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RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2023 10:22:15 AM

Daniel Lee Young

Posts: 13103
Status: offline

I used to go to any lengths to watch Vikings football..

I rejoiced in the wins..

I raged at the losses..

McCoombs sold the team, **** us as fans with the moss trade..

It’s been all such a false hope ride since then..

Almost 20 years of crushed hopes and dreams..

Watching weak teams built into sham contenders around singular “ marketing value” players..

Watching our better coaches be “sniped” by other teams, with more commitment to winning management, have equal or better success.

Watching players like Birk, McKinnie, Mitch Berger, even TJack and Harvin, with the Seahawks.. get SUPERBOWL wins and Championship Rings..

It apparent that the Wilfs and GM’s of the past 20 years, can’t pick a quality coach on offense, our NOT make the mistake of paying big money to “middle of the road , “steady but not electric “ star/stud players.

Tice, Childress, Fraiser, Zimmer, and now, KOC..

A true pentagon of mediocrity, as reflected by the offensive mediocrity that they employ on game days.

This co- dependent relationship and obsessive/ compulsive attachment to this team is quite literally bad for my mental health and my personality.

I have been kicked into a cycle of negativity and despair, by false hope and dreams.

When I feel compelled to find other things to do on game days.. I feel like it’s over.

FML…

< Message edited by Daniel Lee Young -- 12/11/2023 10:25:43 AM >

_____________________________

"Thou shall not bear false witness”
I am WRATH, incarnate.
@RlyeeNicole’sDad

Post #: 5801

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2023 10:26:47 AM

Richard Neussendorfer

Posts: 19085
Joined: 12/7/2007
From: Alamogordo, NM
Status: offline

I get the feeling we'll be watching Flores succeed elsewhere and it'll be another kick in the shorts. I really don't see him staying unless he's made head coach. We know that'll never happen so I'm prepared to be disappointed.

Post #: 5802

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2023 10:33:20 AM

Tom Sykes

Posts: 5711
Joined: 7/27/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

I get the feeling we'll be watching Flores succeed elsewhere and it'll be another kick in the shorts. I really don't see him staying unless he's made head coach. We know that'll never happen so I'm prepared to be disappointed.

For sure. Somebody is going to give him, if not a HC deal, then a DC-ASST HC with a wink wink deal to take over HC when available.

We are going to collaborate ourselves into oblivion with our best buddy regime finding some way to extend Cousins for another year, push his dead money into the 50m strata in 2025 ... and continue on next year with last year's defense.

Imagine this year with last year's defense (ie, with someone other than Flores)

owie.

< Message edited by Tom Sykes -- 12/11/2023 10:35:08 AM >

Post #: 5803

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2023 10:46:33 AM

Jeff Jesser

Posts: 19100
Joined: 7/16/2007
From: Southern Cal
Status: offline

My only hope for Flores is (and this is a really bad "hope") is that his case against the NFL keeps teams at bay until it's resolved. Otherwise, I agree. He should be the hottest name in the league for a HC spot.

I'm just floored at how the mystique (for me, not speaking for others) has just been torn down on KOC. Dude was going to be some offensive wonder mind. Another in the new wave of offensive geniuses. Our offense hasn't adapted with 4 different QB's. We had a brief glimpse but that was just Dobbs running for his life and making something out of fear. As he learned the offense he has gotten much worse and KOC hasn't done anything to help him out. I mentioned it on the game day thread.

Every person on the planet knew that the ball was going to forced to JJ when he entered the game on play 2. You don't think that corner was squatting on that route? A double move would have been 6 or, at least, made them think. Nope, KOC goes the conservative route and it's almost a pick 6.

They were pinning their ears back and Dobbs barely had time to react. Maybe a hard count or 2??? I know it's revolutionary but isn't that what he was billed as? Every time he does do something off script, on offense, it's ill-timed
or just plain weird.

I guess you could point to the fake punts but is that on him or the ST coach?

Post #: 5804

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2023 10:47:50 AM

Richard Neussendorfer

Posts: 19085
Joined: 12/7/2007
From: Alamogordo, NM
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

I get the feeling we'll be watching Flores succeed elsewhere and it'll be another kick in the shorts. I really don't see him staying unless he's made head coach. We know that'll never happen so I'm prepared to be disappointed.

For sure. Somebody is going to give him, if not a HC deal, then a DC-ASST HC with a wink wink deal to take over HC when available.

We are going to collaborate ourselves into oblivion with our best buddy regime finding some way to extend Cousins for another year, push his dead money into the 50m strata in 2025 ... and continue on next year with last year's defense.

Imagine this year with last year's defense (ie, with someone other than Flores)

owie.

Exactly. It'll take years for the organization to figure out KOC isn't that good even though yesterday's game should pretty much seal the deal. A timeout then a delay of game was worse than high school.

Post #: 5805

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2023 10:48:08 AM

Jeff Jesser

Posts: 19100
Joined: 7/16/2007
From: Southern Cal
Status: offline

KOC is forcing his guys in to the system rather than molding it around them. O'Coneshell.

Post #: 5806

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2023 10:48:58 AM

Jeff Jesser

Posts: 19100
Joined: 7/16/2007
From: Southern Cal
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Sykes

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

I get the feeling we'll be watching Flores succeed elsewhere and it'll be another kick in the shorts. I really don't see him staying unless he's made head coach. We know that'll never happen so I'm prepared to be disappointed.

For sure. Somebody is going to give him, if not a HC deal, then a DC-ASST HC with a wink wink deal to take over HC when available.

We are going to collaborate ourselves into oblivion with our best buddy regime finding some way to extend Cousins for another year, push his dead money into the 50m strata in 2025 ... and continue on next year with last year's defense.

Imagine this year with last year's defense (ie, with someone other than Flores)

owie.

Exactly. It'll take years for the organization to figure out KOC isn't that good even though yesterday's game should pretty much seal the deal. A timeout then a delay of game was worse than high school.

Exactly. In a vacuum you can let it go. It wans't the first time that's happened.

Post #: 5807

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2023 10:54:50 AM

Jeff Jesser

Posts: 19100
Joined: 7/16/2007
From: Southern Cal
Status: offline

For the record, before i get put on blast, I like KOC. I was really excited at some of the things I saw last year. His game management and play calling were iffy at times but his situational awareness was miles better than Zimmer. I just thought he needed experience in the other areas. He's not shown any growth in the weak areas and I think he's gotten worse.

At a bare minimum I think he needs to hire a real OC and let that person call plays. Some up and comer from the same tree but an outside voice.

Post #: 5808

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2023 10:56:36 AM

Jeff Allen

Posts: 8657
Joined: 7/25/2007
From: Twin Cities
Status: offline

KOC is 17-0 when winning or at least pushing in turnover battle...yeah, he's the problem.

Post #: 5809

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2023 11:06:43 AM

Richard Neussendorfer

Posts: 19085
Joined: 12/7/2007
From: Alamogordo, NM
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeff Allen

KOC is 17-0 when winning or at least pushing in turnover battle...yeah, he's the problem.

He kept a turnover machine in about 6 quarters too long so I'd say he has culpability.

Post #: 5810

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2023 11:06:49 AM

Ricky J

Posts: 18231
Joined: 7/19/2007
Status: offline

I want to also go on record as saying, "Give the man a chance!"

He's been here less than two full seasons for pete's sake!

< Message edited by Ricky J -- 12/11/2023 11:08:47 AM >

Post #: 5811

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2023 11:09:03 AM

Richard Neussendorfer

Posts: 19085
Joined: 12/7/2007
From: Alamogordo, NM
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

I want to also go on record as saying, "Give the F man a chance!"

He's been here less than two full seasons for pete's sake!

He's getting worse. I've seen enough. If you want to flounder around for another 3 years that's ok. I think I know how this ends.

Post #: 5812

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2023 11:14:13 AM

Jeff Jesser

Posts: 19100
Joined: 7/16/2007
From: Southern Cal
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeff Allen

KOC is 17-0 when winning or at least pushing in turnover battle...yeah, he's the problem.

Talk Vikes board total vindication!

Post #: 5813

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2023 11:22:14 AM

Tom Sykes

Posts: 5711
Joined: 7/27/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeff Jesser

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeff Allen

KOC is 17-0 when winning or at least pushing in turnover battle...yeah, he's the problem.

Talk Vikes board total vindication!

LOL.

Allen with his usual decadent swirl of purple icing on the cake.

Post #: 5814

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2023 11:23:48 AM

Ricky J

Posts: 18231
Joined: 7/19/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

I want to also go on record as saying, "Give the F man a chance!"

He's been here less than two full seasons for pete's sake!

He's getting worse. I've seen enough. If you want to flounder around for another 3 years that's ok. I think I know how this ends.

You think, but you really don't know!

Peace!

Post #: 5815

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2023 11:25:04 AM

Ricky J

Posts: 18231
Joined: 7/19/2007
Status: offline

It's Monday. Vikes win. Life is good!

3-0 I wish I was there (but only bc we had the 3)

Post #: 5816

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2023 11:25:28 AM

Richard Neussendorfer

Posts: 19085
Joined: 12/7/2007
From: Alamogordo, NM
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

I want to also go on record as saying, "Give the F man a chance!"

He's been here less than two full seasons for pete's sake!

He's getting worse. I've seen enough. If you want to flounder around for another 3 years that's ok. I think I know how this ends.

You think, but you really don't know!

Peace!

By that logic let's hire Brandon Stayley. I mean we don't know!

Post #: 5817

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2023 11:28:58 AM

Ricky J

Posts: 18231
Joined: 7/19/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

I want to also go on record as saying, "Give the F man a chance!"

He's been here less than two full seasons for pete's sake!

He's getting worse. I've seen enough. If you want to flounder around for another 3 years that's ok. I think I know how this ends.

You think, but you really don't know!

Peace!

By that logic let's hire Brandon Stayley. I mean we don't know!

Hey! Do what youve gotta do to enjoy your life. Ill do likewise.

Ifs and butts ... Kirk would of made this a great team with this defense. But that's out the window. Im giving O'Connell a chance to see what happens.

Oh, and Flo is going to turn around our offense, huh? good one!

Post #: 5818

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2023 11:31:21 AM

Richard Neussendorfer

Posts: 19085
Joined: 12/7/2007
From: Alamogordo, NM
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

I want to also go on record as saying, "Give the F man a chance!"

He's been here less than two full seasons for pete's sake!

He's getting worse. I've seen enough. If you want to flounder around for another 3 years that's ok. I think I know how this ends.

You think, but you really don't know!

Peace!

By that logic let's hire Brandon Stayley. I mean we don't know!

Hey! Do what youve gotta do to enjoy your life. Ill do likewise.

Ifs and butts ... Kirk would of made this a great team with this defense. But that's out the window. Im giving O'Connell a chance to see what happens.

Oh, and Flo is going to turn around our offense, huh? good one!

I think he could find a person to coordinate the offense. Doesn't seem like an impossible task.

Post #: 5819

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2023 11:35:16 AM

Richard Neussendorfer

Posts: 19085
Joined: 12/7/2007
From: Alamogordo, NM
Status: offline

Let's be honest. It's not getting fixed with KOC either.

Post #: 5820

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2023 11:39:23 AM

Ricky J

Posts: 18231
Joined: 7/19/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

Let's be honest. It's not getting fixed with KOC either.

What's honest about that? He hasn't even had 2 seasons. He just lost his QB. It's starting from scratch during the stretch run.

whatever -- getting into it with you guys on this board is not a battle that can be won

Post #: 5821

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2023 11:41:09 AM

beo

Posts: 2224
Joined: 3/18/2009
Status: offline

Flores is an INCREDIBLE defensive coordinator.

But people have serious short term memory on his head coaching stint.
He was not a great head coach.
He was not good for Tua.

Best case scenario is Flores beef with the NFL and some of his bad press by Tua/former players keeps him with Vikes for another year and KOC improves.

Post #: 5822

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2023 11:45:21 AM

Richard Neussendorfer

Posts: 19085
Joined: 12/7/2007
From: Alamogordo, NM
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

Let's be honest. It's not getting fixed with KOC either.

What's honest about that? He hasn't even had 2 seasons. He just lost his QB. It's starting from scratch during the stretch run.

whatever -- getting into it with you guys on this board is not a battle that can be won

It's just differing opinions. It's fine. I'm just seeing a guy do silly things like getting delays of game after timeouts and poor clock management. Seems very slow to recognize problems and address them too. Dobbs should have been pulled in the Bears game and at the very worst at halftime of the Raiders game. To me these are red flags but I have no problem with your views on it.

Post #: 5823

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2023 11:59:08 AM

Tom Sykes

Posts: 5711
Joined: 7/27/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

I want to also go on record as saying, "Give the man a chance!"

He's been here less than two full seasons for pete's sake!

How about just calling it what it is, while it is.

He needs to get a lot better.

Regardless of his 1.697 seasons of experience.

I totally get the dumbing down stuff for new/back-up QBs ... I get the rash of injuries having a huge impact ... I get the karmic bad bounces compared to last year ... I also see a lot of stale playcalling that ensures games are going to be close regardless of the opponent. Since he got here.

I was hoping for a fresh young offensive mind ... whether it was effective from the get go or needed fine tuning along the way.

Now I'm just hoping he matures into something better than the last OC or HC.

Post #: 5824

RE: General Vikes Talk - 12/11/2023 12:03:18 PM

Ricky J

Posts: 18231
Joined: 7/19/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricky J

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Neussendorfer

Let's be honest. It's not getting fixed with KOC either.

What's honest about that? He hasn't even had 2 seasons. He just lost his QB. It's starting from scratch during the stretch run.

whatever -- getting into it with you guys on this board is not a battle that can be won

It's just differing opinions. It's fine. I'm just seeing a guy do silly things like getting delays of game after timeouts and poor clock management. Seems very slow to recognize problems and address them too. Dobbs should have been pulled in the Bears game and at the very worst at halftime of the Raiders game. To me these are red flags but I have no problem with your views on it.

I hear ya.

All we can really do is stay tuned and see where this goes.

I would be ok with beo being right

Post #: 5825

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