in cap before you have to make the tougher decisions. (Harry, Thielen, and Cook)

Kirk's Salary is not a problem for 2023...it wasn't the issue in 2022...28 in dead cap was the issue.

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KIA 23 March 2007 Habbaniyah Iraq

Post #: 4892

RE: General Vikes Talk - 1/17/2023 8:29:19 AM

Brad H

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quote:

ORIGINAL: bstinger

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

Option #1 for this management team should be to find a new home for Cousins? Does anyone disagree with this?

Never mind how tough it could be. I never said it would be easy. But it can be done. It was done with Russell Wilson. It can be done with Kirk Cousins. There is a ton of teams looking to frivolously spend money on a quarterback, and only so many quarterbacks to go around.

How do you get Kirk to waive the no trade?

Find him to a place where they want to give him a 3-4 year deal. If there's one thing we know about Cousins, he's all about the money. If you can find a place for Matt Ryan, you can find a place for Kirk Cousins.

_____________________________

Defense starts at the corners!

Post #: 4893

RE: General Vikes Talk - 1/17/2023 8:29:23 AM

Mark Anderson

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

Option #1 for this management team should be to find a new home for Cousins? Does anyone disagree with this?

Never mind how tough it could be. I never said it would be easy. But it can be done. It was done with Russell Wilson. It can be done with Kirk Cousins. There is a ton of teams looking to frivolously spend money on a quarterback, and only so many quarterbacks to go around.

Who's our QB next year?

I don't know. I don't have that answer. No matter, this team does not look like a playoff team to me next year and has no chance of winning the big prize.

Lets take one step at a time. The big albatross in the room is Cousins. Has been for five years. Lets solve that first and then rearrange the deck furniture on the Titanic.

If it actually saved cap money, cutting him would make sense. It adds money so it would be pretty stupid.

Post #: 4894

RE: General Vikes Talk - 1/17/2023 8:31:31 AM

Mark Anderson

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Joined: 9/1/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

Once again...Kirk's cap wasn't the problem in 2022. 28 Million in Dead cap to Rudolph, Barr, Pierce, etc. was the issue.

Cap in 2023 will actually be better.

At some point you need to quit kicking the can down the road on the future quarterback issue.

Agreed. You can do that while keeping Cousins one more year.

Post #: 4895

RE: General Vikes Talk - 1/17/2023 8:32:03 AM

Brad H

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mark Anderson

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

Option #1 for this management team should be to find a new home for Cousins? Does anyone disagree with this?

Never mind how tough it could be. I never said it would be easy. But it can be done. It was done with Russell Wilson. It can be done with Kirk Cousins. There is a ton of teams looking to frivolously spend money on a quarterback, and only so many quarterbacks to go around.

Who's our QB next year?

I don't know. I don't have that answer. No matter, this team does not look like a playoff team to me next year and has no chance of winning the big prize.

Lets take one step at a time. The big albatross in the room is Cousins. Has been for five years. Lets solve that first and then rearrange the deck furniture on the Titanic.

If it actually saved cap money, cutting him would make sense. It adds money so it would be pretty stupid.

They gotta find a trade that he can live with. As I see it, they have one wild card advantage. He has one year left. Find a place where he has a 2-4 year contract and Cousins would eat it up. He's all about the money, and always has been.

_____________________________

Defense starts at the corners!

Post #: 4896

RE: General Vikes Talk - 1/17/2023 8:32:30 AM

Phil Riewer

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Joined: 8/24/2007
From: MN
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

Once again...Kirk's cap wasn't the problem in 2022. 28 Million in Dead cap to Rudolph, Barr, Pierce, etc. was the issue.

Cap in 2023 will actually be better.

At some point you need to quit kicking the can down the road on the future quarterback issue.

See that is where we see it differently...Case, Ponder, Bradford....those are those kinds of options which are more of kicking the problem done the road. I would rather have Kirk in 2023 and figure out something in 2024. Pretty sure that is the plan.

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KIA 23 March 2007 Habbaniyah Iraq

Post #: 4897

RE: General Vikes Talk - 1/17/2023 8:33:38 AM

Bill Johanesen

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

10 biggest contracts in the NFL this season:

1) Aaron Rodgers (didn't live up to it)
2) Russell Wilson (didn't live up to it)
3) Kyler Murray (didn't live up to it)
4) Deshaun Watson (didn't live up to it)
5) Patrick Mahomes
6) Josh Allen
7) Derek Carr (didn't live up to it)
8) Dak Prescott (didn't live up to it)
9) Matthew Stafford (didn't live up to it)
10) Kirk Cousins (with the #14 QB rating, didn't live up to it)

Anyone seeing a trend here?

Again it is a double edge sword. You have maybe 8-9 wins w/o Kirk. I remember the Ponder, Teddy, Bradford years. Case we lucked into and he hasn't done that since for one year. Total Sabotage solution; you also are talking about something that can't be done anyway. They can't cut him due to cap and he has a no trade.

Your solution isn't one.

You gain 13 million by cutting Hicks and Kendricks alone. They will have cap space and if they resign TJ and Jefferson they can create more.

IMO you are far too optimistic with say $30 million cap.

First of all, we are starting 2023 with a cap deficit, so the $30 million ends up being around $20 million. Then you have the rookie class, and w/o a second rounder might be around $5 million.

Like magic, your $30 million is automatically reduced to $15 million.

Post #: 4898

RE: General Vikes Talk - 1/17/2023 8:37:31 AM

Brad H

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Cousins tipped his cap this week when he said he loves playing for the Vikings. Translation: He's concerned he won't be making any money past 2023 and trying to buy the fans.

If you are so in love with the franchise, how about you restructure your contract so the franchise can build a competent defense? That would be my question if I were the GM.

_____________________________

Defense starts at the corners!

Post #: 4899

RE: General Vikes Talk - 1/17/2023 8:38:00 AM

Phil Riewer

Posts: 27446
Joined: 8/24/2007
From: MN
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Johanesen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phil Riewer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brad H

10 biggest contracts in the NFL this season:

1) Aaron Rodgers (didn't live up to it)
2) Russell Wilson (didn't live up to it)
3) Kyler Murray (didn't live up to it)
4) Deshaun Watson (didn't live up to it)
5) Patrick Mahomes
6) Josh Allen
7) Derek Carr (didn't live up to it)
8) Dak Prescott (didn't live up to it)
9) Matthew Stafford (didn't live up to it)
10) Kirk Cousins (with the #14 QB rating, didn't live up to it)

Anyone seeing a trend here?

Again it is a double edge sword. You have maybe 8-9 wins w/o Kirk. I remember the Ponder, Teddy, Bradford years. Case we lucked into and he hasn't done that since for one year. Total Sabotage solution; you also are talking about something that can't be done anyway. They can't cut him due to cap and he has a no trade.

Your solution isn't one.

You gain 13 million by cutting Hicks and Kendricks alone. They will have cap space and if they resign TJ and Jefferson they can create more.

IMO you are far too optimistic with say $30 million cap.

First of all, we are starting 2023 with a cap deficit, so the $30 million ends up being around $20 million. Then you have the rookie class, and w/o a second rounder might be around $5 million.

Like magic, your $30 million is automatically reduced to $15 million.

The cap isn't locked in for 2023 yet but they had zero cap room last year and 28 million in dead cap and created 20 million. They have more breathing room this year and will obviously create more.

I see a better chance of keeping Harry over Kendricks and Hicks...those two have almost zero dead cap by cutting. So that could be a restructure (for Harry).

< Message edited by Phil Riewer -- 1/17/2023 8:39:26 AM >

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Post #: 4900